Moraine and Residue

[RobertAlexWillis]

Except Moiraine doesn't know how to invert weaves.

 

 

[Tyrell]

As far as we know, noone who wasn't borne in the age of legends knew how to invert their weaves without an Age of Legends teacher, something Moriane didn't have.

 

#@*&! I go to post, remove my cat from the table and you beat me to the mark RAW :D

[CUBAREY]

I meant something akin to an inversion weave, eiher something that is secret to the Blues or to Moraine personnally. Kind of a very rudimentary form of the weaves knoen to Age of legends channelers.  It has the benefit of not having to be a very complicated weave.  Remember a weave that dissipates a previous weave would also have to self-destruct very quickly in order to be of any use.  Such a weave would seem to be much further beyond the rustics of Randland then a rudimentary inversion weave. I picture it as analogous to the compulsion weace that Liandrin came up with which was much less complicated or useful then that emplyoed by the "Spider".

[RobertAlexWillis]

While I guess that could be possible, it is unnecessarily complicated.  Her words implied that what she was doing was to help the residues dissipate more quickly, not to hide them.

[Gentled Ben]

...and so it begins again...

*weeps*

[Vassili]

Where did shocklances reappear? When is that mentioned in the series? Someone brought it up on page 1...

[Gentled Ben]

I assume it's the ter'angreal that zaps Elayne with the sparks...

[Denethor]

After reading all posts here I agree with the idea of distance and difference between active weave and inactive. Moraine was dealing with a weave that was inactive, already used and unpowered by anyone when she was removing it...thus the risk was very low to her.

 

Aviendah on the other hand had a weave that was localized in two places with some distance in between.

So to use Moraines weave, she and another AS would have to use it, one at the starting point and one at the destination once the gate had closed and the weave was no longer active to do it safely.

 

But as she had to do it alone and by herself, she had to keep the gate open to be able to access both location...and thus had to remove it while it was still active and full of power..thus the risk.

To me this is pretty much the same as trying to revire something electical when its turned of and when its turned on...the more dangerous,more difficult and risky path being kinda obvious. Thats my theory on what happened though, as I seem to remember one AS telling Aviendah how dangerous her actions had been afterward(Need to reread thu to confirm)...thus this was no old secret...just VERY hard and VERY dangerous.

[Kura]

After reading all posts here I agree with the idea of distance and difference between active weave and inactive. Moraine was dealing with a weave that was inactive, already used and unpowered by anyone when she was removing it...thus the risk was very low to her.

 

Aviendah on the other hand had a weave that was localized in two places with some distance in between.

So to use Moraines weave, she and another AS would have to use it, one at the starting point and one at the destination once the gate had closed and the weave was no longer active to do it safely.

 

But as she had to do it alone and by herself, she had to keep the gate open to be able to access both location...and thus had to remove it while it was still active and full of power..thus the risk.

To me this is pretty much the same as trying to revire something electical when its turned of and when its turned on...the more dangerous,more difficult and risky path being kinda obvious. Thats my theory on what happened though, as I seem to remember one AS telling Aviendah how dangerous her actions had been afterward(Need to reread thu to confirm)...thus this was no old secret...just VERY hard and VERY dangerous.

 

Well, I've got one think to burst the bubble of it being some old secret. Even Moradin was stunned that she had unraveled her weave, and counted himself lucky to be alive after witnessing it, and that AS was absolutly panick written, and I beleive Elayne recalls being told to never EVER try it... Okay, so it was three things...

[trakand_01]

Just read the section where Aviendha sees the Gholam on the top of the tower in Ebou Dar, and picks apart her weave. Firstly Merilille screams "No-o-o-o" and they all try and tell Avi she's doing wrong. She admits she can do it, that it's a very rare talent. Then she says that she can read residues, which Elayne comments is a VERY rare talent, and that anyone else who could do the same could open a doorway to the exact point they'd come out.

 

Elayne then tries the same in the farmyard after they leave Alise's retreat and the Seanchan start to come through at them (when Birgitte gets an arrow in her thigh) after using the Bowl of the Winds but in the end she simply lets go and the gateway explodes. The text describes the flows which she has pulled loose as 'flailing about', which makes me think of a snapped electrical cable.

 

I guess someone with the right Talent can feel the residue of someone having channelled, and know what it was they did.

 

Two questions related to this part in the story;

 

Adeleas tells Aviendha and Elayne about an AS who was meddling with ter'angreal, well, investigating them. She was found burned out in her cottage. She left the White Tower and no-one knows what became of her. Is this the woman we know as Setalle Anan?

 

Also Aviendha seems disturbed by a blunt dagger (Elayne remarks it looks to have been made blunt) - what's the significance of the dagger?

[icspots]

*** SPOILERS!!!!! ***

 

Well to anyone who's not read KoD yet anyway.  We find out later that another Talent of Aviendha's is that she can read Ter'angreal.  Meaning she can look at one and know what it does.  The dagger Ter'angreal hides the holder from the Shadow (or from Shadowspawn, we never find out exactly).

 

She wasn't disturbed as much as fascinated.

[trakand_01]

Ah thanks. Yes i know she can read them, and Elayne can find and make them, how coincidental. I just thought it was funny how Avi was obviously enthralled by this artefact and all Elayne could do was take it off her and tell her to keep looking.

[elmis]

She sees Moridin, not the Gholam. :)

[trakand_01]

No she sees the Gholam. Moridin is inside the palace, behind one of the trellises. He watches the gateway 'dissipate' and then seizes the true power, accidentally killing Madic, Tylins' servant (darkfriend) and melting the trellis. After he leaves the room the gholam enters and its' POV describes its' turmoil at being able to make up his own 'mind' (presumably because Sammy is dead now). It remarks about watching the tall woman go through the gateway from his vantage point on the rooftops; which is where Aviendha saw him. Then it feeds on Madic's blood.

[Gentled Ben]

I wonder if that knife is the Knife of Dreams?

[Tyrell]

Mmm "unraveling" almost implies that it's dooing it itsself, rather than being done by someone - Moridin may not have known that someone was controling it on the other side thinking perhaps that the weave was going crazy? Not like he can see Saidar or anything.

 

But yea, Idunno.

[Luckers]

No, at the time he does think to himself about the wonders these untrained savages come up with, the warder bond and now a way of unravelling a weave.

 

And Trakand, Aviendha sees Moridin, not the Gholam. The Gholam doesn't stwp up onto the balcony until after Moridin left--and besides, the description is all wrong. The Gholam looks like a small, slender man.

[trakand_01]

Fair enough, i just assumed seeing as the scene seems to depict Moridin inside the building that it was the Gholam she'd seen  :) I dont really suppose it matters either way - it doesnt particularly affect the storyline for me.

 

Merry Christmas All  ;D

[Luckers]

Christmas killed Asmodean!

[trakand_01]

I wonder what physical form Christmas takes... haha funny if they find a reindeer wandering about Caemlyn or wherever Asmo was when he got killed.

[Luckers]

Well, since Christmas is the day we all gather to remember the birth of Santa, i think its a safe bet that it manifests as a Tim Allen when its off killing people.

[trakand_01]

National Lampoon's Forsaken Murder Rampage

[Cabriana]

No, at the time he does think to himself about the wonders these untrained savages come up with, the warder bond and now a way of unravelling a weave.

 

And Trakand, Aviendha sees Moridin, not the Gholam. The Gholam doesn't stwp up onto the balcony until after Moridin left--and besides, the description is all wrong. The Gholam looks like a small, slender man.

 

How can Moridin see Elayne's weaves?

[RobertAlexWillis]

Moridin doesn't see Aviendha's weaves ... he sees the gateway waver and then dissipate, rather then close in the normal fashion, and reasons out what she did.  (TPoD ch 2)

[DemandredFO]

No, Asmo got runover by a reindeer