tv show spoilers Darkfriends in WoT TV Series (and books by extension)

[Harad the White]

1 minute ago, Agitel said:

3,500 years of not severing male channelers would have resulted in incredible problems. We're told the Aes Sedai only started using severing as a last resort because other methods did failed.

Or, one can argue, thankfully, that the 3,500 years of mistaken behavior led to the catastrophe in modern times. 

[fra85uk]

And this might link well with a possible (populistic?) approach to the recruitment of DFs by higher-level villain (Dana is clearly genuinely unsatisfied of her life), something in the lines of Batman's Bane, maybe?

At that suggests me that Laila was a DF (and also the fact that the wolf was feeding on her in the dream).

[Sabio]

You also have the Df's which joined because they thought it was cool, Fain even had a POV about reminding DF's their oaths were more than just words.  Something fun and edgy that many thought thought they would never be called on to fulfill.  

Edited December 2, 2021 by Sabio

[Elder_Haman]

10 minutes ago, Harad the White said:

Agreed. It's a disease, albeit magical. What's does the Hippocratic Oath say, "First do no harm." The BA "cure" for the disease does ultimate harm. And again, the whole point of 15 Books is to NOT take that approach of the AS, lead by the BA.

Oh, I definitely agree with that take. There are certainly more humane ways to deal with male channelers. But the initial steps taken to stop the insane were necessary. I think one of RJ's point is about how institutions slowly morph away from their original purposes - sometimes in very harmful and dehumanizing ways.

[Agitel]

2 minutes ago, Harad the White said:

Or, one can argue, thankfully, that the 3,500 years of mistaken behavior led to the catastrophe in modern times. 

 

One can argue the world is flat. Doesn't mean the argument is justified or supported. ?‍♂️

[Harad the White]

1 minute ago, fra85uk said:

At that suggests me that Laila was a DF (and also the fact that the wolf was feeding on her in the dream).

Possibly. But there are other explanations for wolf behavior. Wasn't Perrin also chopping her body in a dream. Because she's a DF?

[Harad the White]

Just now, Agitel said:

One can argue the world is flat.

And one can make inappropriate analogies but it doesn't win points in an argument.

[SinisterDeath]

1 minute ago, Harad the White said:

Possibly. But there are other explanations for wolf behavior. Wasn't Perrin also chopping her body in a dream. Because she's a DF?

He was using a Hammer.

I think he was trying to fix her.

[CaddySedai]

1 minute ago, Harad the White said:

Possibly. But there are other explanations for wolf behavior. Wasn't Perrin also chopping her body in a dream. Because she's a DF?

 

Hard to say. That was Rand’s dream (or at least his viewpoint in a forced dream) so hard to say the motivation of the other characters. 

[Harad the White]

1 minute ago, SinisterDeath said:

He was using a Hammer.

I ?‍♀️ corrected.

[Agitel]

2 minutes ago, Harad the White said:

And one can make inappropriate analogies but it doesn't win points in an argument.

 

Yes, I said that already. ?

[fra85uk]

Just now, Harad the White said:

Possibly. But there are other explanations for wolf behavior. Wasn't Perrin also chopping her body in a dream. Because she's a DF?

Of course, this is just a theory of mine and, in the series, we still don't know which role will be played by dreams.

However, I will be very surprised if at some point of the series Laila does not turn out to be a DF.

[Harad the White]

1 minute ago, Agitel said:

 

Yes, I said that already. ?

Oh Light, you were totally correct - I absolutely see your point and you've completely changed my mind!

[Sabio]

 

6 minutes ago, fra85uk said:

And this might link well with a possible (populistic?) approach to the recruitment of DFs by higher-level villain (Dana is clearly genuinely unsatisfied of her life), something in the lines of Batman's Bane, maybe?

At that suggests me that Laila was a DF (and also the fact that the wolf was feeding on her in the dream).

Or the wolf was eating her because it's a wolf, It's probably unlikely a wolf can tell a normal DF. 

[CaddySedai]

17 minutes ago, Harad the White said:

What's does the Hippocratic Oath say, "First do no harm."

 

To be fair the Hippocratic Oath is an invention of our age. 

 

By the time of WoT most oaths might be closer to Hypocritical Oaths. 

 

Just sayin. ?

[SinisterDeath]

2 minutes ago, Harad the White said:

I ?‍♀️ corrected.

I rewatched that scene not to long ago to confirm it was a hammer, no biggy. ? 

Btw, IF you (anyone) has ios, you can share 30 second clips from the show. It starts around 42:30.
Since I have android, I can't. Boooo. 

[Harad the White]

1 minute ago, CaddySedai said:

To be fair the Hippocratic Oath is an invention of our age. 

Naturally. Hippocrates was a future life of Nynaeve.

[fra85uk]

6 minutes ago, Sabio said:

 

Or the wolf was eating her because it's a wolf, It's probably unlikely a wolf can tell a normal DF. 

Only time will tell ?

[Sabio]

You don't need to be a DF to think killing or gentling a man that can channel is fine, regardless of Tower Law is fine.  SIuan herself said some of the people she came to Fal Dara with would still her and kill Rand and probably be justifed in doing it.  is it not humane to kill a poor man who can channel so he doesn't go mad or have to give up wanting to live after he is gentled?  Why take the poor man all the way to the tower when the end result will be the same?

[fra85uk]

Just to put some extra info:

In a podcast someone asked Rafe "Laila - Darkfriend?" and he immediately rejects the idea but then is curious as to what the actual theory is. Then the host tells him the fan theory about how it looks as if Laila is about to attack Perrin and how she apparently looks like someone who appears in a later book. To which Rafe responds "They are noticing things there that are worth noticing. That's all I can say!"

 

[Sabio]

3 minutes ago, fra85uk said:

Only time will tell ?

Or I guess I should of said if going by the book, since wolves rely on smell.  Moiriane had to explain to Perin that few are so far gone to the shadow to explain why her Aes Sedai senses for Shadow spawn didn't let her detect DF's.

[Harad the White]

4 minutes ago, Sabio said:

Why take the poor man all the way to the tower when the end result will be the same?

Why have trials for anyone? They wouldn't be accused if they weren't guilty?

[Theseus78]

35 minutes ago, Harad the White said:

Agreed. It's a disease, albeit magical. What's does the Hippocratic Oath say, "First do no harm." The BA "cure" for the disease does ultimate harm. And again, the whole point of 15 Books is to NOT take that approach of the AS, lead by the BA.

The madness will eventually lead to great harm.

A medical analogy would be if you had a disease that was going to kill you, but the treatment had a good chance of killing you too.  Would you undergo surgery for a disease that's going to kill you in 3 years if there's a 50/50 chance of dying on the table?

[Sabio]

Well sort of easier to prove if a man can channel then if someone may of committed murder or some crime.  Which sort of help justifies not taking them to the tower.  If I try to gentle you on the spot and nothing happens, well saves a long journey to the White Tower.  If it did work, then saves wasting maybe a month for the same result.

[Harad the White]

3 minutes ago, Theseus78 said:

but the treatment had a good chance of killing you too.

100% is a good chance. Or a fate worse than death, as The Medieval Mick Jagger (aka Thom) said. 3500 years of the wrong path was finally corrected when the Blessed Moiraine saw the Light.

Edited December 2, 2021 by Harad the White