Forum Etiquette & You (Repost)

[Arie]

 

Let's sit down and have a small chat. Instead of sending off a thousand different PM's or even taking a Heronmark to every new thread, we're going to have a small little conversation about what Forum Etiquette is. And I don't mean spoilers, wokeness, and using the right acronyms. I'm talking about community conversation that isn't facebook, twitter, or reddit where threads taper off into multiple threads without interacting with each other. 

 

And I may toss in some random gif's to keep your attention, but sadly this is far more important then just a good laugh or a casual glance. Believe me, I am VERY well aware of how many of you have actually read our CoC so I will keep this brief. 

 

Right Foot Forward- It's really just Common Sense

One does not walk in on a party and a conversation and state a core reason of thought without reading the room first. It may feel like you can post anything, regardless of engagement or audience, but forums are far more give-and-take then simply tossing a post into the internet-aether. 

Basically, if your very first post is a new thread full of singular criticism or opinion on the TV Show and there are already threads in place for such conversations, expect it to be removed without warning. With the amount of new member sign up daily and new topics like this, we made threads for conversation to intentionally avoid this kind of commentary. 

 

Maybe start with a Hi, and Post an Introduction, and read the stickies of a given forum before starting your posting spree.

 

That said, should you read all 50+ pages of a conversation? Hell no. But it's important to read the first post that sets up the conversation and at least read a few posts up (or even the last few pages) to see where the conversations sits as you jump in. You will find yourself far more engaged in the conversation and people engaged with you in return.

 

AFTER looking about you find that the topic you are looking for isn't there, THEN start a new thread. If you are not sure, ask a Moderator. We are available both via PM or on our Discord Channel.

 

Why all the "Off Topic" warnings?

 

What do we mean by "Off Topic"? If the topic is "Episode 4", the conversation should stick to things that occur in Episode 4. Talking about the casting choice a character that doesn't appear in Episode 4, how it relates to GoT's casting foibles and social justice, isn't on-topic.

 

Mistakes happen, and sometimes we have the wrong tab open and we post in the wrong place. Just be mindful what you have open and scroll up a bit before hitting submit. We tend not to hit the disciplinary button for off-topic posts, but we will hide them and give warnings.

 

It's never about 'sides'.

 

**WARNING** If new topics are posted intentionally to troll-bait/start shit, it will be removed and Disciplinary action will be enforced!!

 

Whether we all read the books or watched the TV show, we're all fans. This is a 14 book series and there will ALWAYS be a difference of opinions, and perspectives. Think on it, the Bible is but one book and look how many segue religions there are due to interpretation and translation. This is NOT the space to tell someone they are wrong, or ignorant, or informing other fans that your opinion is the right one. Or even to convince someone that the show is bad, or that it is good.

 

It's not. 

 

Not even close.

 

Repetitive, and redundant, commentary isn't a conversation. It borderlines bullying, and instead forces an opinion on someone else without the respect of the opposing opinion in return. Excitement and Disappointment is absolutely natural but it doesn't mean inputting "Nynaeve is the worst character in the show!" every second post. 

 

Friendly Reminder: We are not anti-negative opinions about the Show or the Books. We are anti-asshole about it. 

 

 

Example of constructive criticism.

"The writers fridging Perrin's wife was a mistake. It goes against his character, and they could have given his character motivation without falling on that tired trope."

Example of trollish criticism.
"This show is woke liberal feminist trash. Rafe should go die in a gutter. I hope this stupid show is cancelled, and these SJW clowns stop trying to shove their trans feminist gay agenda down my throat."

 

If there are no sides..

 

There is no "winning", because we are not about facilitating arguments for the sake of being right or wrong. I am sure that we have all had our share of people intending to find a way to prove without a doubt that they are right. Or you feel ever so inclined to do so, but I hate to break it to you. That's not now conversations work. We all want to be heard and we all want to be right, but you can only have the one. Listen, and be heard as that is what builds a social community. The goal is to exchange ideas and share opinions. 

 

Gosh, you guys are so strict!

Yup. Welcome to moderation, where staff actively encourages conversation and keeps topics on track. Don't like it? There are many other social media forms where you can do as you like. 

 

We are a cultured community that has been established for over 20 years. We're older than Facebook! And we like the way we do things because it works. That and we are not paid to do any of this, this is a volunteer community, and frankly dealing with a lot of the nonsense that's on other places is way above our pay grade. 

 

[Beidomon]

3 hours ago, Arie said:

Example of constructive criticism.

"The writers fridging Perrin's wife was a mistake. It goes against his character, and they could have given his character motivation without falling on that tired trope."

Example of trollish criticism.
"This show is woke liberal feminist trash. Rafe should go die in a gutter. I hope this stupid show is cancelled, and these SJW clowns stop trying to shove their trans feminist gay agenda down my throat."

I would agree that your example of trollish criticism is worded quite rudely. But is any criticism of making changes to the story to appeal to Woke sensibilities de facto trolling? That seems like a valid viewpoint to me, even if some disagree. I ask because at least one moderator has previously opined that the very use of the W word is grounds for censorship, which strikes me as a little odd that that word is now considered a pejorative.

[Arie]

Usage of the word "woke" is absolutely censored at this time. This was a decision by not just one Moderator, but the higher-ups. It has been used frequently enough in a derogatory way, and there are many other ways of describing something without such a generalization that indicates racism or a certain unfairness to skin color or other physical attributes of the casting. Posts are now read prior to approval to ensure appropriate tone, or if it considers disciplinary action.

[CaddySedai]

And it is not based on how it is used. Any post with that word automatically get put into a moderator queue. 
 

It isn’t targeted it is a blanket hard stop.

 

We then read it. And make decisions on a post by post basis. 

[Elder_Haman]

We are doing our best to promote a free and open exchange of dialogue. We absolutely do not want to shut people down and delete posts. Just be polite, bring a thoughtful take, and then keep your disagreements in perspective.

[Daenelia]

Good moderation is both extremely hard and very much needed. And I think it is an art to be that consistent and fair, and I know from experience how hard it is to mess up. And I have been impressed with how well you all moderate and keep things flowing, respectful and just pleasant. One more point for forums in favour of unmoderated social media. Yay! ?

 

But I also think that sometimes members, like me, should just check themselves and either not go into a certain thrwad, not go and reply to someone and maybe even not hit 'reply' after writing a post. I do. There have been several things I wrote that I then just did not post. Because I do not want to be at odds with my 'fellow fans and forum mates'. I hope we can do that without feeling like we muzzle ourselves.

 

I am just happy to have a place I can come to discuss a book series that I forgot I loved and a tv series that exists because of the books.

 

[TheMountain]

I think that overall, we're doing pretty well in comparison to other forums. Reddit is extremely critical of dissent and the mods are starting to remove criticism and ban people left and right. I just discovered yesterday that I'm shadowbanned from posting on r/WoT lol. I was wondering why things seemed to have died down recently. I know why now....

Edited December 1, 2021 by TheMountain

[ArrylT]

My unwanted 2 cents ?

 

As someone who has been / is a moderator elsewhere I wish this was a feature done more often.   Words are a challenge in that people interpret them differently.   I feel that a lot of times moderation is taken as censorship and vice versa. Moderation is direction, censorship is suppression.   Follow the direction and there is no suppression.

 

The internet is known as the information super highway.    Moderators are simply people who do their best to ensure that people travelling down this segment of the highway are doing so at the proper speed & lane.  Having someone doing 40 in a lane accustomed to travelling 100 is not good, nor is someone doing 120 in a slow lane.  

 

And that is what the moderators are trying to do.   Move the discussions in ways that are fair to all and allow everyone to drive to the topics they wish and share their thoughts.  I doubt any of them are actively looking to take away peoples "licenses".   But if they allowed everyone to drive at whatever speed and in whatever way they wanted then we'd simply end up with massive traffic logjams (ie hundreds of hundreds of threads with similar contend) and only the people acting like they are driving massive SUVs and willing to run over small compact cars would get to their destination.

 

There is always someone louder, someone faster, someone in a hurry - but sometimes they need to be aware there are other cars on the road who are equally trying to get somewhere.

 

And that to me in a nutshell is the thankless task of being a moderator.

Edited December 2, 2021 by ArrylT

[SinisterDeath]

This is not Facebook, Reddit, or Twitter.

This is website & forum are paid for and hosted by Jason Denzel.

The speech you are allowed to use on this site is at his discretion, and as such it is moderated and administrated by staff that volunteer their free time to make sure everyone plays nice, and conforms to the speech he allows to be used here.

To put it bluntly, if Jason issued the command "Every user must finish every post with "excelsior!" or be banned for life, that is well within his rights.

Since the TV show's release and the flood of new users, we have instituted Topic Approval, and other measures to try to keep DM a safe and inviting place.
As such, we try to:

1. Limit the number of topics, so we don't have 30 threads discussion Perrin.
2. Shut down unproductive topics or posts from trolls/shit starters, etc.
3. Keep DM Tidy and easy to locate topics that fit with what you want to talk about.
4. Get users to work with the Moderators on getting topics approved.

As a reminder to Everyone, per DM's Code of Conduct section 6a and 6b, when a member of staff issues instructions it is expected that members follow those instructions. If the Member disagrees or have questions, they should PM the moderator(s) and to work with them in a respectful manner. 

[Katherine]

I appreciate the clear rules and expectations. I gave up most social media years ago and this is my first forum in a while. Clear boundaries and expectations lead to success, and I love being able to talk to you all about my favorite book series. 

 

Also, from a teacher's perspective, these rules just help us refine our position better. 

 

For example, saying that something is "woke" is a weak statement that is overused. 

 

However saying, "this scene took me out of the moment and put me back in the real world in a negative way" is a much better statement of your position. 

 

 

[Arie]

I will add on a small caveat to this topic. We have 3 Moderators, and it's intentional that there are more than one. It's a big job, but not everyone jives with everyone. 

 

IF you have a problem with one Moderator and feel you are dealt with unfairly (and we do track together problems that pop up), you can request talking to another Moderator. This is NOT intended to work around the system to get what you want, but we do recognize that sometimes language, tone and perspective makes some conversations to be difficult with certain personality types. I am a different moderator than Caddy or Haman, and vice versa. 

 

We are genuinely here to HELP and provide a SAFE discussion environment within the rights stated by Sinister above.

[Jackdaw_Fool]

So I know how this forum has instituted the rule where all posts must end with "excelsior!" or the user will be banned, but I did have a question. Does the excelsior truly have to come at the end of the post, or is it sufficient to just be within our signature?

 

P.S. Everyone has become too serious in this forum.

 

P.S.S. Excelsior!

[CaddySedai]

1 minute ago, Jackdaw_Fool said:

So I know how this forum has instituted the rule where all posts must end with "excelsior!" or the user will be banned, but I did have a question. Does the excelsior truly have to come at the end of the post, or is it sufficient to just be within our signature?

 

P.S. Everyone has become too serious in this forum.

 

P.S.S. Excelsior!

 

It must come at the end in every case except one. The following gif can be inserted into the post anywhere as a valid substitute.

 

[Arie]

*Twacks Caddy*

Stay on topic. ?

[Canukistani]

As you command, so do I obey!


Excelsior!

[JenniferL]

This thread seems to be bait for all the trolls and weirdoes. Let’s go ahead and lock it. If you have any questions, feel free to contact any of us. Thanks.