tv show spoilers S1E7: The Dark Along the Ways

[DigificWriter]

4 minutes ago, Mailman said:

you have 2 separate things linking the accusation

 

Genuine question: what are you referring to here?

[Sabio]

57 minutes ago, Terry05 said:

This was my favourite episode so far - just ahead of episode 4.

 

Like others, on first watch I was put off by what I thought was a "triangle" with Eg, Rand and Perrin, but on re-watch it definitely seemed like Nyn making a mountain out of a mole hill. Eg seemed to put it to bed later on so doubt we'll be seeing anymore of it.

 

The stand out for me was the Fal Dara set - looked amazing. Production design has been a real positive for me the whole season.

Fal Dara looks nice, the White Tower just seemed really empty.  All the time there and it never really seemed all that impressive.

[Mailman]

32 minutes ago, DigificWriter said:

 

Genuine question: what are you referring to here?

Perrin being in love with Egwene

 

You have Nyn being the first then Rand linking the day he and Egwene started dating to Perrin engagement with his wife

[DigificWriter]

6 minutes ago, Mailman said:

Perrin being in love with Egwene

 

You have Nyn being the first then Rand linking the day he and Egwene started dating to Perrin engagement with his wife

 

Perrin isn't in love with Egwene, though.

[Mailman]

9 minutes ago, DigificWriter said:

 

Perrin isn't in love with Egwene, though.

That is your hypothesis, But having just watched  the scene again its clearly a line the show wants us to at least think about.

 

Nyn says she is tired of them fighting over Egwene like she is something that can be won then immediately looks as if she has spilled a secret she shouldn't have.

Rand then links the date of engagement to the day he started seeing Egwene.

Nyn then apologizes for what she revealed.

 

At the very least this scene is meant to put this love interest forward as a possibility.

[flinn]

13 minutes ago, Mailman said:

That is your hypothesis, But having just watched  the scene again its clearly a line the show wants us to at least think about.

 

Nyn says she is tired of them fighting over Egwene like she is something that can be won then immediately looks as if she has spilled a secret she shouldn't have.

Rand then links the date of engagement to the day he started seeing Egwene.

Nyn then apologizes for what she revealed.

 

At the very least this scene is meant to put this love interest forward as a possibility.

 Machin Shin: "You wanted Laila dead, out of the way." "Thats why you killed her." "Because you loved another woman more than your wife."

 

 Come on people, can the show spell it out for you any better than that? That was Perrin's fear. That is the angle Machin Shin was playing on Perrin.

 

 Perrin was in love the Egwene, being the shy quiet guy, she probably never knew. She hooked up with Rand, Perrin pouted, went and asked Laila to marry him. Yes he loved his wife, but a part of him still was and will always love Egwene and he feels guilty about it.

[DigificWriter]

19 minutes ago, Mailman said:

That is your hypothesis, But having just watched  the scene again its clearly a line the show wants us to at least think about.

 

Nyn says she is tired of them fighting over Egwene like she is something that can be won then immediately looks as if she has spilled a secret she shouldn't have.

Rand then links the date of engagement to the day he started seeing Egwene.

Nyn then apologizes for what she revealed.

 

At the very least this scene is meant to put this love interest forward as a possibility.

 

Your read on all of this is incorrect based on what the show presented us with with regards to Perrin, Egwene, and Rand going back to Episode 1.

 

You missed the obvious and correct point of that scene and ended up drawing the wrong conclusions from it.

Edited December 22, 2021 by DigificWriter

[Mailman]

1 minute ago, DigificWriter said:

 

Your read on all of this is incorrect based on what the show presented us with with regards to Perrin, Egwene, and Rand going back to Episode 1.

 

You missed the obvious and correct point of that scene and ended up drawing the wrong conclusions from it.

I'm nearly 100% certain that my read is not incorrect but what is the take then.

[ManetherenTaveren]

49 minutes ago, Mailman said:

At the very least this scene is meant to put this love interest forward as a possibility.

I wish there was an emoji for *yawn*. The EF5 are on a journey to expand and expend, not to dwell on the mundane issues of juveniles in Two Rivers. That scene was so contrived that it made me question the insecurities of the showrunner. Why imply anything like that at this point in their journey? Smh, move on, please. R & E & P & M & N will soon realize their potential, differences and unique, if disturbing, influences that will escalate their independence (and test their friendship).  

Edited December 22, 2021 by ManetherenTaveren

[DigificWriter]

9 minutes ago, Mailman said:

I'm nearly 100% certain that my read is not incorrect

 

And I'm 150% certain that you're absolutely wrong in how you read that scene because the show clearly demonstrated what was really happening, which I've already outlined repeatedly but will outline again: Nynaeve wrongly claimed that Perrin and Rand saw Egwene as an object to be fought over, and Rand, already emotionally compromised by slowly coming to accepting the reality of being the Dragon Reborn, wrongly validated Nynaeve's erroneous conclusion by lobbing baseless accusations at Perrin.

[flinn]

11 minutes ago, DigificWriter said:

 

And I'm 150% certain that you're absolutely wrong in how you read that scene because the show clearly demonstrated what was really happening, which I've already outlined repeatedly but will outline again: Nynaeve wrongly claimed that Perrin and Rand saw Egwene as an object to be fought over, and Rand, already emotionally compromised by slowly coming to accepting the reality of being the Dragon Reborn, wrongly validated Nynaeve's erroneous conclusion by lobbing baseless accusations at Perrin.

 Explain away what machin shin said then. Machin shin plays on fears. Why would Perrin fear he killed laila because he loved another woman more than his wife?

 

 Clearly there is something there.

[Mailman]

17 minutes ago, DigificWriter said:

 

And I'm 150% certain that you're absolutely wrong in how you read that scene because the show clearly demonstrated what was really happening, which I've already outlined repeatedly but will outline again: Nynaeve wrongly claimed that Perrin and Rand saw Egwene as an object to be fought over, and Rand, already emotionally compromised by slowly coming to accepting the reality of being the Dragon Reborn, wrongly validated Nynaeve's erroneous conclusion by lobbing baseless accusations at Perrin.

It a awfully convenient that the day Egwene and Rand got together is same day Perrin got engaged.

 

How does that fit with Perrins Machin sin fear that he loved another more than his wife? That has nothing to do with Nynaeve.

 

Why does Nynaeve immediately look like she has spilled a secret when she says it and Perrin look resigned before becoming angry when Rand laughs.

 

If you think that these things are clearly examples of the story being false then you are wrong. It may turn out to be as you guess and honestly I want them to forget this story arc as I find it horrendous, but at this point you have nothing that we have seen in the show to back up your line of thought and I have the actual words and actions of the characters to support mine.

Edited December 22, 2021 by Mailman

[Windigo]

7 hours ago, Elder_Haman said:

What if it's entirely the other way around? What if Egwene was hot for Perrin and made a move on him, but Perrin was in love with Laila? Laila and Egwene have a falling out over it. Perrin doesn't understand it. Blames himself for leading Eg on. 

 

Flamin' ashes if that wouldn't be entirely on brand for Perrin.

That is really on brand!
I also thought what if like the comment from the book, he loves her, but not like "that", maybe it was Laila who was jealous of that friendship or even his friendship with all of them. 

 

Quote

TEotW   Chapter 30 

 

[Terry05]

1 hour ago, Sabio said:

Fal Dara looks nice, the White Tower just seemed really empty.  All the time there and it never really seemed all that impressive.

You’re 100% right about the WT. Can’t really put my finger on exactly what was wrong. I liked the smaller sets like the warders rooms. When the camera pans up in the Hall room I think that is where it doesn’t look great imo 

[Mailman]

6 minutes ago, Terry05 said:

You’re 100% right about the WT. Can’t really put my finger on exactly what was wrong. I liked the smaller sets like the warders rooms. When the camera pans up in the Hall room I think that is where it doesn’t look great imo 

Theres also the scene where they are parading Logain through the streets and its barely wide enough for his cart to go down. Im assuming they are not taking him down the backstreets on the way to the tower.

 

Also it just bare walls in a lot of places not a lot of decorations, tapestries, vases, paintings or the like on the walls

Edited December 22, 2021 by Mailman

[Mailman]

11 minutes ago, Windigo said:

Quote

TEotW   Chapter 30 

 

That reads to me I dont love her like a dating thing in the first part

And not like a sister in the second part 

But i love her because Rand loves her and he is like a brother to me

So if the ravens caught us i would do what needed to be done i hope.

[Mrs. Yojimbo]

On 12/19/2021 at 11:12 AM, flinn said:

 

 I want my fantasy to be realistic.. yes I understand why that is confusing, but even fantasy has rules. You build a world and you create the rules, once you make a rule, you don't get to change it to fit a plot you cant figure out how to write properly.

 

Yes this right here!!

[Mrs. Yojimbo]

8 hours ago, DigificWriter said:

 

Your read on all of this is incorrect based on what the show presented us with with regards to Perrin, Egwene, and Rand going back to Episode 1.

 

You missed the obvious and correct point of that scene and ended up drawing the wrong conclusions from it.

 

Your interpretation may be the right one, but the fact that viewers have come away with such different interpretations indicates that the point is not so obvious. Speaking as a non-book reader, I can take your word for it that the clues you mention are all there, BUT for me they were presented in such an inconsequential way that 1) they made no impression at the time and 2) even when others are now describing them, I can't recall those scenes.

 

I do think that book readers are in some cases filling in blanks without even realizing it--that is easy to do when you are so well-versed in a subject. 

[CanisNoir]

16 hours ago, DigificWriter said:

 

We don't know why Laila didn't go to Egwene's Women's Circle Initiation.

 

True, we're never specifically told that, however, we can certainly infer it based on character actions and dialogue. The fact that Laila responds with "I know" when Perrin says "I love you" after pointing out that she didn't go tells you he was reassuring her of his love. The logical inference from this is that she is jealous of Egwene and thinks Perrin has stronger feelings for her than he does.

[Deviations]

10 hours ago, Sabio said:

Fal Dara looks nice, the White Tower just seemed really empty.  All the time there and it never really seemed all that impressive.

Thinking back on it, the rooms in the white tower seemed too small.  Not quoting dimensions from the books or anything, they just didn't seem fitting (or lived in).

[Deviations]

18 hours ago, KakitaOCU said:

If you are going to try and use Dragonmount as a sampling.. No.  This place is specifically home to book fans and more so dedicated book fans, which is not an even sampling of the show's audience or the population as a whole.  It's stacking the deck, which is dishonest from a statistics standpoint.

Exactly!  When a group of people invested in the material don't get it or don't like it, something is REALLY wrong.  The subset of people posting on this forum had the highest probability of getting it or liking it!  The fact that a noticeable amount of us didn't is doubly damning.

[fra85uk]

Fal Dara has  been way better depicted than Tar Valon.

Overall, the look of the show was noticeably improved in the 7th episode.

The cold open was really cool and cool-looking but we needed many more of these scenes also for previous episodes: please more action and less bla bla bla (considering that the dialogues/writing are not great either...)

 

I want to be provokative: if GoT never happened, this series would have been much better because they wouldn't have tried to replicate (i) the grim-dark tone (BS said that initial scripts were even darker) of situations/characters (ii) the need to make any dialogue confrontational and every character cynical. 

 

 

 

[bringbackthomsmoustache]

40 minutes ago, Deviations said:

19 hours ago, KakitaOCU said:

If you are going to try and use Dragonmount as a sampling.. No.  This place is specifically home to book fans and more so dedicated book fans, which is not an even sampling of the show's audience or the population as a whole.  It's stacking the deck, which is dishonest from a statistics standpoint.

Exactly!  When a group of people invested in the material don't get it or don't like it, something is REALLY wrong.  The subset of people posting on this forum had the highest probability of getting it or liking it!  The fact that a noticeable amount of us didn't is doubly damning.

Or conversely they may have an increased propensity to dislike it due to pre-conceived notions of what it should be or inflated expectations of scale or quality.  Personally I like it but then I anticipated substantial changes and had minimal expectations.

[Deviations]

3 minutes ago, bringbackthomsmoustache said:

Or conversely they may have an increased propensity to dislike it due to pre-conceived notions of what it should be or inflated expectations of scale or quality. 

Fair point.  In my case I got it but didn't like it.  Drives me crazy when they add stuff and at the same time delete stuff because they don't have enough time.  

 

Not enough time to show the Perrin stedding scene?  O.K., lets have Perrin be married and kill his wife to show his conflict instead.  Puke.

[KakitaOCU]

4 minutes ago, Deviations said:

Fair point.  In my case I got it but didn't like it.  Drives me crazy when they add stuff and at the same time delete stuff because they don't have enough time.  

 

Not enough time to show the Perrin stedding scene?  O.K., lets have Perrin be married and kill his wife to show his conflict instead.  Puke.

What value does the Perrin Stedding scene provide?  It introduces Stedding, it info dumps on Hawkwing.   Hawkwing isn't actually important to the narrative, just cool world building.  The Stedding would be better introduced with Loial or other Ogier to give it the proper feel.

Instead, yes, we get a few scenes that take very little time and give a much better basis for Perrin's Axe and Hammer struggle.

And as is already pointed out, no, our group is not a better example of the show audience.  Because, again, for everyone of us there's 10 or more casual viewers.  Not on a 1/1 basis or anything but you have me who likes the show and is active here.  I know 17 people who all like the show but don't care enough to talk about it heavily and definitely don't care enough to go to a web forum.  

Likewise, you dislike the show and I imagine you may know a group of people who dislike the show but likewise don't go post.  Those numbers are what decides if the show is good or not, and a glance at RT shows that about 3/4 people are happy with it.  And even those numbers aren't really super relevant to the big picture.