Lol as you can probably guess rule of cool does not quite cut it for me.

Nope Nyn she told him about the tracking tell to allow him to follow Moiraine to the eye.

The show actually said Moiraine had a tracking tell that Lan had not spotted in 20 years which is a super nerf on him.

The euphoria of holding the power is well established and his lucid conversation about what the taint feels like is not madness, he is talking about the thing that will drive him mad in the end. I'm sorry I don't recall that s3e1 convo.

So you are saying the tonal discordance is real and was intended. I think the Taarad where happy because their chief had returned. I don't think they should have been joyful with Rand given they knew who he was and what his future speaks for the Aiel. Which was my point. Grim, stoic, and committed not laughing and gleeful. We have seen no real development of Rand being taken by the Madness at this point. You are suggesting this as it's first appearance? I'm sorry I don't buy those as the reasons. I believe they wanted to set up a relationship between Rand and the kid to make a future scene hit harder, this was not an impossibility what I question is the manner they have chosen to achieve it. For example have Rand training with Lan and then Rhurrac approaches and offers to help him learn the spear or hand to hand fighting and have the girl laugh at his initial attempts and then even joins in on the lesson mirroring the moves along with the men.

That certainly is not Rand's lived experience though. And being stoic does not exactly fit with the way he and the child acted. For the audience it is still tonally discordant as Rand who only a couple of scenes earlier learned the Aiels history and shame and only just before that learned that he would destroy almost their entire civilization. It's the same level of discordance as when Rand was being one of the boys at the pub joking about sleeping with Lanfear, it's simply not the reaction a normal person would display when faced with a incredibly confusing and emotional situation like that. I think we are agreeing that by having a diverse cast you are going to have a diverse set of people being good and bad and some people are going to read things into those choices. I had not thought it heavily or deliberately skewed. Yep but that picture is from the show where it very much feels like they are going to make those relationships sexual. My concerns are mainly to do with the ceremony and the fact that they were sisters not lovers in the books which requires changing the relationship dynamics. It also raises the question are we going to see some threesomes or moresomes. When not all the characters are sleeping together it is not a question when they are all sleeping together it becomes likely that they would engage in this activity. I am not against it I am just saying if this is the relationship going forward do we expect this to be shown.

As I have stated before I do not care if they give Rands wives a more sexual component with each other to their relationship. My issue is that in the books they are sisters and the ceremony they undertake clearly involves a rebirth as the twin sister of each other and it clearly seems that rafe is going to keep this ceremony which is called first sisters. If you are happy with the relationship involving an incestuous element then it is no issue. If they remove the maternal birthing segment of the ceremony then it could work, however with this it is will it will not.

ewwww the thought of all those dangly bits flapping around and potentially getting caught in ropes or on the rigging. That would be a bad place to get a rope burn.

But at no point in the books do I remember those wives actually having a sexual relationship with each other. The same as in the books Rand's wives do not have a sexual relationship with each other.

Considering the lack of extras at this point in the show I'm fairly sure they could have actually found enough actors of any body shape and size. If every one of those casting choices had been white there would have been complaints about only casting white people in those roles. Sammael, Moggy, Lanfear and Morgase are all white and clearly evil at this point of the show. I am not sure having a solitary bald person in the BA out of 11 is exactly falling into the bald = evil trope. Although she is the only bald woman I can remember in the show so maybe?

I find the idea that only a marriage between 2 people to be the correct formula antiquated. The idea that every person on Earth fits neatly into a 2 person loving relationship feels wrong surely some people can be involved in multi party loving relationships/marriages and be happy. The examples you raised are where a considerable power imbalance is present usually and the vast majority of these relationships that have occurred in our world fall into this category. Cult like harems are rarely done for the right reasons and thus should be avoided.

I am aware of the current thought line that this will replace the Tear scene. I am fine with that scene being moved although without Callandor it will make it harder to replicate his feeling of being filled with so much of the power that he can literally do anything. The scene in the book did not require him having an attachment to the child and worked very well, again not saying that having said attachment could not work well here. What I am questioning is the jokey way the introduction was handled. Rand has just become the Car'a'can and learned that he will destroy basically the entire Aiel nation as his future, he has also just learned and experienced the entire history of the Aiel nation and their fall and shame. Having Rand be all jokey and happy in this scene is jarring considering everything he has just experienced. The fact that the child knows of the Car'a'can would indicate that his upcoming role is not a secret to the general populace and so to a lesser extent her role is also questionable. Would have been a fine scene if you had made their meeting more sombre and reflective especially from Rand POV.

Storytelling has accepted metrics that can be judged and they can be good or bad.

Again excusing them as nitpicks (which a lot of them are more severe than IMO) does not make them not true. The better the writing the fewer the nitpicks. You really almost have that paragraph on auto fill. It is of course not possible to for an adapter to not change some things as then it is not an adaption but a copy. And of course the life experiences of the writer is going to play a role on the material they produce. However claiming that they have the same freedoms as the original author is simply not true. If they are adapting a work they must work within the world the original author has created or it is no longer an adaption but a new world. My analysis is based on how effective they are in this endeavour. The quality of the world building, keeping the characters true to their counterparts in the books, how the magical system is used and its rules in comparison to the books, characters competence being tied to the character and not the story requirements. I base my analysis on all these things and others, I provide clear examples for them. This is not ignorance.

Definite for Siuane and Moiraine in New Spring. Was it simply the fact that they were trapped in a harsh all girls environment? No idea it's not important. They share a lifelong bond and they have a goal that trumps every other relationship and thing in their lives Elayne and Avi are sisters and that is it they are rebirthed together as essentially bonded twins. Ishy in the books I never got an impression either way the same as Siu and Mor he had taken up a cause that was more important than anything else to himself. As a man from an extremely cultured and educated world I don't believe he would have any issues any form of relationship although this does not prove in any way which way he might have swung before his fall. I don't care relationships between characters should make sense to the characters worldbuilding.

I present clear examples of the world breaking and storytelling issues when I provide my analysis on each issue. People frequently dismiss them as nitpicking however the fact that you are able to look past said issue as you do not see it as a problem does not mean the problem is not present. The show writers are there to adapt the WoT their personal interests and beliefs are not as important as the story written by the original author. The are working within Jordans world so no they do not get the same freedoms as he does. As you are talking about tone and tenor your posts almost always come across as if your word is absolute and sacrosanct on every writing issue and are unwilling to accept that there are any worldbuilding or story issues at all.

Well firstly the first sister ceremony is not a marriage. They literally become sisters, birthed again and imbued with a magical bond of basically becoming a twin sister. If they keep the bond and ceremony the same as the books and have them sleeping together it is going to be incredibly close to incestuous. Yes Elayne and Avi spend far more time together than they do with Rand but it is not sexual in nature they are sisters holding each other. This I believe is a queer person seeing something that is simply not there and I will again reference the fact that the first sisters ceremony involves a birthing element. I am not against Rands ladies having a more physical relationship but it should not be between sisters unless the show is advocating for a truly incestuous intent. I respect the issues his mormon upbringing coupled with his sexuality must have caused, but this is truly not the relationship that occurred in the books. I really like the talk about not setting the sexual identity of the character as that characters main defining trait. A real problem in a lot of the increased prominence of female and gay leads is that it is those very characteristics are their main ones. However, I don't believe that he has followed this. I have never disliked the idea that we could see an expanded physical relationship between Moiraine and Siuane. My problem is that it has super ceded their defining trait which was the single-minded desire to find and guide the Dragon and thus save the world. It began with the FFH ter'angreal being used for a hookup and when they finally had the meeting there they had sex before discussing the fact that Moiraine had found the Dragon which had been there most important goal of the past 20 years and their lives. And then this episode he has broken down the worldbuilding and storytelling to throw these characters at each other again by using Egwene.

How does that show my ignorance. Of course I believe that the decisions were made in good faith I don't believe that the showrunners and creatives are intentionally producing bad content. That is a mad assumption to make and one that I have never made. The show defenders really need to stop accusing me of saying things that I have not said.

Thanks for the explanation but just because he had the book knowledge and quite possibly already the intention to use Chesmal at another point himself does not validate the changes he has made. I am sure at some level he and the other creatives have reasons for the numerous changes they have made. I question the sheer volume of alterations and additions made outside the original work and the value they provide. And the methods by which, and for which, they are inserted.

It's a forum not a direct message it was not meant for him to solely respond too just as you choose to respond to a comment that I did not direct at you. I apologize if you jumped to the conclusion that I was avoiding extrapolating on the examples I listed as some argumentative ploy. I simply thought that it was obvious that I thought they were not required or good changes for the adaption. How is it a strawman argument, I did not set up a separate thing to argue about I listed specific examples of changes within the show compared to the books and then when challenged by you I happily listed the issues with the changes. It's very hard to believe that you don't think calling me a dick is an insult or then going on to label me as biased and obstinant as doubling down on this.

Even if she takes Lans bond i feel we have devoted far to much time to the melodrama of her and the warders. We could have fully explored almost everything about warders and Aes Sedai with Moiraine and Lan while deepening our connection with these 2 vital characters. It would even have increased the impersonal feeling of transferring the bond by not throwing Alanna at us every episode. At this point in the books they had devoted almost no time to tower politics and they did not really until Egwene a main character stepped into the role.

I've got no idea what that meme you are referencing is? Chesmal was in episode 1 of this season so why she would have died in episode 2 of season 1 I have no idea. How can we be ignorant of storytelling as you previously said that there is no objective good or bad storytelling.

Dude yourself! He asked for examples, and I provided numerous. You can make a judgement on just how required they were for an adaption, I would argue for most of them not very. I would argue that sacrificing an unforgivable amount of screentime to Alanna and her warders and their melodrama when you have Lan and Moiraine who could have filled this void and kept the show on a tighter and cleaner line is a poor choice for an adaption desperately short on time. I would argue that inventing a relentless number of tower politic scenes are not required for an adaption failing to generate enough time for it's main protagonists including relegating the main character to playing with a kid and laughing about being the Car'a'can despite that meaning he is going to destroy most of that childs civilization. A tonally deaf scene if there ever was one. I would argue that giving Egwene the power to instantly bring non dreamers into the dream was simply a sloppy writing mechanic to allow the showrunners to again throw Moiraine and Siuane at each other and thus not required for an adaption. Is that enough validity for you. Have I explained myself enough for you to understand. Or are you going to insult me again.

Come on almost the entire episode was only incredibly loosely based on the books. Entire tower sequence not in the books Entire Alanna sequence is change the only relation it has to the books is that she was in the 2 rivers. Entire dream sequence with Moiraine entirely made up and after only 1 training session. Lanfear and Rand dream banging entirely made up. Moiraine having the worlds most powerful Sa'angreal entirely made up. Bloody hell Rands entire contribution to this episode was to chat and bang Lanfear and play with a kid which when viewed through the lens of the fact he is going to destroy most of the entire Aiel nation is tonally deaf. If you watched this episode in isolation with changed names it would be nearly impossible to link it to the books.

I think we have to assume at this point that there is no feeling others channel at all. I mean Elayne and Nynaeve where what 15M or so from channeling for 2 weeks on the boat and never felt any of the channeling. Have we got an indication at any point in the show of people actually saying they felt channeling happening that they could not see.