[Standard] The Matrix Reloaded - Game Over

[Yates]

Votecount

 

 

Lenlo - Zander, Dice, Sooh, Sili, Shad (5)

 

Sooh - Lenlo, Clov, Corlanna, Yates, Thane, Taborline (6)

Actually, this suggests Dice is scum bussing. Unless you think this is a zero bus scum team? So thanks for the reminder.

 

Tabor/Dice/Hally pool tomorrow, imo.

[Cory Caboose]

Why is RTE town Yates?

[Yates]

Why is RTE town Yates?

Oh he isn't. He is conf scum, though. So no need to include him in a scum discussion pool.

[Yates]

You're also assuming he'll be alive tomorrow.

[Shad_]

Tab is a really hard read. I snipped these quotes irt her treatment of Sooh throughout the game:

 

 

 

I have unsure to bad feelings about Sooh and Zander or Lenlo. I want to see more from Sooh, who seems quieter than normal.

Ah, this would likely be a good reason why Sooh would have made her post about wanting to defend herself, if that's one of the first things she saw.

 

It's not even the worry it's just that she reads with the assumption that she is being run up

 

Poot is a lovely lady that we treasure very much and I think she's also the type to have a "guilty" mindset when she's a wolf

 

And I hate myself for saying that because I'm pretty sure that's a Darthe-style read and I'm better than that, damnit

I pulled that up in my last post, about the mention of there being impatience on Sooh, which might have influenced that post.

 

But the guilty mindset is interesting to keep in mind.

 

 

 

 

The impatience involved regarding Sooh is not something I share.

Ah, this would likely be a good reason why Sooh would have made her post about wanting to defend herself, if that's one of the first things she saw.

 

Why would you assume that post might be one of the first she saw? And even if you did; why not ASK SOOH instead of offering up an excuse? You know better than that...

 

You are right, I was trying to help answer Cory. I cited that one as it was the first I saw that might prompt that kind of reaction.

 

As for what I think of Sooh, I need to go through and re-read :)

Sooh, do you have negative feelings about people other than Thane for now?

 

 

Sooh, do you have negative feelings about people other than Thane for now?

Not sure if you saw, but I did respond to Nomi's question about the same thing.

 

I have read Dice now, and he does ping me as less involved than he usually is as town.

 

Poop, no I didn't see it, my ISO of your posts was from earlier, but I have now!

 

I am feeling better about you since you started posting today :)

 

Shad, reads are looking like:

 

Sili

Corlanna

 

Zander

Clov

 

Yates

Shad

BFG

Rack

Hallia

Parlaya

Sooh

 

Nomi

Lenlo

 

Thane

Dice

 

My Town reads are, at this point, more gut than anything. I feel comfortable with Corlanna and Sili, they seem consistent with how I've played with them before, though apparently Cory is really good at being townie when he's a wolf, so we'll see.

 

 

I have unsure to bad feelings about Sooh and Zander or Lenlo. I want to see more from Sooh, who seems quieter than normal.

at this point in the game can you tell me or show your thought process on Sooh and me, Lenlo you did kinda touch on in this post.

 

At that point I was concerned about Sooh not seeming like she usually is, and was still getting a handle on you. Your original post squeeing about being town, and subsequent fluffy posts made me wonder if it was a tactic. Since then, seeing much more from you, I feel good about you.

 

 

 

 

Ah, this would likely be a good reason why Sooh would have made her post about wanting to defend herself, if that's one of the first things she saw.

kinda feels to me like she's again leaving an out/bracktracking. again reads change and shes a new player but this kind of stuck out to me after i thought she made a nice catch.

 

I could be wrong but im thinking it so ill mention it

 

Something I should have asked Sooh, "Why do you think that?" instead of pointing out to someone that that's a possibility why. Again, bad play.

 

 

 

As for what I think of Sooh, I need to go through and re-read :)

but yet you had already posted that you were slightly suspicious of Sooh, made posts and had questions and comments on her.

 

fencesitting/backtracking and leaving yourself outs is not a great look.

 

Because all I had on Sooh so far was a feeling, and wanting to get something more concrete is wrong?

 

Up until this point I was feeling pretty good with going for Lenlo. I dislike his pushing on Zander, the paranoia about Zan being fooling us all, and I dislike that interaction above with Dice, but that might be MY paranoia at the thought of letting him off for the claim.

 

But I really dislike this.

 

so, yeah.... not feeling the 'let's lynch the doc' vibe here....

 

even if the chance is slim, there's still a chance he is telling the truth.

 

i'll throw it on an entirely different angle here, and will ...

 

[v] Taborline [/v]

 

more chances of finding a wolf here than with Lenlo IMO.

 

talks a lot, says little, leaves remarks left and right without explaining.... just a tag along wolf, hoping to be ignored till endgame

I'm not bothered about you voting for me, but a bit bothered by the accusation I talk a lot But why am I better candidate as a tag along wolf? That says to me that it's not real evidence, just a hunch, or a hope. Why not push ME more, engage me, or bring real stuff up against me?

 

so, i'll be trying to be in here today. Don't know if i can, considering work.

 

Seemingly i make comments that make people frown and question. It's what i do. I ask odd questions, because i need answers. I comment because i want other players to know what i think.

 

Honestly, i still think the Lenlo lynch is a bad idea.... testing the PR claim by lynching.... imo... not the best of ideas.

 

Taborline is a decent target, hence the vote. Hallia is down there too. And both of these players are suspects by other players too. Would be nice to lynch one of these two.

Thane, would you lynch me?

Not right now, seeing I have scummier reads on other players. But if I'd not be convinced of you being town later in the game, then yes.

I think you both know Lenlo's not a wolf.

 

I don't like Sooh's vote on Len, being "Blown away" by Shad's post, it's a convenient time and a good excuse to take for putting her vote there. Wolf Team puts one of their chips on Lenlo, knowing Lenlo is likely to go today. Thane looks good, however, trying to steer away from Lenlo, knowing he's town. Thane liking lynching me over lynching Sooh at that point (or Dice or Hally even), and lynching me for what I think is a weak reason, is odd to me, when it seems other people have more immediate evidence to go on. Your vote for Sooh still seems to hedge your bets:

 

 

Just that everybody should keep an eye on her. Not convinced she's town here, even considering the latest posts. Talks a lot, says little imo.

 

Don't lynch Lenlo. Claim buys him time, for now.

 

unvote

 

Vote: Sooh

[v]Sooh[/v]

 

 

 

In the meantime, she starts out liking Thane's first big analysis/reads post (who didn't?) but quickly turns on him, largely to do with his treatment of Dice. She puts Dice and Thane as her two bottom scum, but not w/w.

 

With Sooh she starts out bothered, works her back up to a null, says she'll ISO but kind of drops the topic after getting hounded by Z. We don't hear opinions on Sooh again until she votes her.

 

She's been consistently suspect of Lenlo.

 

So her ultimate reason for voting Sooh is that she thinks Sooh and Thane are w/w and don't want to be on the same mislynch (Lenlo) together, so Sooh votes Lenlo and Thane votes Tab, but Tab's not going through so he commits to bussing his scum mate Sooh.

 

The actual consequence is that immediately after Thane brings Sooh up to a tie with Lenlo (5 votes each) she votes Sooh as well on the theory that Thane is bussing.

[Shad_]

Basically Tab votes WITH her top scum read on a NULL COUNTERWAGON to her third scum read. That looks pretty awful.

A part of me feels like there is continuity to her thoughts. She's suspicious of Thane. She sees Thane treating Sooh as one of his top scum reads all game, then when it comes time to find a target other than Lenlo, Thane goes for her instead of Sooh. Maybe his scum read of Sooh is distancing, but he doesn't actually want to get her lynched? But since he can't steer town away from a Sooh vote, he's boxed himself into committing to the bus now. And look at Sooh, jumping at the opportunity to lynch Lenlo as soon as Shad provided a means to lynch him without consequence.

This could make sense from someone who is basically fully convinced in her head that Thane is scum and everything he does is scummy. Especially after he voted Tab (she knows she's town) over anyone else (paranoia), she knows there's a link between them, and Sooh's taking advantage of my Lenlo case, so bam! Two scum outed. Feels good.

And then my intelligent side kicks in and says wow that's stupid. Tab was scum reading Lenlo all game, and I rolled in with every reason in the world to vote him. She was town reading me. Who jumps to "too easy" and assumes Lenlo must be town because some other guy she's also scum reading exploited an excuse to peel off of Lenlo but dumped his new vote in a manner inconsistent with his previous reads?   Like, at the core of all this she's going "I think Thane is scum and I think Lenlo is scum and Thane is trying to stop the Lenlo lynch, but because he tried to peel votes off onto me instead of Sooh he and Sooh must be w/w distancing from each other therefor Lenlo is town!" Really?

And "Thane liking lynching me over lynching Sooh at that point (or Dice or Hally even), and lynching me for what I think is a weak reason, is odd to me" when one of her reasons for sussing Thane is his town read on Dice isn't the sort of mistake an attentive town who's watching Thane like a hawk should ever really make.

Then post-Sooh flip we get

 

Lenlo, you SOB.

Followed by:

 

 

..... bye Clov, see you in DT.

people, calm down.... Lenlo is being run up here imo. With 4 wolves still in the game, highly possible. One needs two or three wolves to start the train ,get town to doubt and boom, one more townie down.

I can be wrong about Len, i know. And that'd be bad.

I'll still [v] Hallia [/v]

That hammer and her explanation after.... nope. nope nope nope.

I'm starting to worry that's true as well, that Lenlo is being run up.

Sooh - Lenlo, Corlanna, Yates, Thane, Taborline, Hallia (7)

Lenlo - Zander, Dice, Sili, Shad (5)

Saying Lenlo is what he says he is, or some form of town, that leaves a lot of my previous townish-reads sitting in the wolf pile. Right now, I feel Zander and Shad are my only stronger reads, though I have a fear in the back of my mind that Shad is just really, really good. The same fear I have for Cory, Yates and Sili.

 

HOLY S*** ARE YOU SHEEPING THANE NOW?

[Shad_]

So my basic question: is town!Tab perpetually lost in the clouds or is this as blatantly opportunistic as it looks on the surface?

[Shad_]

Because I do get a slight feeling that there's a pattern of mass paranoia behind her thoughts that's making her continually act in ways totally counter to her stated reads.

 

But it's pretty bad.

[Shad_]

 

Votecount

 

 

Lenlo - Zander, Dice, Sooh, Sili, Shad (5)

 

Sooh - Lenlo, Clov, Corlanna, Yates, Thane, Taborline (6)

Actually, this suggests Dice is scum bussing. Unless you think this is a zero bus scum team? So thanks for the reminder.

 

Tabor/Dice/Hally pool tomorrow, imo.

 

 

Not convinced that you are scum (though I've let myself jump to that a few times) but feeling pretty confident that this lynch was zero bus.

 

Maybe I'm just clinging to too much faith in this town.

[Shad_]

 

Does it make any sense for scum!Yates to, knowing Clov was town, openly sheep him to do a complete flip on his stances on Lenlo and Cory?

ftfy

 

 

You mean the same Yates who gets away with claiming Miller on D2 and then claiming that the cop peeked him town after he shoots her D4?  Yeah, he'd do that.

 

But would town!Yates was my question.

[Shad_]

Because I do get a slight feeling that there's a pattern of mass paranoia behind her thoughts that's making her continually act in ways totally counter to her stated reads.

 

But it's pretty bad.

 

More like a strong feeling that this pattern exists.  Meh.

 

Maybe the question to ask is this: does town!Tab get cold feet and back away from lynches any time they feel too easy?

[Shad_]

Going to bed, good luck if I wake up in dead thread.  Don't tinfoil.  Always better to lose because scum played epic than because town played terrible.

[Shad_]

Hard to conceive of any of these as scum:

10) Zander

11) Corlanna (Cory/Alanna)

3) Sili

14) Dice

 

Really torn on this one:

4) Thane

 

Lynch from these imo:

9) Yates

5) Hallia

7) Taborline
15) BFG ReleaseTheEvil

[Cory Caboose]

why am i awake

[ReleaseTheEvil]

Here's a question. Between Hallia's hammer and Tabor's hammer, which of the two looks worse now?

[Sili Quirrels]

why am i awake

It might just be a coincidence but wolves are up at night too.

[ReleaseTheEvil]

I'll try collecting Hallia's and Tabor's posts before and after their hammers in a bit.

 

Based on Sili's ISOs (thanks) my lynch pool tomorrow would be Yates, Tabor, Hallia, Thane.

[Yates]

 

 

 

Votecount

 

 

Lenlo - Zander, Dice, Sooh, Sili, Shad (5)

 

Sooh - Lenlo, Clov, Corlanna, Yates, Thane, Taborline (6)

Actually, this suggests Dice is scum bussing. Unless you think this is a zero bus scum team? So thanks for the reminder.

 

Tabor/Dice/Hally pool tomorrow, imo.

Not convinced that you are scum (though I've let myself jump to that a few times) but feeling pretty confident that this lynch was zero bus.

 

Maybe I'm just clinging to too much faith in this town.

You're right. Crazy for me to think that of however many scum pr's there are, the whole team decided to go all in on the no bus approach to save a goon. A goon that will pretty much always get himself lynched in this game.

[alannalynn]

hi Yates

[Zander?]

morning peeps

 

catching up and prolly around for a little bit!!!!

[Zander?]

ALLLLLLLLlAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!

[alannalynn]

ALLLLLLLLlAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!

ZANDDEERRRRRRRRRRRRRR HI DARLING HOW ARE YOUUUUUU?????????????

[Zander?]

Does it make any sense for town!Yates to, knowing Clov was town, openly sheep him to do a complete flip on his stances on Lenlo and Cory?

 

 

not gonna lie the swing around was a little off to me.

[Zander?]

 

ALLLLLLLLlAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!

ZANDDEERRRRRRRRRRRRRR HI DARLING HOW ARE YOUUUUUU?????????????

 

 

 

tired as hell....lol my buddy called drunk at 5:00 am ish to go pick him up about 45 mins away.

[Thane Vakarian]

30 bloody pages.... i've skimmed 30 pages... 

 

and Lenlo is dead, and wolf. Gods why did i buy his claim..? Should have known better....

 

i need to rethink my entire suspect pool....

 

Can't blame you all for sussing me, i've been stupid enough to believe Len. And i missed the entire EOD.. ugh...