Belichick - Mafia Eternal Night

[Verbal32]

Verbal, if you are legit town with a vig I'd like to hear your thoughts on who you're shooting. I mean, you would know there is a wolf lurking outside of the poe somewhere. You're an experienced player. I can't honestly say that if I were in your shoes I would 100% shoot Rand. I don't know what you're planning to do but certain players are pretty impressively clear right now and I don't want you to make a bad mistake for lack of having been around for much of this game. If you're behind and need some key quotes summaries or something let us help you. And absolutely do not leave us hanging end of night phase, wondering if a kill came from you or scum.

I'd rather the wolves wonder if I'm bluffing or not.

[Andrej]

 

 

It's called GOATing Rand.

hehe its satisfying to read this and know you're wrong :P

 

Even more satisfying to know that its very possible that I'm going to have a better batting average then you in this game.

 

Then it gets less satisfying if you're scum and just doing a good job of leading town away from actual scum. :(

Pretty sure I just sus'd out and cased a wolf on actual thread content while you were busy making up NK theories to reinforce your scum read. Keep reaching though

[BFG]

 

 

I'm awake (barely) and catching up. I don't know why we're voting Hally though, this is basiclaly the only time I've town read her which is odd but I think good;; and I'm pretty sure I don't get the argument against Shad, though. He's high on my list with Zander at this point.

 

Zander, not sure why you're voting Talya, I've got her in ??? until I can figure her out better, like BFG.

  

 

 

@ Alanna  for town to win we need to be on the same page.  please re read Talya!!!

 

I reread her tomorrow but I don't think she's the way to go today

 

Page 16 and not going to get to the end before deadline.

Thus far I'm liking Hallia at a general level, she's commenting, forming reads from the major events although quiet.

Possible ping in that I think I remember from her reread today not liking Yates early (from earlier today) but when she initially read the thread Yates/AH were her town reads. I can't check this right now though and remember liking more from her posts than that is a negative, if that makes sense.

I dont see Talyas earlier ISOs from mafia, particularly the one on Thane.

Not particularly happy with either of these trains

 

I think Hally initially had a town read on Yates but moved him down after he cleared Zander/Talya with the test.

 

I'm caught up now, I did respond to your question on Dice and would like your thoughts

  

 

 

 

 

 

 

Laine

Re Dice. I can sort of see what you mean, and need to read ME in context. In ISO Dice in ME sounds nothing like Dice in SW or here based on conviction and tone. It's not the action, although partly that, but the way he does it. He builds up to the vote in ME, in SW he votes straight away. This is different because he votes and reasons afterwards, but the tone/language is closer to SW than ME

Town pending more info imo

 

I see what you're getting at, I think? I may need to re evaluate my read on him, but I still didn't really like his reaction to my comment. It feels like he's trying to make something out of my frustration with his joke vote.

I get it and I need to read him in ME in context, but he's nowhere near my wtl list if not yet out of tinfoil territory.

I'd also like AJ/Yates opinion here they read him ~well

I probably need to do that too, I didn't read too much in context since I played the games. I remember town reading Dice more when he was mafia than town though.

  

@ Dice: really wish you wouldn't, I don't know what to say to make you think I'm town at this point and I feel like you're going to tunnel me from here on out, so I'm sorry if it seemed I snapped back at you, I was annoyed at your entrance: it was really out of place at that point in the game. The tone was different because their votes were at a certain stage and yours was at an entirely different one. I'm just letting you know how I saw it, but you're calling it placing blame on you; I don't get where you're getting at with that?

 

@Zander

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i get the feeling that we're still missing a few players..... hopefully they will get in before DL

 

i contemplate voting Yates... he rands wolf way too often, so it'd be an excellent D1 guess imo

 

 

Only if he claims Mason (which has already been said - always late to the party)

 

 

 

i get the feeling that we're still missing a few players..... hopefully they will get in before DL

 

i contemplate voting Yates... he rands wolf way too often, so it'd be an excellent D1 guess imo

 

 

According to the CCSOWH if Yates looks towny D1 ignore him if not,,,,,,,,lolololol

 

Yates actually looking more towny thus far then in SW imo.

 

Why do you think he is more towny right now. The only person I have is slight lean on AJ, as he started the don't vig n1

 

 

 

yeah, i think the vigs should mainly holster. like i said, it'd be town suicide. And, i think it was yates who said that we need a smaller POE, so we're ore certain to hit wolves. With quite the amount of vigs... it'd make sense.

 

On the other hand... wolves also have vig shots, next to their regular NK? that'd be a possible massacre for town N1. On the other hand, the pool ofsuspects would be smaller.... ugh... posibillites and choices....

 

True, I like waiting for a smaller POE before people start vigging. No need to pull a Zander/Notbob, both killed strong townies N1.

 

 

1 Wolf 2x vigilante1 Wolf 1x vigilante1 Wolf 1x vigilante

 

Do you think they have an NK on top of the vig shots? If they did, theoretically they could kill 4 people N1 with that.

 

I think if they had nightkills as well, this could be over pretty quick. to me looks like they just have those 4, but this is a Darthe game, besides, I think that would be a too powerful wolf team.

 

 

 

SHOULD the wolves use their vig shots N1, the pool of suspects would get rather small. So, imo, they have a NK as well. It's going to be interesting how this will play out

 

 

imo obv solution LUNCH all wolves!!

 

so out your team mates now then yes?

 

1st Bold= Ive played i 3 games with Yates and Ive read him right in all....you played SW right....I think my Yates reads probably good.  its early but hes towny to me.

 

2nd Bold= .......I hope this was a joke cause Im obv town.

 

See above:  Trying to create WINFoM for the town early on

I didn't think enough had been said to decide yet.

 

It was a joke, but you're not obv town to me, this game is still to early to tell.

 

 

also questions by read on Yates by saying not enough to go on when hes certainly not playing the same as in SW but yes giving a town lean on AJ for like one thing.,  its not a problem with the read its her reasoning.

 

 

I have no energy to ISO nor trim quotes, so spoiler tags it is. Was this still in the RVS joke phase of d1? The first part has that vibe to it, imo. I don't see how that's setting up wifom.

Second point: null, not much to say here

 

 

Yeah last quote spews Dice even clearer. First 2 'might' look bad for Talya, but in context with everything else Talya looks great still.

[Shad_]

"I don't know what to say to make you think I'm town at this point" pretty convincingly clears Dice imo.

[BFG]

 

 

 

 

 

Verbal's post I'm quoting from: Here

 

Ouch.  All that green is you giving yourself an out to change reads.  Lots of "cautiously" putting people in a pile, and needing further review.  Spoken like a wolf that wants to commit to as few reads as possible, and is happy playing off of everybody else.

As for the red....huh?  You're saying the wolves killed Pral to literally incriminate you?  Why?  You weren't being a town leader, and you weren't a lynch candidate going into D2.  Why would the wolves kill Pral based on what you're saying?  Am I missing your point here, or are you actually saying they killed Pral to create wifom on you?

 

 I'm really not trying to give myself an out, I'm just not finding the time I needed to thoroughly read some of these players. I wouldn't say I'm on the fence with BFG, I have her in town and I want to move her up more with an ISO; she's staying up there. Talya I have in town but I'm reserved about it because of Zander's insistence that she's scum. Dice was the only one I was truly fence sitting on, but he is in my bottom three with Thane and Rand who I wouldn't mind lynching atp.

Second part: No not to incriminate me, but me and Hally. The mafia couldn't have known that Hallia really would be vigged, so they could be setting up her lynch for the next day. That's what I meant by knowing her alignment and mine.

If Hallia had not been killed last night, would Pral's death have made you suspicious of her?

With how Yates was going after her? Maybe maybe not. I wouldn't ignore the possibility that that's why they killed him, but that's then and there.

 

 

 

This is jumping ahead a bit but if w/w Rand was more likely to shoot last night because he was more likely to get lynched today.

 

That is jumping ahead, I'm very sure Rand is mafia, but I'm town and not a vig.

Are you suggesting something or is this just worded funny?

Worded funny.

 

 

 

 

This is jumping ahead a bit but if w/w Rand was more likely to shoot last night because he was more likely to get lynched today.

 

That is jumping ahead, I'm very sure Rand is mafia, but I'm town and not a vig.

Are you suggesting something or is this just worded funny?

 

Alanna things are starting to look really bad on you now.  Are you claiming VT or doc.  I teetering on you atp. your answer may determine your fate imo.

I am vanilla town right now and being that I already claimed that, I'm probably NOT claiming doc lol, I know who the doc is though, fwiw

 

 

 

This is jumping ahead a bit but if w/w Rand was more likely to shoot last night because he was more likely to get lynched today.

 

I wasn't here during night, remember I popped in thinking it was day 1, and it was day 2.

You just...

is this...

did this post just happen?

Scummy scummy is scummy. Why are we not voting him again? I repeat: Why the freaking heck aren't we lynching this wolf instead of me?

 

 

BTW if y'all are going to only respond to one part of a quote, cut it down omg

 

I remember flipping out in DT when Eldrick started making awkward reads like these during the final day phase of Star Wars, because he was painting such a huge target on himself that I thought it would suck all of the attention back off of Yates.  I think at this point we have to stop asking whether Rand's thought process makes sense and ask instead whether his conclusions push a scum agenda.  (Pretty sure they do but I'm going to give it a second read.)  And we have to look at his interplay with Laine especially.

 

If Rand and Laine are w/w, we are in great shape.  If they are v/v, we are totally lost.  I don't even want to humor v/v here because I'd like to think 64 pages have gotten us somewhere.  I'm not completely ruling out w/v yet, and I don't want to all in on Rand tonight until we've sorted it out.  We need to lynch with the objective of best possible chance to eliminate a scum vig shot.  If we end up resolving on w/w, we lynch Laine, both because Rand would have been more likely to shoot between the two of them (he was likely to get lynched today) and because Rand argued that he wasn't around during night phase.  (If w/w the only plausible reason I see for him to say this is because I was right about Laine still having an NK and his being burnt.)

 

Town with me here?

 

And now to dig in to this mess.

 

So you're saying that you want to lynch me instead of a wolf in the event that we're both wolves so that you can eliminate a vig shot? I can assure you that Rand and I are w/v, at this point I have no doubts. He's trying to get me lynched so he can use his shot tonight because as he claimed "he wasn't around" last night to use it.

 

 

@Zander/Thane - would you consider moving to Laine?

If you two plus me move over that will be hammer and at the very least we can guarantee a lynch.

 

 

i will but I think Rands flip confirms BOTH Alanna and Talya imo.  Im really thinking it gives more game solve.  Rand flips Town Talya is a Wolf  Rand flips Wolf it confirms Alanna a Wolf.  Thoughts?

So now you're willing to vote Rand? Why not before? And how does Talya connect to Rand, feels like you're reaching there, Zander. I think you just want anyone to be a wolf with Talya at this point so that you can lynch her, which I find odd because she's being heavily town read. At least in SW there was solid proof Yates was mafia but here you don't have the same benefits. If she ends up flipping mafia though, hats off to you for being right again when no once else would listen.

 

 

I think this makes it pretty clear IM WAITING on Alanna's answer before I vote.  Ive said I would consider switching and her answer will determine that.  I made my thoughts about Rand because they were there and I wanted a sounding board.  I also like the idea of what SHAD said concerning Rand's flip.  And if Alanna does freaking flip wolf I will die inside.  I had her as town most of the game till recently so this will be shame on me but shame on you for betraying me!!!!.  Want to give her the chance to answer my question before passing judgement as it will cement things for me.

 

Zander are you seriously turning against me? You know I'm town, you believed me in the last few games and we swept mafia together. One game that I play like crap shouldn't be enough for me to get lynched. Believe me this time when I say that Rand is the way to go and not me.

 

 

Ok were well into WIFOM territory, but does that appeal to Zander ever come from teammates?

[BFG]

I'm done for the night.

 

Glgl all

[Andrej]

"I don't know what to say to make you think I'm town at this point" pretty convincingly clears Dice imo.

Agreed.

[Andrej]

I think it's Rand/Verb an overwhelming amount of time here.

 

Verb basically doesn't want to work with town on the merit of wifom and Rand is continuing to act as if there is no reason to be suspicious of him. Like it sort of baffles me lol. Ignoring everything and everyone calling you wolf doesn't clear you, bro.

[Shad_]

Laine's wishy-wash back and forth with Thane never pinged me about her personally before the flip because most of us went back and forth with him.  In hindsight I'm thinking she knows he's an easy mislynch but she doesn't want to be left with reads that don't match the town average so she's trying to go with the flow and it just gets messy.  I think as a scum mate she more steadily soft defends him here because there's leverage for her to do so without looking scummy.  Or else she just kind of stays out of that discussion.

[Andrej]

 

Also Verb coming in and hard clearing a bunch of players (including Talya) looks a lot like his approach in SW.

Actually, it looks like what I did in ME. Check.

I'm sorry you randed wolf again, dude.

[Andrej]

Laine taking advice from her "null read" BFG on Dice could mean she knows BFG is being legit.

[RandA lThor]

 

 

It's called GOATing Rand.

hehe its satisfying to read this and know you're wrong :P

 

Even more satisfying to know that its very possible that I'm going to have a better batting average then you in this game.

 

Then it gets less satisfying if you're scum and just doing a good job of leading town away from actual scum. :(

Pretty sure I just sus'd out and cased a wolf on actual thread content while you were busy making up NK theories to reinforce your scum read. Keep reaching though

 

Pretty sure you were a lot slower on figuring out that she was a wolf than I was. Get on my level AJ.

 

I think it's Rand/Verb an overwhelming amount of time here.

 

Verb basically doesn't want to work with town on the merit of wifom and Rand is continuing to act as if there is no reason to be suspicious of him. Like it sort of baffles me lol. Ignoring everything and everyone calling you wolf doesn't clear you, bro.

I've literally answered and responded to all the cases of me that I could find. But maybe if you keep making stuff up you can save some time for yourself before you get lynched or vigged

[Andrej]

Phase should be ending within the hour btw.

 

Please, please stay focused to my villagers out there. Don't give the wolves any relief - you hold them under water and watch them flounder. No mercy for the enemy.

[BFG]

I'll Iso Dice again tomorrow in this game and cliche (think he was bussing a teammate in that one) to dot I's and cross t's, but Dice is mafia here approximately never.

[Andrej]

LOL Rand. Save the bravado bro. Your D1 case was clearly tmi but good job outing yourself trying to distance from a wolfmate. You were this close to getting lynched for it but shockingly one confirmed wolf just happened to miss the opportunity to vote you. Please...

 

And seriously I DARE you to kill me and explain to the pack of angry villagers ready to rip you apart the next phase that you did it thinking I was scum. Go for it, man.

[Shad_]

I think it's Rand/Verb an overwhelming amount of time here.

 

Verb basically doesn't want to work with town on the merit of wifom and Rand is continuing to act as if there is no reason to be suspicious of him. Like it sort of baffles me lol. Ignoring everything and everyone calling you wolf doesn't clear you, bro.

 

I've been skimming back over a lot of stuff today and the only fishy interaction with Laine I'm finding is coming from Rand.  If there's a town player between Rand and Verbal I don't know where I'd go.  Not touching you or Dice unless it's F3 with you me and Dice, seriously.  Zander/Talya/BFG/Thane, meh, everyone is super chilll with Thane at this point--even Rand and Verbal.  I would lynch Zander before BFG and Talya personally, especially if Rand's scum and Verbal's town.  A gut thing?  I don't know, maybe I don't trust his lolololols as much when he's not plowing down scum like a freight train?  Maybe just because he hasn't really articulated his reads on Talya/BFG but I know that's not alignment indicative for him.  BFG is kicking butt on the research side of the game, she's just not putting her money where her mouth is.  If Rand flips scum Talya lead two scum lynches straight out the gate and I would have to consider Thane alongside her.  Rand v Verbal w doesn't make her quite as clear.  Realistically we'd probably have room for three lynches between the four of them.  If scum only have 1 shot left we've already won short of the dumbest town hero shot in the universe.

[Shad_]

Think it's time to chill out and enjoy the ride though because I don't see Rand or Verbal flipping town under the current circumstances.  My guess is they're praying for a helping hand from hero shots at this point.

[Andrej]

You mean like Rand vigging me if he isn't a wolf? Lol

[seph]

There are two hours left ish until nights ends.

Please get all your night actions in!

[Shad_]

You mean like Rand vigging me if he isn't a wolf? Lol

 

Thought crossed my mind.

[Andrej]

Just wanna go on record saying that if Rand backs down from shooting Verb although he said he would and instead shoots me on some BS that I "moved ahead in scumminess" or whatever you tear that SOAB wolf apart mercilessly.

[Shad_]

But even then he'd probably double up with a scum shot.

[Andrej]

 

 

You mean like Rand vigging me if he isn't a wolf? Lol

Thought crossed my mind.

Seriously if this happens and he flips town afterwards... I don't even know. WOAT Vig candidate since we're making a Records thread for mafia games now

[Andrej]

There's one reason why Rand shoots and Verb doesn't die. Be ready for this scenario D3

Reiterating with phase change looming. Don't be surprised to see only one death that makes sense as a NK and for Rand to say he shot Verb and nothing happened. Literally the only way this works is if Verb is the doc because he gets saved tonight ~never by any doc who has played mafia before.

 

That or Rand pulls the balliest wolf move ever and shoots me hoping people will clear him on it despite EVERYTHING in this game that points to me being a wolf never that he obviously isn't seeing or deciding to ignore. If this happens, seriously, any villager left alive should have 1 post on D3:

 

[v]Rand[/v]

 

For AJ.

And that's it :)

[Andrej]

&& @Zander - although I know vigging town reads would make sense to you, don't let Rand get a pass for it

 

Pretty sure I can count on Dice, Thane and BFG to avenge me though.

 

Shad knows what's up but we're probably both dead soon :(