[Standard] 11/10 Top Tier Vanilla+ Game Thread

[DPR]

Pushers gonna push indeed. But what do the pushees do? You seeing some of the things I have, wes?

 

It's different times and different styles, for certain. Some are good, some are not. We'll see how things play out, but logic never dies. heh

[Barmacral]

heh

There we are, now it feels like a game with wes.

 

FYI in school right now, following the game but can't really post until the evening.

[hazelkrs1]

 

 

 

SUPGATE - Salami soft serves an invitation to make hay. Darthe and Womby bite, but at different ends and the ball starts rolling. HWSIDI moment?

 

Darthe is so weary. Like, depressing weary. Why so serious?

 

D1 Yates decides to make a "Just Say No To Drugs" speech and claim Seer to clear Dice. That's like, really really town. Really.

 

Pushers gonna push.

What does bolded mean DPR? I actually understand very little of that entire paragraph, not sure what you're referring to

 

And do you really think Yates is the seer? Or do you think him providing seer cover makes him likely to be town?

I think your "Seer Seer Cover" play is interesting.

 

I'm just wondering why you feel the need to tell us how Yates is playing.

 

He's a big boy and can speak for himself.

What about the first part of my post- I still don't know what you were saying with bolded

 

And I wasn't trying to talk for him. Again, seer cover is fairly common in other places. Highly doubt Yates was claiming there as the real seer.

 

Again- do you think he was telling the truth? It kinda defeats the point of Seer cover to admit it's Seer cover, so I doubt Yates will say so. I'm interested in your opinion here Wes.

[hazelkrs1]

"Tone reading"? As in people are playing/acting differently as town or scum? Wow, had no idea I was so missed.

It's actually more to do with "gut" than meta, but I wasn't trying to say it's a new thing- it's just a big trend lately.

[hazelkrs1]

Pop quiz, hotshots. What's the goal of Day 1? Want to see how far you've fallen

Generate as much activity (within reason) as possible and on as many players as possible, and then lynch the candidate who gives town both the best chance for catching scum and the most info going forward

[Darthe]

 

 Salami and Verb both are meh currently but Des and Barm look good despite both being eh on me IMO.  I wouldn't try to link anything yet.  

 

I saw it. Looked wolfy. Like you were trying to lay some bait out and see if others followed.

 

Def not much to back up a wolf connection between us so far (I also have the advantage of KNOWING were not scum together) so it seemed meh and lazy

 

I'm town, Thane so your connection makes no sense to me. Furthermore, i couldn't even see what on earth made you say that. So what sort of reaction did you expect?

 

Des looks so genuine this round that it's heightening my concern of Salami.  Look at how out of shape he got over this.  Also, you two gave vastly different responses to the same accusation to the same person.  Both were equally self centered but beyond that...  DES how can you place your POV on someone and try to push them for not knowing what you know about your alignment?  Salami why the overreaction?

 

Really don't like the angle that Darthe is pushing here- that his reads on hydras are muddled because of the different behavior of each hydra head. He has enough experience with hydras to know how they work and how having multiple people to get a read on actually gives you an ADVANTAGE in resolving that slot. Instead it looks like him trying to lay foundation for waffling on either of us multiple times.

 

And to respond to his query to me: Uh, I wasn't? I was saying that I DO have the advantage of knowing my alignment, and that he doesn't, but that from an outside POV I don't think there was enough evidence there to connect Verb and I as scumbros. Savvy?

 

 I expected from your first couple of posts that you'd be scumreading me this game and that's actually okay with me considering how often we've done this together.  At least for now.  However, this here isn't okay.  It's something you've accused more than me of in this game and isn't actually either accurate or scummy behavior.  The advantage of hydras is indeed that you can read two different people to determine the slots.  However, that also intrinsically allows for two reads.  Des you can't join up with Salami and then be pissed when he pulls you down a bit, you actually make complaints earlier in the thread about Verb and Barm looking different to you.  

 

Also your response to my earlier question makes sense but I don't think his conjecture was as out of whack as you seem to.

 

I think Des is town here so far but from the above and history I'm expecting the tunnel through this one.  

[DPR]

 

 

 

SUPGATE - Salami soft serves an invitation to make hay. Darthe and Womby bite, but at different ends and the ball starts rolling. HWSIDI moment?

 

Darthe is so weary. Like, depressing weary. Why so serious?

 

D1 Yates decides to make a "Just Say No To Drugs" speech and claim Seer to clear Dice. That's like, really really town. Really.

 

Pushers gonna push.

What does bolded mean DPR? I actually understand very little of that entire paragraph, not sure what you're referring to

 

And do you really think Yates is the seer? Or do you think him providing seer cover makes him likely to be town?

I think your "Seer Seer Cover" play is interesting.

 

I'm just wondering why you feel the need to tell us how Yates is playing.

 

He's a big boy and can speak for himself.

What about the first part of my post- I still don't know what you were saying with bolded

 

I'll wait to comment. I'd like to see who does know what I'm saying.

 

And I wasn't trying to talk for him. Again, seer cover is fairly common in other places. Highly doubt Yates was claiming there as the real seer.

 

Regardless of what you were trying to do, you did talk for him. And you did this not by offering your opinion, but by brow-beating Dice, implying that he was not playing well. Claiming authority is a technique that can be used for either side, but doing it on D1 - in my experience - is usually the province of noobs or those with a desire to set up agendas. 

 

Again- do you think he was telling the truth? It kinda defeats the point of Seer cover to admit it's Seer cover, so I doubt Yates will say so. I'm interested in your opinion here Wes.

 

My opinion is that when putting together a blind puzzle with 100 pieces, don't lay out the first 7 pieces and guess what the picture will be. You'll trip yourself every time.

 

 

I'm in blue above.

[hazelkrs1]

Wow Darthe is scum.

 

First of all Darthe, I didn't complain about having diff reads on Verb and Barm. I didn't realize they were hydra until very recently. So my diff reads were because I thought it was two slots I was looking at.

 

Second I'm not complaining about Salami "bringing me down". I'm saying YOU being all wordy about us being a hydra and blah blah blah looks scummy cause you can town read me and then turn around and scum read Salami later to justify a vote or push on him

 

And lastly the thing that tells me you're definite scum here is the way you try and discredit my push against you as just me tunneling on you again. Way to expose yourself bro

 

##[unvote]

 

[V]##Darthe[/v]

[Darthe]

SUPGATE - Salami soft serves an invitation to make hay. Darthe and Womby bite, but at different ends and the ball starts rolling. HWSIDI moment? 

 

Darthe is so weary. Like, depressing weary. Why so serious?

 

D1 Yates decides to make a "Just Say No To Drugs" speech and claim Seer to clear Dice. That's like, really really town. Really.

 

Pushers gonna push.

 

I don't feel serious or weary?

[hazelkrs1]

 

Where did I imply Dice was playing poorly?

 

I also don't know what "claiming authority" means, excuse my noobship

[DPR]

 

 

 Salami and Verb both are meh currently but Des and Barm look good despite both being eh on me IMO.  I wouldn't try to link anything yet.  

 

I saw it. Looked wolfy. Like you were trying to lay some bait out and see if others followed.

 

Def not much to back up a wolf connection between us so far (I also have the advantage of KNOWING were not scum together) so it seemed meh and lazy

 

I'm town, Thane so your connection makes no sense to me. Furthermore, i couldn't even see what on earth made you say that. So what sort of reaction did you expect?

 

Des looks so genuine this round that it's heightening my concern of Salami.  Look at how out of shape he got over this.  Also, you two gave vastly different responses to the same accusation to the same person.  Both were equally self centered but beyond that...  DES how can you place your POV on someone and try to push them for not knowing what you know about your alignment?  Salami why the overreaction?

 

Really don't like the angle that Darthe is pushing here- that his reads on hydras are muddled because of the different behavior of each hydra head. He has enough experience with hydras to know how they work and how having multiple people to get a read on actually gives you an ADVANTAGE in resolving that slot. Instead it looks like him trying to lay foundation for waffling on either of us multiple times.

 

And to respond to his query to me: Uh, I wasn't? I was saying that I DO have the advantage of knowing my alignment, and that he doesn't, but that from an outside POV I don't think there was enough evidence there to connect Verb and I as scumbros. Savvy?

 

 I expected from your first couple of posts that you'd be scumreading me this game and that's actually okay with me considering how often we've done this together.  At least for now.  However, this here isn't okay.  It's something you've accused more than me of in this game and isn't actually either accurate or scummy behavior.  The advantage of hydras is indeed that you can read two different people to determine the slots.  However, that also intrinsically allows for two reads.  Des you can't join up with Salami and then be pissed when he pulls you down a bit, you actually make complaints earlier in the thread about Verb and Barm looking different to you.  

 

Also your response to my earlier question makes sense but I don't think his conjecture was as out of whack as you seem to.

 

I think Des is town here so far but from the above and history I'm expecting the tunnel through this one.  

 

 

I love the smell of martyrs on D1. Reminds me of... mafia.

[csarmi]

How am i dragging Despo doqn, Darthe?

[csarmi]

Please advise. Should i start distancing from Des?

[Darthe]

Wow Darthe is scum.

 

First of all Darthe, I didn't complain about having diff reads on Verb and Barm. I didn't realize they were hydra until very recently. So my diff reads were because I thought it was two slots I was looking at.

 

Second I'm not complaining about Salami "bringing me down". I'm saying YOU being all wordy about us being a hydra and blah blah blah looks scummy cause you can town read me and then turn around and scum read Salami later to justify a vote or push on him

 

And lastly the thing that tells me you're definite scum here is the way you try and discredit my push against you as just me tunneling on you again. Way to expose yourself bro

 

##[unvote]

 

[V]##Darthe[/v]

 

 

From the above and history I'm expecting the tunnel through this one.  

 

 

 

See Des, if I was to do something like this it would be discrediting you by brushing off your line of reasoning as just the way Des tunnels.  

 

I'm not doing that (except in an ironic way to make a point above).  Simple fact: Des tunnels people.  It's not conjecture whatsoever and despite your denial you inevitably do do so, which is how I knew you would the instant you brought up my name in early game.  As I said before, if you want to argue with me and go through this whole thing again then fine but at least bring some decent reasoning before you start.  The whole "Darthe should know Hydras better" thing doesn't hold water since I have always treated Hydras this way.  

 

How am i dragging Despo doqn, Darthe?

 

Is that a serious question?

[Darthe]

 

 

 

 Salami and Verb both are meh currently but Des and Barm look good despite both being eh on me IMO.  I wouldn't try to link anything yet.  

 

I saw it. Looked wolfy. Like you were trying to lay some bait out and see if others followed.

 

Def not much to back up a wolf connection between us so far (I also have the advantage of KNOWING were not scum together) so it seemed meh and lazy

 

I'm town, Thane so your connection makes no sense to me. Furthermore, i couldn't even see what on earth made you say that. So what sort of reaction did you expect?

 

Des looks so genuine this round that it's heightening my concern of Salami.  Look at how out of shape he got over this.  Also, you two gave vastly different responses to the same accusation to the same person.  Both were equally self centered but beyond that...  DES how can you place your POV on someone and try to push them for not knowing what you know about your alignment?  Salami why the overreaction?

 

Really don't like the angle that Darthe is pushing here- that his reads on hydras are muddled because of the different behavior of each hydra head. He has enough experience with hydras to know how they work and how having multiple people to get a read on actually gives you an ADVANTAGE in resolving that slot. Instead it looks like him trying to lay foundation for waffling on either of us multiple times.

 

And to respond to his query to me: Uh, I wasn't? I was saying that I DO have the advantage of knowing my alignment, and that he doesn't, but that from an outside POV I don't think there was enough evidence there to connect Verb and I as scumbros. Savvy?

 

 I expected from your first couple of posts that you'd be scumreading me this game and that's actually okay with me considering how often we've done this together.  At least for now.  However, this here isn't okay.  It's something you've accused more than me of in this game and isn't actually either accurate or scummy behavior.  The advantage of hydras is indeed that you can read two different people to determine the slots.  However, that also intrinsically allows for two reads.  Des you can't join up with Salami and then be pissed when he pulls you down a bit, you actually make complaints earlier in the thread about Verb and Barm looking different to you.  

 

Also your response to my earlier question makes sense but I don't think his conjecture was as out of whack as you seem to.

 

I think Des is town here so far but from the above and history I'm expecting the tunnel through this one.  

 

 

I love the smell of martyrs on D1. Reminds me of... mafia.

 

DPR y u so confusing today?

 

Also, if Seer I checked DPR N0 and

 

 

 

town

 

 

[csarmi]

It is a serious question Darthe. What did i do that you dislike cause i cant follow you.

[csarmi]

And a DARTHE i cant follow is usually a bad sign.

[DPR]

Pique. It's what's for breakfast.

[Darthe]

It is a serious question Darthe. What did i do that you dislike cause i cant follow you.

I don't specifically dislike you though you've thrown out a few meh points.  You bring Des down because he is a much more conscientious and careful player than you are and so he simply speaks better.  He naturally looks more townie than you do.

[Verbal32]

Vanilla+ Setup1 Wolf (Godfather OR 1x Bulletproof)1 Wolf Roleblocker1 Wolf N1 Vig1 Wolf N2 Vig1 Serial Killer (Godfather OR 1x Bulletproof)1 Village Seer1 Village Jailkeeper1 Village Odd-Night Vig1 Village Even-Night Vig11 Vanilla Villagers *polite cough* _______Interesting defense. But you are missing the point. Town's advantage is numbers. Nks harm that advantage - sk + scum kill plus vig kill hitting town eats into that advantage pretty quickly.

Ok, but that doesn't address my point. You voted somebody for potentially having a NK. Now you're trying to twist that into ME defending.

 

Nice try, but no.

[Kivam]

 

Vanilla+ Setup1 Wolf (Godfather OR 1x Bulletproof)1 Wolf Roleblocker1 Wolf N1 Vig1 Wolf N2 Vig1 Serial Killer (Godfather OR 1x Bulletproof)1 Village Seer1 Village Jailkeeper1 Village Odd-Night Vig1 Village Even-Night Vig11 Vanilla Villagers *polite cough* _______Interesting defense. But you are missing the point. Town's advantage is numbers. Nks harm that advantage - sk + scum kill plus vig kill hitting town eats into that advantage pretty quickly.

Ok, but that doesn't address my point. You voted somebody for potentially having a NK. Now you're trying to twist that into ME defending.

 

Nice try, but no.

 

 

I voted someone who implied he had a NK.

 

You jumped in attacking me for the vote, mumbling about how "NK" doesn't necessarily mean anti-town, and trying to shift the read onto me.  If you think anyone needs to twist that into "defending", I'm curious what your definition of the term "defending" is.

[hazelkrs1]

I don't deny that I tunnel people, but if I'm tunneling scum, it's good for town, and likewise scum would rather dismiss my suspicions as the ramblings of a crazy tunneler

 

DPR evading my questioning is noted btw.

[hazelkrs1]

Holy crap Kivam can quote!

 

 

Also, "defending/not defending" argument is boring imo. So very tomato/tomato (what? You say tomayto/tomahto, I say tomato/tomato)

[Yates]

I'd like to put this "let's not cheat" post to bed by pointing out the logic implied by Des's summation here:

Look at the whole #Alliance thing. If one of that group rolls scum, you think they'll back down from forming a "town" power core with the other members of it who are actually town? Hell to the nah. They'll act like they're ready to #alliance it up just like normal.

Des basically just stated why me saying up front that we can't play that way is a Town null tell. If I'm scum? Why not abuse it since I *DIDN'T* get a chance to say it pregame? I gain nothing as scum pointing this out and instead make myself a huge suspect - at least in AJ and Dice's eyes. So there is zero scum motivation for making this post.

My Town personal motivation is obviously because I actually care about the integrity of the game. Which was my stated motivation in my original post.  Okay?  Good?  Good.

[hazelkrs1]

I'd like to put this "let's not cheat" post to bed by pointing out the logic implied by Des's summation here:

Look at the whole #Alliance thing. If one of that group rolls scum, you think they'll back down from forming a "town" power core with the other members of it who are actually town? Hell to the nah. They'll act like they're ready to #alliance it up just like normal.

Des basically just stated why me saying up front that we can't play that way is a Town null tell. If I'm scum? Why not abuse it since I *DIDN'T* get a chance to say it pregame? I gain nothing as scum pointing this out and instead make myself a huge suspect - at least in AJ and Dice's eyes. So there is zero scum motivation for making this post.

 

My Town personal motivation is obviously because I actually care about the integrity of the game. Which was my stated motivation in my original post. Okay? Good? Good.

The only caveat here is that you COULD be scum and ALSO value the "integrity" of the "Three Amigos/soulread with Dice" thing, and wanted to preempt AJ and Dice being able to use that against you.