[Standard] 11/10 Top Tier Vanilla+ Game Thread

[Andrej]

To be clear I don't think Nyn fits as a wolf but I can certainly see her as a SK. I think Wombat was making good points where she was trying to stay very much in the middle on a lot of issues.

[Thane Vakarian]

@Hallia: who are your suspects? interested in who you'd pick besides me (i'm most definately town)

[Hallia]

I'm pretty confident with you. Otherwise Atm Dice is my other.

[Thane Vakarian]

dice? hmm... interesting. He's sorta floating in the middle for me... 

[Andrej]

 

Vote Count D2.17:Kivam (3): AJ [#2373], Deslami [#2623], Darthe [#2728]

Verbarm (3): Nyn [#2192], Saladtosser [#2202], Pral [#2500]

AJ (3): Verbarm [#2562], Kivam [#2785], Wombat [#2797]

Pral (1): Thane [#1931]

Wombat (1): DPR [#2730]

Unvote (1): Cass [#2187]

Not Voting (4): Hallia, Krak, Rags, TressAt the gallows: Kivam

3x3

Reminder: players not voting at EOD will be voting for themselves.

Sick vote spread. That Kivam wagon just looks so nice. So so nice.

 

For the record, you should probably defer to your hydra for your read on me. I'm probably playing as strong of a villager game as I have in a while and I'm not even really putting a ton of effort in.

[Hallia]

Do you think Yates would have been more or less likely to put a teammate as a peek?

[Thane Vakarian]

less, i think. He'd go for the long run. 

[Thane Vakarian]

work is done, so i'm going to head out. Cyas around all

[Andrej]

With him as the GF? I don't know.

 

The only *possible* motive I can see is that if Dice were to flip wolf later on he could point to that as why he hadn't been NK'd because the wolves would "know" his peek was incorrect and therefore he wasn't the true Seer. But with the high level of bullets flying in this round I'm not sure how good of a strategy this would be.

 

Aside from Yates's interaction, although I haven't been overly impressed with a lot Dice's play (volume wise), I think he comes across genuinely and doesn't seem guarded in his responses.

[Darthe]

The only people I wont lynch today are Des AJ and Hally and Dice.

[Nynaeve]

Rags ISO

 

 

Rags

 

Checks in about a day and a half after the game started, saying he’ll catch up after they secure a lynch in another game.

 

Next post he apologizes for quietness, says his focus was elsewhere.

 

Then he makes a post I remember liking. Town read on both Thane and Sili. Explains well why too. Unsure about Krak. AJ scummy lean (doesn’t specify why). Arsis bad juju. 

 

Next gives Cass a townie read. Soft defends Sili against DPR, saying he gets EMO as town. It’s true lol

 

Then he gives Wombat a hard time at having him in his greens and how he prides himself at being unreadable. I don’t really understand why he would pride himself with it… but ok. Asks him why DPR, Cass, Tress and AJ are placed where they are placed. I think this is pot meet cattle considering Rags dropped reads on Cass and AJ without a visible reason and expressed no read on DPR or Tress at this point.  The way he’s engaging Wombat suggests the placing doesn’t agree with him? Or maybe he doesn't understand why. Not sure.

 

Next post he says DPR is giving him bad juju.

 

Asks Kivam if he considers what he said about Sili being mafiasplaining. Kivam said no.

 

Quotes Darthe saying it’s dangerous to townread Rags this early on. Rags is all… that’s more like it! And says that’s why it bugged him that Wombat was green reading him

 

Wombat explains his placements and pretty much sums up Rags placement as having good juju about him but openly admits that he usually reads Rags better midgame. Rags thanks him and seems satisfied by the response (I guess?).

 

Then he has the back and forth with DPR of new vs old players. Rags accuses him of deflecting.

 

He tells Sili he should give up on trying to read him Okay?

 

Sili asks him to post more so he won’t misread him. Rags says he will (spoiler alert - he doesn't :P).

 

Next post is a day and a half later, after EOD and N1 passed. He didn’t end up voting anyone at all on D1 for that matter. He apologizes for being AWOL. Promises to read through Yates posts.

 

He posts his findings here: http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/91702-standard-1110-top-tier-vanilla-game-thread/page-105?do=findComment&comment=3379899

Seems like a through sum up overall. And at least I can see how he reached his conclusions. He ends it with saying that he has town reads on: Thane, Darthe, Leelou, Stelio, Pral, DPR, Wombat, Kivam, Krak, Tress. Don’t really agree with some of these, but it’s a matter of opinion, really. He says: “I am going to look at AJ, Des/csarmi, Nyn, and dice as people whose interactions with Yates struck me as particularly odd.”

 

He responds to Des questioning his conclusions. He answers well and in detail, imo. Again, don’t necessarily agree, but he seems rather straightforward about it. 

 

Makes a joke about Wombat being scum cause he doesn’t think he’s crazy.

 

Asks people if they have thoughts about his recap.

 

Wombat says he thinks Tress, Desalami and Krak should be null in regards to spew. Rags says fair enough.

 

A little more exchange with Des about Yates spew. Overall seems fine to me.

 

Says DPR looks good from Yates spew.

 

He asks Des why he seems different. Personally I don’t see it.

 

His next post is like 2-3 days later… about 4 hours to DL where he says he has like 15 pages to catch up on….asking how long do we have. He says he could either catch up or YOLO vote. He didn’t end up voting or posting again since….so I guess he chose to catch up? xD   timing kinda bugs me. It also bugs me that up until now he’s yet to cast a single vote. Theorizing and read lists is all good and well but I want him to put his vote where his mouth is.

[Andrej]

I'd probably throw Thane in there too, as much as I know you'll disagree at this time.

 

Pral could be an outlier townie but I want to see more from him. His Verb vote makes me curious in hindsight and I don't remember who he was voting D1.

[Andrej]

Did I mention tone reading is a real thing?

 

[Darthe]

So Nyn where is the analysis in that? I read it and have no better understanding of your view on Rags though I sense you want readers to leave with an opinion on him that amounts to a shrug.

[Darthe]

Did I mention tone reading is a real thing?

 

Is that your reason for including Thane?

 

Also, and I need everyone to answer this, are you currently hunting for the SK or mafia? With one left I expect there to be distinguishment.

[Nynaeve]

@Nyn - probably because Kivam thought he'd get more momentum on my wagon after a few of his buddies expressed interest in keeping him alive. Take notice of his appeal to the masses.

 

"If you want me alive vote AJ" etc

 

Yeah, I can see what you mean. During night time I discussed this with Clov in our QT and my theory was that Verbram was the N2 vig and Kivam was the N1 vig and Kivam was basically trying to get the best out of the situation. IE taking heat off of Verbram (so he could use his N2 shot) while also trying to direct the heat in your direction.

[Hallia]

The answer should be : both

[Andrej]

 

Did I mention tone reading is a real thing?

Is that your reason for including Thane?

Also, and I need everyone to answer this, are you currently hunting for the SK or mafia? With one left I expect there to be distinguishment.

Maybe partially. Bad logical arguments aside I think how Yates/Krak handled him D1 is probably a good thing for his slot. I'm not clearing him but I think there are better lynches for today. If we go through a few and the game is still running I'd reconsider.

[Andrej]

Oh and to answer: I'm looking for the people who I don't see playing from a Village POV. At this point the distinction isn't that important except that the last wolf is slightly stronger because they can potentially block the Vig. Then again they can also block the SK which is still a positive for us.

[Darthe]

The answer should be : both

Yesterday with three mafia I agreed. Today I think people may select one over the other and it makes sense to. SK is more likely to be in that middle range and scum is more likely to be lower down so people are going to focus on them differently if we are being realistic. Itd be nice if folks played the whole field but I dont anticipate that happening.

[Nynaeve]

So Nyn where is the analysis in that? I read it and have no better understanding of your view on Rags though I sense you want readers to leave with an opinion on him that amounts to a shrug.

 

My opinion is that I like his initial read list. I like his spew analysis, if not necessary agree with his conclusions.  I don't like his scarceness. I don't like the fact that he hasn't voted even once at all. I see ideas, I see analysis but I don't see execution. Does this make him scum? I'm not sure. Could be RL and DL time not meshing well together. But that shouldn't really have stopped him from casting a vote before he left.

 

I think Tress actually had bad posts. Bad read list. Also scarceness. Focused on stuff I found kinda unimportant, seems self conscious and isn't really making any sort of sense. Kinda wondering if she has a reason to not wanting us to look at Kivam spew.

 

 

So in a nutshell I feel more confident of Tress being outside of her town range. With Rags I don't know. And I don't have that much experience with him so it's kinda hard for me to sass out his alignment.

[Darthe]

Nyn would it help to know that this is the least active ive ever seen Rags and that he won a champions game against me with Tommy?

[Nynaeve]

Nyn would it help to know that this is the least active ive ever seen Rags and that he won a champions game against me with Tommy?

 

A little. 

 

In your experience does he handle being in more than one game at a time well?

[Darthe]

I dont know tbh.

[dicetosser1]

I'm pretty confident with you. Otherwise Atm Dice is my other.

 

yeah...nah!  wrong tree Hally.

 

Did I mention tone reading is a real thing?

 

 

I did too. Mindmeld! lol

 

 

Did I mention tone reading is a real thing?

 

Is that your reason for including Thane?

 

Also, and I need everyone to answer this, are you currently hunting for the SK or mafia? With one left I expect there to be distinguishment.

 

 

Dont care. am hunting for non town. Dont care which we get first