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This will happen in A MEMORY OF LIGHT:


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Guest Cadsuane
There was also a vision dream of Mat holding a balance scale with his eye on one side and an Aes Sedai on the other. I think we will see pirate Matt with a foxy eye-patch AAARRRRRGH!

Maybe this is him giving an eye to save Moiraine?? Oh! Perhaps he gives up his knowledge of past lives?? He got that knowledge through the Finns, and maybe they will trade it for Moiraine's rescue. The eye might not be literal, but a symbol for knowledge.

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The loss of Mat's eye is almost certainly linked directly to the rescue of Moiraine.

 

Egwene's dream from The Fires of Heaven, chapter 15, describes:

 

Mat throwing dice with blood streaming down his face, the wide brim of his hat pulled low so she could not see his wound, while Thom Merrilin put his hand into a fire to draw out the small blue stone that now dangled on Moiraine's forehead.

 

Thom pulling Moiraine's blue stone out of a fire is almost certainly a reference to the Finn-land rescue, and Mat has blood streaming from a wound high on his face (indicating that it is fresh) while Thom is doing that.

 

 

 

 

There was also a vision dream of Mat holding a balance scale with his eye on one side and an Aes Sedai on the other. I think we will see pirate Matt with a foxy eye-patch AAARRRRRGH!

 

The dream about Mat and the Aes Sedai on scales is in The Path of Daggers, chapter 15, and it describes:

 

Mat, weighing two Aes Sedai on a huge set of balance scales, and on his decision depended...She could not say what; something vast; the world, perhaps.

 

This seems related to the Tower of Ghenjei rescue by implication: the stakes are the same (the world) and the symbolism of the balance scale is often associated with the loss of Mat's eye. It leads one to wonder, however ... who is the second Aes Sedai? Another captive of the Eelfinn? Someone waiting outside the Tower of Ghenjei? An Aes Sedai who follows Mat in?

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[TDR: 25, Questions, 234]

Mat, placing his own left eye on a balance scale.

 

Another of Egwene's dreams. I guess i combined that one and the AS one.

[TEOTW: 15, Strangers and Friends, 181]

MAT: A red eagle, an eye on a balance scale, a dagger with a ruby, a horn, a laughing face

 

Min's viewing on first seeing Mat. The evidence certainly points to Mat literally losing an eye.

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I don't think the eye on the scale should be taken quite literally. I see it as a representation of Mat weighing the decision of giving up his eye to save Moiraine. We know that Min had a viewing of Rand that led her to believe he can't win at TG without the help of a woman she "knows" to be dead (Moiraine), so giving up the eye to rescue Moiraine would be saving the world.

 

There is further foreshadowing in KoD. I don't have the book in front of me so I can't provide references, but perhaps someone can back me up. Mat is disturbed by his memories of dying. Moiraine said that the Finn sort of feed off of human experiences, but was not specific about how they got these experiences. If I remember correctly, Mat believes that the memories came from men who had visited the Finn, but how would the Finn collect the memories that included their deaths? They can't visit the Finn after they're dead. So Mat begins to worry that the Finn are collecting experiences as they occur because they can see through his eyes (or perhaps just 'eye'). This would pose quite a problem in playing a life-and-death game of snakes and foxes with the Finn if they can see everything he sees. I'm speculating here that the world of the Finn that Mat has walked through before becomes the board and Mat, Thom, Noal, and the Finn are the pieces. This is a game you can't win unless you cheat, so they'll need to take some iron and Thom's musical instruments with them.

 

This causes me to wonder, if this is the case, why he wouldn't just wear an eye-patch so the Finn couldn't see what he was up to or where he was going. The only answer I can think of is that they can still see through his eye after he plucks it and he must hand the eye off to Thom or Noal to lay a false trail. This, of course, is just speculation but I think it's plausible and within the character of the story. It seems that although Mat would rather be as far from Aes Sedai as he can get, he's constantly put in a position of risking his neck to save one.

 

By the way, if Rand gets his hand back, I'm going to have to insist that Mat gets his eye back. Somehow I doubt either will happen.

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This causes me to wonder, if this is the case, why he wouldn't just wear an eye-patch so the Finn couldn't see what he was up to or where he was going.

 

Wearing an eyepatch doesn't cause your face to bleed, like Egwene saw.

 

Mat throwing dice with blood streaming down his face, the wide brim of his hat pulled low so she could not see his wound, while Thom Merrilin put his hand into a fire to draw out the small blue stone that now dangled on Moiraine's forehead.

 

(TFoH ch.15)

 

The eye thing has been foreshadowed by the Aelfinn, Min's viewings, and Egwene's Dreams. Not too many things have recieved that much reinforcement.

 

It seems clear that Mat will literally, and intentionally sacrifice his left eye in the course of rescuing Moiraine from the Tower of Ghenjei.

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Wearing an eyepatch doesn't cause your face to bleed' date=' like Egwene saw.[/quote']

Exactly my point. If you had read my post carefully you would have noticed that I wasn't suggesting that Mat was not going to lose an eye. I was suggesting that he wouldn't literally place his eye on a scale. This is just a prophetical metaphor for the choice he has to make between keeping his eye or plucking it to save the world.

 

It seems clear that Mat will literally' date=' and intentionally sacrifice his left eye in the course of rescuing Moiraine from the Tower of Ghenjei.[/quote']

What I have not seen so far is a decent explanation of WHY he loses an eye.

Somehow only the Light knew, the Eelfinn had gathered the memories they had planted in his head, but how could they harvest memory from a corpse? A corpse in the world of men, at that. He was certain they never came to this side of that twisted doorframe ter'angreal for longer than minutes at a time. A way occurred to him, one he did not like, not a scrap. Maybe they created some sort of link to any human who visited them, a link that allowed them to copy all of a man's memories from other men after that right up to the moment he died . . . Burn him, the bloody foxes were inside his head right then! They had to be. It was the only explanation that made sense . . . Could the Eelfinn see through his eyes?

(KoD, ch.8 )

 

What I am suggesting is the reason he plucks his eye is because the Eelfinn can see through it and he can't rescue Moiraine from them if they can see everything he can see. However, if it was as simple as keeping them from seeing through his eye, all he would have to do is cover it. We know that he plucks it, so there has to be an additional reason. I think he plucks it so that he can travel in a different direction than the eye, causing the Eelfinn to believe he is somewhere he isn't, thus allowing him to rescue Moiraine.

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I was suggesting that he wouldn't literally place his eye on a scale. This is just a prophetical metaphor for the choice he has to make between keeping his eye or plucking it to save the world.

 

Oh, ok. Well in that case, I agree.

 

What I am suggesting is the reason he plucks his eye is because the Eelfinn can see through it and he can't rescue Moiraine from them if they can see everything he can see. However, if it was as simple as keeping them from seeing through his eye, all he would have to do is cover it. We know that he plucks it, so there has to be an additional reason. I think he plucks it so that he can travel in a different direction than the eye, causing the Eelfinn to believe he is somewhere he isn't, thus allowing him to rescue Moiraine.

 

Unless the Eelfinn are using the eye itself, and not the impulses that it sends to the brain, then leaving the eye somewhere and moving on would only be the same as covering it up. Besides, given the detailed senses in Mat's memories, the Eelfinn can do more than just see what he's doing. The connection almost has to be in his mind.

 

Personally, and this is purely speculative, I think he will trade the eye for something that gives him or Thom access to Moiraine. Then the boys start cheating and take her out. The Eelfinn might be able to do something with a human eye that we can't, giving the actual organ some value to them, and they've always struck me as more interdimensional merchants than genies. A trade would also give added meaning to the symbolism of the scale.

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I think the Darkhounds are hunting Fain. The Shadow wants him dead because he's a renegade or something.

 

Something else that just struck me while reading KoD: Aviendha found out she can read ter'angreal, and then she picked up one that she said was for "making holes" only they are not quite holes, and to make it work you have to sing the right song. Sounds like something connected to THE Song.

 

But what is holes that aren't holes?

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Something else that just struck me while reading KoD: Aviendha found out she can read ter'angreal' date=' and then she picked up one that she said was for "making holes" only they are not quite holes, and to make it work you have to sing the right song. Sounds like something connected to THE Song.

 

But what is holes that aren't holes?[/quote']

 

I wondered about this, too. I thought maybe it was the ter'angreal for growing the Ways because that's sort of making a hole from one place to another, and it would have been meant to be used by the Ogier who do a lot of singing. Just speculating.

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Maybe Tuon gets wasted in the last battle in some dramtic way and Mat has to choose between her and saving the world. I mean she kinda is his light in rand land and she does own half of it. :D

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I thought maybe it was the ter'angreal for growing the Ways because that's sort of making a hole from one place to another, and it would have been meant to be used by the Ogier who do a lot of singing.

 

Sorry, its not. The men who made the Ways gave the Talisman of Growing to the Ogier, and they still have it.

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RAW, i need some references for that. I think Avi's description makes it almost certain that she was holding A talisman of growing. No reason to think there was only one.

 

The ter'angreal could be used by someone who couldn't channel. All they have to do is sing. And it makes holes that are not holes. Seems silly to think it is not a talisman of growing.

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I also understood it to be a talisman of growing. Maybe the ogiers lost theirs (unlikely) or there were several made for the various stedding.

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In The Shadow Rising, ch. 43, Loial describes to Perrin how a Waygate would become unusable if both leaves were removed. He then says:

 

"The only means of opening the Gate again will be for the Elders to bring the Talisman of Growing.”

 

In other words, the Ogier Elders have it, and there is only one.

 

Another supporting comment:

 

"When the last Aes Sedai left the stedding, they gave to the Elders a key, a talisman, that could be used for growing more.”

 

(TEoTW, ch.43) Again, note the singular usage and the fact that it was given to the Elders. If it had been subsequently lost or stolen, Loial certainly would have mentioned it in one of these two explanations.

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Can we be certain that there was only made 1 Talisman for growing the Ways? There`s is alot of Ways out, I`ve always assumed that they had made more then one, especially since Aviendha`s description match the Talisman to good to be a coincidence(I`m suspicious of ALL "coincidences")

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Well, as I say, Loial seems to be pretty sure there's only one. Given that the Ways were made as a gift to the Ogier, why would there be other Talismans of Growing made that the Ogier didn't know about?

 

Aviendha said it reminded her of "holes", but that they weren't exactly "holes". That describes an awful lot of things other than just the Ways. It may be that the Talisman of Growing was designed on the same principles as this ter'angreal (given its connection to singing and the root-like shap of its carvings) but it doesn't seem likely to me that it IS the Talisman of Growing.

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The game of snakes and foxes tells what Mat and Thom will need to defeat the well snakes and foxes. Music. Fire. Steel/Iron(can't remember exactly). But Thom has a harp and flute, and Mat has a lot of knives and spear/quarter staff weapon. Who knows there are many possibilites.

 

Bearlin(however you spell the slut's name) I think will end up with a gaishain-spelled wrong I know but I don't have a book in front of me right now--a man in white does not have to mean a Child of the Light.

 

And I Have a question will the funk in the way start to clear away now that the male half of the power is cleansed?

 

I'm outta here.

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Berelain with a Gaishan is a possibility but somehow i still see her ending up with Galad. (pretty babies) They are probably close enough together geographically. Actually it would be silly for Galad's WC's not to run into Perrin and catch a lift into TG. I wonder if Galad will find out his half-brother is the dragon reborn.

 

The question of the ways is one of those mysteries right now. Nobody knows what is going on with Machin Shin right now, much less in the future. I would be surprised if RJ bothers to clear that one up.

 

What are the biggest mysteries left to clear up at this point?

 

1. Who killed Asmodean? (obviously #1)

2. Where is Demandred?

 

I'm sure there are others. I say we make a list and then maybe post predictions. See if anyone gets them all right once the book comes out.

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missing out something real important.....!

Rand finally marrying the avi, elayne and min and having a threesome with them :wink:

thats the only way to end the best fantasy series ever.

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Will Alviarin and the Black Ajah catch the group of sisters hunting for them? When the Last Battle comes, will all the Black sisters and Darkfriend Asha'man finally come out in the open?

 

What will happen with the Darkfriend Asha'man and the Red sisters in the Black Tower?

 

How will the Last Battle begin?

 

Where did Lan go and what is he trying to do?

 

What will Cadsuane teach the Asha'man? What will she do with Semirhage?

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Guest Barmacral

Dimmmu666, as entertaining as your thread about the 4some was to read, I'd request that you don't go bringing it up in every thread you respond to, or even a large part of them... this is not so much because I don't like it, as that others definately won't.

 

Melaine, Lan is riding across the breadth of the borderlands (started in Saldea, headed towards Shienar) gathering an army around himself so that he might fight off the Trollocs Raving Horde at Tarwins Gap. He is doing this under the banner of the Golden Crane.

 

"Oh, I have seen stark Tarwin's Gap,

and faced the Trollocs' raving horde.

I have stood 'fore the Halfman's charge,

and walked on death's cold borde.

Bu a winsome lass, she waits for me,

for a dance, and a kiss 'neath the apple tree...."

 

Man, I love that song, I hope once RJ finishes the series he writes the whole song, as well as the whole song for Jak'o'the shadows.

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