A thought on the 3 oathes and the a'dam

[Radhiën]

I am currently on the great hunt on my second run through the series, and a thought occurred to me.  The a'dam allows sul'dam to control aes sedai, which often involves using the power as a weapon.  However, as I remember, the oath rod makes the oathes binding to the point at which the aes sedai who swears them is physically unable to break them.  That being said, it would seem that this inabilty to break the oath not to use the power as a weapon would still be in place on the damane.  The only explanation I can come up with are that with the sul'dam controlling the aes sedai, it somehow counts as using it to protect ones life.  However, it's been a while since I've read these so I can't remember exactly how the sul'dam channels through the damane or if she is merely controlling her channeling.

[Barid Bel Medar]

It is mentioned that the Aes Sedai captured are useless as weapons. They can't be used in battle like the other damane. 

 

I can't give you a chapter or quote atm I'm afraid, but it's there somewhere. 

[BFG]

ToM

 

 

That many? Tuon thought. A force like that could turn the war entirely. True, those marath'damane who had traveled with Matrim had said that they would not take part in wars. Indeed, marath'damane who had once been Aes Sedai had—so far—proven useless as weapons. But could there be some way to twist their supposed vows? Something Matrim had said in passing made her suspect they could. Her fingers flew.

 

 

But I think there's another one where Mylen apologises for being unable to kill on command. 

 

Edit:

 

Found it

 

KoD

 

 

   He had considered using another damane than Mylen. The tiny woman with the face he could never put an age to almost bounced in her saddle with eagerness to lay eyes on the High Lady again. She was not properly composed. Still, she could do nothing without Melitene, and she was useless as a weapon, a fact that had made her hang her head when he pointed it out to the dersul’dam. She had needed consoling, her sul’dam petting her and telling her what beautiful Sky Lights she made, how wonderful her Healing was.

 

[Radhiën]

Ah, thanks for pointing that out

[Michael Wentz]

I had a similar question, but about the 3 Oaths and linking.  If an Asha'man, Wise One, or Windfinder was leading a circle that included an Aes Sedai, and that person wanted to use their shared circle Power as a weapon, what would happen with the Aes Sedai?

[jedman67]

i would imagine that it would work, as the AS herself is not using the power as a weapon. she's merely a construct in this case.

[Elaevia]

I have always thought that an aes Sedai damane could be made to channel as a weapon though, if you dedicated enough time in the right way to it.

 

We know that they are very could at 'training' damane, and getting them to accept their situation, and w know that the oath against using the power as a weapon has a 'except' clause ( i think it's 'last defence of myself, another sister or a warder' or something light that) and we know that the oathes only hold Sosa far as the aes Sedai considers them to ( like being able to lie if they believe what they are saying is true).

 

So, an example of what I mean:

 

The sul'dam makes the aes Sedai understand that her survival depends on the sul'dams survival. Then the damane must understand that the suldam, and so herself, will be in danger. As damane she can not run and hide or pick up a weapon to hide, so the power as her only weapon is her last line of defence. Once the damane is convinced of this, it should allow channelling as a weapon to protect the sul'dam.

 

 

I know that's not watertight logic, but I am surprised that the Empire, that usually gets what it wants and makes people fit the spaces they are given, gave up on this so easily. Maybe they don't know the full wording of the oath?

[Mr Ares]

I have always thought that an aes Sedai damane could be made to channel as a weapon though, if you dedicated enough time in the right way to it.

 

We know that they are very could at 'training' damane, and getting them to accept their situation, and w know that the oath against using the power as a weapon has a 'except' clause ( i think it's 'last defence of myself, another sister or a warder' or something light that) and we know that the oathes only hold Sosa far as the aes Sedai considers them to ( like being able to lie if they believe what they are saying is true).

It isn't lying if you believe it to be true. AS cannot lie (save by omission), but they can be mistaken.

 

So, an example of what I mean:

 

The sul'dam makes the aes Sedai understand that her survival depends on the sul'dams survival. Then the damane must understand that the suldam, and so herself, will be in danger. As damane she can not run and hide or pick up a weapon to hide, so the power as her only weapon is her last line of defence. Once the damane is convinced of this, it should allow channelling as a weapon to protect the sul'dam.

 

I know that's not watertight logic, but I am surprised that the Empire, that usually gets what it wants and makes people fit the spaces they are given, gave up on this so easily. Maybe they don't know the full wording of the oath?

Well, they have no way of testing it outside of a situation in which the AS fears for her life. AS damane would have to be used only in the most dangerous parts of the battle, in order to get any use out of them. It also leaves them more vulnerable than usual to surprise attacks. Given the drawbacks, and that damane have uses outside of battle, why would you bother using them as weapons? There are plenty of more suitable ones, just use the AS for other duties. Makes a lot more sense than going to the extra effort for no extra gain.