Hangar 18 [BASIC GAME] Game over! Scum win. Nolder & WBK.

[Nolder]

If we were to lynch the right person, it'd help us though, wouldn't it? 

Technically yes but the odds of doing that if most of us are just guessing aren't great

 

Do you think you have a good idea of who scum is? Do you think everyone else does?

If the answer to either of those questions are no then it's best to stall for as long as we can until they both turn to yes.

[Nolder]

 

Oh yeah, here are my adjusted scum reads: WBK, Cloud, and Nol.  You can note that Hally has dropped off the list and Nol has popped back on.  I figured it down to these three last night but didn't want to reveal since they seem to want my vote to help them win.  

 

So, mafia.  I have you down to three.  Your move.

 

Why switch Nol and Hallia?

He's switching up his tactics. Calling me town and calling her mafia wasn't working so he switched us to get a different reaction out of people. He's banking this will be more favorable to the town and net him a lynch since the other way obviously wasn't getting him anywhere. He's been playing this town the whole game and right out in the open. Really I'm impressed. I mean I've only spent all game pointing this out to everyone and still he's not lynched. He's gotta be doing something right I guess.

[Nolder]

Since I have the most on Darthe anyway I'm gonna recollect my case on him before moving on to the rest of you.

[Nolder]

I'm here.  You can all hold onto your loins.  Also, Vote hallia.  Cause its scum/

Right out of the gate he's naming Hallia scum.

 

 

you know whats funny, getting out of jail by rolling doubles, then proceeding to roll two more sets of doubles and going right back

 

 

Nol - odds are a townie will get lynched D1, going ahead and voting No Lynch not only keeps our numbers equal to scum in the night, but also prevents any D1 claims from happening.

 

Disgusting.  This is the sort of logic that leads to ...and they lived happily ever after.  

 

For those of you who don't know what that is, it is the fact that probablistically each time gains advantage by offsetting the number of kills in their favor and as such the idea was proposed that it is actually beneficial for a team to not kill at some points.  When both teams do this it is a stalemate of no deaths and so the game ends, typically with the line  ...and they lived happily ever after.

Look who's talking about a "Happily ever after" scenario on Day 1. He obviously had this situation planned and from the beginning.

 

It is beyond rare.  I have a suggestion.  Why don't you either join me in pressuring the newbie or we all mass claim.  I think this could be ground breaking.  It will narrow down which game variety we have through the outing of town PR's and then our investigative views the vanillas (doc of course claims vanilla).

Suggesting a Day 1 massclaim in a game where anyone could be lying. That's useless to the town but...not to the mafia. If the mafia could get a bead on a doctor or cop Day 1 it would have been an entirely different game.

 

To be honest the only person that can really make the call to reveal or not is the doctor.  mafia roleblocker would out themselves to do so and doctor very well may, I just do not like the indecision left in having potentially less townsfolk than can be assumed in the original mafia game.  I mean, without a cop and doc we could lose the cop and all potential viewings with a single NK and be left in a full vanilla game.  Makes me antsy.

Pressuring them to claim indirectly. He wasn't really "antsy" he's trying to scare whoever might have been the cop into claiming earlier than they normally would have.

 

 

pressure the newb or mass claim.  wtf Darthe.  why the newb over everyone else?  and option #2, you cant really be serious on the mass claim crap.

 

 

Excellent!  Red is on my town list as is Nol and Tress.  5 to go!

Here's where he flips his story around for the first time. First he's sure Hallia is scum and then it's just a reaction test. Note that me, Red, and Songstress are on his "town list".

 

 

 

(To the bold) So, to be clear here Red, you are stating that I have pinged you (the bulldog) three times by page two and you aren't voting me?  You have also accused me so far of being heavy handed, fatalistic, extremist, scummy, bulldogging, fishing, latching, and avoiding answering questions.  I should mention that you state that I have not answered for questions that you only ask in the sentence before (aka directly in the same post and already pushing me for not answering it).  This has been highlighted in green and listed alongside a vote count for everyone's convenience.  

 

Red has bitten.  She knows that I extensively know her meta and is attempting to create a strong impression without risking herself by placing an early vote because with only two mafia that is risky.  Red is mafia.

 

Unvote Vote Red.

yes you've done three things to ping, but pressure can be applied to you without voting you. right now, i like my vote where it is becuase nothing has yet to convince me No Lynch isn't the way to go today.

 

i asked my question around 9:30pm last night, you posted after me aroudn 10pm and now, still avoiding my 2 questions.

 

1 - why the newb over everyone else?

 

2.1 and 2.2 - why the mass claim phishing technique and why (if it was a reaction test) did you show your hand before even half the players have checked in?

 

 

and without risking myself, lmfao Darthe yer so funny. my playstyle is a risk in itself; i thought i was just on your town list here dude? seems like yer being way too over eager there.

 

1. The new person got a second vote from me because I can do so and because new players can warrant strategies such as early pressure whereas other players know how to respond to those already.  Any early read gained or way to exploit another to get information is an advantage.  It could just as easily have been another and yet we have little other than a compensating response from hallia to show that the person was here and then left.  More will be learned with time.

 

2. The mass claim was a thought which I recognized as flawed moments after posting it.  Regardless I intended to use it as a game starter and once it produced movement I discarded it.  I am not going to attach myself or commit to something I do not fully agree with, you know better.

 

Don't attempt to flip or shrug off my response.  

1. So now his story changes in a small but significant way already. First it was a reaction test to see who would follow Darthe or call him on an obviously bad train and now it's to pressure a newbie who doesn't know how to hold up under pressure.

 

2. He suggested it, pushed it a little, and then when absolutely no body was biting he took it back as a "bad idea". Just wonder what would have happened had anyone agreed with it.

 

That is not very logical Nol.  What mafia member would antagonize and gain this much heat right off the bat for no reason?  I haven't "flipped" anything.  I placed a second vote on someone and used it for my purposes.  

Let me rewrite that second sentence for you all and turn it into a statement instead of a question. "A mafia member would not antagonize and gain this much heat right off the bat for no reason." This is a No True Scotsman argument. He's trying to convince everyone that his actions are not scummy because no scum would ever do it. It's fallacious.

 

 

whatever you say bro   

Dismissive and unwilling to engage in further conversation on the matter because he realizes the longer he does so the longer it stays in front of everyone. If he doesn't discuss it hopefully it goes away. Luckily I am persistent.

 

So!  On page 3 with little evidence and a game that hasn't even had everyone check in and I am about halfway to a lynch.  This is a good place to start looking for mafia.

Getting worried by a few votes. Getting lynched on Day 1 would leave his partner alone to face down 7 more townies and at least 3 more days by himself.

 

 

 

 

We need to come to a consensus before tomorrow people. If we leave it to tomorrow that's cutting it too close.

I am willing to switch back to Darthe if necessary but I really prefer a policy lynch in this case. I mean seriously the thread moved less than 2 pages while I was asleep during the day. That's a terrible level of activity.

 

This post is terrible though the one about Red before it was better.  I can't decide what I think of you now Nol.

 

Also, policy lynch is a wasted day and I would rather no lynch than intentionally waste a life.

It's not wasted as everyone is a suspect on some level. If we lynch anyone it removes them from the pool of suspects and brings us that much closer to finding mafia, assuming they aren't mafia in the first place. Do the math Darthe, No Lynch is the waste here.

 

I said that earlier but inactive is actually worse.  I understand your logic, you're attempting to use the cop like Red is except you want to wean their numbers where red wants to view them.  Your strategy really does work better.  But today is a poor day for it.  If we were going to lynch an inactive I would prefer it be someone who hasnt given content rather than someone who hasn't posted much.  Hallia for example.  Call it a gut feeling if you will.

And here the story is changing again. Now it wasn't a reaction test and it wasn't just pressure on the newbie. He has a "gut feeling" that Hallia is actually scum.

 

no newbie should have reacted as she did.  i waas csaught up in yoours and reds rediculousness at the time but retrospectively ive noted that and chosen to pursue it.  did you just say you want me lynched regardless of alignment?

There's that No True Scotsman argument again. I guess Darthe is fond of those.

 

 

O.o Wait, did I do something wrong?   I find the way you target me to be suspicious sir.

 

Unvote

 

Vote Darthe

 

You didn't meaningfully contribute, ignored the fact that votes were gained on you, and I have received large flak from both Nolder and Red whom I am suspect of for voting you when I used their reasoning (logical fallacy/inactivity respectively).  Thus, either one or both of them is using you as a scapegoat and full of Bullshanks or one is protecting you and the other is misguided.  Either way you're info to pressure.

He can't get away with this stuff with Red and I so he engages Hallia directly. He puts the responsibility of his vote on her on Red and I and claims she is a scpegoat. If she's the scapegoat then why was HE going after HER and not me or Red? Because he wants to lynch her and then blame me and Red for it. Setting up lynches.

 

^ That is true.  

 

I can see we aren't going to lynch her today anyhow.

 

I hate doing this but if it is a choice between losing a confirmed townie and nothing I choose nothing.

 

Vote No lynch

 

God I hope our cop is experienced enough to get this metagame.

He goes with the No Lynch because town opinion was starting to shift out of his favor again and it was safest to vote for no one because no one is not a real person and can't get mad or fight him on it. Note he is again pressuring the cop to reveal at the end there. Plant this seed of doubt and maybe the cop decide that he actually isn't experienced enough to get the metagame. Better to claim tomorrow with one sure result and let town guide them eh? Luckily we don't appear to have a cop for Darthe to have influenced.

 

 

 

Final Vote Count:

 

Cloud: (1)  Red

Darthe: (1) Nolder

No Lynch: (5) Mish, Cloud, WBK, Darthe, Hallia

 

No Lynch has taken place.

 

Please submit night actions by 11 am MST Monday 1/21/13.

The final vote count for Day 1. I thought it was telling. All surviving players are on the No Lynch train except for me. My only question is who's in it with Darthe? I guess I'll get to that eventually.

[Nolder]

I'm confirmed to myself and it was me or no lynch Red. And I avoided cop directing. Praying they know what they're doing isn't telling them what to do.

Still trying to get the cop to doubt themselves.

 

I am going to remind everyone of the play mentioned earlier by myself, aka and they all lived happily ever after.  If we have a doctor this isn't neccesary but since the probability of having a doc or the doc protecting the right person is low this means that either Red, Nol, or myself is mafia likely.  We are probably the three best lynch candidates today and I know who is most likely to make this play.  

 

Vote Nol.

Bringing up the "Happily ever after" scenario again and trying to pin it on me. Once he lynches me he'd be on to Red. After that he'd just play it off as a mistake or something I guess. I honestly don't know what he'd do after getting us both lynched and guaranteeing that one of us three is mafia but just saying it makes it sound more convincing. Maybe he was hoping by that time the game would be pretty much over. Regardless I hope by now it's clear to everyone who's idea a "Happily ever after" scenario was. There was no reason to bring such a thing up but he's done so three times now as far as I can remember and look where we are. It's also important to note that this was said maybe a page and a half after he put me and Red both on his town list.

 

Look, either this was done by Red and she intends to play it off as a frame job or it is one and was done by you and is an attempt to get me and Red lynched.

 

I could sincerely buy either but you have more to gain from that than her and I am rolling with my thoughts.

Here he is trying to convince everyone that this was in fact something that was planned. While that was certainly a possibility it was also possible that the mafia hit a doc protection and it appears we do indeed have a doc (unless she is on a team with Darthe but such is the nature of WIFOM and uncertainty in mafia). So why is Darthe trying to push the idea that it's a "frame job"? It's because THIS IS HIS PLAN. I'm not sure how many times I need to spell it out but I guess at least once more. Darthe has been accusing everyone of doing exactly what he is doing.

 

 

Come to think of it Red has been more passive in this game than usual IMO 

I guess she could be trying to play to her meta while laying low but I'm reluctant to lynch her based solely on that

 

I still feel my case on Darthe is solid and am very surprised he hasn't been lynched yet. He literally backpedaled and contradicted himself. He wanted to lynch Hallia for being new andthen when he got called on it he played it off like it was a reaction test and then later turned around and went right back after Hallia for the same reason. It doesn't make any kind of sense from a townie POV. If he was town and was reaction testing he wouldn't have gone after her again later that day for the same reasons. I would stake any possible reputation I may have as a mafia player on his being scum.

 

You're going to lose some rep then this game bud.

 

I legit am about to hammer Red if nobody objects?

Seeking permission in order to push the idea that because nobody objected it's "not his fault" when Red turns up town. Interesting to note that Mish was the one who gave him that "permission".

 

Vote Count:

 

Darthe: (2) Halllia, Nolder

Red: (5) Cloud, Mish, Rand, WBK, Darthe

Nolder: (1) Songstress

 

DEADLINE IS WEDNESDAY 3PM MST.

 

That's a lynch.

The final vote count for the day. Everyone alive except me and Hallia are on Red.

[Nolder]

Okay, I did something I haven't done lately.  I took a good hour and stepped back and thought before i spoke.  I hope that what I have to say will ring true to each of you as it did to me.  

 

This entire plan, the whole setup from the beginning, has revolved around the mafia being less active.  At least one of them is experienced enough to get how to play up the controversy between me, Nol, and Red.  I think that it had to be touched on by each of them and I think cloud may have slipped up but I do not intend to go forward without proof because, I believe that this mafia team is playing an inactive game.  

 

I believe the intent was to let me, red, and Nol duke it out until one was left standing and then to pop up, point a finger, and lynch that person for the victory when their credibility died.

 

This plan is not going to be allowed.

 

Yes, you're reading this correctly.  I think Nolder is town.  He has been prodded at, put under hellacious pressure, and lashed everywhere.  His name made it into this list and with Red gone it would be his death if he kept pushing like this and I was lynched too.

 

I am left with the following suspects: Tress, Hal, Mish, WBK, and Cloud.

 

 Mish, I am glad that you revealed.  Did you self protect last night as well?

 

Based on that we can have one of these two games:

 

2 Mafia Goons, 1 Sane Doctor, 6 Townies

 

2 mafia Goons, 1 Sane cop, 1 Sane Doc, 5 townies

Here is another flip flop. I'm town now and Tress who was formerly town with me is now scum.

 

Oh, I forgot to mention.  Vote Hallia.

Putting aside the voting with no context or reason he's back on Hallia again just like he was from the beginning.

 

 

 

 

At least one of them is experienced enough to get how to play up the controversy between me, Nol, and Red. 

 

"1358904385">

>Oh, I forgot to mention.  Vote Hallia.

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This doesn't really jive. It feels like you're angling for my sympathy by calling me town now but you're still going after Hallia. Seemingly in contradiction with what you just said.

 

I know that an experienced player is the other mafia member.  I am leaning Tress because of the incredibly lurkish game she has played but the player that I am most certain of is Hally.  I have some reasons for it as well.

 

He's certain Hallia is mafia for reasons he wont reveal and Tress is mafia because she has played mafia before and for some reason he hasn't ever made clear Darthe is certain that at least one mafia member this game must be experienced. These are not legitimate reasons and again the fact that he made it through another day after posting this is mind boggling.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

At least one of them is experienced enough to get how to play up the controversy between me, Nol, and Red. 

 

>Oh, I forgot to mention.  Vote Hallia.

> trong>

 

This doesn't really jive. It feels like you're angling for my sympathy by calling me town now but you're still going after Hallia. Seemingly in contradiction with what you just said.

 

I know that an experienced player is the other mafia member.  I am leaning Tress because of the incredibly lurkish game she has played but the player that I am most certain of is Hally.  I have some reasons for it as well.

First of all, how the hell can we even tell? She's been a little better since I called her out but she hasn't posted enough for me to really gauge her one way or another which is exactly why we needed to policy lynch her. Secondly you are the only person who's came to the conclusion that "someone experienced" is mafia and you keep pushing it. I don't even think we can call it a slip anymore. You're broadcasting your scumtells all over the place Darthe.

 

The only reason I'm cautious about voting him is that Darthe *doesn't* make scum slips.  He's very deliberate in what he says while playing, and if something appears to be a slip it's entirely intentional.  However, since he knows that's his rep, he can use it for WIFOM all he wants.

While I have always loved the ego stroke it gives me when you say this it isn't true.  I slip up like everyone else and, as I am just recently back at school while playing 5 mafia games and hosting 2 (technically 1 at a time but still) I have been playing very much by the cuff, to be frank.  I have been blunt and honest everywhere and it sucks but at least mafia moves on the site in this manner.  So, lynch me if you want.  But Lynch Hal first.  If I cost us the game there I will self vote tomorrow and that'll end it all.  Or do it the other way around if it makes everyone feel safer.  

 

Annnd he's down to bargaining. He is obviously nervous at this point. He changed his tune with me because if he'd gotten me lynched that would basically be the end for him and probably his partner too. So all he has left is trying to appease as many people as possible or trying to get one more lynch before his own any way he can.

 

 

@Songstress: Oh I didn't mean to say they were slips on his meta. I'm saying he's dropping general scumtells. The only thing I can think of is he's playing dirty on purpose because he's the cop and doesn't want to be targeted for a nightkill but if that's the case he's played it way way too strong.

 

@Hallia: Exactly. He keeps coming at you and then backing off and coming at you again for different reasons. I think by now he's just too invested in his story about you being the scum partner of someone more experienced to let it go. He has to see it through.

It is rediculous and contrary to assume that I am some sort of sole mastermind setting this entire game up, yet that is what you are attempting to paint me as.  Mafia is opportunistic, no self respecting player would be dumb enough to go back to a case like that of mine against Hallia.  Call it whatever you want but the reactions and all else point to this one being mafia IMO.

There's that No True Scotsman again. Darthe's entire gameplan has been one big WIFOM. I think he's actually trying to play this bad (or I hope to god it's intentional anyway) in order to make everyone think that he couldn't possibly be mafia. He's hiding in front of everyone as it were. It's been a good run but I hope now you can all see it for what it is.

 

I have considered that but if she is lying then we should either have a real doc or a cop.  If cop doesn't (or didn't) view her that person is dim.  Either way this play could only last for a day.  You know things like this, why are you being so intentionally obtuse?

This is completely false. You can look at the setups in the OP for yourselves. Just because someone claims cop or doc does not guarantee us the other role. We aren't even guaranteed one of them unfortunately. He also slips in a little more doubt directed at a cop. One last try to flush them out?

 

Hally why would a doc protect you? Are you cop?

 

Also since you watch the thread so muc you should have no trouble giving your read on every living player.

Fishing because he's nervous that a cop hasn't claimed or been killed yet. Each night a cop gets more and more dangerous. 

 

Hally?  I know you're on right now.

Badgering. He had to try to get some answers out of her ASAP before Day ended.

 

So, you will be doing that comprehensive list when?  

It's obvious he suspects Hallia of being the cop at this point which clears her in my eyes. A suspect list from her would tell him who she's investigated already and who's likely to be next if she's the cop. As an aside I think Darthe's whole game with her has been a WIFOM. He tries really hard to get her lynched for no reason. If it ever succeeds that's ok he can just blame it on her for being a newbie and giving off supposed scumtells. If she doesn't get lynched it's all part of his play so scummy no one will suspect him of being mafia plan and he can keep playing it. If HE is lynched then we would all end up wondering if maybe the reason he was tunneling Hallia the whole time is she was his partner and it was all distancing.

 

 

I'm more interested in getting a solid string of thoughts from every player in the game instead of the half that have been posting.  The inactivity quite frankly disgusts me.  I don't say that to sound pompous but I do not consider winning by not playing to mean anything and I think it against the spirit of the game.

Here he's playing the concerned about activity card. The truth is low activity only helps mafia. The more they talk the more chances they have of slipping up. If Darthe was actually concerned about low activity he would have followed my lead when I brought it up and again when it came up later. The truth is he's just pandering for some easy and much needed townie cred here.

 

Okay, let's start over from square one here.  

 

@ Nol, if you are mafia you should have the victory.  Plain and simple.  Sheer work force, activity, and risky manipulation when we were all bickering deserves it.  However, I think you are town.  I haven't always agreed with your thoughts this game but I think you're town.  That gives us a basis to work from and is, to my eyes, the only reasonable way to continue.

 

@ Mish, your doc claim works for me unless we are proven otherwise.  Either cop views you, you get CC'd, or you are in the clear.  

 

Rand and Red are dead.  That is 4.  I know my own alignment, that is 5.

 

We are left with hally, Cloud, Tress, and WBK.  We can lynch two, hopefully.  This is a damn mess.

Well would you like at that. I'm town. Again. It's painfully clear Darthe will say anything at any time if he thinks it will suit him at the moment. 

 

Personally I would lynch every inactive every game and give the mafia a win until people picked their crap up and started playing.  I care very little about my standings on some scoreboard, if we can't play it's useless.  

 

I do enjoy the case on me though, it was very enlightening.  Are you willing to die tomorrow if wrong?

More pandering for townie cred and bargaining for someone else's life in a bid for sympathy.

 

 

 

I do enjoy the case on me though, it was very enlightening.  Are you willing to die tomorrow if wrong?

I am baffled that you haven't been hammered yet. Truly. 

Daring someone to gamble their life for yours in a bid for sympathy?

How are you actually expecting these ploys to work man? They're not exactly subtle.

 

Not sympathy, not a ploy or even much of a play.  I fully anticipate tress to say yes and if she can't then that is telling.  I care little for my own life Nol, though your blind stupidity has become grating I do not even hold it against you because I recognize that playing off the cuff was a cruddy early game strategy for me, or lack thereof.  However, I anticipate a strong push for you due to your direct actions in getting two townies lynched and vocal nature, thus I want to avoid that issue and.. conceivably lynch scum.

 

I still feel right about hallia, but I suppose it could be WBK though I have a light town read on him.  Time will tell.

He had to respond to me but he couldn't lay it on too thick because he'd just called me town. Now he only "feels right" about Hallia instead of being 100% sure for untold reasons but he could go on WBK. Basically he's playing everyone as well as he can to avoid being lynched. Call someone town here, say you're not 100% sure anymore there, then force someone to agree to lynch themselves if they're wrong on you and BAM one "off the hook" special coming right up.

 

Interesting.  I haven't much interest in arguing my own statements, intentions, or meanings with you or Nolder because your opinion is formed before I speak.  I do find it interesting how you have popped up all of a sudden.  I appreciate it, but am curious as to why their is so sudden a change.

This is mafia. We aren't debating for ourselves we debate for an audience. Darthe knows this and the reason he wouldn't engage with me isn't because my opinion is formed but because the less he engages with me the less opportunity I have to point out the scumtells he's dropping. He can't attack my own credibility because he just named me town so instead he has to avoid the debate entirely.

 

 

Okay so this is some bloody sheepswallop here.  My thoughts on Hally were revolved around a couple of ideas that don't stand as strongly in light of the ISO, which I did not expect.  Here was the rundown of my casing on Hally, strong connections with tress and Nol, very bad reactions (or lack thereof) when voted, not contributing, not making the mistakes that first timers usually do (which I looked at as being coached), and popping up when her name was mentioned which meant lurking.  

 

Obviously any connection to Red didn't matter once Red passed.  If we had time Hally would be grand info, but frankly we do not.  Thus: Unvote.  

 

This game must have an experienced player as mafia.  Two newbies would have to be damn lucky and almost completely inactive to manage this.  

 

Because everything keeps coming back to Tress, Nol, and myself.  

 

All three of us have had a moderate to blegh mafia game and it leaves too many options open.  Traditional mafia is 9 people, 2 scum 1 doc 1 cop 5 regular town.  Anything less than that is a disadvantage, right?  This is a good instance of that.  Strangely, I want to test WBK.

 

 

Also, I think that Cloud has played a mafia's game.  It is just the little things I picked up on in reread.  Nobody here is making clear mistakes, but everyone is making overt ones.  If you need more proof of how linked everybody is just look at the one example with a focus on hally above.  I begin to think that my death may serve best because of the info gained from it, but I fear that if this happens then Nol or Tress will no longer be of use and one will eliminate the other in the night.

This quote got messed up when I was removing his "case". Feel free to look up the post yourself if you'd like to see it. What interests me about this post isn't the case (which I found to be convoluted and ridiculous) but the fact that he's slipping my name back in with Tress. He isn't outright calling me mafia again but that comes next after the idea sinks in a bit.

 

 

Also, back to statistics.

 

 

1. Darthe

2. Rand - NK Night 2.

3. Wolfbrotherkronos

4. Hallia

5. Red - Lynched day 2.

6. Mish

7. Cloud

8. Songtress

9. Nolder

 

Since I think Hally is town now that leaves 6 slots with only one open.  The odds of two mafia being side by side are, in this instance, 1 in 72.  Thus either mafia is Cloud and Nol or WBK is mafia if you believe me and Hally.  

 

Yeah, I recognize this case has a lot of "if" in it.  I am working on substantiating it but am putting an idea out first.

 

Also, Vote WBK

Oh hey Hallia is town now what do ya know. And I'm back on the mafia list along with WBK it seems. Tress wasn't going anywhere at the time so Darthe had to go after a different but equally lurky target. Of course his flip flopping is quite apparent at this point so he has to qualify everything he's said with the fact that he recognizes his "case" has a lot of "if" in it. Why do you think he felt the need to do that? It's because he knows it's false and he feels like it'll be hard for anyone to swallow if he doesn't.

 

Hell, I could agree that I have played the strangest game ever, but if you're confident

 

Tress, the logic of a Mish/me team makes no sense.  That requires either a doc who could CC or a cop who will definitely view Mish to avoid a gambit.  Either way it would be a losing strategy.  

 

Nol, lets be frank.  If I was mafia I would not have kept you alive to contest me.  With how vocal I have been this game I would have killed you and taken it over practically uncontested.  Sure, it would cause some hiccup to do so but we have each lived this long for the purpose of creating this WIFOM.  I swear your blind nature towards me is the most suspect thing from you all game, and that only because I happen to know my alignment.  I am expecting that you would have done the above as well, knowing the risk of leaving me alive and able to get you lynched another day, and once that hit me you became town in my eyes.  Just take a bit, step back, and seriously contemplate this.  What would I have to gain from keeping you alive?  

Again he pushes the idea that in order for Mish to be mafia/on his team there would have to be a real doc or cop. And again I'll ask you to look at the possible setups for yourselves and realize this simply is not true. I like how he calls it a losing strategy there at the end as if he knows it's a 100% guaranteed loss and if he knows that then obviously this would never be the scenario right? I'm going to be honest here and admit that at this point I am leaning towards Mish being Darthe's partner. I still plan on rereading and casing everyone though so no worries. Back to the post, I see Darthe is using No True Scostman AGAIN. As I said to Darthe when he originally posted this I have no idea why he chose to keep me alive. Maybe he was hoping to buy me out by calling me town or something and when that backfired he just didn't know what to do. I don't know but it doesn't matter to me really because that's just the way it is. I'm alive and we wont know why Darthe didn't kill me until after the game is over.

 

I am guessing that the WBK train isn't going anywhere.  The three players I trust are myself, Mish, and Nol (sorta).  With a bit of WIFOM we can manage another day or two at this rate.  I will vote anywhere else though my reads are effing dead now.  

Preparing to move off WBK and onto Tress, throwing me in an inbetween state again since he just got done calling me mafia and can't say he fully trusts me again so soon. 

[Darthe]

I like how those got bigger as you bolded them.  You know, the case you make on me isn't half bad.  It distinctly humbles me as I am reminded of how shitty my plays have been this game.  Nonetheless my alignment remains static.  God, I wish I was half as good at mafia as you give me credit for.  I would have this game in the bag.  Of course, you still haven't managed to explain why I didn't NK you, why I am so active when I have no reason to be (any idiot could have figured there was no cop by N2 or D3 at least) or why I am pushing no lynch now.  

 

Honestly, it is your unwillingness to consider the possibility of me as anything other than mafia that pings so strongly.  

[Nolder]

 

Peace, exactly when is that for those of us not familiar with American time zones?

 

I believe it is about 6 hours off.  Don't really want to hammer tress but I feel like we are being left with little choice.  

He doesn't want to hammer her...but wait isn't she on his scumlist? 

 

 

 

Songstress innocent town has been lynched.  Deadline is Monday morning 10 am MST.

 

Vote Count

 

Darthe (2): Nolder, , Songstress

 

Songstress (4): Mish, Cloud, Hallia, Darthe

 

Not Voting: WBK

Well he hammers her anyway. Myself and WBK are off the lynch and everyone else alive is on it. I know it's not saying much at this point since there aren't many of us left alive but to me that's telling. As I said before I think Hallia is town and Mish is Darthe's partner. I can't be sure about that but what I will say is WBK being off the lynch makes me feel a little better about him. Hallia being on the lynch doesn't make me feel worse about her but she's been more active than WBK so maybe that's why. It's easier to read her and chalk this up to a bad vote.

 

 

Very well.  Either we are being duped by Nol or we have a 66% chance of catching tomorrow between WBK, Cloud, and Hally.  

 

If mafia eliminates any of those three Nol is mafia.

 

If they eliminate me or Nol then the other is town.

Look at that list. First of all I've gone back to being mafia again you'll note. But more importantly note that everyone is on that list except for Mish who wouldn't die anyway if she was his partner. To put it simply, anyone they chose to kill would implicate me according to Darthe. 

 

Oh yeah, here are my adjusted scum reads: WBK, Cloud, and Nol.  You can note that Hally has dropped off the list and Nol has popped back on.  I figured it down to these three last night but didn't want to reveal since they seem to want my vote to help them win.  

 

So, mafia.  I have you down to three.  Your move.

Has anyone kept count of how many times my alignment has flipped according to Darthe? Anyway that's all I got. I did my best to show you guys how scummy he's played. It's on you now. Vote: Darthe

[Nolder]

And no worries I'm still going to case everyone else. Gonna take like an hour break or something though. I'll case Mish next I guess since atm she's the person I'm most suspicious of after Darthe.

[Nolder]

I like how those got bigger as you bolded them.  You know, the case you make on me isn't half bad.  It distinctly humbles me as I am reminded of how shitty my plays have been this game.  Nonetheless my alignment remains static.  God, I wish I was half as good at mafia as you give me credit for.  I would have this game in the bag.  Of course, you still haven't managed to explain why I didn't NK you, why I am so active when I have no reason to be (any idiot could have figured there was no cop by N2 or D3 at least) or why I am pushing no lynch now.  

 

Honestly, it is your unwillingness to consider the possibility of me as anything other than mafia that pings so strongly.  

I don't know why you didn't NK me as I said. I think it was probably some sort of screw up but either way we'll find out when the game ends. Your activity has no bearing on your alignment. You're pushing No Lynch because you have some sort of infatuation with the "Happily ever after" scenario. Either that or I'm wrong about Mish and she blocked your kill and you and your partner want another shot without risking either of you being lynched today.

 

And I don't know why I would consider another possibility when your scuminess is clear as day. Nothing you have done is remotely townie. NOTHING. You haven't scum hunted or cased anyone, you didn't prod for activity until late in the game, you use fallacies and absolutes almost every post, your scum/town lists change by the hour, and you've been on every town lynch since the game started. There isn't a single reason I should doubt that you are scum.

[michellem]

Nol I appreciate your case on Darthe. My problem with Darthe is that I can never read him; it's him and Des, I never trust them and always doubt them, and that makes me hesitant to vote them.

 

This game is super confusing and I don't have a gut read on anyone either way, and that disturbs me greatly.

 

I am not Darthe's partner, or anyones partner.

[Nolder]

I think I'll do Cloud next actually. I may be wrong about you Mish but at least I have an opinion about your actions. Cloud and WBK are complete unknowns to me outside my case on Darthe right now. So yeah gonna do Cloud now.

[Nolder]

 

 

 

 

 

Nol - odds are a townie will get lynched D1, going ahead and voting No Lynch not only keeps our numbers equal to scum in the night, but also prevents any D1 claims from happening.

 

Disgusting.  This is the sort of logic that leads to ...and they lived happily ever after.  

 

For those of you who don't know what that is, it is the fact that probablistically each time gains advantage by offsetting the number of kills in their favor and as such the idea was proposed that it is actually beneficial for a team to not kill at some points.  When both teams do this it is a stalemate of no deaths and so the game ends, typically with the line  ...and they lived happily ever after.

 

fatalistic and extremist much?  at best we have 2 cops or a cop and doc, at worst we have 1 power role.  Mafia already has the advantage, especially if they ended up with the RBer.

 

it isn't ending in a stalemate or "living happily ever after" its limiting the eventuality of a being down two townies come D2 before a cop can view, if we have one. 

 

no lynch benefits the town and hampers the scum, you're heavy handed reaction pings.  mafia is a numbers game, the longer we keep our numbers up, the longer they have to hide and the more chance they will slip and expose themselves.  unless a scum exposes themselves, No Lynch is our smartest option for this setup.

 

 

"1358217750">

>It is beyond rare.  I have a suggestion.  Why don't you either join me in pressuring the newbie or we all mass claim.  I think this could be ground breaking.  It will narrow down which game variety we have through the outing of town PR's and then our investigative views the vanillas (doc of course claims va

nilla).

 

pressure the newb or mass claim.  wtf Darthe.  why the newb over everyone else?  and option #2, you cant really be serious on the mass claim crap.

 

I have to agree with Darthe on this one. Winning with such a cheap tactic is beyond boring. I play Mafia to have fun, and I won't be having any if we continue down this path. 

 

Why not the newb? Someone must get lynched and she is the most likely to make mistakes. Your defense on Hallia is noted. 

 

It is beyond rare.  I have a suggestion.  Why don't you either join me in pressuring the newbie or we all mass claim.  I think this could be ground breaking.  It will narrow down which game variety we have through the outing of town PR's and then our investigative views the vanillas (doc of course claims vanilla).

 

Yes, let's mass claim.... /sarcasm

 

And the fun is underway. 

 

@ Darthe - in the case of a mass claim, anyone with a brain is going to claim vanilla town.  Period.  We're not guaranteed a doc to protect a cop, if we even have a cop. 

 

This. 

 

 

Seriously guys, this game has just begun and there are already two crazy strategies underway. I don't like how Darthe acts that his plan was actually a trap and how he concluded that Red, Nol and Tress are on his town list for no reason at all. 

 

 

Unvote

 

Vote Darthe 

 

The fact that Cloud is echoing my own thoughts here makes me feel pretty decent about him from the start here.

 

 

I understand where you're coming from Nol, but I think Tress falls under the first group most of the time. I've played a few games with her and she's never amongst those with high post counts. But she can contribute really well with what she's got (expect for Darthe's bloodlust where she was trying to get lynched on purpose :P ). Sometimes it pays not to post so much; I know I have a tendency to make more note of the posts of those that post more seldom, it's an unconsious thing and not very smart, but I can't help it :P

 

Man Cloud, I'm not sure if I've ever seen anyone else pick up the game this fast! Proud of you, you're really my mentee But I still haven't decided on if it's town confidence or maifa confidence you've got here... :P

 

Re: Darthe & Red, am I the only one who feels like Darthe is a bit off? And by that I don't mean that he's scum nessesarily; I've seen him as town and scum, I've been scum with him. He just seems a bit unbalanced here as to what I'm used to. Not sure what to make of that. Red however, is spot on her meta :P I don't know where any of them belongs just yet. My gut is confused!

 

Haha thank you Mish I've learned from the best It's a more general Mafia (as in the game) confidence :P 

 

 

Both Mish and Red have claimed that Darthe is off his meta and acting weird. Darthe seems to have gone silent so I think this will be the only info we will get from him. I think that his lynch will be the best for today. 

 

 

Unvote

 

Vote Darthe

It's worrying that he's relying on others to make a read for him when they could be mafia for all he knows if he's town. But the fact that he's still pushing on Darthe so early again leaves me with a good feeling. I am positive Darthe is scum and that would mean if Cloud was his partner he pushed a Darthe lynch pretty hard at first which would be an extremely dangerous thing to do with just two mafia.

 

Hmm interesting.... Seems like you don't like the idea of getting lynched if your case that you were so sure of would fail in the end. So instead of convincing the others to get me lynched AFTER Darthe you decided to go after me now. 

 

Trap. Sprung. 

 

Seems like Darthe was right after all. 

 

 

UNVOTE

 

VOTE RED

This worries me a bit. It almost looks like he was looking for an excuse to jump off Darthe. I guess we'll call it even on those good feelings I got before.

 

Why aren't you so certain anymore on your case on Darthe , Red? You see, unlike you, I don't care if I get lynched this game. It would certainly prove that you are scum either way. 

This makes me feel good again. He's not bargaining like Darthe did later in the game he simply doesn't care if he's lynched or not. It's a very townie aspect.

 

 

 

Ok I'm having a fever atm so I don't have much patience anymore. Quoting would be too bothersome for me now so I'm just going to write everything out. 

 

@Red: I'm NOT shadowing ANYONE. I was the first to vote on Darthe with a case made by myself. I was also the first to case Kronos after everyone seemed to have ignored his comments. Saying that I was shadowing Mish throughout the whole game, or anyone for that matter, is plain bs. I'm doing by best to stand on my own two feet. Yes, I admit, I took your and Mish's comments about Darthe and incorperated them in my reasoning to vote on him, but that was just because I found the comments on his meta good and they drew me over the line. On page 6 I thought for sure that you were scum, but I'm not so certain anymore. That is the reason why I voted for a no lynch. We need more time. 

Ehhh I'd have to check but I'm pretty sure I made the case on Darthe first. Not that it's a contest or anything. It's interesting that he got so defensive here but that may have been because of his fever. That's it for Day 1 and so far there's not much here but I do have a slightly town read on him.

[WolfbrotherKronos]

Nol I appreciate your case on Darthe. My problem with Darthe is that I can never read him; it's him and Des, I never trust them and always doubt them, and that makes me hesitant to vote them.

 

This game is super confusing and I don't have a gut read on anyone either way, and that disturbs me greatly.

 

I am not Darthe's partner, or anyones partner.

 

I second this and I'm still trying to get a read on everyone and put together thoughts on my reread.

[peacesells]

Vote count:

 

No lynch (1): Darthe

 

Darthe (1): Nolder

 

Not voting Mish, Cloud, WBK, Hallia.

 

With 6 players it takes 4 to lynch.  Deadline is Tuesday night 11 pm MST.

[Nolder]

Sorry 

I got distracted and then DM went down for awhile

I'll finish rereading Cloud now

[Nolder]

Vote Red

This is one of two posts he made on Day 2. I think that's telling. I can understand what he's doing here. He had a previous...case on Red and followed up on it. I think this is a good time to remind everyone that it's always good to at least reference your cases/reasons even if you're not going to rehash them. It makes you look a lot better in retrospect. But yeah this isn't very noteworthy and I'm tired.

[Nolder]

I'll finish the case on Cloud and everyone else next time I wake up.

[Darthe]

Finally!  Scum team is Cloud and Nol, I got the linking I was looking for.  

 

Nol has stated he has no good reads on anyone else the entire game but look at how amiable they are with one another.  Of course, I expect that you all suspect me enough to not want to dive into this.  Thus I request that nobody else makes a vote on either of them unless we have exhausted the idea of no lynch and people are not amiable.  

[Darthe]

Actually, that last post was a bit ham fisted.  Based on the way Nolder is pulling these last second pushes for a lynch I feel more strongly than I was able to early game.  The link to cloud is tenuous upon his casing here, the only real interaction that those two have had in this game.  You all know I am down to those three, but I will leave myself open to the possibility of a WBK train until I see Nol's case there.

 

Also, mafiaaaa come out to plaaayyy!

[Nolder]

Finally!  Scum team is Cloud and Nol, I got the linking I was looking for.  

 

Nol has stated he has no good reads on anyone else the entire game but look at how amiable they are with one another.  Of course, I expect that you all suspect me enough to not want to dive into this.  Thus I request that nobody else makes a vote on either of them unless we have exhausted the idea of no lynch and people are not amiable.  

I don't understand what it is you were expecting...

Did you want me to call him a name or something?

[WolfbrotherKronos]

So essentially Darthe, you are saying in that post you are back to where you were before...it's me, cloud, or Nol?

[Darthe]

That made me smile. I expected someone who thought so little in general of the players this game to have a bit more to say on someone than that.

[Hallia]

Wow Nol, when you make Darthe's case like that, it really does seem like he's scum...are you a lawyer? lol

[_CLOUD]

Yeah Nolder's case is very strong. It might be due to the big font sizes he used but it kinda convinced me. I'm also having a hard time getting a good read on Darthe, but the evidence against him is out there. 

 

Finally!  Scum team is Cloud and Nol, I got the linking I was looking for.  

 

Nol has stated he has no good reads on anyone else the entire game but look at how amiable they are with one another.  Of course, I expect that you all suspect me enough to not want to dive into this.  Thus I request that nobody else makes a vote on either of them unless we have exhausted the idea of no lynch and people are not amiable.  

 

Quite a statement you got there. 

 

Amiable? Furthermore, first you tell us that you don't expect us to follow your lead due to your scuminess, but then you go ahead and make a request to go for the no lynch. This post is contradicting in my eyes. 

 

Actually, that last post was a bit ham fisted.  Based on the way Nolder is pulling these last second pushes for a lynch I feel more strongly than I was able to early game.  The link to cloud is tenuous upon his casing here, the only real interaction that those two have had in this game.  You all know I am down to those three, but I will leave myself open to the possibility of a WBK train until I see Nol's case there.

 

Also, mafiaaaa come out to plaaayyy!

 

Ok, so you aren't so sure anymore that I'm scum? That was fast. You should make a decision and stick with it. Your play here isn't helping you out.