Elayne!

[Mistress alDebaw]

I just don't like her. I finished KOD and she really angers me.

Did I miss something? Because she decided to go after the Blach Ajah and the dark friends with them, many people died and many were injured. I find her arrogant.

Maybe she knew (somhow) they would come after her, if she didn't go after them first? Or maybe she is just arrogant and figured, why not go after them, not much will happen to her, Min said so.

If it wasn't for Dyelin she wouldn't be Queen of Andor. Dyelin would make a better queen.

[SBoydW]

Yes, I HATE Elayne with a passion. I feel like burning everyone one of her chapters in the books whenever I read them

[RobertAlexWillis]

Well ... in Elayne's defense (three words I'm surprised to see myself typing) ... what she did was impetuous, but not totally irresponsible. She was acting on the information she had, and if the information had been correct, it would have worked, and she would have revealed a spy in her own midst as well (Careane). It was a decent plan compromised by bad information.

 

On the whole, Elayne makes better decisions than most 18-20 year old women. (That one should get me alot of hate mail :D ) Her decisions just have much larger consequences. During the course of reading Knife of Dreams, I came to like all of the Wonder Girls (Elayne, Egwene, and Nynaeve) a lot more. I think we're seeing them come into their own at just the right time.

[Mercer]

I'd send the hate mail if I could be bothered. Well, I wouldn't, but I'm thinking it all the same!

 

Agreed on the general dislike of Elayne, the most flat, boring, and incredibly annoying character next to Cadsuane (different subject, I know). Here's a summing up of the supposed character of Elayne, "She's so courageous!". That's it. She has zero humourous moments (complaining about/to Birgitte or anyone that will listen or screaming in frustration doesn't come close to counting), has no other real specific governing skills despite everyone saying what a good queen she'll make...hell, Norry and Dyelin together could do the job fine. The only reason she's needed is because of the Aes Sedai connection, her convenient and recent gift of making ter'angreal, and now her even stronger connection to Rand. Every other main female character, whether they are themselves annoying or not, have SOMETHING that makes them bearable or interesting. To me...Elayne's got squat. She's Egwene without the Emond's Field bit going for her. Meh. Not yet a spot on Cadsuane.

[RobertAlexWillis]

I'd send the hate mail if I could be bothered. Well, I wouldn't, but I'm thinking it all the same!

 

That's OK, Mercer, its the thought that counts! :D

 

screaming in frustration doesn't come close to counting

 

Well, I got a real kick out of that one. I guess she's funny to men, or at least me.

 

Norry and Dyelin together could do the job fine.

 

Dyelin would make a fine Queen on her own. The fact that other people are also qualified doesn't disqualify Elayne.

 

Meh. Not yet a spot on Cadsuane.

 

I guess were not likely to agree, since I like Cadsuane too. I mean, I really like Cadsuane.

[Mr Ares]

I'd send the hate mail if I could be bothered. Well' date=' I wouldn't, but I'm thinking it all the same! [/quote']

 

That's OK, Mercer, its the thought that counts! :D

 

screaming in frustration doesn't come close to counting

 

Well, I got a real kick out of that one. I guess she's funny to men, or at least me.

 

Norry and Dyelin together could do the job fine.

 

Dyelin would make a fine Queen on her own. The fact that other people are also qualified doesn't disqualify Elayne.

 

Meh. Not yet a spot on Cadsuane.

 

I guess were not likely to agree, since I like Cadsuane too. I mean, I really like Cadsuane.

Every sensible person here likes Cadsuane. I mean, they really like Cadsuane. But you are the only person here with the guts to come out and say it. RobertAlexWillis, we salute you. And I'm very glad to not be sensible.

[DemandredFO]

see the Popularity thread to see what I think of the wondergirls but let's stick with Elayne's decision at the end of KOD. She did get people killed but as Robert said she had bad intelligence and that always is bad. She was pregnant though and her emotions were probably not under full control or her decision-making processes, that by no means fully absolves her. Despite Mins viewng about nothing harm her till her kids were born, someone should have tied her to the Lion Throne. As Robert said she is only like 19 or so and but for Rahvin, she would have been alot older before she became queen.

[DragonSpawn]

I like her in some aspects and in others not. As a character she represents the aristocracy to an extreme, she is headstrong, obsessed with new clothings (remember those long reads on every last stitch on her new dress made in, etc..), believes in her own superiority and is very unripe.

 

Whereas Egwene is somewhat passable as a leader, the way Elayne is now I would scream disaester. In my opinion she is a bit too high for her rocker, she expects people to die for her just because of her lineage, however doesn't treat them with the same attention a proper noble should. She shuts herself out of her kingdom, surrounds herself with Aes Sedai, Kinswomen and her amazon guard. How can she expect her army to die for her when they never see her care about them or let alone appear by them for morale reasons.

All in all, I believe Galad would be a much fitter ruler for Andor. Although Galad has the problem with his imperious sense of justice, his sense of reality, closeness and belovedness with the people are what makes a ruler. How he rose in the ranks of the whitecloaks so quickly, inspired people to follow him.

Galad was born a leader, whereas Elayne was merely made one. I also find her jealousy in her oldest brother interesting, she always appears upset when the other women mooned over him or he got praised for his excellency in various fields.

Elayne in my opinion is taking a shade off Marie Antionette in some of her ways.

[bhthomas88]

i think all the WOT women need a swift kick in the butt

they all run around thinking they no best about everything and that all the men are there to serve them

and if a guy does something right they complane about ho it could have been done better

there i said it all the guys were thinking it but ill take one for the team

[DemandredFO]

I agree Elayne has flaws even large but she IS like 19 and another reason she may be less apt to mingle with common people right is that the black ajah and maybe their masters, the Foresaken have a personal reason to hate her, she got in the middle of a few of their plans while Galad did not. Now I'll shut up about the wondergirls for a few days or more.

[Guest Wynne Jessal]

In my re-read, I actually didn't mind her until Mat joins her part in LoC and she, inexplicably, treats him like dirt.

 

... Not that I'm overprotective of Mat or anything. :oops:

 

In any case, I find all her 'fits of giggling' highly irritating (but that goes back to my complaints about the way RJ writes the relationships between the girls in the series). Whether it's completly believable or not, I don't like 'cutesy.'

[RobertAlexWillis]

... Not that I'm overprotective of Mat or anything.

 

Awwww, you're in love with Mat! How cute! :D

[Guest Wynne Jessal]

... Not that I'm overprotective of Mat or anything.

 

Awwww' date=' you're in love with Mat! How cute! :D[/quote']

 

Don't be ridiculous. And since I am not and never have been, it would certainly have nothing to do with my unrelenting hostility toward Tuon. :twisted:

[RobertAlexWillis]

Don't be ridiculous. And since I am not and never have been, it would certainly have nothing to do with my unrelenting hostility toward Tuon.

 

Hehehe ... where do I get tickets? This is a fight I want to watch.

 

Would you be mad if Mat and I bet on the outcome? :twisted:

[DragonSpawn]

I agree Elayne has flaws even large but she IS like 19 and another reason she may be less apt to mingle with common people right is that the black ajah and maybe their masters' date=' the Foresaken have a personal reason to hate her, she got in the middle of a few of their plans while Galad did not. Now I'll shut up about the wondergirls for a few days or more.[/quote']

 

There are two ways to rule a nation, by force or by respect. Elayne seems unable to acquire either at the moment to a significant degree.

She is unwilling to brutally suppress rebellion but on the other hand is also uncapable of inspiring people to follow her ala Joan of Arc.

She is only in charge of the capital of Andor, the rest of the country belongs to the rebels or is under third party control who don't heed her commands at the moment. Two Rivers as good as broke away from Andor, raising the standard of Manetheren and subtly edging Perrin to Kingship.

Also the only reason she holds the capital is because the Lord Dragons troops held the city and handed it over to her command. Also I believe a large reason why there aren't riots in Caemlyn at the moment is the fear of her connection to the Dragon, who is a man who can channel who commands more troops then most remaining Randland nations combined, on top of the Ashaman.

To think she plans on ruling all of Andor and Cairhien is in my opinion unrealistic the way the cards stand now where she barely holds onto Caemlyn..

[Mistress alDebaw]

Now that you mention it, she did have bad intelligence. She figured it would be easy to take down the BA and DF's. Turns out there were more BA's than she was told. Still she thinks nothing of the people that killed her. I don't like the pregnancy excuse though. But, then maybe because she can channel and does it has an affect on her behavior. She's a flawed character, just as all WOT characters are (which is why I love them so much). I almost cried for Galina, but then remembered who she is! The thing about Elayne is that in my mind she is not heroic. Egwene is. Faille is. Of cource just my opinion. :-))

 

see the Popularity thread to see what I think of the wondergirls but let's stick with Elayne's decision at the end of KOD. She did get people killed but as Robert said she had bad intelligence and that always is bad. She was pregnant though and her emotions were probably not under full control or her decision-making processes' date=' that by no means fully absolves her. Despite Mins viewng about nothing harm her till her kids were born, someone should have tied her to the Lion Throne. As Robert said she is only like 19 or so and but for Rahvin, she would have been alot older before she became queen.[/quote']

[Elayne Sedai]

Actually Elayne had no way to know more AS were going to turn up. After all the BA themselves didn't expect them. So her information was as correct as it was possible to be and Elayne did the best she could on the information she had. And all the deaths weren't the result of HER orders, but of those who saved her (not that I blame them, but we can hardly blame Elayne eighter). Her fault was only Vandene's death and Vandene had nothing against the plan.

[Elayne Sedai]

Besides, Elayne had no choice but to act, because the BA were already killing off her people(Adeleas and Kin)

[Guest Wynne Jessal]

Hehehe ... where do I get tickets? This is a fight I want to watch.

 

Would you be mad if Mat and I bet on the outcome? :twisted:

 

Hehe. It's not a fair fight if there isn't hair for me to pull.

[RobertAlexWillis]

Hehe. It's not a fair fight if there isn't hair for me to pull.

 

I didn't say I was going to bet on you :P

 

.... unless Mat does! Then Tuon would sneeze and throw out her back or something.