Alanna Mosvani, is she aligned with the dark?

[WMBunt]

The unrevealed DF is Faile. I have no proof. I have nothing to offer other than it always seemed to tug at me that Perrin would be willing to give up everything for her and love and she clearly loves him too, but she always seems to be a little torn and conflicted about something lurking under the surface. Probably wrong, but hey. I just wanted to say it so that I can vocalize it and get it out of my system.

 

But I don't think it's Alanna.

[TootThatHorn]

I don't think she is aligned with the dark, but I feel like there is a small chance she is being held by the dark. Or she is at Tarwin's Gap.

[Pinzarn]

The whole with this argument is that Verin knew that Alanna was black, and gave her a letter to warn her that she would be hunted in order to avoid Rand suffering from Warder Rage at her death.

 

We don't know enough about the Warder Rage when the warder has four bond holders. I think it would be interesting to see wha happens if she is killed. Since his other three bond holders were done in secret (was it made public?), I would like to see Alanna killed and the killer expect the warder rage only to have calm Rand there.

[herid]

Actually, if Alanna is Black (and even if she isn't) the most natural thing for the dark side to do would be to kill her and see if this sends Rand into the Death Rage. They don't need her to find him any longer according to Rand and she can't control him through the bond so killing her seems like the best use of the bond they can make.

 

It's not too clear to me though if they know of the bond (assuming Alanna is not Black herself). Elza definitely knew of it so she could have told Shaidar Haran I guess. Are there any other known DFs who know of it for sure?

[Aulduron]

Warders go on an suicidal killing spree, against those who killed their Aes Sedai. I, for one, would not want to be the one who kills the sister of a warder who is also the most powerful channeller in history.

 

If the Wise Ones have a DF, my money is on Bair.

[Darksmoon]

I have not seen evidence to make me believe Alanna is black.

 

I think the Darkfriend is Taim. It has never been stated that he is a darkfriend and he will be revealed in this book.

[herid]

While I don't think Alanna is Black there are plenty of reasons to be very suspicious of her.

• She showed too much interest in Rand, Perrin and Mat from the very beginning (TGH ch 12) when there was little reason to do so. The other Aes Sedai like Anaiya (with the exception of later revealed Blacks like Liandrin ) don't.
  
• Egwene was suspicious of her as possibly being Black in TDR. This should not be taken lightly as the only others explicitly named that she was suspicious of were Verin, Liandrin, Sheriam and Elaida. Of those only Elaida turned out not to be Black. Those early scenes including Egwene's Accepted test are full of foreshadowings. In particular, Egwene's suspicions of Elaida in that scene were framed this way:

  If she isn’t Black Ajah, Egwene thought sourly, she’s the next thing to it.

  Which really describes Elaida very well.
  
• Alanna behaved very suspiciously after Egwene's Accepted test and volunteered to share her kitchen duties in a clear attempt to get close to Egwene. Whatever for?
  
• Verin warned Perrin to be wary of Alanna (TSR, ch 33). She likely meant Alanna's desire to bond Perrin but it's not a certainty.
  
• Alanna mysteriously disappeared twice while Loial was watching her, once to the surprise of her warder (TSR, CH 40). Where could have she gone in the Two Rivers, especially in the middle of a Trolloc invasion?
  

[Aulduron]

Alanna behaved very suspiciously after Egwene's Accepted test and volunteered to share her kitchen duties in a clear attempt to get close to Egwene. Whatever for?

 

I haven't read it in awhile, but if IIRC, she felt responsible for the near tragedy that happened, because Egwene had the the dream ring too close to the test ter'angreal

[herid]

that was the ostensible reason Alanna gave but it's made quite clear in that scene that this is not all she was after and what she really wanted was to get close to Egwene.

[Ferdawoon]

The whole with this argument is that Verin knew that Alanna was black, and gave her a letter to warn her that she would be hunted in order to avoid Rand suffering from Warder Rage at her death.

 

We don't know enough about the Warder Rage when the warder has four bond holders. I think it would be interesting to see wha happens if she is killed. Since his other three bond holders were done in secret (was it made public?), I would like to see Alanna killed and the killer expect the warder rage only to have calm Rand there.

 

Well, in a way we do.

Moiraine made arrangements to transfer her bond with Lan to (Was it Myrelle?). Lan is still a bit edgy if I recall correctly (ages since I read it so can get this wrong) but he is not on a Warder-rampage.

Is this because the bond was not broken, just transfered, or maybe because it is just the maintaining of the bond that keep them from going berserk? That who they are bonded to is not that important, as long as a bond is maintained.

I think Rand is the only example we have of a warder with multiple Aes Sedai though. We see Aes Sedai with more than one warder, but never the other way around. However, seeing how Alanna slipped into a coma when the three girls bonded Rand, it is understandable if it dont happen very often =P

[Durinax]

The whole with this argument is that Verin knew that Alanna was black, and gave her a letter to warn her that she would be hunted in order to avoid Rand suffering from Warder Rage at her death.

 

We don't know enough about the Warder Rage when the warder has four bond holders. I think it would be interesting to see wha happens if she is killed. Since his other three bond holders were done in secret (was it made public?), I would like to see Alanna killed and the killer expect the warder rage only to have calm Rand there.

 

Well, in a way we do.

Moiraine made arrangements to transfer her bond with Lan to (Was it Myrelle?). Lan is still a bit edgy if I recall correctly (ages since I read it so can get this wrong) but he is not on a Warder-rampage.

Is this because the bond was not broken, just transfered, or maybe because it is just the maintaining of the bond that keep them from going berserk? That who they are bonded to is not that important, as long as a bond is maintained.

I think Rand is the only example we have of a warder with multiple Aes Sedai though. We see Aes Sedai with more than one warder, but never the other way around. However, seeing how Alanna slipped into a coma when the three girls bonded Rand, it is understandable if it dont happen very often =P

Lan isn't in Death mode now because he has a reason to live now (Nynaeve). When Myrelle held the bond he pushed himself to near death during practices and he was nearly dead when he arrived to the Saldiar AS camp

[Luckers]

@ Cem Önal

Well, it has to be somebody. If not Sorilea and Alanna then who? Any suspects? I used to be pretty sure that it was Sorilea because she is the only one who knew how to disarm the wards on Cadsuane's box.

Nobody else knew those weaves as they were Cadsuane's own invention and BS made clear in interviews that this was not something that Shaidar Haran could have done himself.

 

I still think Bashere has a solid chance--we know something removes him from the line of inheritence re: the Broken Crown as Faile and Perrin end up with it, and then there is this....

 

"And there's something... dark... in the images I saw around Lord Davram. If he turns against you, or dies..."

 

Now the obvious answer to both is death--but I like the idea of his turning. It's very RJ.

 

Of course there is the issue of the blinding light Rand seems to induce in Darkfriends, but then we already know that that varies--Weiramon and Anaiyella simply find it hard to look at him, whilst the guy in Saldaea was driven mad by it. Alternatively Weiramon could have warned the Shadow, and they've been busily warding their darkfriends against it or some other such.

 

From there though--consider... Bashere has never done anything on behalf of the Light against the Shadow. He didn't bring down Taim--apparently he nearly let himself be defeated by Taim--this from a Great Captain. The only campeign he's ever undertaken on Rand's behalf was against the Seanchan, not the Shadow. And as for the forming and the use of the Legion of the Dragon has never been turned against the Shadow, and the long absense of the Legion has often been used to suggest that its been subverted for evil ends on the forums.

 

There is, of course, the oddity of the Seal that Bashere has and the fact that Darkfriends attacked his wife in trying to find it--but then there is an oddity anyway in Taim giving it to Rand in the first place. I've suggested in the past that Taim may have done it to win himself time before the Great Lord's return to displace the Forsaken, and there is no reason Bashere wouldn't join in in such a plan--possibly they even planned the approach to Rand together, despite their hatred (presuming that hatred wasn't play acting to begin with).

[MasterAblar]

In CoT chapter 24, exactly what you quoted Luckers in fact, Min says this about Logain, Dobraine and Bashere:

 

"Logain's aura still speaks of glory, stronger than ever. Maybe he still thinks he's the Dragon Reborn. And there's something . . . dark . . . in the images I saw around Lord Davram. If he turns against you, or dies . . . I heard one of the soldiers say Lord Dobraine might die. Losing even one of the would be a blow. Lose all three, and it might take you a year to recover."

 

The bolded part, is that a viewing, or just Min being smart? If it's just Min being smart, why does she include Logain in that? Dobraine and Bashere have already proven their worth, but Rand didn't even know Logain was an Asha'man before he showed just a few moments earlier! And he certainly didn't trust him at all, or believe that he would be of any particular importance to him. What, apart from a viewing could lead her to claim losing Logain would be a significant blow, putting him on the same level as Dobraine and Bashere? And if she's just being smart, isn't she sort of stating the obvious? I mean I'm pretty sure Rand is aware of how important Bashere (his greatest commander with Mat, and the man he relies on the most with Perrin, Mat, and the Aiel) and Dobraine (pretty much the only Cairhienin who has been more or less unambiguously loyal to him, not to mention rescued him from the Shaido) are.

 

 

I have to say, if Bashere is a darkfriend, he's really, really good. Nothing in the way he acts hints towards him being a darkfriend in my opinion. For example in ToM, when Rand puts himself in great danger, he gets frustrated. And he advises abandoning the city, when the shadow would be best helped by the Light trying to hold on to it (obviously Bashere wasn't aware that Rand could send the entire trolloc army packing on his own). And then he worries that Rand let the Dark One goad him into it, and Rand agrees he made a mistake (or does he? He seems to say it was a necessary mistake). Compared with Weiramon and Verin who were always a little suspicious, Bashere comes off as a pretty damn good actor, even when you're in his own head.

[herid]

@ Cem Önal

Well, it has to be somebody. If not Sorilea and Alanna then who? Any suspects? I used to be pretty sure that it was Sorilea because she is the only one who knew how to disarm the wards on Cadsuane's box.

Nobody else knew those weaves as they were Cadsuane's own invention and BS made clear in interviews that this was not something that Shaidar Haran could have done himself.

 

I still think Bashere has a solid chance--we know something removes him from the line of inheritence re: the Broken Crown as Faile and Perrin end up with it, and then there is this....

 

"And there's something... dark... in the images I saw around Lord Davram. If he turns against you, or dies..."

 

Now the obvious answer to both is death--but I like the idea of his turning. It's very RJ.

 

Of course there is the issue of the blinding light Rand seems to induce in Darkfriends, but then we already know that that varies--Weiramon and Anaiyella simply find it hard to look at him, whilst the guy in Saldaea was driven mad by it. Alternatively Weiramon could have warned the Shadow, and they've been busily warding their darkfriends against it or some other such.

 

From there though--consider... Bashere has never done anything on behalf of the Light against the Shadow. He didn't bring down Taim--apparently he nearly let himself be defeated by Taim--this from a Great Captain. The only campeign he's ever undertaken on Rand's behalf was against the Seanchan, not the Shadow. And as for the forming and the use of the Legion of the Dragon has never been turned against the Shadow, and the long absense of the Legion has often been used to suggest that its been subverted for evil ends on the forums.

 

There is, of course, the oddity of the Seal that Bashere has and the fact that Darkfriends attacked his wife in trying to find it--but then there is an oddity anyway in Taim giving it to Rand in the first place. I've suggested in the past that Taim may have done it to win himself time before the Great Lord's return to displace the Forsaken, and there is no reason Bashere wouldn't join in in such a plan--possibly they even planned the approach to Rand together, despite their hatred (presuming that hatred wasn't play acting to begin with).

Personally, I'm very sure Bashere is not a DF. He never did anything even vaguely suspicious. He raised Faile. For all her flaws she is infinitely far from being a DF. Perrin smelled him and found nothing at all amiss. And Bashere showed zero negative reaction to the new Rand even when Rand was super channeling in Maradon. We have no evidence that the shadow can shield people from that.

About Bashere almost losing to Taim. He didn't lose and let's not forget that Taim is a very powerful channeler. Even Hawkwing almost lost to Amalasan. As for fighting against the shadow for Rand, he did against Sammael (their plan against Sammael worked quite well) and later in Borderlands if only briefly. There are other small things about him that I like such as the fact that he suggested the name Asha'man to Rand. It's one of the few positive terms related to the Black tower both in-story (the Old Tongue meaning) and mythologically (Asha). Most other terms like the ones that Taim introduced are the exact opposite. Storm Leader and Attack Leader are very similar to Nazi SS titles for example.

 

Min's viewing just means that Bashere is going to die IMO. Both he and Tenobia have to clear a way for Perrin to become the king of Saldaea. The legion of the Dragon might indeed have some DFs which could explain how Bashere dies.

[Whizbang]

Back to Alanna:

 

One of the methods to help warders past the death rage is to give them something so important that they want to live. This is proven with Lan and Nyn. Rand already has something so important that he must live. Pre-VoG, he was already about as grim as it gets. He was convinced he was fated to die at TG, and the only thing keeping him going was his sense of duty. Losing the bond to Alanna (through her death) would just be one more pile of crap on the heap, but his duty would push him on. He could wait a couple of weeks/months to die. Post-VoG, he has discovered his reason to live and fight, and so loing the bond would be sad for him, but not enough for him to just rashly run off to the blight.

 

Alanna is in the borderlands/blight un-doing some plot by the BA. She'll come out of nowhere with some treasure or some forsaken in the bag.