AMOL progress and excitement...

[capuga]

Ach I don't agree with the sentiment that the book needs more time so to speak it's simply going to be Tor and the editing team being slow and Brandon twiddling his thumbs as he waits about. He'll be feeling like his productivity has taken a massive hit. I'm a little surprised that they're not saying the editing time will be reduced given Brandon will be doing a second draft, as he is actually a fast worker. Tor needs to work a bit smarter like digital editing to get it done quicker. Collaborative documents etc. If im not mistaken RJ was not a digital man, Brandon is, therefore needs less time.

 

Well you would certainly know better than Brandon, the editors, and the publisher.

 

I think (with no supporting evidence at all) that there is a real possibility that the book could be ready around mid-summer but not released until November just to take advantage of the prime holiday release period. Releasing the book is a money making/business decision and not just a matter of how fast they can finish it up.

[Suttree]

Ach I don't agree with the sentiment that the book needs more time so to speak it's simply going to be Tor and the editing team being slow and Brandon twiddling his thumbs as he waits about. He'll be feeling like his productivity has taken a massive hit. I'm a little surprised that they're not saying the editing time will be reduced given Brandon will be doing a second draft, as he is actually a fast worker.

 

As has been posted in other threads, I find it hard to disagree when it comes straight from BS's assistant Peter...

 

This does mean editing and revision will take longer, but rushing TOWERS caused a ton of headaches and stress, and Team Jordan and Brandon all want to avoid that this time. They have to get things RIGHT in this final book.

[Bob T Dwarf]

Ach I don't agree with the sentiment that the book needs more time so to speak it's simply going to be Tor and the editing team being slow and Brandon twiddling his thumbs as he waits about. He'll be feeling like his productivity has taken a massive hit. I'm a little surprised that they're not saying the editing time will be reduced given Brandon will be doing a second draft, as he is actually a fast worker.

 

As has been posted in other threads, I find it hard to disagree when it comes straight from BS's assistant Peter...

 

This does mean editing and revision will take longer, but rushing TOWERS caused a ton of headaches and stress, and Team Jordan and Brandon all want to avoid that this time. They have to get things RIGHT in this final book.

 

Please! Let's not wish the excessive foot dragging and lily gilding that Jordan indulged in on anyone. Least of all us, his loyal readers.

 

Lord of Chaos is Book 6 of the series and carries a 1994 copyright.

Knife of Dreams is Book 11 of the series and carries a 2005 copyright. Five additional books in eleven years.

2012 is staring us in the face and we still don't have volume 14 in our hands 7 years after volume 11. How much further foot dragging can even WOT endure before it crumbles to dust from sheer entropy?

 

The first six books are individually and collectively better than any of the following five, and they were written, published and already into paperback within four years. All Jordan's "polishing" over the next eleven years did was anger his readers and cost him most of the core of his most ardent fans.

 

Polishing is the last thing A Memory of Light needs. Proof it for spelling and continuity errors and print it before we all die of old age.

[Suttree]

Polishing is the last thing A Memory of Light needs. Proof it for spelling and continuity errors and print it before we all die of old age.

 

Mate you have to be joking. For one your post above detailing time doesn't take into account RJ's passing, and second BS/Tor's rush job turned out some truly clumsy writing. The lack of polish in those books was a serious issue and now we have two books in the series that offer almost zero rereadability. Regardless of how you rank the books RJ wrote, the quality of writing never suffered. KoD for instance is consistently makes the top 5 books in the series.

 

The series has suffered greatly trying to keep to some 1 per year schedule during TGS and ToM. They owe it to RJ and his legacy to make this the best book it can possibly be regardless of the time it takes. BS assistant has admitted as much. Not sure how anyone can argue with that?

 

Edit: Added Tor in the rush job sentence.

[Bob T Dwarf]

Polishing is the last thing A Memory of Light needs. Proof it for spelling and continuity errors and print it before we all die of old age.

 

Mate you have to be joking. For one your post above detailing time doesn't take into account RJ's passing, and second BS/Tor's rush job turned out some truly clumsy writing. The lack of polish in those books was a serious issue and now we have two books in the series that offer almost zero rereadability. Regardless of how you rank the books RJ wrote, the quality of writing never suffered. KoD for instance is consistently makes the top 5 books in the series.

 

The series has suffered greatly trying to keep to some 1 per year schedule during TGS and ToM. They owe it to RJ and his legacy to make this the best book it can possibly be regardless of the time it takes. BS assistant has admitted as much. Not sure how anyone can argue with that?

 

Edit: Added Tor in the rush job sentence.

 

I'm not joking one bit.

 

We're not talking Shakespeare here. This is pulp fantasy fiction. He's Robert Jordan, not Heinlein or even Zelasny.

 

All Knife of Dreams did was show us that Jordan was still capable of writing an interesting yarn and how badly he had wasted our time and goodwill for the preceding 11 years. Not satisfied with that, he then had the bad manners to die on us and leave somebody else to clean up his mess. ( Something Zelasny also did, but he had the further bad manners to not leave enough notes that anyone could even attempt to finish his Amber series. )

 

It's been 22 years. We need The Wheel of Time to be over and done with so that we can move on to other things. If Harriet simply cannot let go of her husband let her spend that time and effort on the promised Encyclopedia. But, please, for the sake of all that's holy, don't delay AMoL any longer than it already has been.

[Suttree]

I'm not joking one bit.

 

We're not talking Shakespeare here. This is pulp fantasy fiction. He's Robert Jordan, not Heinlein or even Zelasny.

 

Look I get it, really. I was a Lit major at a UC school so I understand the difference. I don't think we can classify tWoT as "pulp fantasy" however and how the writing stacks up outside of genre has no bearing on keeping true to form for what has already passed in the series. The rushed nature of the last two books hurt the series(writing and errors), BS through his assistant is acknowledging that and they are taking the proper steps to fix it.

 

BTW not sure if it came across correctly but your comment concerning RJ's passing seems to be made in very poor taste.

[Guest PiotrekS]

I agree with Suttree here.

 

People can have different opinions about the quality of RJ's writing in comparison to masterpieces of world literature. But regardless of that, there is a very clear difference in the quality of writing between the first eleven tomes and TGS and ToM. Even if you see RJ's writing as "pulp fantasy" - which I personally disagree with - how do you rank the books which are wrtitten a level or two below that? I mean TGS and ToM.

 

The last book definitely needs more polish. A few months more waiting is small enough price to pay for a better book, which will be enjoyable on the re-read.

[TheBeerPatriot]

While I can see the point that TGS and TOM suffered some continuity and editing errors, I do have to disagree with a previous poster that said these two books offer almost zero re-read value as a result of these errors. Both of these books do not stray so much from the themes of WOT that they detract from the series. At the very least these two books offer far more re-read value than Crossroads of Twilight.

 

So long as we indeed get AMOL in 2012, then a little more editing time to polish it up should be fine.

[capuga]

Let's also not forget that in the world of literature 6 months or so is nothing. These books will be around "forever". Your great-great grandchildren will be able to read these stories. Will it matter at that point whether we had to wait for our gratification for a few more months or that they get to read the best possible book? Asking for this sooner regardless of the costs to quality is a very selfish and short-sighted request. Whether it is Shakespear or not, it is still a literary legacy that will be left behind and I would want that legacy to be as good as possible.

[Guest PiotrekS]

For me, Crossroads of Twilight offer some enjoyable re-read time because of Mat and Tuon scenes. I don't find anything comparable in terms of writing in either TGS or ToM, maybe excepting Veins of Gold and some other single chapters. In CoT almost nothing happened in terms of plot, but the writing was ok IMHO. IN TGS and ToM there were a lot of important plot developments, but I personally had trouble with immersing myself in the story as much as in case of earlier works.

 

I wouldn't of course say that TGS and ToM offer zero re-read value, but it is true that I definitely prefer to reread earlier books, especially TSR and TFH. I find ToM to be more attractive in re-read than TGS, because there are some bits and pieces of good writing scattered through, especially in the prologue, Apples first or Ituralde chapters. I might be biased against TGS though, because of my issues with a certain character who takes half of this book for her arc I'm seriously curious who wrote Veins of Gold.

[Bromo Sapien]

I'm not joking one bit.

 

We're not talking Shakespeare here. This is pulp fantasy fiction. He's Robert Jordan, not Heinlein or even Zelasny.

 

All Knife of Dreams did was show us that Jordan was still capable of writing an interesting yarn and how badly he had wasted our time and goodwill for the preceding 11 years. Not satisfied with that, he then had the bad manners to die on us and leave somebody else to clean up his mess. ( Something Zelasny also did, but he had the further bad manners to not leave enough notes that anyone could even attempt to finish his Amber series. )

 

It's been 22 years. We need The Wheel of Time to be over and done with so that we can move on to other things. If Harriet simply cannot let go of her husband let her spend that time and effort on the promised Encyclopedia. But, please, for the sake of all that's holy, don't delay AMoL any longer than it already has been.

 

Do you even like this series? That's a dead serious question. Honestly, do you like these books? Because from what you've been writing here and earlier, the answer clearly seems to be a resounding no. If you just want it to be "over and done with", don't read aMoL. It can be over right now for you. From what I can tell by this passage, you only care about the series ending, not the series ending well.

 

BTW, that entire post was entirely condescending and incredibly rude to Jordan's legacy and especially to Harriet. "If Harriet simply cannot let go of her husband..." Seriously, bro? Learn some damn compassion.

 

After that little attack...

 

I honestly consider TGS with Tracy Jordan to be one of my favorite books of the series, but I do admit to really liking Egwene and she whooped absolute ass in this book. The entire ending is honestly up there with the end of EotW and WH for me, tbh, and blows Dumai's Well out of the water (which is one of the more overrated scenes in the series). Everything from Rand's confrontation with Tam on just gave me chills. The writing might not have been the best, but after some very, very long plotlines that really didn't need to be as long as they were, it was nice to see some advancement again. I loved seeing Rand fall further into the darkness, I loved Egwene going BAMFtastic, and I loved Gawyn actually getting some badassery himself (finally). The writing might not have been as great as Robert Jordan, but BS came in very late to the series, didn't murder it, and did some great things with the plot. To me, it's probably the only book that I would sit down and read individually instead of reading the entire series as a whole (like I normally do). At one point I simply read the entire White Tower plotline by itself because it was awesome. TGS (and BS) gets a lot of crap, but I feel like BS did as good a job as possible unless he was able to tap directly into RJ's mind.

[khutch8]

I think, and this is from my own perspective, that what fans don't want is for the publisher to hold off publishing the book for marketing reasons. I've written a (rather extensive) post about this, but basically, Brandon Said on his Twitter account that:

 

"However, realistically, I doubt Tor will pass up the holiday season for the last WoT book. Or at least the summer season.

Werthead While they COULD pick spring, it wouldn't make much sense marketing wise, and I think Harriet wants a good six months to edit."

 

I think this is what has caused some dissention. The fact that marketing even is a consideration for the final Wheel of Time book. To quote myself: I graduate from University in the late Spring, and if AMoL came out on the day of my graduation, I would still pick it up that morning, and likely be reading it during the ceremony. I think this is probably the sentiments of most WoT fans. I don't think there is an "optimum time" for release in that regard. It should be released when it's done.

I want them to take the time to make a great, polished book, no doubt about that, and I support Harriet and Brandon and Team Jordan wholeheartedly in that regard. However, for the publisher to essentially withhold the book for marketing reasons, knowing that we have been (not intentionally - not meant as an inflammatory comment) strung along for this last book, is essentially a slap in the face to fans.

[CUBAREY]

I want them to take the time to make a great, polished book, no doubt about that, and I support Harriet and Brandon and Team Jordan wholeheartedly in that regard. However, for the publisher to essentially withhold the book for marketing reasons, knowing that we have been (not intentionally - not meant as an inflammatory comment) strung along for this last book, is essentially a slap in the face to fans.

 

Except that those involved are professionals, i.e. they live from the money they make from writing/editing publishing books. So if a 2 month delay in publishing the book translates into 50,000 or 100,000 more books being sold that means more money for Harriet and Brandon which I see as a good thing. Moreover, I have no problem in Tom Doherty and TOR maximizing their profits, as those profits allow them to continue publishing. I have been an avid fan since 1992, I have no problems in waiting a couple of months more if that insures that Harriet, Brandon and TOR receive the maximum profits from their labors.

[Bromo Sapien]

Which is more fun: the journey or the destination? Meaning those extra X amount of months will be spent speculating and hypothesizing where you are NEVER WRONG! Sounds friggin' awesome to me. Think about it. Name one successful ending to a TV show. Just a month or two ago, people were flipping out over the ending to Entourage. Last year, it was the ending of Lost. Before that, the Sopranos. While I don't think this will be anywhere close to a disappointment that most people will bitch about, I do think that when it comes to popular shows, especially ones riddled with mysteries like Lost and WOT, nobody really wants all the answers. The extra time, I think, will be helpful to the fans. You might think you want it immediately because for 20+ years now, that's what you've wanted, but I'd rather have the extra time to play with theories and ideas. Not that I won't buy and devour aMoL the morning it comes out, but, you know. Once it's out there, I'm not going to deny myself.

[capuga]

I think this is what has caused some dissention. The fact that marketing even is a consideration for the final Wheel of Time book.

 

To expect a for profit business not to make monetary business decisions is really unfair. I see an awful lot of fan entitlement in this thread. Brandon and Harriet should do what they need to do to protect their and the WoT's legacy. TOR should make as much money as they can. That's both reality and just being fair to those involved in putting this product out.

[Suttree]

However, for the publisher to essentially withhold the book for marketing reasons, knowing that we have been (not intentionally - not meant as an inflammatory comment) strung along for this last book, is essentially a slap in the face to fans.

 

It's a business plain and simple. They would be negligent in their jobs if they were not releasing this big of a book during the proper time of year. It's the exact same thing as movies being targeted for certain release dates. To be put off by, or expect anything else is being very unrealistic and quite simply shows some heavy entitlement issues.

 

As a side note to the people complaining about BS taking the extra time, as Neil Gaiman said, George R.R. Martin is not your bitch.

 

http://journal.neilgaiman.com/2009/05/entitlement-issues.html

 

Edit: Cue all folks who were ranting about some grand Tor conspiracy when the books were split. Somewhat surprised they haven't entered the fray already.

[khutch8]

The thing is - TOR IS going to make money on this book - I'm assuming it will have a similar amount of hype that "A Dance With Dragons" had this summer - and it stayed on the NY Times bestseller list for an extended period of time. It doesn't matter when the book is released - WoT fans will be lining up out the door for it on Day 1, be it Christmas, New Year, Random Local Holiday #2 etc. And I'm not convinced waiting until November is the greatest idea anyways - November seems to be both the Stephen King month for a new book, as well as the James Patterson month for a new Cross book - both of these authors consistantly hit the bestseller list, and will definitely give AMoL a run for its money (especially since next years SK book is looking likely to be a sequel to The Shining).

 

Furthermore, by cutting AMoL (original) into three books, TOR has already tripled their profit. Now, yes, it was necessary to divide the book. They could have likely done it in two volumes though (again, DWD was about 425 000 words I believe - it was publishable - so it would likely have been very possible to publish the original last volume in two volumes (GS was 303 000 words, ToM was 326 000 and AMoL is going to be around the same as those two - likely altogether they'll be 940 000 words - two volumes of 470 000 words - I'm sure adding an aditional 45 000 words (less than the length of Stephen King's "The Gunslinger") to a book would not pose undue hardship (nevermind the arguement of "the stores don't like big books on their shelves - its the Wheel of Time - they're not going to abstain from ordering any in because it's big))).

I think that after waiting so many years that, yes, the fans are entitled to a resolution As Soon As Possible, and while TOR is entitled to (and expected to) make profit on these books, I think withholding it for any length of time after it is ready is really saying that making the last extra couple of bucks is more important to them than the loyalty displayed by hundreds of thousands of fans over the past twenty years.

[baalsmistress]

Well A Memory of Light on Amazon is there, with a planned release data of November 1st 2012

 

I realise that that is just a best guess by Amazon without publisher confirmation, but I don't hold out any hopes of it being before then.

[Bromo Sapien]

The thing is - TOR IS going to make money on this book - I'm assuming it will have a similar amount of hype that "A Dance With Dragons" had this summer - and it stayed on the NY Times bestseller list for an extended period of time. It doesn't matter when the book is released - WoT fans will be lining up out the door for it on Day 1, be it Christmas, New Year, Random Local Holiday #2 etc. And I'm not convinced waiting until November is the greatest idea anyways - November seems to be both the Stephen King month for a new book, as well as the James Patterson month for a new Cross book - both of these authors consistantly hit the bestseller list, and will definitely give AMoL a run for its money (especially since next years SK book is looking likely to be a sequel to The Shining).

 

Furthermore, by cutting AMoL (original) into three books, TOR has already tripled their profit. Now, yes, it was necessary to divide the book. They could have likely done it in two volumes though (again, DWD was about 425 000 words I believe - it was publishable - so it would likely have been very possible to publish the original last volume in two volumes (GS was 303 000 words, ToM was 326 000 and AMoL is going to be around the same as those two - likely altogether they'll be 940 000 words - two volumes of 470 000 words - I'm sure adding an aditional 45 000 words (less than the length of Stephen King's "The Gunslinger") to a book would not pose undue hardship (nevermind the arguement of "the stores don't like big books on their shelves - its the Wheel of Time - they're not going to abstain from ordering any in because it's big))).

I think that after waiting so many years that, yes, the fans are entitled to a resolution As Soon As Possible, and while TOR is entitled to (and expected to) make profit on these books, I think withholding it for any length of time after it is ready is really saying that making the last extra couple of bucks is more important to them than the loyalty displayed by hundreds of thousands of fans over the past twenty years.

 

The whole reason the holidays are better times to release stuff is because of gifts. Yes, most WOT fans will line up Day 1 to get it, but there will also be those fans who read the book, then put it down to wait for the next one, the ones who aren't hardcore WOT fans. TOR is catering to them with this release date and I think that's completely fair. As much as we see it as an entertainment form, this is TOR's business and they have to look out for their own best interests. More money for them as well as more time to polish it up is all around better for everyone. It's not like the book is going to be finished in March and then Brandon's going to stick it on a shelf to gather dust. They'll be refining it and making it perfect during those waiting months. It's going to be a lot better with a November release date than with one in the early part of the year.

[Guest Emu on the Loose]

Was it actually confirmed somewhere that TOR is going to deliberately hold back AMoL until the 2012 holiday season so as to maximize its business interests, or is this just speculative?

[Suttree]

Was it actually confirmed somewhere that TOR is going to deliberately hold back AMoL until the 2012 holiday season so as to maximize its business interests, or is this just speculative?

 

 

Two quotes, one BS twitter

 

"However, realistically, I doubt Tor will pass up the holiday season for the last WoT book. Or at least the summer season.

Werthead While they COULD pick spring, it wouldn't make much sense marketing wise, and I think Harriet wants a good six months to edit."

 

& BS assistant

 

That was the case with THE GATHERING STORM and TOWERS OF MIDNIGHT, but it's not how they're doing A MEMORY OF LIGHT. Instead, Brandon is writing a complete draft and then doing a revision or two before sending a polished draft to Team Jordan on December 31st (and that will be the first draft they see). This is more like Robert Jordan's process; he never showed anything to Harriet until it was finished. This does mean editing and revision will take longer, but rushing TOWERS caused a ton of headaches and stress, and Team Jordan and Brandon all want to avoid that this time. They have to get things RIGHT in this final book.

 

 

So while revisions and editing is the primary concern, not sure how anyone is up in arms about Tor doing it's job by possibly having a Summer or Holiday release.

[Bob T Dwarf]

For me, Crossroads of Twilight offer some enjoyable re-read time because of Mat and Tuon scenes. I don't find anything comparable in terms of writing in either TGS or ToM, maybe excepting Veins of Gold and some other single chapters. In CoT almost nothing happened in terms of plot, but the writing was ok IMHO. IN TGS and ToM there were a lot of important plot developments, but I personally had trouble with immersing myself in the story as much as in case of earlier works.

 

I wouldn't of course say that TGS and ToM offer zero re-read value, but it is true that I definitely prefer to reread earlier books, especially TSR and TFH. I find ToM to be more attractive in re-read than TGS, because there are some bits and pieces of good writing scattered through, especially in the prologue, Apples first or Ituralde chapters. I might be biased against TGS though, because of my issues with a certain character who takes half of this book for her arc I'm seriously curious who wrote Veins of Gold.

 

Dunno. And that's the beauty of that Chapter.

 

When TGS came out there was much wailing and gnashing of teeth and rending of cloth over the Mat scenes. Brandon Sanderson's name was taken in vain in many uncomplimentary ways. Then it was revealed that almost all of the Mat stuff had been written by Jordan.

 

Those who hated Sanderson for "ruining" their Mat now hated him for not having written the offending passages and leaving them looking like fools because they thought he had. Those folks are never going to reread TGS for those reasons alone, not because it isn't a well written book.

 

Given what bad shape the overall plot was in when Jordan died, and how much of a mess he left to clean up, TGS and ToM are miracles of clarity and conciseness which against all odds got the plot back to a place where it could be wrapped up in one more book.

 

Given all of the context within which those books were written I'll take them any day over any of A Crown of Swords, The Path of Daggers, Crossroads of Twilight, or Winter's Heart all of which were personally polished by Robert Jordan until there was nothing left to them BUT their flaws.

 

Sanderson, Harriet, TOR, etal are making a huge mistake by pandering to the very vocal minority who are going to hate A Memory of Light no matter how polished or unpolished it is simply because it was not written by Robert Jordan.

 

The only part of that book that matters is the last scene that was written by Jordan. The ending he foresaw before he started writing The Eye of the World. That's the beef. Everything else is just the filler.

[Suttree]

When TGS came out there was much wailing and gnashing of teeth and rending of cloth over the Mat scenes. Brandon Sanderson's name was taken in vain in many uncomplimentary ways. Then it was revealed that almost all of the Mat stuff had been written by Jordan.

 

Those who hated Sanderson for "ruining" their Mat now hated him for not having written the offending passages and leaving them looking like fools because they thought he had. Those folks are never going to reread TGS for those reasons alone, not because it isn't a well written book.

 

Wait what?

 

I have heard the RJ wrote the whole ToG sequence in ToM but have never even remotely heard it implied that RJ wrote the majority of Mat in TGS(Hinderstrap?!?!) If true I would be very interested in seeing quotes backing this up?

[Guest PiotrekS]

I'm pretty sure most, if not all, Mat in TGS was Brandon's. Hell, Brandon himself acknowledged that a lot of readers had issues with Mat in TGS and said he would work to write him better in ToM(not his exact words, but that's the gist). It would be really weird if he said he would try to write better Mat if that Mat had been in fact RJ's.

 

I think Bob might have confused Mat from TGS with Tower of Ghenjei sequence from ToM, which as I'd heard was written mainly by RJ.

 

I think we might be looking at the books from different perspectives here. For me personally the ending is not so huge a thing as for many others (that doesn't mean I'm not interested though!). I enjoy mainly the worldbuilding and characters, particular very well written scenes etc. For example right now I'm re-reading Shadow Rising and Fires of Heaven, just for Rand and Mat's interactions with the Aiel, the whole exposition of fascinating Aiel culture and lots of great scenes there (and Asmodean, of course). In fact, I might say I enjoy the most those things you might call the "filler", while on the other hand you seem to be concentrating mainly on plot gratification, in which case it is perfectly reasonable you would enjoy both TGS and ToM.

 

I would say different perspectives, both acceptable.

 

edit: I'm not believing for a second RJ wrote Hinderstrap. It might be a generational thing or something, but I just don't see RJ introducing a B zombie movie into WOT under any circumstances...If you're looking for a really weak and grating filler, Hinderstrap is a perfect example.

[Bob T Dwarf]

I'm pretty sure most, if not all, Mat in TGS was Brandon's. Hell, Brandon himself acknowledged that a lot of readers had issues with Mat in TGS and said he would work to write him better in ToM(not his exact words, but that's the gist). It would be really weird if he said he would try to write better Mat if that Mat had been in fact RJ's.

 

I think Bob might have confused Mat from TGS with Tower of Ghenjei sequence from ToM, which as I'd heard was written mainly by RJ.

 

I think we might be looking at the books from different perspectives here. For me personally the ending is not so huge a thing as for many others (that doesn't mean I'm not interested though!). I enjoy mainly the worldbuilding and characters, particular very well written scenes etc. For example right now I'm re-reading Shadow Rising and Fires of Heaven, just for Rand and Mat's interactions with the Aiel, the whole exposition of fascinating Aiel culture and lots of great scenes there (and Asmodean, of course). In fact, I might say I enjoy the most those things you might call the "filler", while on the other hand you seem to be concentrating mainly on plot gratification, in which case it is perfectly reasonable you would enjoy both TGS and ToM.

 

I would say different perspectives, both acceptable.

 

edit: I'm not believing for a second RJ wrote Hinderstrap. It might be a generational thing or something, but I just don't see RJ introducing a B zombie movie into WOT under any circumstances...If you're looking for a really weak and grating filler, Hinderstrap is a perfect example.

 

You're trying to take Hinderstap out of context. Mat's just had his whole world rocked. The child who kept trying to run and hide from all responsibility has just had to mastermind a brilliant guerrilla warfare campaign, followed by calmly watching 10,000 heavy cavalry kill themselves for greed. All coming hard on the heels of a marriage that scares him to his marrow, and learning that he's now not just nobility but royalty because of that marriage. And then execute an escape for 8000-9000 men pledged to him as their commander.

 

Mat is beginning to come to grips with his destiny at long last and it has him way, WAAAAAAAY out of his comfort zone. The Wheel has finally succeeded in forcing him to become a new Mat, and he's floundering around as he attempts to deal with all of the changes. You honestly expect someone in that set of circumstances to be unchanged by it all, and behave exactly as he did in, say, Salidar?

 

It's called character development. In Mat's case it's particularly hilarious because it has been so suppressed and so delayed. The Mat from TGS was perfect for his new circumstances.

 

If you REALLY enjoy the atmospherics and worldbuilding, may I recommend to you anything by Sinclair Lewis. He could do 20 pages about the dust on the mantelpiece.