Egwene hate thread

[Hybrid]

She was using one of the most powerful items of power ever created. Imagine the rush from wielding that much Saidar combined with defeating almost single handed the greatest threat the WT has ever faced. Think she can be forgiven for going overboard in that situation.

 

I get it. It was just that the wording of the thought was so over the top that it bordered on caricature.

[DemandredFO]

Since this has mostly become a debate, can on of the Egwene fans tell me a reason why she nearly got a taveren killed during the TAR battle with Mesaana and the BA. There isn't one but I just want to hear the creative logic.

A second point, I also would like to hear reason as to why she gave Nicola enough responsibility to kill herself.

[Suttree]

Since this has mostly become a debate, can on of the Egwene fans tell me a reason why she nearly got a taveren killed during the TAR battle with Mesaana and the BA. There isn't one but I just want to hear the creative logic.

A second point, I also would like to hear reason as to why she gave Nicola enough responsibility to kill herself.

 

Would creative logic from someone like Brandon interest you at all?

 

 

Towers of Midnight book tour 7 November 2010 Harvard Coop, Cambridge, MA - Zaela Sedai reporting

 

Q: Much has been made of Egwene’s thought to tie up Perrin in the midst of a battle that could have brought about his death if he had not been able to stop her. Such apparent negligence is shocking considering her knowledge of how quickly things can happen in Tel'aran'rhiod. Can you Explain Egwene’s thought process? Did she intend to leave Perrin there while she finished the battle?

A: (not verbatim) Egwene thought she was doing the right thing. She was acting as the Amyrlin and trying to make sure that he would be safe and out of the way of danger. She was not going to tie him up and leave him, she would have brought him somewhere safe away from the danger of the fight and left him there until it was over.

[DemandredFO]

Of the two of them Perrin is the only one that has so far stopped balefire. I'm not confident Egwene would've had enough time to leave before the balefire came calling.

[David Selig]

Since this has mostly become a debate, can on of the Egwene fans tell me a reason why she nearly got a taveren killed during the TAR battle with Mesaana and the BA. There isn't one but I just want to hear the creative logic.

 

She wanted to spare all of us the pain of having to read about Perrin anymore, I think that was a highly commendable goal.

 

A second point, I also would like to hear reason as to why she gave Nicola enough responsibility to kill herself.

She wanted to rid the story of another boring and annoying character and thankfully succeeded this time.

[Himiko]

^ Pretty much absurd. The asses being dragged into line belong to Aes Sedai, a group hardly beloved by most people who don't like Egwene.

 

As for Rand, he got EXACTLY what he was looking for from Egwene, don't kid yourself.

 

There are many reasons people don't like Egwene. The fact that you and Kael don't find those reasons compelling doesn't mean that those reasons are invalid. Standards aren't set by trolls.

 

I still think Egwene just makes you feel all funny in your tummy.

 

They are very compelling, they just simply are not true.

 

Kael, generally I enjoy reading your posts, because, much as I disagree with you on the subject of Egwene, your posts are usually fairly calm, and you explain your reasoning, in other words, as a general rule, you are a fun person to debate with, and a poster that I respect.

 

However, I'm going to have to disagree here. Massively. I have seen many reasons for disliking Egwene put forward. I have seen many reasons for liking Egwene put forward. Both sides have backed up their sides with evidence (by and large, certainly not all posters have done so), and, in many cases, different interpretations of the text allow us to draw two very different conclusions. In other cases, a person's mileage may vary on Egwene depending on characteristics that particularly appeal to/ annoy that particular reader. You have drawn different conclusions from the text than people who dislike Egwene, and that's fine, that's what books are for. It doesn't mean everyone who reached a different conclusion than you or interpreted the text differently is wrong or "simply not true". I've seen BOTH sides back up their points, and both sides interpret things differently. Why is your interpretation apparently so much more valid than ours?

 

And, on a general note to everyone, I am sick of people saying "Well, this other character has faults! But no-one's criticising them, so noone should criticise Egwene either!" Glance up at the thread title, people. Its a thread for people to talk about why Egwene annoys us. Or perhaps what aspects of her annoy us, without needing to hate the character themselves. If this was entitled "Nynaeve hate thread" or "Rand hate thread", then you'd probably see more posts criticising those two characters.

 

People have explained why Egwene's abilities annoy them and not Nynaeve's- because Nynaeve does not have anywhere near the level of knowledge that Egwene supposedly has. Nynaeve's weak points are shown throughout the story, her natural aptitude for healing and her raw strength are behind a lot of her success, and she comments fairly late on in the series that her abilities in Delving, I believe, were improving, there is certainly no suggestion that in any area outside of healing, Nynaeve is anywhere near mastery of weaving, nor, beyond a basic level of knowledge in politics, and her knowledge of healing with herbs, is she particularly skilled in anything else. Noone is arguing that Egwene shouldn't have a better knowledge of weaving in general than Nynaeve, given her willingness to learn, and being forced by the Seanchan. It is that she has apparently read, and memorised, volumes worth of information on Tower history and politics and law, whilst having meetings with Siuan to train her in politics, and we know that she was sleeping because she was Dreamwalking in TAR :P Its that she is described as the best Dreamwalker ever, the best channeler in the WT, surpassing all training, one of the best Amyrlin the Tower has had, as well as being an expert on everything from logic to Warder troubles. Yes, Egwene is thirsty for knowledge. Yes, she likes to learn. But she has spent a maximum of a few months in all of these jobs. She can be as thirsty for knowledge as she wants, she is still going to have to take breaks to eat and sleep. If she is doing such intensive training in each subject, she won't have much time to practice her older skills. This implies that all of the weaves from the hundreds of years of Tower history, and the knowledge that the Ajahs impart, can be learned in a few months of study if you work very hard. You can become an expert in Tower history and law to rival the best AS out there in a few months where all others have taken decades to get there. THAT is the issue. Not that she is powerful. If Nynaeve was good at everything she ever tried, people would probably find that unrealistic, too. Nynaeve learns weaves very quickly, quicker than Egwene, but she is also less eager to learn- so Egwene has a wider knowledge of weaves than she does, I assume. No issues with that. It is the fact that the author/s tremendously overdo it by then saying there is nothing else the WT can teach her.

 

Just to repeat, since people seem to have trouble comprehending this.

 

IT IS NOT THAT EGWENE IS GOOD AT WEAVING. NOT EVEN THAT SHE IS GREAT AT OTHER STUFF. IT IS THAT EVERYTHING SHE TRIES HER HAND AT SHE IS DECLARED A MASTER OF AFTER A FEW MONTHS. THIS DOES NOT HAPPEN WITH NYNAEVE. NYNAEVE IS STRONG IN THE POWER AND GOOD WITH LEARNING WEAVES AND HEALING. SHE IS NOT SHOWN TO BE ESPECIALLY GIFTED AT ANYTHING ELSE. THAT IS WHY THE COMPLAINT IS MADE WITH EGWENE AND NOT NYNAEVE.

 

I hope this has proved helpful to people's comprehension of the question.

[csarmi]

There are many reasons people don't like Egwene. The fact that you and Kael don't find those reasons compelling doesn't mean that those reasons are invalid. Standards aren't set by trolls.

 

That's very funny coming from you, you know :)

[Hadilmir]

Just to repeat, since people seem to have trouble comprehending this.

 

IT IS NOT THAT EGWENE IS GOOD AT WEAVING. NOT EVEN THAT SHE IS GREAT AT OTHER STUFF. IT IS THAT EVERYTHING SHE TRIES HER HAND AT SHE IS DECLARED A MASTER OF AFTER A FEW MONTHS. THIS DOES NOT HAPPEN WITH NYNAEVE. NYNAEVE IS STRONG IN THE POWER AND GOOD WITH LEARNING WEAVES AND HEALING. SHE IS NOT SHOWN TO BE ESPECIALLY GIFTED AT ANYTHING ELSE. THAT IS WHY THE COMPLAINT IS MADE WITH EGWENE AND NOT NYNAEVE.

 

I hope this has proved helpful to people's comprehension of the question.

 

Much appreciated, this is the format I've grown accustomed to reading Anti-Egwene comments. [/trolling]

 

 

Of the two of them Perrin is the only one that has so far stopped balefire. I'm not confident Egwene would've had enough time to leave before the balefire came calling.

 

Certainly you're just trolling here. Has Egwene EVER seen Perrin in T'A'R before? I think there was this once and she wasn't sure it was actually Perrin.

 

 

She wanted to rid the story of another boring and annoying character and thankfully succeeded this time.

 

I consider this one of Egwene's crowning achievements, despite the fact that it was completely unintentional.

[Goldstar]

Egwene is the greatest creation of the mind of Robert Jordan.

[Guest PiotrekS]

That was one of the most unintentionally funny lines in the series IMO. Not only is it monumentally arrogant and self-agrandifying, but it is also just plain stupid. The Seanchan have already faced the actual, true, honest to god Heroes of the Horn; and given that they are still invading the lands of the people those Heroes fought beside, their daring would seem to be of the level needed to face them again. Egwene... you should be embarassed to have even thought those words.

 

100% agreed. I literally could not believe it when I first read those words. The only thing I can think of off the top of my head that it approaches is Rand's words in TPOD during his Seanchan campaign. Those might have been under the influence of the Callandor-magnified Taint, but they didn't even approach the level of ridiculousness or stupidity of Egwene's.

 

She was using one of the most powerful items of power ever created. Imagine the rush from wielding that much Saidar combined with defeating almost single handed the greatest threat the WT has ever faced. Think she can be forgiven for going overboard in that situation.

 

I agree with the part about Saidar, but not with "defeating almost single handed the greatest threat the WT has ever faced.". It is written in a very exaggerated way in TGS and I've noticed the more you like Egwene, the more you tend to exaggerate her actions in TGS.

 

First, the biggest threat WT has ever faced must be either Arthur Hawkwing's siege, Trolloc Wars, Aiel Wars or Black Ajah and Mesaana's infiltration. Certainly not the Seanchan attack, which was a raid.

 

Second, Egwene has not defeated it, since the Seanchean consider it to be a success (officers responsible for it get promoted, Tuon thinks so and wants to repeat it). They made their raid, dropped the blood knives, took their damane, lost some raken - it was a successful raid against enemy's capital. Egwene was the only person who actually gave the Seanchan any fight, which again illustrates the fact that so often it is not Egwene's actions which make her look so good, but rather the terrible, carricaturish weakness of the Aes Sedai surrounding her.

 

I would also like to agree with the point made some posts above about Nynaeve. It is often claimed that "Nynaeve's achievements came too easily too and you don't mind it so much". The key difference is that Nynaeve is good in specifically defined things (which are mutually connected and make sense). Egwene is shown to be good at anything she does and in that regard, she is a unique character in the whole WOT.

[David Selig]

Egwene is shown to be good at anything she does and in that regard, she is a unique character in the whole WOT.

Does the name Rand al'Thor ring any bells? He's way more of a "great at everything" type. Strongest channeller ever and incredibly skilled at weaving, blademaster, great at unarmed fighting, excellent politician, got three beautiful women in love with him, he's even good at playing the flute.... And that's of course without even mentioning that he's the saviour of the world.

 

Really, all main characters in WoT get good at whatever they try at ridiculously fast rate, it's hardly unique for Egwene, she's just had more interests than Nynaeve. Mat became a master juggler in like three weeks, and that's about as long as it took for Elayne to learn to make back flips on the tightrope.

[Luckers]

I'm locking this thread. There is too many personal attacks.