The 3rd Callandor wielder

[gloweye]

I always thought it would be Morraine and Mierin(=redeemed lanfear). We've known for a long time that the CK wouldn't be required, so most likely brute strength in the power is not the main requirement for the circle. Callandor is neccesary. why? maybe a part of the flaw? Caddy stated it was a manufacturing flaw, but what it it was intentional, and designed for closing the bore? (mmmmh, good theory, gotta think about it some more. maybe a tar/sa angreaal combination?) Mierin would be the one who knows to close te bore, and Morraine... actually, mostly because we know of Min's viewings that she is essential. but maybe its more like a Siuan/Garet essential - save his back from an assassin. (fain?)

 

But now iv'e read it all, Tuon seems fine to, instead of Morraine. once convinced by to Ta'veren concerning things like "Channeling" and "Humanity/animality", she could do it as part of her giving an edict over the Seanchan Empire regarding freeing all damane. they may be used to it, but they are also used to obeying the Empress. if she states that Damane are human, then even the damane would agree.

[Tyzack]

Tuon.

 

 

would be so epic

 

Pretty much impossible from my understanding...

 

I'd say:

Rand

Moraine

Nyn

Merine/Lanfear/Cyande (if she is redeamed)...otherwise Avi.

[Gabriel Kross]

Tuon.

 

 

would be so epic

 

Pretty much impossible from my understanding...

 

I'd say:

Rand

Moraine

Nyn

Merine/Lanfear/Cyande (if she is redeamed)...otherwise Avi.

 

 

It will not be 4 people, it specifically states in the book 3, however it states this because there is no buffer against the taint I believe, but could be wrong so I don't see why a circle is still needed other than if its the buffer to keep from burning out and not a buffer against the taint I did not read the explanation Cadsuane gave very well

[FarShainMael]

“{Callandor} is flawed... lacking the buffer that makes other sa’angreal safe to use. And it apparently magnifies the taint, inducing wildness of the mind. So long as a man is using it, anyway. The only safe way for you to use The Sword That Is Not a Sword, the only way to use it without the risk of killing yourself, or trying to do the Light alone knows what insanity, is linked with two women, and one of them guiding the flows.”

 

So there are two problems - it isn't buffered, and it magnifies the taint. The latter effect, of course, is no longer a problem.. though some have suggested that it may mean Callandor can handle the TP..

[Gabriel Kross]

“{Callandor} is flawed... lacking the buffer that makes other sa’angreal safe to use. And it apparently magnifies the taint, inducing wildness of the mind. So long as a man is using it, anyway. The only safe way for you to use The Sword That Is Not a Sword, the only way to use it without the risk of killing yourself, or trying to do the Light alone knows what insanity, is linked with two women, and one of them guiding the flows.”

 

So there are two problems - it isn't buffered, and it magnifies the taint. The latter effect, of course, is no longer a problem.. though some have suggested that it may mean Callandor can handle the TP..

 

Now the debate is what is this buffer?

[gloweye]

The normal angreaal buffer. its a build-in security so that you can't overdraw power when drawing though an angreaal.

[baalsmistress]

I think Moiraine's 3 Gifts from the Foxes were

 

1) the angreal

2) knowledge of how to seal the Bore

3) knowledge of how to weave saidin

 

 

I don't think so. I distinctly remember Moiraine "clawing" the Angreal from Lanfear's hand. Also she would have been smart enough to "wish" for Lanfear's strength, particularly with foreshadowing from the rings in Rhuideean (where she learnt about her impending vist to the snake's/fox's realm).

 

Mind you, I don't disagree with point 2 except that maybe she wished for Lanfear's knowledge instead of and/or power.

 

Would have been a waste, seeing as she just would have had that strength drained away. Asking for the angreal (which she did) is much smarter considering what the Finns were about to do to her.

 

I know I'm assuming here that she knew what her fate at the hands of the Finns was to be but I think it's likely.

 

Quote from TSR6 pg 134 paperback

The Aes Sedai winced and threw up her hands. "You three rush in blindly where Lan and a hundred Warders would tread warily. Why do you think i have not stepped through? Days ago I could of asked what Rand must do to survive and triumph, how he can defeat the forsaken and the Dark One, How he can learn to control the power and hold off madness to do what he must."

 

From this quote i think this is a strong froshadowing of the likely questions she asks. Although we know she asked for the angreal so the question is what did she decide to scrap or change/re word because all three listed assumed questions have strong merit because of the wording.

 

The doorway she went through was not the one that lead to the Aelfinn, but rather the one to the Eelfin.

 

She had 3 wishes, not 3 answers.

 

We know one was the angreal, but I rather suspect that asking for knowledge would be futile.

 

Unless of course, she managed to bargain as one of her wishes for the chance to bargain with the Aelfinn also.

[Tyzack]

 

Unless of course, she managed to bargain as one of her wishes for the chance to bargain with the Aelfinn also.

 

"I wish to transfer my wishes to questions from the Aelfinn"

 

...something like that?

[kght22]

Lanfear?! Sorry, I'm a sucker for characters in any story that go through some form of redemption. I'd love Lanfear to come back to the light, and eventually sacrifice herself in an effort to help save the world.

 

Generally every concept RJ has introduced into the books has eventually crept in as an actual event. For example, we've all heard about how 13x13 works from lonnnng ago, and I'm guessing we'll finally get confirmation that Taim and his Asha'man have had that done to them. Another concept we've heard is that no one can be in the shadow so long that they cannot be brought back to the light. Who has been in the shadow longer than the person who actually created the bore in the DO's prison in the first place? Sure, I'm EXTREMELY skeptical of her intentions in the dream scene at the end of ToM, but it's definitely something to consider. The only person that you could even argue came back to the light has been Asmodean, so I'd say we're still waiting for this to actually happen.

 

Besides, who would know how to seal the bore better than the one that made it?

ingtar. i know its pretty late to reply to this post, but you seem to forget ingtar from tgh.

[Guest Senrabekim]

Alivia is rumored to be 'much' stronger than Nynaeve in the One Power and Nynaeve herself is considered on par with the Forsaken, though probably the weakest of those. If Alivia is much stronger than one who is on par with the weaker forsaken, it's conceivable that Alivia herself is on par with the stronger ones (if not the strongest). She has shown a remarkable skill in learning, is exceptionally good in destructive weaves and has survived with her sanity intact for hundreds of years as a damane thereby fooling mind control tactics the Sul'dam use on their charges to 'make them forget that they were human once'. No other damane has ever even come close to a little of that. The vast majority at some point or other becomes so brainwashed that they literally 'want' to be leashed. Alivia not only retained her individuality throughout that process but kept it for hundreds of years while fooling the most skilled manipulators and brainwashers in the world. That combined with her strength in the OP and the fact that Rand trusts her fully, knowing she will 'help him die', makes it more likely that she will be the third.

 

Lanfear, he won't trust, no matter if she repents. Too much is at stake for him to take such a risk.

Cadsuane, she's not as strong as Nynaeve, let alone Alivia. He may have forgiven her but she still made a huge mistake in his books according to the last book.

Moiraine, even with the angreal she has doesn't match Nynaeve or Alivia, let alone Rand. It's more likely she will be trusted to guard their back while they're doing it. Together with Cadsuane.

Logain will be too busy gaining his glory (unwittingly) and I doubt that being a conduit for Rand constitutes a glorious act.

 

My money is still on Alivia therefore. It's possible that while using Callandor it will drain Rand from his lifeforce and he will rely on Alivia to keep the circle intact until whatever they're set out to do is done, regardless the cost to him or them. Nynaeve, being the Healer she is, would likely find a way to break the circle (she's done the impossible on more than one occasion, after all) so she may endanger the mission by caring too much. In such an event, Alivia is the only one strong enough to stop her. Alivia knows sacrifice. She's had to destroy countless of people in her hundreds of years as a damane and somehow still kept her sanity, her individuality. She knows how to prioritise and detach herself from the action she is doing. It's possible she has had to destroy people she knew, she loved, in her time as damane. And she doesn't have the emotional connection to Rand that Nynaeve has.

 

So for all those reasons, my guess remains Alivia.

 

 

I had to check something before I replied here, then register. Anyway, Alivia is the strongest female channeler since the AofL.

 

"Then the woman struck back at her, and she suffered her second shock. She was stronger than Cyndane had been before the Aelfinn and Eelfinn held her!" Chapter 35 WH pg. 758 (paperback)

 

Since it is stated that Lanfear is the strongest female forsaken and possibly the second strongest Forsaken behind Ishamael, in the table top book; we can assume that Alivia is the most powerful female channeler in the world since the AofL at least. With Rand's penchent for surrounding himself with the most powerful people he can, this indicates her and Nynaeve, who probably won't let anyone else take that sword if she isn't in on it as well. I also think that it may be a minimum of one man two women, I can't find a passage to support this though. Lews Therins original plan was a circle of 72 plus supporters. Mabye he was right from the beginning.

[1Brotherbill]

Lanfear?! Sorry, I'm a sucker for characters in any story that go through some form of redemption. I'd love Lanfear to come back to the light, and eventually sacrifice herself in an effort to help save the world.

 

Generally every concept RJ has introduced into the books has eventually crept in as an actual event. For example, we've all heard about how 13x13 works from lonnnng ago, and I'm guessing we'll finally get confirmation that Taim and his Asha'man have had that done to them. Another concept we've heard is that no one can be in the shadow so long that they cannot be brought back to the light. Who has been in the shadow longer than the person who actually created the bore in the DO's prison in the first place? Sure, I'm EXTREMELY skeptical of her intentions in the dream scene at the end of ToM, but it's definitely something to consider. The only person that you could even argue came back to the light has been Asmodean, so I'd say we're still waiting for this to actually happen.

 

Besides, who would know how to seal the bore better than the one that made it?

 

 

This is what I want to happen.

 

But I think Verin took care of the walking in darkness and coming back to the light.

 

However, if Lanfear is in the light won't Rand look at her like a "How are you doing?" type of way. I'm not sure but aren't Min's views on Rand's trio of women based on them loving Rand and not Rand loving them. I'll find that out on the grand and final re read. That would play into the whole past life thing. Because LTT was a player on a cosmic scale it seems. So maybe Rand would be as well.

[Bromo Sapien]

It seems to me that it's impossible for Mierin to come back due to the mindtrap. Moridin would have to release her, which would probably mean that he had to come back too. I don't see two of the evilest characters in the story to both make a last minute change of heart.

 

We already have seen Rand channeling with Nynaeve and his trust for her tells me she's probably going to be involved. And wouldn't it be awesome if the three main channelers to come out of Emond's Field all reunited (and it feels so good!... until Rand gets killed...)? I think, after all Rand and Egwene have been through together, that she should be in as well. They've been tied together throughout the entire series, first through the marriage pact thing when they were still in the village, then both learning their power at the same time, and now they're both the head of their own Tower. They're the two leaders of the entire world and they both trust each other completely. It would be awesome.

[Bob T Dwarf]

They're the two leaders of the entire world and they both trust each other completely. It would be awesome.

 

Sadly, no. They've both forgotten how to trust each other at all.

 

Just one of many internal conflicts the Light has to overcome before they're in any shape to offer any real resistance to the Dark at all.

[1Brotherbill]

It seems to me that it's impossible for Mierin to come back due to the mindtrap. Moridin would have to release her, which would probably mean that he had to come back too. I don't see two of the evilest characters in the story to both make a last minute change of heart.

 

Why not? The book is going to be over a thousand pages long. The book could easily have all the forsaken turn coat and be good guys. There is going to be enough room.

 

What was it, Winter's Heart where everyone who could channel spent six hundred pages looking north and being scared? You could easily chop and add a plot where everyone pledged to the dark one turns coat and walks in the light. After all they all probably realize that it's going to be a long wait if they get sealed up again. Probably way longer than three thousand years. The forsaken are selfish so they might just jump ship.

[Bromo Sapien]

Fine, I'll change "impossible" to "highly, highly, HIGHLY unlikely". Though that would make for one hell of an interesting meeting. "O hai everyone who's been trying to kill me and end the entire universe. Sure, why not trust you after you abandoned not only the Dark One once, but also our side before as well?"

[GryphonRyder]

Hi all, new here.

 

After re-reading the series in the last month I've had some time to think about the prophesies and how they make sense. One notable thing I think i've hit on is the Sword that is not a Sword. It's said that "The three shall become one". I dont think this has anything to do with who will be in the circle operating it. Obviously Rand will be weilding it, but the "three" that is alluded to I believe is the three sources of power. Saidar, Saidin, and the True Power. Only Rand has the ability to weild the True Power (on the side of the Light) and we all know he will eventually go blind. This is a known side effect of the True power, so obviously he will use it heavily in the Last Battle. On to Callandor, i believe it's merely thought to be flawed. It's most likely a fairly perfect sa-angreal as all the others were - but with one major difference. Callandor was made to weild the at least the True Power if not all three at once. This also gives us a method to seal the Bore, using the Dark Ones power on himself since LTT said "we had to touch something to him to seal him up" and thats how Saidin was tainted. Despite my misspellings i hope the main idea gets across.

[GryphonRyder]

Fine, I'll change "impossible" to "highly, highly, HIGHLY unlikely". Though that would make for one hell of an interesting meeting. "O hai everyone who's been trying to kill me and end the entire universe. Sure, why not trust you after you abandoned not only the Dark One once, but also our side before as well?"

 

Granted you make a good point. But there is something there... If you remember (I can't quote the reference) the penalty of turning your back on the dark one was your bones were broken every night and yadayada. Pretty much what Lady Seline AKA Lanfear is going through at the end of the last book. Besides she's always been an almost if-fy forsaken, displaying several non-forsaken thoughts of challenging the Dark One himself. Plus theres some one sided love for LTT there too, and i'm not sure how that will play out.