Mat's Plotline (Spoilers for the whole book)

[Calderis]

I started reading this series 12 years ago, and Mat has ALWAYS been my favorite character.

 

I can see what people are saying with the change, but the blame on sanderson is... overblown in my opinion. It's a mixture of the change in Mat's circumstances and internal conflicts, with the simultaneous change in writing style. The combination of these two separate things magnify each other.

 

Honestly, as BrS stated in the forward of tGS, RJ left EXTREMELY detailed notes, and that's why we are getting 3 books instead of one. Do you honestly think there was much room for BrS to just up and create a story arc? The content left in notes, and some already written (which was I admit re-written by BrS so as not to stand out in the flow of the book, but this would have been just changed wording and not changed storyline) was so extensive that it couldn't be published in one volume, which is consistant with RJ's writing in the past going above and beyond what was expected.

 

We can't have RJ, and BrS intention not to try and Mimic RJ's writing, which would come off FAR worse than anything that feels off to anyone about the book in it's current state, is a respectable and honest decision. Step back and look at the character and think, if the transition in mat's character had come at a different time than the change in the writing style, I doubt we'd get the complaints, but I lay that on timing rather than the author. BrS answered a call that any author would have been stupid to turn away from. Thinking that, with the level of commitment RJ had to this series, Brs has any room to step outside a pre-planned path... Highly highly doubtful.

 

If you don't agree with me, go back and re-read BrS's forward to tGS. He's just fleshing out a skeleton that still has a good amount of meat on the bones already.

[b9anders]

Back when I collected comics a long time ago, I was totally a fan of Jim Lee's take on the X-Men. loved every frame. He left to do stuff for Image comics, and I followed him when he started WildCATS...In hindsight, the book sucked, but I still was into his art and his style. Thing is X-Men remained the X-Men, even without Jim Lee, but I know what I liked about it and what I didn't like about WildCATS. I know what I didn't like about X-Men when Lee left.

 

It slightly mirrors what has happened here. I really liked Sanderson's work on some of his books. I really liked Elantris. I liked Mistborn 1. I thought Warbreaker was ok. Judging from these works I thought Sanderson had the chops to do Wheel of Time. He does, but something wasn't quite the same. While I like his work on Wheel of Time, some things just didn't work for me. There's no use for me to try to convince myself otherwise. I was very clear about what I liked about his efforts with The Gathering Storm. I am equally clear about what I don't like, I think.

 

Many people seem up in arms about the very act of not liking something about the book. I find this sadly typical. Try something why don't some of you...Gain some distance from the book.

I find that a lot of people have a hardon for it simply because they can't bear the thought that perhaps this isn't going to be as special an ending as the series deserves.

 

I said months ago that it's going to be very sad when it turns out that the people who want something so bad realize in horror, that what they get isn't quite as good as they've hyped it up to be. That they HAD to hype it otherwise face despair again. The despair that RJ has passed away and we won't get to see the end he promised us. It's almost that the facsimile presented to us by Sanderson and Co. is just a shadow of what we could have had from the man himself.

Thing is we could never have that. We could NEVER have RJ's ending. To accept that truth is far more painful that just blindly defending every little shortcoming Sanderson shows. He was always going to fall just short guys. In a lot of cases he will fall far short. That's life, cruel as it is.

Sanderson isn't RJ. I know that. It think it's pretty simple of people to suggest that I need to accept something that I already know. Sanderson's work pales in comparison to RJ's. In many ways. In some ways he's an equal to RJ. Some things he does a bit better, but not enough for me to say that the sum of what we are getting from Sanderson by any means meets or surpasses what I think RJ would have produced by himself had he lived.

 

Some may think me unfair to say it, but hey; Someone had to. No one has gone as far as to say what some are truly thinking at this point.

 

I loved some parts of this book. I like a good portion of it. I though a good deal of it was passable, and a small chunk of it I thought was tripe and garbage. Sorry if that's mean to you, but it's honest. Problem is, no one likes honesty these days. So there you have it. dislike it all you want. Doesn't make it not true. 

Hate the title. The cover art is horrible. Hated Mat's overacting, and how fanfic his conversation with Thom was. Didn't think many of the "funny" bits were very funny. Some of the dialogue was too modern but most of it was passable. That pretty much says it for what I did not tolerate. As you can see, the majority of the book I enjoyed, most of it I enjoyed very much.

 

I think it's entirely fair to critise the book on account of it not being very good (though I for one, thoroughly enjoyed it and found it much better paced than many of its predecessors). I don't think there's anything wrong with picking out parts of the book and explaining in a fair and balanced manner why that didn't do much for you (though I'll add, literary criticism in general seems to score very high in the BS stakes).

 

What I find objectionable is the justification for this being Sanderson writing it, as some kind of obvious source of fault.

 

Looking at the concrete points of criticism other than the elusive 'Sanderson is just too different/not good enough', can you honestly say the same does ot could not apply to any of the other books in the series?

 

I find it ridiculous to critisise the book on account of Sanderson's writing because we have no way of knowing which parts Jordan wrote, which parts he left detailed notations for and what he only gave broad outlines for. I find it entirely likely that many of the things people are critisising as Sanderson's shortcomings in this book are in fact the shortcomings of Robert Jordan, now put under a new and more meticulous scope of criticism because Sanderson co-authored it.

 

You're saying fans should consider the possibility that this is not the ending we had all been hoping for. Well yeah, but fans should be open to that possibility with Jordan authoring it as well. In fact, I'm sure there would be many fans dissatisfied with the ending gad Jordan authored it on his own. But now we have a convenient scapegoat that we can henceforth blame for anything that is wrong in these last three books. I think it's a cheap copout and rather ungrateful to an author who has undertaken a very difficult task with both humility and dedication.

[lordofsoup]

im pretty sure that u mean Stan Lee. 

 

 

but im positive that harriet will not let brian sanderson change the ending, even if he wanted to, which i believe that he has no intention of doing

[b9anders]

im pretty sure that u mean Stan Lee. 

 

Jim Lee was a popular artist on X-Men in the 90s.

[Calderis]

Well said B9anders.

 

Definitely agree with you. People are throwing a fit for what they see as changes, when the story would have been damn near identical. Wordings and flow may have changed, but Sequence of events?

 

Doubt it.

[Jonn]

Well said B9anders.

 

Definitely agree with you. People are throwing a fit for what they see as changes, when the story would have been damn near identical. Wordings and flow may have changed, but Sequence of events?

 

Doubt it.

 

What is WRITING if it isn't wording and flow? I can tell you a story and you'd hate it, and someone else talks about the same story and you really enjoyed hearing their take on it. Same story, but your feelings about they delivery differ.

 

Stylistically, Sanderson's portrayal of Mat is seen as a disturbing departure from Robert Jordan's by some including me.

 

And "blaming" Sanderson is quite apparent here as it's so obvious to most that the style is completely different from any of Jordan's prior depictions of Mat Cauthon.

[Jonn]

 

I think it's entirely fair to critise the book on account of it not being very good (though I for one, thoroughly enjoyed it and found it much better paced than many of its predecessors). I don't think there's anything wrong with picking out parts of the book and explaining in a fair and balanced manner why that didn't do much for you (though I'll add, literary criticism in general seems to score very high in the BS stakes).

 

What I find objectionable is the justification for this being Sanderson writing it, as some kind of obvious source of fault.

 

Looking at the concrete points of criticism other than the elusive 'Sanderson is just too different/not good enough', can you honestly say the same does ot could not apply to any of the other books in the series?

 

I find it ridiculous to critisise the book on account of Sanderson's writing because we have no way of knowing which parts Jordan wrote, which parts he left detailed notations for and what he only gave broad outlines for. I find it entirely likely that many of the things people are critisising as Sanderson's shortcomings in this book are in fact the shortcomings of Robert Jordan, now put under a new and more meticulous scope of criticism because Sanderson co-authored it.

 

You're saying fans should consider the possibility that this is not the ending we had all been hoping for. Well yeah, but fans should be open to that possibility with Jordan authoring it as well. In fact, I'm sure there would be many fans dissatisfied with the ending gad Jordan authored it on his own. But now we have a convenient scapegoat that we can henceforth blame for anything that is wrong in these last three books. I think it's a cheap copout and rather ungrateful to an author who has undertaken a very difficult task with both humility and dedication.

 

Sure, you get points for trying, and Sanderson has scored big in other areas besides, including his pace and his portrayal of female characters which I think he excels at, and is as good as any author in the world at making female heroes intriguing and believable.

 

These shortcomings of Jordan's you speak of...yeah, I wouldn't be reading these books the day they come out for 16 years of my life if I thought that there were any shortcomings of Robert Jordan's worth mentioning.

 

You talk about timing. I can see your point, but it's more than timing here. It's about consistency of character. I mentioned months ago in analysis of Sanderson's style vs Jordan's that sometimes Sanderson for some reason loses his focus on character consistency. In Warbreaker the main antagonist and his sidekick were acting too similar and were chatty, but then suddenly they were very ruthless, and the transition just seemed off. It was hard for me to believe that the protagonist observing that behavior would well...BELIEVE what they were seeing. It just seemed unbalanced. I feel much the same about Mat's character in The Gathering Storm, him and his coterie. They were too chatty, unbalanced and I had a hard time believing in them. They were too nebulous. Too "charactery".

 

You talk about transition in character, and some have mentioned that Mat has "matured", but his freaking out and being over-elaborate and a chatterbox...doesn't ring like maturity to me. I'm not even sure how to feel about his feelings towards Tuon. He just thinks about her vaguely and worries about her more or less because...I'm not so sure why. It's almost like he has to simply because of the circumstances, or that he regrets- I really can't settle on any one idea honestly. I guess part of my misgivings is because I freaking hate Tuon at the moment. I can't recall much of what makes her appealing to Mat. He never really dwells on it in the Gathering Storm in any substantial way. YET...in Knife of Dreams it was so delicately  handled by RJ, I found myself entranced. There was a longing between the two that was unstated. That has disappeared in The Gathering Storm. I really forgot what I liked so much about the couple in the prior offering. THAT IS BAD TRANSITION.

 

So, it's deeper than what you think, that I need a scapegoat for what sucks about the ending of the series.

If the ending of the series sucks or any part of it sucks, the author who writes it has to have the balls to take full responsibility for it.

 

I was perfectly fine with how RJ had written the series, though some things did bother me a little. The whole of it was consistent and I felt settled with it.

 

Sanderson has to prove that he can finish and do so in a way that is consistent and befitting on every level. He really CANNOT afford to make mistakes.

 

I think Mat's portion of this first book of three is a mistake/miscalculation.

 

Which is too bad, as it mars an otherwise valiant effort in continuing the series.

[b9anders]

fwiw, I found this on facebook:

 

*Regarding the issue of how Mat was written in TGS, Brandon's response was twofold. First he acknowledged that he and RJ have different senses of humor, and so he'll probably never be able to write Mat with exactly the same droll humor that RJ did. However, he also said that he intentionally wrote Mat differently than before. Specifically, he wanted to convey that Mat's worldview has been a bit shattered by the fact that he can no longer pretend that he's not royalty and that he's not a married man. He's trying to be the same guy he used to be, and failing...because he's not that Mat anymore. Brandon also said that Mat's acceptance of his fate is nearly complete by the time he encounters Verin, and so future Mat chapters should seem at least a little less "off-kilter".

[Calderis]

Well said B9anders.

 

Definitely agree with you. People are throwing a fit for what they see as changes, when the story would have been damn near identical. Wordings and flow may have changed, but Sequence of events?

 

Doubt it.

 

What is WRITING if it isn't wording and flow? I can tell you a story and you'd hate it, and someone else talks about the same story and you really enjoyed hearing their take on it. Same story, but your feelings about they delivery differ.

 

Stylistically, Sanderson's portrayal of Mat is seen as a disturbing departure from Robert Jordan's by some including me.

 

And "blaming" Sanderson is quite apparent here as it's so obvious to most that the style is completely different from any of Jordan's prior depictions of Mat Cauthon.

 

And "wording and flow" which you seem somehow to think should be exactly the same are different because, as has been stated many times, BrS doesn't want to try and mimic RJ's writing because that would just come off worse. Ever hear of the uncanny valley? that's being avoided. You don't like his writing style. I feel sorry for you in that fact. My point wasn't that there isn't a change, but that the changes are happening along a set path that would have happened regardless of who was writing the book. Sanderson doesn't have room to "create" all he can really do is act as a mediator between the heavy notes, and finished product.

 

I happen to like the product, and feel sorry for you that it's not something you seem to be able to stomach.

[Ted M]

Back when I collected comics a long time ago, I was totally a fan of Jim Lee's take on the X-Men. loved every frame. He left to do stuff for Image comics, and I followed him when he started WildCATS...In hindsight, the book sucked, but I still was into his art and his style. Thing is X-Men remained the X-Men, even without Jim Lee, but I know what I liked about it and what I didn't like about WildCATS. I know what I didn't like about X-Men when Lee left.

 

It slightly mirrors what has happened here. I really liked Sanderson's work on some of his books. I really liked Elantris. I liked Mistborn 1. I thought Warbreaker was ok. Judging from these works I thought Sanderson had the chops to do Wheel of Time. He does, but something wasn't quite the same. While I like his work on Wheel of Time, some things just didn't work for me. There's no use for me to try to convince myself otherwise. I was very clear about what I liked about his efforts with The Gathering Storm. I am equally clear about what I don't like, I think.

 

I don't think anyone anywhere has a problem with that.

 

Many people seem up in arms about the very act of not liking something about the book.

 

This is where you start losing people.

 

I find this sadly typical. Try something why don't some of you...Gain some distance from the book.

I find that a lot of people have a hardon for it simply because they can't bear the thought that perhaps this isn't going to be as special an ending as the series deserves.

 

I said months ago that it's going to be very sad when it turns out that the people who want something so bad realize in horror, that what they get isn't quite as good as they've hyped it up to be. That they HAD to hype it otherwise face despair again. The despair that RJ has passed away and we won't get to see the end he promised us. It's almost that the facsimile presented to us by Sanderson and Co. is just a shadow of what we could have had from the man himself.

Thing is we could never have that. We could NEVER have RJ's ending. To accept that truth is far more painful that just blindly defending every little shortcoming Sanderson shows. He was always going to fall just short guys. In a lot of cases he will fall far short. That's life, cruel as it is.

Sanderson isn't RJ. I know that. It think it's pretty simple of people to suggest that I need to accept something that I already know. Sanderson's work pales in comparison to RJ's. In many ways. In some ways he's an equal to RJ. Some things he does a bit better, but not enough for me to say that the sum of what we are getting from Sanderson by any means meets or surpasses what I think RJ would have produced by himself had he lived.

 

Some may think me unfair to say it, but hey; Someone had to. No one has gone as far as to say what some are truly thinking at this point.

 

I loved some parts of this book. I like a good portion of it. I though a good deal of it was passable, and a small chunk of it I thought was tripe and garbage. Sorry if that's mean to you, but it's honest. Problem is, no one likes honesty these days. So there you have it. dislike it all you want. Doesn't make it not true. 

Hate the title. The cover art is horrible. Hated Mat's overacting, and how fanfic his conversation with Thom was. Didn't think many of the "funny" bits were very funny. Some of the dialogue was too modern but most of it was passable. That pretty much says it for what I did not tolerate. As you can see, the majority of the book I enjoyed, most of it I enjoyed very much.

 

Now this is where you start annoying people. 

 

Everyone here has agreed that there were differences between the way Mat was written in this book and the way he was written in previous books.  Some people have been bothered by it, and some haven't.  From what I've seen, most of the people who either didn't mind it, or actually liked the way he was written in tGS have said they can understand that some people wouldn't like it and why.  Equally, most of the people who have said that it bothered them have understood that some people don't have a problem with it or like it.

 

You, on the other hand, have moved past saying that you don't like the Mat parts of tGS.  You've said that they're garbage and badly written and that anyone who thinks otherwise is a fanboy who's in denial and willfully blind to what's obvious to everyone with half a brain.  Then you get annoyed when the people you've just insulted have the audacity to defend their position. 

 

To put it rather bluntly... Mat was written a bit differently in this book than previous books.  Some people weren't as bothered by it as you.  Some even actually liked the way he was written (gasp!).  Get over it.

[Muad Cheade]

I agree wholeheartedly with Ted M.

 

And fyi, Jonn, Mr. Jordan finished the true ending of aMoL before he passed away so it will not be Mr. Sanderson's work and that's not counting the very detailed notes he left of the events leading up to it.

[Chivalry]

Some of Mat's humor came across as odd.  Writing dialogue for his men?  Completely out of character.  Since when has Mat put that much detail into anything (with the exception of planning a battle)?  Mat is a guy who wings it.  He doesn't stay up late at night writing like some aspiring writer polishing off a screenplay.  So the humor is off, the fact that he actually put in that much effort is out of character, and the action itself (writing dialogue for his men)is something one would expect from someone in our world and our time, not the WoT.

 

Other than this particular example (which really stood out in my mind), I don't think Mat was painted with that different a brush.  I especially enjoyed his interaction with the AS.  That seemed genuine to me.

 

And although I know this isn't the correct forum, I think Brandon did a fine job all in all.  I think his next effort will be even better.

[Ged]

The creating backstories for his men thing, was a form of battle preparation. Meeting unknown people on terms that would give him an advantage.

 

The way Brandon expresses things is different though. The way Rand and Nynaeve defended Mat, seemed rather out of character and felt like something one might get in fanfiction where the writer is expressing his personal liking for the character rather than writing the story.

[sdelu]

The way Brandon expresses things is different though. The way Rand and Nynaeve defended Mat, seemed rather out of character and felt like something one might get in fanfiction where the writer is expressing his personal liking for the character rather than writing the story.

 

I don't think that's true at all. In fact, I would have been surprised had they not defended him, especially Nynaeve, considering the entire reason she ever left the Two Rivers was to protect the 3 boys.

 

There are times throughout the previous books where Nynaeve "defends" him, saying that stuff like "he may be stubborn but he always keeps his promises" or things to that effect. When she's around friends or in control, she's annoying and doesn't take him seriously, but outside of that she's fairly defensive of all the Two Rivers people. I also think we've seen Rand become defensive over his friends before as well, though I couldn't personally tell you where.

 

Besides, it fits perfectly well that Nynaeve would mouth off to the soon-to-be-empress :)

[b9anders]

Some of Mat's humor came across as odd.  Writing dialogue for his men?  Completely out of character.

 

Tbh, I thought that was a very mat thing to do. He spent how many months planning their escape from ebou dar? Playing up the part of the fop in advance, working out an elaborate story of how he and egeanin were runaway lovers, Tuon and Selucia were treacherous servants, etc. The 'there's some good drama in there' line I thought captured perfectly well the irony of how a hardened battle leader, gambler and womanizer shouldn't be that into those things, but Mat in fact loves that stuff.

 

It fits in very well with the explanation from Sanderson that Mat is 'over-living' his former character traits, including one last over-elaborate dramatic plan.

 

The only thing I found noticeably different about Mat was the fact that he was much more verbose about the assumptions that we usually only see him thinking about. The main differences to me were moreso in the people around mat.

[jadelollipop]

I loved the chapters with Mat...the difference was in Talmanes' reaction to Mat's complaints etc...rolling eyes and laughing at him internally which Mat realized...

Love the fact that Tuon is beginning to realize that the things she dismissed about Mat are in fact true and she has to adjust her thinking...:)

[NetSlider]

Ok, I was staying away from this post because Mat is my favorite character and I did not want to express my bias. But, here is my five cents.

 

Mat was definitely off. Granted that RJ already begun expressing Mat's feeling of responsibility I think that BS actually did not expand on that. I think that Mat still stuck between what's right and what's fun (but I guess he always will).

As far as feeling differently once getting married (and this is coming from someone who fairly recently went through the happy stage of saying "I DO") I think it was very on point. Just remember how you felt; ok...I'm married, but I really don't feel any different?! Well, and you don't feel different in a major way, you still you, but you ACT different. I think Mat has problem with that balance just as everyone does. He will start FEELING different once he holds his firstborn (I think many will agree). And that feeling different will actually not be an overnight either, but instead will be gradual and very strong as the time passes.

All in all, Mat is off, but as expected. Sure we will never know how "off" RJ would make him but I think BS did a good job.

[Jonn]

It's not something I don't expect on this message board, that the majority who post here defend everything about the books very vocally.

Believe it or not though, everyone I have had a face to face or telephone conversation about the parts of this book that seemed off, pretty much across the board noticed it most in Mat's portion of the book.

 

"Get over it."

Yeah, guess how you get over things that bother you. You talk about it. So you're currently witnessing the process and if you can't handle someone being honest about how they feel disappointed about certain aspects of the book...You know what to do. So just leave the whole idea out that I'm going to shut up my feelings because it makes you angry or uncomfortable.

 

I've reread the book already, skipping Mat's chapters. It's a better book for it. In fact, you could have cut out Perrin's and Mat's portions of the book and it would have been an excellent book.

 

I really think stylistically Mat was a mess. What happened plot wise was actually alright, but the problem I had with the plot was that it didn't go far enough. I would have liked for Mat to have actually made it to Caemlyn and had interactions there. That would have been useful. Meeting Verin and getting YET ANOTHER letter was an anticlimax.

Just the way it was written with what WAS there...it made it worse. Stylistically it was different from the way Mat had been written in almost all of the later books and it actually stood out in tone from the rest of the Gathering Storm itself.

 

So plot development...didn't go far enough. Style wise, I found it clunky and obtuse.

And the character notes Sanderson seemed to be trying to push home are not notes that really need to be used as a bludgeon on our heads. Mat can be silly and brash...well no s%$!.

 

The majority of the book Sanderson did either a credible or very good job.

 

I just don't think he did a very good job with Mat.

[Sharaman]

This "literary" discussion is in lazy eight territory. Some folks don't like the way BS wrote the Mat scenes; some folks do.

How does this contribute to speculation about Mat's future plotline, which is what I thought the thread was about?

 

[Ted M]

It's not something I don't expect on this message board, that the majority who post here defend everything about the books very vocally.

 

And, no offense, but the impression I get is that because you were expecting that, you came into this thread with a huge chip on your shoulder, and looking to fight.

 

Believe it or not though, everyone I have had a face to face or telephone conversation about the parts of this book that seemed off, pretty much across the board noticed it most in Mat's portion of the book.

 

"Get over it."

Yeah, guess how you get over things that bother you. You talk about it. So you're currently witnessing the process and if you can't handle someone being honest about how they feel disappointed about certain aspects of the book...You know what to do. So just leave the whole idea out that I'm going to shut up my feelings because it makes you angry or uncomfortable.

 

I've reread the book already, skipping Mat's chapters. It's a better book for it. In fact, you could have cut out Perrin's and Mat's portions of the book and it would have been an excellent book.

 

I really think stylistically Mat was a mess. What happened plot wise was actually alright, but the problem I had with the plot was that it didn't go far enough. I would have liked for Mat to have actually made it to Caemlyn and had interactions there. That would have been useful. Meeting Verin and getting YET ANOTHER letter was an anticlimax.

Just the way it was written with what WAS there...it made it worse. Stylistically it was different from the way Mat had been written in almost all of the later books and it actually stood out in tone from the rest of the Gathering Storm itself.

 

So plot development...didn't go far enough. Style wise, I found it clunky and obtuse.

And the character notes Sanderson seemed to be trying to push home are not notes that really need to be used as a bludgeon on our heads. Mat can be silly and brash...well no s%$!.

 

The majority of the book Sanderson did either a credible or very good job.

 

I just don't think he did a very good job with Mat.

 

Speaking for myself, if this had been your original post, I wouldn't have had the slightest problem with it.  You're recognizing your opinions as opinions, not attacking the holders of opposing point of view, and I find the tone much more pleasant.  For myself, I could accept the differences in Mat as character development, and Talmanes hasn't been so prominent that the differences in him really bothered me.  However, I can completely understand where others would be bothered by the Mat sections and the fact that you have those opinions doesn't trouble me in the slightest.

 

One of the things that bothered me in the previous post was that you were arguing against straw men.  I haven't seen a single person, anywhere (including Sanderson himself) argue that Sanderson did as good a job as Jordan would have done.  I haven't seen a single person say that Mat, Talmanes, etc. seemed like they were written exactly the same as they had been in previous books, though some (like me) are willing to explain the changes in Mat's personality at least to his changing circumstances and character development, rather than Sanderson screwing up the character.  If, however, your earlier posts were the only things I'd read in the thread, I'd expect the other posts to read something like this:

OMG!  Sanderson rulez!  He got Mat totally perfect, even better than Jordan would have!!!!eleventy-one!!1!1!!  No haterz!

[lillcheese]

I'm constantly surprised on this thread about people complaining about the back-stories.  I saw the back-stories as an understandable over-reaction to almost turning into a zombie.  Mat charged into Hinderstap (sp?) with no plan.  He "winged it" as per his usual and ignored the town rule about leaving before sunset.  As a result, he and his party almost die and turn into zombie permaresidents.  Wouldn't it be pretty odd for him to not change his behavior before entering a town in which he KNOWS there's someone looking for him and Perrin? 

 

I hadn't even recalled the "runaway lovers" story and other examples that B9anders points out.  Mat's not used to being careful and planning ahead.  When he does it, he's no good at it.

[Chivalry]

I'm constantly surprised on this thread about people complaining about the back-stories.  I saw the back-stories as an understandable over-reaction to almost turning into a zombie.  Mat charged into Hinderstap (sp?) with no plan.  He "winged it" as per his usual and ignored the town rule about leaving before sunset.  As a result, he and his party almost die and turn into zombie permaresidents.  Wouldn't it be pretty odd for him to not change his behavior before entering a town in which he KNOWS there's someone looking for him and Perrin? 

 

I hadn't even recalled the "runaway lovers" story and other examples that B9anders points out.  Mat's not used to being careful and planning ahead.  When he does it, he's no good at it.

 

Would Mat invent back stories for his men?  Sure, it's possible.  Would he sit down and spend all night scribbling away like an aspiring 20th century screenwriter?  Very unlikely.  That's my problem.  It came across as too contrived, too modern.

[Vambram]

 

 

Would Mat invent back stories for his men?  Sure, it's possible.  Would he sit down and spend all night scribbling away like an aspiring 20th century screenwriter?  Very unlikely.  That's my problem.  It came across as too contrived, too modern.

 

On the other hand, it makes much more sense to me that Brandon Sanderson, Harriet McDougal, and the researches known as Team Jordan.. having access to RJ's thousands of pages of notes.. would have a much better idea of what Mat.. or any other character in WOT.. would or would not do.

[Auld Manriva]

 

 

Would Mat invent back stories for his men?  Sure, it's possible.  Would he sit down and spend all night scribbling away like an aspiring 20th century screenwriter?  Very unlikely.  That's my problem.  It came across as too contrived, too modern.

 

On the other hand, it makes much more sense to me that Brandon Sanderson, Harriet McDougal, and the researches known as Team Jordan.. having access to RJ's thousands of pages of notes.. would have a much better idea of what Mat.. or any other character in WOT.. would or would not do.

 

 

THE single most intelligent paragraph among thousands of paragraphs that litter this entire board.

 

 

Just read the dang story people ... or don't. It's not yours to tell, nor to direct.

[Chivalry]

 

 

Would Mat invent back stories for his men?  Sure, it's possible.  Would he sit down and spend all night scribbling away like an aspiring 20th century screenwriter?  Very unlikely.  That's my problem.  It came across as too contrived, too modern.

 

On the other hand, it makes much more sense to me that Brandon Sanderson, Harriet McDougal, and the researches known as Team Jordan.. having access to RJ's thousands of pages of notes.. would have a much better idea of what Mat.. or any other character in WOT.. would or would not do.

 

 

THE single most intelligent paragraph among thousands of paragraphs that litter this entire board.

 

 

Just read the dang story people ... or don't. It's not yours to tell, nor to direct.

 

Wow, I guess opinions aren't allowed on message boards.  How funny.  ;D