Rand's Plotline (spoilers for the entire book)

[Crael123]

Together.

They must be together. ;)

 

Even if Rand isn't there, as far as I'm concerned.   :-*

 

*Agrees wholeheartedly*

;D

 

 

that is incredibly naughty ;D

[Firebird]

Together.

They must be together. ;)

 

Even if Rand isn't there, as far as I'm concerned.   :-*

 

*Agrees wholeheartedly*

;D

 

Men! [sniffs]

:P

[thewalrus777]

Together.

They must be together. ;)

 

Even if Rand isn't there, as far as I'm concerned.   :-*

 

*Agrees wholeheartedly*

;D

 

 

that is incredibly naughty ;D

 

FREAKY NAUGHTY! :D

[Flamingskulls]

Mute ... Moot  ;D

 

I LOVE IT! One guy telling another he stinks and they're both standing in a hurricane force S*%t Storm.

 

This place and most other forums are so riddled with bad spelling, poor grammar and "text speak" that it makes trying to read these "discussions" cringe worthy. Especially for those who actually DO use their spell check etc. Most of it is just laziness or unwillingness to go back and correct typo's. At least it seems to me to be so.

 

Mr. Immortal resides in the Pacific Time Zone, so he IS in the USofA. Now, that in itself does not preclude him having English as a 2nd if not 3rd language. One would think if he reads all these books and comprehends them all better than most others extant, (or so he seems to insinuate) then some of the spelling and grammar might just end up soaking in.

 

I agree with the dispute over his assertions though. It doesn't seem to me he's reading the same book as I am. Maybe he actually knows the books outside in? :-\

 

And who the devil is "fayod dayostivsky"??!! Should we assume Fyodor Dostoyevsky? Hell I don't sprechen zie Russky even a little bit, but Wiki is a very cool tool 8)

 

You do realize that there are places besides the USA in PST, right?

[Tel Asra Nejoar]

Can I just agree with the above post? Not everyone knows/spells /types/reads/understands american. And, that yes, the PST covers a LOT more than just the west coast of the states. I'm not backing up bad spelling/grammar, and try to check/correct most of my mistakes, but some things do slip notice, and assuming that just because its a second/third langauge for someone automatically means they have perfect spelling or typing skills is a bit much.

 

Anyway, on topic. the peeps looking for a group session of the three with rand, EWWWWWWWWWWWWW!!!!!! I would pull my eyes out, but the image is in my head, not my sight, may go and blow my brains out. Wonder what RJ woulda called it though, "flocking the herd" perhaps? Did the sword that rand was gifted get sorted? Last i read it was thought of as a hats off to RJ, but does anyone have a description of high lord Turaks sword? I cant put one up, as the early books are in the loft, recently moved y'see, but thought it might be that one, as rands comments on it, and remembering that fight as he held it. he was supposed to recieve the blade as proof of bladesmastership by tradition, yes?

[Bastor]

I am pretty worried that the true power has corrupted Rand...like LTT said he has doomed them...death is better....hmm....

That aura of darkness was due to the TP...do you think he cleansed himself with that light in the end or was it just LOADS of the one power being channelled ....hmm....

 

If he still has that aura of darkness I am afraid Rand will be going crazier in the next books but without the voice....

[thewalrus777]

I am pretty worried that the true power has corrupted Rand...like LTT said he has doomed them...death is better....hmm....

That aura of darkness was due to the TP...do you think he cleansed himself with that light in the end or was it just LOADS of the one power being channelled ....hmm....

 

If he still has that aura of darkness I am afraid Rand will be going crazier in the next books but without the voice....

 

I don't think he'll go crazy again. Remember he had his epiphany on top of Dragonmount. He realized that LTT's voice in his head wasn't real and merged that personality into his own. He doesn't need LTT's voice anymore, just his knowledge.

[Sentinel78]

BS indicated there would be "consequences" for Rand's channeling of the TP.  This could be the dark aura, an acceleration of his Moridin-merge, saa, some kind of link to the DO or something else.  Rand's epiphany on Dragonmount is certainly good towards his sanity, and might even cure him of his saidin-sickness if it was caused by Rand deviating from what the Pattern wants him to do, but I don't see how it could fix whatever damage was incurred via the TP.

 

Rand's woman-list is also probably still there, as that was not a manifestation from LTT's personality, but Rand's own.  That'll likely be fixed when Moiraine steps back on stage.

[dflinn]

I dont think the dark aura was directly due to using the TP. The dark aura, IMO, was more related to Rand's overall attitude. The TP may most likely contributed to his coldness, but there were many things contributing to it as well. I personally still expect a dark edge from Rand. For instance, female DFS wont have a safety net anymore. And I would be suprised if we dont see using the TP affecting him in other ways. I expect the negative, unbalanced effect on the pattern close to him will come much closer into balance again. Semi said those who were hearing a real voice couldnt be healed. But, we are all pretty sure that he wasn't hearing a real voice, only his attempt to deal with the memories. So I do believe his sanity will be mostly restored. Not entirely, you can't stuff someone in a box and beat them everytime the box is opened without some backlash. Not to mention all the other stuff he has been through.

[OptimusPrime]

Has anyone made this connection to Rand in TGS?

 

From A Crown of Swords Prologue

 

"There can be no health in us, nor any good thing grow, for the land is one with the Dragon Reborn, and he one with the land. Soul of fire, heart of stone, in pride he conquers, forcing the proud to yield. He calls upon the mountains to kneel, and the seas to give way, and the very skies to bow. Pray that the heart of stone remembers tears, and the soul of fire, love.

 

    —From a much-disputed translation of

    The Prophecies of the Dragon by the poet

    Kyera Termendal, of Shiota, believed to have

    been published between FY 700 and FY 800."

 

Yet another prophecy fulfilled.

[Diederichos]

At the very most that's half fulfilled, there were no tears. And I don't know just how much Rand will change post-TGS.

[Crael123]

Well Rand cried as he was torturing Min or does that not count

[thewalrus777]

Well Rand cried as he was torturing Min or does that not count

 

That would count probably, seeing as i don't think we've ever seen Rand cry. Ever. For him to cry during his torturing of Min was a HUGE event.

[Worm]

Can I just point out that Rand will probably keep on woman DF killing now, I'm fairly sure that his whole obsession with not hurting girls was his madness manifesting because he killed woman in the first, second and third books without stressing over it. It's only after Moraine "dies" he creates his list and goes a bit mental.

 

I seriously doubt that after his epiphany he will revert back to the same obsessive maniac we saw in books 6 and onwards. He'll still be a bit mad but it will manifest in other ways xD

[thewalrus777]

Can I just point out that Rand will probably keep on woman DF killing now, I'm fairly sure that his whole obsession with not hurting girls was his madness manifesting because he killed woman in the first, second and third books without stressing over it. It's only after Moraine "dies" he creates his list and goes a bit mental.

 

I seriously doubt that after his epiphany he will revert back to the same obsessive maniac we saw in books 6 and onwards. He'll still be a bit mad but it will manifest in other ways xD

 

He was always a DF/Forsaken woman killer. Those people need to kick it out of necessity. His list of women is entirely comprised of women who have died fighting for him. All good women, that have died helping him fight the DO. I don't believe any bad women to be on that list. He knows bad people, male or female, need to go.

[Diederichos]

Ok, but how did Cadsuane teach him to cry if that was involved in the Min scene? And I don't think the tears involved will be ones of sorrow/grief rather than ones of happiness, I think that at the end of ToM, he'll see Moiraine and break down.

[mossman87]

Ok, but how did Cadsuane teach him to cry if that was involved in the Min scene? And I don't think the tears involved will be ones of sorrow/grief rather than ones of happiness, I think that at the end of ToM, he'll see Moiraine and break down.

 

BS has said only part of the prophecy was filled, and Cadsuane still has more to teach them.

[thewalrus777]

Ok, but how did Cadsuane teach him to cry if that was involved in the Min scene? And I don't think the tears involved will be ones of sorrow/grief rather than ones of happiness, I think that at the end of ToM, he'll see Moiraine and break down.

 

I think he still needs to shed tears of joy. He shed tears of sorrow, for Min. I think he'll shed those tears of joy when his babies are born. No man can stop from crying at the birth of his children. IMO, he needs to shed both kinds of tears to fulfill that part of the prophecy. He's already shedded those tears of sorrow, in regards to his scene with Min. I just believe he will also need to have those tears of joy as well. And don't think Rand doesn't know about his babies, he's bonded to Elayne and can sense everything through that warder bond.

[Tel Asra Nejoar]

Ok, but how did Cadsuane teach him to cry if that was involved in the Min scene? And I don't think the tears involved will be ones of sorrow/grief rather than ones of happiness, I think that at the end of ToM, he'll see Moiraine and break down.

 

I think he still needs to shed tears of joy. He shed tears of sorrow, for Min. I think he'll shed those tears of joy when his babies are born. No man can stop from crying at the birth of his children. IMO, he needs to shed both kinds of tears to fulfill that part of the prophecy. He's already shedded those tears of sorrow, in regards to his scene with Min. I just believe he will also need to have those tears of joy as well. And don't think Rand doesn't know about his babies, he's bonded to Elayne and can sense everything through that warder bond.

 

he could sense this about her except for one thing...

 

 

.... hes too far away to do so, and wouldnt know what it meant in either case.

throughout the series we are told and shown that the warder bond carries less info about the bonded/bond holder the more distance between them. a country's distance, and all you can really tell is that the other is alive. i ndont think Rand has visited andor at all since knocking Elayne up has he? no, doubtful he knows yet, or we'd know. he wouldnt be wasting time elsewhere otherwise.

[randfandom]

That would count probably, seeing as i don't think we've ever seen Rand cry. Ever. For him to cry during his torturing of Min was a HUGE event.

 

Actually Rand cried on several other occasions: EoTW when he tells Moiraine about his mother being tortured; tSR when he fails to revive the dead girl with Callandor and again when he visits the glass columns; tFoH after he discovers Aviendha and Mat are alive due to his balefiring Rahvin; LoC when he is locked in the box. But I don't think he cried since then until the Semirhage torture scene.

Actually, compared to his friends Rand is quite the crybaby - Perrin cries only once (when he learns his family was killed) and Mat has never cried yet...

 

[ed2funy]

Well, compared to Mat and Perrin, Rand has gone through a lot.

Like you said, Perrin found out his family died. the only other time he would have cried is when Faile got captured, but he celebrated was all upset. :D

Mat never went through anything traumatic yet.

 

It is not a HUGE event in my mind, because he has a lot of reasons to cry.

 

I wonder what took him so long.

(I do know...it was more rhetorical.)

[dflinn]

Ok, but how did Cadsuane teach him to cry if that was involved in the Min scene? And I don't think the tears involved will be ones of sorrow/grief rather than ones of happiness, I think that at the end of ToM, he'll see Moiraine and break down.

Also didnt Min say not just teach Rand but all of the Ashaman? How have ANY of the ashaman been affected by Rand sitting on Dragonmount. Even if Rand comes back crying tears of joy, are all of the Ashaman going to join in? They can all sing Kumbayah around the fire holding each other and crying their little hearts out.

[Firebird]

Also didnt Min say not just teach Rand but all of the Ashaman? How have ANY of the ashaman been affected by Rand sitting on Dragonmount. Even if Rand comes back crying tears of joy, are all of the Ashaman going to join in? They can all sing Kumbayah around the fire holding each other and crying their little hearts out.

What an image I have in my head LMAO!  ;D

You're absolutely right. I can't picture Mr. Taim joining in the big group hug somehow :)

[OptimusPrime]

At the very most that's half fulfilled, there were no tears. And I don't know just how much Rand will change post-TGS.

 

At the very worst, only one thing in that passage wasnt fulfilled. We saw Rands darkness affect the Pattern negatively as observed by Cadsuane. We saw the food begin to rot, even the food Rand brought. We saw Rand run his back on his humanity on a greater degree than ever before. We saw Rand/Lews Therin/whoever remember love, and that made him smile.

 

Well Rand cried as he was torturing Min or does that not count

 

That would count probably, seeing as i don't think we've ever seen Rand cry. Ever. For him to cry during his torturing of Min was a HUGE event.

 

Moiraines death. And he didnt realise he was crying till Aviendha pointed it out, even though he was trying to cry. The prophecy at the end of TGS said he stood on his own grave and weep for what has been wrought. Chances are he cried angry tears and didnt realise. I mean, come on, he came as close to suicide as anyone has without actually doing it.

 

 

[Daemian]

What I was wondering is, when Rand is forced to nearly kill one of the women he loves most (Min), he grabs on to the last straw. He finds a new source of power, the True Power, and kills Semirhage with it and saves his loved one.

 

First, what is the message here? Is it that if the need is big enough, one would even turn to the Dark One for a solution? What would that mean for future situations of pressure or blackmail, would the desire to grab the 'last straw' always be there? And has that changed when Rand destroyed the Choedan Kal, which could be interpreted as a signal that using the power as a way to forcibly dominate all opposition has made way for an approach of 'love, happiness and laughter'?

 

Second, access to the True Power is limited exclusively to those with the Dark One's permission. And it's available to a very select few, not even to all of the Forsaken. But Rand even gets access to it to kill one of those very Forsaken. So what's the message there? Is it the Dark One trying to lure Rand to his side with the potential of unlimited power? And why not let Semirhage have her way, let Rand kill Min (if that was even what she intended), to get Rand enraged and distracted? It's not like Rand's own life is on the line.

 

Maybe my questions are suggestive, and perhaps they have been addressed already. Still I would appreciate some thoughts.