Rand's Late Channeling

[Cockta]

Well, RJ said (I think) that AMOL would explain a lot of things, and connect plot threads, and this is a importnat theme, so I think it will be explained in the last book.  ;D

[Guest Dreadlord]

I have been building myself up for a one-on-one between Rand and Moridin for ages, and I have a sickening feeling that I will be disapointed. If it does happen, Moridin had better do some serious damage to Rand, I cant stand the idea of Moridin falling as easily as the other Forsaken.

 

 

[Cockta]

See, Moridin, is going to walk down the street, and Rand walks behind him, pulling out a knife, and stabs him in the back. That was what Brandon said to me when I was interviewing him last Thursday  :)

[Jagen Sedai]

I'm having something of a blonde moment, who is Moridin again? Is he the guy he met originally in Shadar Logoth? I still can't remember who he is though. Not a Forsaken, so a high Darkfriend?

 

And while I'm asking who someone is, who is Bors? I can't remember that either...

[Guest Dreadlord]

QUOTE

See, Moridin, is going to walk down the street, and Rand walks behind him, pulling out a knife, and stabs him in the back. That was what Brandon said to me when I was interviewing him last Thursday

UNQUOTE

 

I bumped into Brandon the other day and he told me Demandred has done jack all this time because he is in fact Rands father and doesnt want the Last Battle to get in the way of their reuniting, and he told me that Shaidar has been having an affair with Isam behind his own back. He even told me Padan Fain actually hates Rand because Rand killed Fains ex, Narg, but Brandon gave me a fiver not to say a word about it.

 

Oh crap not again...

[Ganth]

Bors is Jaichim Carriden (sp?) who is now dead.

 

And Moridin was an adviser in Aridhol (I feel like I'm getting something wrong, correct me please) who betrayed Manetheren. Moridin and Shadar Logoth are considered a separate evil than the Shadow. I believe Padan Fain is some sort of Moridin incarnate since the dagger has probably taken his soul by now.

[Mr Ares]

I'm having something of a blonde moment, who is Moridin again? Is he the guy he met originally in Shadar Logoth? I still can't remember who he is though. Not a Forsaken, so a high Darkfriend?

 

And while I'm asking who someone is, who is Bors? I can't remember that either...

Bors is Jaichim Carridin, Whitecloak Questioner and Darkfriend, now deceased. Moridin is a Chosen. He is Ishamael reincarnated. Rand forst met him in Shadar Logoth at the end of ACoS, and is now linked to him.

 

And Moridin was an adviser in Aridhol (I feel like I'm getting something wrong, correct me please)

You are. Mordeth was the advisor to Aridhol. He is now joined to Fain. Moridin is Ishamael. He is one of the Chosen.

[Cockta]

So the evilness of Aridhol/Shadar Logoth isn't completely dead, because Mordeth is still alive, if I can say so, with Padan Fain, and when Padan Fain dies, I hope so at least, Mordeth will die too?

 

And I don't think the dagger could have taken Padan's sould, because Padan Fain is so evil, I think. Correct me if I am wrong.

[Generic Aelfinn #2]

mordeth isn't WITH fain, he IS fain.  more accurately, fain's soul and mordeth's merged together and inhabit fain's body.

[Cockta]

Ahh, I see, but still, if Padan Fain is killed, both his and Mordeth's soul wil die, or at least not be present anymore.

[Sabio]

Forget which book it was but was explained what had happaned to him. Something about because of what the DO did to Fain, Mordeth found the soul tainted so couldn't fully consume him.  So he became sort of a blend of evil. 

[Hybrid]

At first, he had a sort of personality/soul conflict, with both Mordeth and Padan Fain fighting over his body.  Eventually, the two personalities/souls merged.  I'm not sure whether his soul would vanish though.  I mean, Mordeth stuck around for a pretty long time without a body in Shadar Logoth.  Balefire might work though.

[Darth_Andrea]

Rand never learned the main lesson of BaleFire...

 

 

DON'T CROSS THE STREAMS

 

 

 

 

[glow=green,1,500]Darth_Andrea[/glow]   

[Sabio]

Think as long as that dagger exsists there will be a Mordeth, since it is  tainted.  I mean if fain dropped the dagger and then got balefired would someone get corrupted if they found it 20 years later?  Though not sure with no SL anymore what that means either.

 

 

[Guest Dreadlord]

I remember in a Fain PoV he was thinking to himself he was remade by the Dark One to be the Hound that hunts Rand, and he was reborn in Shadar Logoth when he encountered Mordeth. Fain is still the mind in that body, but he sometimes cant remember whether he is Fain, Mordeth or Ordeith.

[Luckers]

Did Rand start getting dizzy and sick when channeling as soon as him and Moridin became connected? I dont think he had the issues straight away, and I cant understand why he would start having issues unless he was suffering the side effects of the True Power.

 

Well he was unstable and dizzy, but i think that had more to do with nearly getting splattered by lightning. The first issues become noticeable later on, during the eighth book.

 

But he isn't suffering the side effects of the True Power. The True Power, as far as we know, does not cause any form of nausia. It can also only be drawn upon with the Dark One's active permission. Furthermore we know moridin is probably suffering similar symptoms as Rand percieves him looking 'sick and angry' and as we also know he has totally given up use of saidin after nearly four thousand years of having used it and the True Power in equal measure.

 

In effect what is causing the nausia is the link that is activated whenever one or the other draws upon saidin.

 

I believe the specific reason for the nausia is the sensations being passed along the link. At first when the link is weak the images and sensations Rand recieves are a blurry conflicting mass--which is what causes him to get dizzy. Later the link grows stronger, and as it does the sensations grow less distorted. I believe eventually the nausia will no longer be problem. Instead will come a bodyswap. :)

 

At first, he had a sort of personality/soul conflict, with both Mordeth and Padan Fain fighting over his body.  Eventually, the two personalities/souls merged.  I'm not sure whether his soul would vanish though.  I mean, Mordeth stuck around for a pretty long time without a body in Shadar Logoth.  Balefire might work though.

 

We don't actually know the events surrounding Mordeth surviving what happened in Shadar Logoth--indeed, he did still have a body of sorts--he had to compact himself to fit through a hole in the wall when confronted by Mat which suggests he did still have some comporeality to him. It may be that his body never did die, simple that it became less real, but still there with him in it. It would explain why he needed to take another body to escape whilst his current body was still real to some degree.

 

As such it may well be possible that Fain is mortal, and if killed his soul would move on in the slightly more natural manner.

 

Think as long as that dagger exsists there will be a Mordeth, since it is  tainted.  I mean if fain dropped the dagger and then got balefired would someone get corrupted if they found it 20 later?  Though not sure with no SL anymore what that means either.

 

Keep in mind the evil infecting Shadar Logoth is not Mordeth. Mordeth caused that evil by fermenting hate so strong that it consumed the city, but that evil was a seperate thing. Kin, but not the same. If Fain were killed and another found the dagger, the dagger would infect them, and they would infect others, but they would not be Mordeth, or have him as a part of them as Fain does. They would be like Mat was in the first book.

[Jethro]

Hmm well in EotW when Elan Morin Tedronai aka Ishamael/Moridin was telling Lews Therin he was going to Heal the madness, didnt he say something like "this wont be the same as normal Healing, as Healing never was one of his Talents and he followed a different power now?" I always thought he was referring to the True Power even back then and took it to mean he only used the True Power even as far back as that. I personally thought he only started using Saidin again after the link came into play

[Luckers]

He was indeed referring to the True Power in that. Ishamael did use the True Power quite heavily throughout his long life--the burning fire in his eyes and mouth were results of long term excessive usage.

 

But, despite that, he did still use saidin in equal or greater amounts than he did the True Power, and gave up using it as a result of the link, not that he resumed using it as you suggest. We know this because the Forsaken directly comment on him giving up the use of saidin entirely.

 

Beyond that in Rand's encounters with him we see directly when he draws on the True Power during the fight in the Stone of Tear, thus implying that he was using saidin prior to that, which is inferred anyway by the fact that Rand can sense what he is doing, which one cannot with someone channeling the True Power.

[Cockta]

Who is Ordeith now?!

 

I know Padan Fain will bite the dust, I know and I hope so, well, amybe more hope so than know so, but still.

[Luckers]

Oredeith is an invented name, an alias.

 

There is no devision between Fain and Mordeth--they are one person now, an amalgamation.

[Fryn]

Beyond that in Rand's encounters with him we see directly when he draws on the True Power during the fight in the Stone of Tear, thus implying that he was using saidin prior to that, which is inferred anyway by the fact that Rand can sense what he is doing, which one cannot with someone channeling the True Power.

 

Ishy used Saidin, however I can't seem to remember a reference of Mordin using it. The time Rand felt sick in Far Madding might of been one such occurance, but were there any other references of Moridin using Saidin since his ressurection?

[Cockta]

I just wonder, have Rand ever been sick, like, sick sick, not sick because of Saidin, or some other thing. Has he ever been sick of coldness, or because of some bacteria. Seems like Rand is immune to every form of bacteria.

[Luckers]

People who channel have a greater natural immunity to most illnesses. Nynaeve mentions it in the Eye of the World when they find Mat has the dagger.

 

"What's wrong with him?" Egwene asked, and Nynaeve added, "Is it catching? I can still treat him. I don't seem to catch sick, no matter what it is."

"Oh, it is catching," Moiraine said, "and your . . . protection would not save you."

[tEotW: Ch: 41 - Old Friends, and New Threats]

 

 

 

 

[Cockta]

Wow, being a channeler just seems even cooler now!

[Sabio]

Ok to be honest if I could channel I would have to go to the DO, they seem to have alot more fun and whats the use of having the power if you have to obey rules?