[Discussion] how many different kinds of Mafia?

[MsDanya]

ok, here's the deal.

 

in these boards we now have three different kinds of Mafia games. we have:

 

1) Regular mafia , with many players, more exotic roles that lasts for a while even with timerestraints. this game takes some experience to play (tho anyone can if they want to) and to be able to Mod this kind of game, you should have some experience in modding different kinds of games.'

 

2) Newbie Mafia . this game is for those who havent played mafia before, and would like to learn more about how they work. this game has regular roles (Healer, Cop and mafia in different variasions depending on the setting on the game and the Mod) and wont last as long as the regular mafia games. the general rule is that you should play at least a couple of these games before you sign up for a regular game. there is usually a couple experienced players that will help the mod in answering questions that will come up.

 

3) Fast Mafia. this game has timelimits on their Days and Nights, and will last not much more than a week. this game is those who knoe they wont have time to do loooong posts by various players working on proving why they are innocent and the others are guilty. you want to play Mafia, but know that in a week you will be away on loa doing something fun like school or work? then you should join this game instead of the regular ones.

 

so, these are the mafia games we are having currently. but there are some talks about having another kind of game, with even more limitations, specially when it comes to the number of players allowed in the game. so, in this thread, people can come with suggestions if they want to, and we will decide if we will start a regular sign up for them.

 

so please, suggest! discuss! but be nice about it  ;)

 

i'm making this a sticky so it wont be lost.

[Kivam]

quiet, jerkface! nobody tells me to be nice!  :-*

 

I know Ilgross was talking about a mini-mafia game, with limited numbers of players.  That happens to dovetail nicely with what I'm planning anyway, since my next game will be capped at 12 players (but will have a public thread for anyone who wants to comment on the game from outside)

 

Since it will be a smaller game, I think it would work as a staggered game after the main mafia game starts - maybe after the first 6 players in the main mafia game die, so nobody has to wait overlong to play again.

 

If we do that regularly (small player staggered games) they should end quickly enough to release the player pool back to the new main mafia game (since, given the main mafia game's larger size, the main game and the staggered game might end close to the same time)

[Kivam]

Oh, just to clarify - the game I'm proposing wouldn't be any more limited than the main mafia game except in the number of players.  It could be as mind-bendingly off from mafia-normal as the mod wants it to be.

[loki redfern]

sllllllloooooooooooowwwwwwww mafia :P

 

no really, we need more spam i recon generally..i think, maybe this isnt the real problem but some games lately have been a bit..dead.  i know trawling through 5 pages every hour is not something everyone likes .. but its kinda hard to post i find if..er there is nothing to lands on ..i dunno..other suggestions?

[Alys Kinch]

*shrugs* as long as people aren't suffering burnout, i say however many they will sign up for.

[ilgross]

I am sorry but we don't have fast mafia at the moment. The Vampire game is not mafia, because townies don't die when they are lynched, which IMO makes it a different game entirely.

 

I really think that we DONT need more spam, it really just slows up the game increasing reading.

 

What we need is for the games to have more roles. Not new roles, but more roles in general, so that people have more to go on when playing the game, IE a game with more of every role, leads to more activity and more infomation.

 

In my last game, there were no roleless townies, and it worked we had very high activity.

 

To be honest I don't see why we cannot play several games of mafia at once, I meand one should be startign up (atleast the sign up stage) when there are only 3-6 players left in the old game.

 

I don't know why we don't have a new mini-mafia game atm.

 

Personally I am against public threads as, they allow outside intervention into a private game. It think that the game should be amongst the players themselves, not open to outside intervention...

[bcxanth]

I agree with ilgross on a couple of points.

 

More roles in a game makes it more fun.  And not just that everyone gets a role, but that it's ok to have more then one person with the same role, just at different times perhaps.  Say the Finder dies on Day 2, then another Townie gets activated as Finder. Something like that. It would the newbies win more perhaps.

 

And I agree about running several games at once. I personally sign up for as many as I can find, though it requires finding the Org games. It'd be nice to have some more of those games happen over here.

 

And I agree about public threads. That seems pointless.  Last thing you need is some random person not involved trying to get somebody they have a grudge against lynched in their game.  There's nothing wrogn with letting the public watch, but they don't need to comment.

 

However, I do think spam is a good thing. :D  As long as decent time restrictions are put in place on the day/night phazes, people will know when they have to move things along and yet they're still allowed to have fun with each other too.

[Barmacral]

The Vampire game is not mafia, because townies don't die when they are lynched, which IMO makes it a different game entirely.

 

Agreed, although it looks fun (I haven't played the current version yet) its not the same thing.

 

I really think that we DONT need more spam, it really just slows up the game increasing reading.

 

A little spam is ok, and at a website such as this unavoidable, we'll always have some. Lately the mods have been doing well at cracking down on the amount of spam, so its all good. This is a non-issue IMO.

What we need is for the games to have more roles. Not new roles, but more roles in general, so that people have more to go on when playing the game, IE a game with more of every role, leads to more activity and more infomation.

 

I say leave it up to the mod. Lots of roles are fun, but having only a few roles can be quite refreshing too, as well as not as confusing and less likely to scare away new players.

 

Personally I am against public threads as, they allow outside intervention into a private game. It think that the game should be amongst the players themselves, not open to outside intervention...

 

I think the public thread is a great idea for those who wish to use it. I disagree with dead players being able to talk in it. The public thread (introduced by Raena) worked wonderfully for those who wanted to be a part of the Illuminator's game but either didn't have time or didn't get there in time.

 

Also, a guide on moderating would be a good idea... I think I'll make one of those up. It also might not hurt to take a break once every few months and have no mafia games running. I took a 2 week break before I started mine, and people appreciated it a lot.

[DPR]

I vote for more spam, and elect Loki as The Spam Minister. I never understood why we couldn't spam in the first place, but that's just me. I always allow spam in my games.

 

And why don't we leave the choices of how the game will run up to the mods? I know that I like to be creative in hopes that it will make the game more fun.

 

bcxanth, have you played a game with a public thread? It can let experienced players in that did not have time to play the whole game.  Imagine Kivam and Sirayn being able to add analysis even though they could not play. It can be an awesome thing.

 

And now I'm sad because ilgross never likes my games. :(

[ilgross]

The only reason I don't like your last game DPR was 'cause I was (wrongly) lynched day 1.

 

Imagine Kivam and Sirayn being able to add analysis even though they could not play. It can be an awesome thing.

 

Thats the whole point thought, when I as mafia kill Kivam, I do so because he is a good player and a thread to my existence. Shifting him to another thread where I cannot even talk/refute him, defies the point of the game.

 

Besides if good players take over the public thread, then it shifts the empthasis of the game from a discussion where ALL people are innocents/townies to ones where the mafia are able to talk/influence the game. It completely nulifies the mafias best advantage. The ability to direct the discussion...

[DPR]

 

But getting lynched on day one could happen to anyone - and if you play enough games it will happen to you because it happens to someone every game!

 

As for the public thread, Some people like it and some don't. That's cool, but again, leave it up to the mods. If you don't care for it, then sit that game out, no?

 

What do I think?  Open up all of the faucets and see what runs through. Evolve the games and se if you can invent something fun for everybody to play! There are no limits, so why should we hold to any? I would love for someone to invent the ultimately fun game that everybody wanted to play!  That's the whole point!

 

To many people are getting upset during mafia games and not having fun. That's not why we play. It's to match wits and have fun with roles and see who can win in each game. Fun, fun, fun!

 

I realized this during the second hour of my family gathering where political arguments reached a flare. No fun. I wished I was playing mafia on DM.....

[Kivam]

The only reason I don't like your last game DPR was 'cause I was (wrongly) lynched day 1.

 

Imagine Kivam and Sirayn being able to add analysis even though they could not play. It can be an awesome thing.

 

Thats the whole point thought, when I as mafia kill Kivam, I do so because he is a good player and a thread to my existence. Shifting him to another thread where I cannot even talk/refute him, defies the point of the game.

 

Besides if good players take over the public thread, then it shifts the empthasis of the game from a discussion where ALL people are innocents/townies to ones where the mafia are able to talk/influence the game. It completely nulifies the mafias best advantage. The ability to direct the discussion...

 

No, it just means that you require a different strategy if you are mafia.  In fact, the mafia won Raena's illuminator's game because we made fooling Sirayn the sole focus of our strategy, knowing that her analytical skills would likely sway the actual players.  Our goal was to sneak Talya onto her list of highly probable innocents - and it worked.

[bcxanth]

Imagine Kivam and Sirayn being able to add analysis even though they could not play. It can be an awesome thing.

 

Thats the whole point thought, when I as mafia kill Kivam, I do so because he is a good player and a thread to my existence. Shifting him to another thread where I cannot even talk/refute him, defies the point of the game.

 

Besides if good players take over the public thread, then it shifts the empthasis of the game from a discussion where ALL people are innocents/townies to ones where the mafia are able to talk/influence the game. It completely nulifies the mafias best advantage. The ability to direct the discussion...

 

I agree.  If there is a public discussion thread, then you might as well just let all those people play the game.  If people are too late to sign up, then they should have signed up faster.  Giving them a place to go "discuss" just means to me that hey, here's this place where I can still play the game without running the risk of dying for my actions.

 

However, I don't see any point to ban the practice or anything.  It should be up to the mod.  I just know that, if I ever get to mod a game, I won't do that.

[MsDanya]

The Vampire game is not mafia, because townies don't die when they are lynched, which IMO makes it a different game entirely.

 

its a KIND of Mafia imo, and I will leave it as one  :)

 

I really think that we DONT need more spam, it really just slows up the game increasing reading.

 

the mod decides. if you know that one mod allows spam in his/her game, and you really dont like reading through it? dont join that game. simple as that.

 

What we need is for the games to have more roles. Not new roles, but more roles in general, so that people have more to go on when playing the game, IE a game with more of every role, leads to more activity and more infomation.

 

sooo... you want a rule that we have all kinds of roles in the regular mafia?  ??? cause imo thats up to the Mod of the game to decide. his game, he decides the roles.

 

To be honest I don't see why we cannot play several games of mafia at once, I meand one should be startign up (atleast the sign up stage) when there are only 3-6 players left in the old game.

 

the thing is that it looks like some people are getting sick of playing mafia. to not have several games of mafia going at once was a way to male the numbers or people not wanting to play mafia for a while, a little smaller. I think we've made that. but sure, if you play in more than one, please go ahead, but we're following the list. Dixi

 

 

I don't know why we don't have a new mini-mafia game atm.

 

that is what this thread is for.. to see if we can find new and fun mafiagames  :)

Personally I am against public threads as, they allow outside intervention into a private game. It think that the game should be amongst the players themselves, not open to outside intervention...

 

again, I Think this is up to the mods of the games. some mods have the games where having a public thread makes the game even better, some mods have games where it's not needed at all.

 

I think I have replied to most of the issues here. what I would really like to point out tho is: leave the modparts to the mods! thats what they sign up for! i'm not gonna make alot of rules about this or that, because its up to the mod how he/she wants to do things! if you have questions about these kinds of things, ask the mod before you sign up.. "hello there Mod, will there be allowed to spam in this game?" "Yes it is allowed!" "ok, I dont like spam, I think I will skip this one!" see? *nod* easy as something that is easy I suppose. I agree with Wes, we want to evolve the games, and make them even better. I remember when Rae started up with the Werewolfgames, and those are waht we call newbiegames today.. so I'd say we have managed to make them better, but i'm sure people here are creative enough to find something even better *nods* and i'm not one of the creative ones, so please, someone else, go ahead  :P

 

 

[ilgross]

I know DPR I was just joshing with you.

 

No, it just means that you require a different strategy if you are mafia.  In fact, the mafia won Raena's illuminator's game because we made fooling Sirayn the sole focus of our strategy, knowing that her analytical skills would likely sway the actual players.  Our goal was to sneak Talya onto her list of highly probable innocents - and it worked.

 

Thats fine, but its not what a mafia game should be about.

 

its a KIND of Mafia imo, and I will leave it as one

 

Actually I think it has a serious game flaw which makes it vastly different to mafia, but I will leave that for anothe thread.

 

the mod decides. if you know that one mod allows spam in his/her game

 

I agree. But this thread is about discussion about mafia games, and so the purpose is to advocate what you would like to see happen in future mafia games, and I was doing just that. I agree it should be up to the mod to decide, however I think that if this is the case then we should have multiple mafia games running so that if you don't like the settings on one you can join another one.

 

sooo... you want a rule that we have all kinds of roles in the regular mafia?  Huh cause imo thats up to the Mod of the game to decide. his game, he decides the roles.

 

No rules, but I think mods should follow the basic principle of maximising fun, and having a role is WAY more fun then being a roleless townie... So as long as the game is balance I would promote having a role over not having one, and I think future mods should take this into consideration.

 

Besides designing the roles, is the one really fun thing a mod gets to do, you might as well make as many as possible...

 

 

that is what this thread is for.. to see if we can find new and fun mafiagames

 

No I meant that the last one finished ages ago, why hasn't the next person on the list started one?

[Leelou]

Ok...atm I'm one of those burnt out players. Mainly it has to do with day/night limits lasting too long with nothing happening. Sometimes it is refreshing to be a simple role less innocent and trying to figure the game all out on your own, not everyone needs a role and the game can still be fun.

 

I find a lil spam doesn't hurt the games, especially on day 1 when you are just jumping into the game and really don't have a feel for other players yet. But again, it is up to the mod.

 

I don't find a problem with public threads as long as the dead players from the game don't post any information they knew that might sway the game. I understand the wanting to comment on the game play.

 

I loved Wes's game because it was so quick. Although I know when I was the vampire that died day 1 I had wished there was some consequences for the hunters, but now that I've played it both sides hunter/vampire I found to like the way its run.

[Toy and Minion]

Hmmm...I think this thread has turned from "Types of Mafia Games" to "What the Mod Decides About Their Mafia Game".  I would like to return it to it's original topic.

 

Now, we have Regular, Newbie, and Fast (which I will discuss more on when a thread is made for such).  I also like the idea of what ilgross is doing right now, with 5 players who all have roles.  That could be tweaked with depending on the mod, but it's a good idea.  Definately want to see how this one turns out.

 

Still brainstorming on ideas for types of Mafia Games, but just thought I'd bring the topic back on track.

[Alys Kinch]

Thats fine, but its not what a mafia game should be about.

 

mafia games are about exploring ways of finding out who everyone is so that you can win. evils want to find those most threatening to them, innocents the same. you can choose to kill those players or you can choose to exploit them. it's all in your own style or the needs of the situation. *shrugs* you can start your own philosophy thread on it if you like... but you may give away some of your own style secrets that will out you... although, we do have to change things up to avoid that anyway.

[Guest Far Dareis Mai]

My thoughts:

 

Mods determine the aspects of their Mafia game. Period. Nobody is going to tell me what kind of game I'm going to run, if I've signed up. My creation, my rules. End of story. :P

 

I don't particularly care for tons of roles. Sometimes the roles people make up are just plain bad roles, that don't add any interesting element to the game. I prefer the games that are more classic, with roles that actually have some useful function to the game. I'm also a fan of less spam, but I think that's entirely up to the mod.

 

As for other kinds of mafia games, I just ran a really successful Post Restriction Mafia game at Shayol Ghul, that was lots of fun. I'm debating whether or not to do another run when it's my turn to mod a big game here. There are also Serial Killer games which I've participated in on a mafia site, which are pretty interesting. Then of course there are Themed Games, which seem to be the general flavor here. I'd like to see a large scale game here that doesn't revolve around a theme and manifesto. :P

[Alys Kinch]

don't forget the anonymous games too! someone should think of something again. *grins*

[MsDanya]

Thoughts:

 

we have a few different kinds of Mafiagames (or whatever you wanna call them *cough*Ilgross*cough*. what I want is to divide all the games into two main categories.

 

1) Newbie game. The game have simple roles, and is in the "normal" setup. you all know what that mean.

 

2) Advanced game. People sign up to run a game. What kind of game is up to the Mod to decide. These games are big, with unusual roles etc.

 

This will be restricting about how many games can be played at once. but on the other hand, (I think) it will make sure we always have enough players to play the advanced games.

 

your thoughts?

 

to be honest, one persons preferance in this wont matter. its a democracy (tho me, Alys and Boyd have the final say) and we want to make sure everyone is happy. If you end up unhappy about how things are in this particular board, nothing is stopping you from running or playing in games on other boards, but I (meaning Danya) thinks that since we have this board, we should use it for what its worth.

 

Advertise this board. if you are modding a game, browse around the other boards, PM people you think may be interested, inform the newbies about this board. it really does annoy me that mafia games run on other boards, specially if they are large and have an open sign-up, but I cant do anything about it. but we should be able to work something out. if we get enough people to join this board, we can start having multiple advanced games running at once. so if you are a regular at these boards, playing mafiagames, please inform people in other orgs and divs about this board. cause we really need it. we have been the same people in ten games now, and tho I do love to play with all of you, I would really like to get some new people to play as well.

 

these are just the thoughts I had now, and that I've been having a while. if you think it sounds like I'm frustrated about the low activity on these boards, it is because I am. same with Fiddles, but thats another matter all together..

 

so if you wanna contribute to have this board run many games with alot of participants, please advertise this board. thats all we need  :)

[Barmacral]

I agree with what Drunkya said.

[MsDanya]

:P

[DPR]

 

So where does "fast mafia" fit in now?  And, I have an idea for another new format:

 

It's set in a courtroom and all of the players are on the jury.  They will vote on 5 suspected mafia members (not players) that will sit on the stand each day to be judged.

Each day (48 hours) the jury debates the evidence and each player will vote innocent or guilty to be recorded by the judge (mod).

Each night (24 hours) the Lawyers (could be players, but don't have to be) present the case for the next defendant.

 

At the end of the game, the judge reads the verdict, and you find out how many defendants the jury judged correctly. Points are awarded if the jury judges more correctly than incorrectly.

 

Roles:

 

Innocent jury member: You get to debate each case and vote.

Bribed jury member: The mob has paid you off to sway the jury's votes. You know who is innocent and who is guilty. You will try to get the rest of the jury to vote the guilty defendants as innocent and the innocent defendants as guilty.

FBI jury member: You are a special agent sent to investigate who has been bribed (the finder). Once per night, you get to ask the judge if another player is innocent or bribed.

 

No one dies. The game will last for exactly 15 days. It will be up to each Judge (Mod) to create the evidence to present to the jury (Or you can assign two people as Lawyers to do so).

Bonus points will be awarded to those that play their roles well.

[ilgross]

I agree that mods shouldn't be forced to do anything, but we should have guide lines.

 

Doesn't that game depend highly upon the evidence provided?