The Literal Facts Behind TG

[trakand_01]

Please forgive me if i'm mis-understanding here, but the basic facts behind the entire series here is that the DO is breaking loose, yes? The seals that hold the bore closed are weakening / breaking, and he's breaking through from inside. Already his Forsaken are loose on the world and his influence is spreading once more.

 

So... cant they just re-seal the bore, again? Lanfear was a scientist (technically this is all her fault) and it was she and her team who drilled through and created the 'Bore' in the first place - surely if she can be turned (perhaps Rand could persuade her if he could bring himself to do it) she would know a way of blocking the bore back up again, of creating new seals?

 

This is obviously all very basic and i'm sure there's some thread somewhere which points out exactly why this can't be done but your thoughts would be very welcome.

[Kura]

Well, I suppose Lanfear would have some insight on how to seal the bore permantatly (or as permanant as cyclic time allows), but there are two rather large issues with that plan.

 

1.)She's mind trapped. I doubt Moradin will let her have any free rain to go to the light.

2.)She hates Rand now.

[trakand_01]

Good points, thanks i'd forgotten that - i'm re-reading after several years and am only up to CoS so only Moghedian is mind-trapped that we know of (although Moridin did have another mind-trap around his neck when he pulled out Moghedians).

 

But if they'd done it earlier, say around the time Lanfear kept trying to seduce Rand, could it technically have had any use?

[Kura]

Well, for that I'd argue that Rand was a newb with the power. He couldn't even embrace it everytime he tried, and I'm going to guess that to patch up the bore it will take both halfs of the power. Plus he's so busy dealing with all these bloody lords, that he hardly has time to mess around with Lanfear, and a bunch of other situational things. The fact that she is a Forsaken not a small one.

[RobertAlexWillis]

But if they'd done it earlier, say around the time Lanfear kept trying to seduce Rand, could it technically have had any use?

 

Quite possibly ... remember, Lanfear claimed she had a plan, in which she and Rand, using the Choedan Kal, were supposed to take on Shai'tan ...

 

That said, given the current situation, I don't think she'll end up as part of the solution.  Also, just because she had a plan, doesn't mean that plan would work.  In the Age of Legends, Lews Therin and others were as experienced with the Power as Mierin, and Lews Therin's plan didn't turn out so well ...

[loki redfern]

i dont think there is really any situation now where lanfear and rand would seal the bore. that said in a hypotheical situation where lanfear was ammenable and rand at his nadir then i would say that they could as its one of the main themes that men and women work better together than apart (possibly why its failed this time round when just men did it) as LTT was going to do it will just one other person in the first place until the fateful concord thingy , so that is probably one of the optimum ways to seal the bore.

[DemandredFO]

I don't think at any time Lanfear would've turned to the light.  She was to ambitious, the Shadow still had secrets for her to figure out.  So before and certainly now, I believe it to be impossible

[krelianzg]

I don't think Lanfear would have any special knowledge about how to seal the Bore. Just because you can rip a hole in something doesn't mean you know how to fix it afterwards.

 

Also, from what Lanfear was saying about the Choedan Kal, it seemed that she wanted, in her supreme arrogance, to actually kill the DO and/or Creator and replace them with her and Rand.

[elmis]

I don't think making new seals, if they knew how, would do much good. I don't really think the seals was the endgame for the War of Power either, but rather a desperate attempt in order to gain some time to really fix the problem.

[RobertAlexWillis]

I don't think Lanfear would have any special knowledge about how to seal the Bore. Just because you can rip a hole in something doesn't mean you know how to fix it afterwards.

 

Well, when it is something as metaphysical as manipulating reality ... she has a better chance than most of knowing something more.  The Bore isn't actually a "hole" ... so the comparison isn't entirely apt.

 

Also, from what Lanfear was saying about the Choedan Kal, it seemed that she wanted, in her supreme arrogance, to actually kill the DO and/or Creator and replace them with her and Rand.

 

I don't doubt Lanfear's arrogance, but she was consistent in asserting that she and Rand could defeat the Dark One with the Choedan Kal ... while Lanfear is quite arrogant, she's also bloody good at backing it up.

 

Again ... I'm not saying that her plan, whatever it may have been, is certain to have worked.  I'm saying she had a plan, and, on the whole, she has a decent track record of backing up her claims to be able to do something.

 

I don't think making new seals, if they knew how, would do much good.

 

I agree.

 

I don't really think the seals was the endgame for the War of Power either, but rather a desperate attempt in order to gain some time to really fix the problem.

 

I'm not quite so sure of that ... the way Lews Therin goes on an on about their pride and being sure they could fix what the Creator had made, I imagine there was at least speculation that the Seal could be a permanent solution.

 

I understand that guilt colors everything Lews Therin says, but he seems pretty consistent on that idea ... they thought they could fix what the Creator had made.

[loki redfern]

unless the creator is going to float down though at the end of  TG when rand breaks a nail on SG and say 'well done kid, ill take it from here though' the cyclic nature of time and the creators policy of non-involvement seems to suggest that it is going to be the people of the third age that are going to fix it some how, which is probably why it is a thin spot in reality by the time the second age comes,

so the speculation seems to have good grounding that it could have worked (useing ?fel hedrid? 's theories anyway)

 

and i get the feeling that they must have had some doubt seeing as the 100 companions was only a hasty plan B

[krelianzg]

 

I don't doubt Lanfear's arrogance, but she was consistent in asserting that she and Rand could defeat the Dark One with the Choedan Kal ... while Lanfear is quite arrogant, she's also bloody good at backing it up.

 

Again ... I'm not saying that her plan, whatever it may have been, is certain to have worked.  I'm saying she had a plan, and, on the whole, she has a decent track record of backing up her claims to be able to do something.

 

 

I agree with that wholeheartedly. What I meant to get at is that all this talk about her helping to seal the Bore is ridiculous. Helping the Light just isn't on her agenda, which really boils down to;

 

1. Make LTT love me

2. Rule the world

 

Not necessarily in that order, depending on her mood. Even if she did help the forces of Light seal the Bore, I'm sure she'd then proceed to kill off everyone she saw as a threat to her new reign on Earth. Some victory that'd be.