Question?

[Lady Saravhem]

Why is it the Fox head is the only thing that effects the gholem?

 

Anybody got any theories as to why this is?

 

:? I would really rather have something bigger to use against him if it where me.

[Rufae]

I would think because it negates the Power. And since the gholem is made from the One Power, then it negates it.

 

Option #2 : They both absorb the One Power so odds are they are made with the same principle in mind. So there might be some harmonics or wave cancellation kind of thing going on.

 

My 2 cent.

[Tenshin_Xo]

Its pure speculation, but it seems as though the Gholam is a purely artificial construct. Perhaps a blending of the TP and saidin/saidar? In any case the medallion most likely interferes with the part of the gholam that is made or sustained by the Power. Its also possible that its ability to nullify or absorbe weaves causes some kind of feedback with the medallion.

[Arath Faringal]

Which leads to an interesting idea. Would prolonged contact with a Gholam damage the medallion?

[BrainFireBob]

I've always favored the idea that the gholam has an incidental or even built in vulnerability to silver.

 

Aginor would have wanted some control on them- he didn't trust shadowspawn, and silver in any relatively advanced society isn't common, but can be easily accessed at need.

 

Besides, Jordan's Shadowspawn are missing the lycanthropic vulnerability to silver. And gholams are shape-shifters.

[RobertAlexWillis]

I've always favored the idea that the gholam has an incidental or even built in vulnerability to silver.

 

The only problem with that is that the gholam thinks to itself that the medallion was the first thing it had encountered that could harm it. Its difficult for me to picture it going through its entire existence without encountering any silver.

[Guest Barmacral]

In a time of war it could be very possible that a Gholam would never go near silver.

[Luckers]

I always thought that it was simply because they both have the same effect, and that the interaction between these two effects caused a reaction in the gholam.

 

I also dont see it being silver.

[Beckon]

I agree. RJ seemed to go out of his way to describe the experience of channeling at both the gholam and Mat's medallion(sp? for some reason no matter how I spell that it doesn't look right :P) in very similar terms.

[RobertAlexWillis]

I always thought that it was simply because they both have the same effect, and that the interaction between these two effects caused a reaction in the gholam.

 

I agree. At the risk of creating a less than entirely accurate metaphor, I think of it a something like the interaction of two identically charged particles forced into contact.

[HoppyQ]

So how will it be killed? Does Mat stand and slap it for a week until it's all burned up? Since the ter'angeral in Far madding block the power would contact with that hurt him? Is there something in the tower that will destroy him?

[Lord Beric]

Hmmm, this has me thinking.

 

If the gholam and the medallion can cause damage to each other because of the similar effects they respectively have on channeling, what would happen were the gholam to attempt to enter Far Madding, where the stedding-in-a-box ter'angreal seem to have a large-scale effect that is quite similar?

 

For that matter, does anyone have any ideas on whether the ter'angreal/gholam produced anti-channeling effects would clash with an actual stedding? I would think not, but that's only an assumption based on the stedding being a natural phenomenon which the gholam, for example, clearly is not.

 

As far as the silver possibility, I've never really liked this option for a bouple of reasons.

 

1) Aginor has never seemed to have had all that much control over the specifics of his creations (i.e. Fades appearing unplanned), and I think any such specific vulnerability being built in on purpose seems unlikely.

 

2) The medallion isn't REALLY silver anymore anyway. Consistently we have seen ter'angreal described as having been made out of a substance, while clearly no longer actually being that substance. For example, the twisted stone ring ter'angreal is described as not actually being stone, the same with most of the ter'angreal that Elayne makes. They start out as one thing, and undergo some sort of molecular change during the creation process, and end up as something else. I always assumed the same was the case with the medallion.

[wvlr]

So how will it be killed? Does Mat stand and slap it for a week until it's all burned up? Since the ter'angeral in Ebou Dar block the power would contact with that hurt him? Is there something in the tower that will destroy him?

 

Well, My suggestion - in another thread - was that Matt would hold it at bay for a few moments until a channeler got the chance to use a "Deathgate" on it. We already know Matt was able to go through the gateway that Rand used to take him to Salidar and the girls used a gateway to take him to Ebu Dar. So if Matt is able to use gateways while wearing the "Fox Head" then a "Deathgate" could probably be used against the Gholam.

 

But I would not completely rule out silver at this point. It stands to reason that the gholam would be created with some kind of weekness so that if it became dangerous to its masters they could dispose of it. We know the fox head is made of silver, so that could be it. Or not.

 

Edited to add:

 

Another option - maybe - is if Matt fights it again and it tries to escape through a little hold in a brick wall again, Matt might use the Fox Head to "slice it in half". I don't know how much that would do to kill it though. It might create two "midgit" gholams, like a worm.

[Luckers]

For that matter, does anyone have any ideas on whether the ter'angreal/gholam produced anti-channeling effects would clash with an actual stedding? I would think not, but that's only an assumption based on the stedding being a natural phenomenon which the gholam, for example, clearly is not.

 

Well, we witnessed both Cadsuane and Nynaeve's ter'angreal within Far Madding, with no issue.

[mègon]

Why is it the Fox head is the only thing that effects the gholem?

 

Anybody got any theories as to why this is?

 

:? I would really rather have something bigger to use against him if it where me.

 

Because RJ said so, that's why :P

[RobertAlexWillis]

So how will it be killed? Does Mat stand and slap it for a week until it's all burned up? Since the ter'angeral in Ebou Dar block the power would contact with that hurt him? Is there something in the tower that will destroy him?

 

The ter'angreal that break weaves of the Power (both Mat's and Cadsuane's) were made somehow using the Power. Remember, they don't simply block the Power, like a stedding, or the Far Madding ter'angreal, they break the flows apart, make them seem to melt. That is a different function.

 

So, it is probably possible to produce the ter'angreal's effect in a temporary way using the Power. The Forsaken are the most likely to be familiar with this method. Among those who follow the Light, though it makes my teeth grit, Elayne has the best chance to figure it out. How her pregnancy altered ability to channel might figure into this, I don't know.

 

Alternatively, the Gholam could be sent to kill Semirhage, once its known she's been captured. In order to save her life, she might tell Cadsuane or someone else how to kill it. Especially if she does get clapped into an a'dam.

 

The Power may not be able to kill it directly, but encasing it in a weave that mimics the ter'angreal's effect would probably cause the same reaction as Mat's medallion, but all over it, all at once. And that could be enough to kill it.

 

And yes, that entire line of thought is purely speculative.

 

As far as a weakness to silver goes, while silver in a pure form might have been easier to avoid, silver is a part of many, many useful alloys. That the Gholam hadn't encountered silver at all, in a war situation or otherwise, truly is almost unfathomable.

[Luckers]

My thought is that the Tower of Ghenjei and the Finns may play a part in the destruction of the Gholam.

[Emrys]

also remember that ter'angreal can have more than one ability and people may never learn how to access them. Therfore this could be another ability it has that we dont know about it doesnt have to be related to the fact that it blocks the power of channeling.

[Lady Saravhem]

I sure the above response will definitely harm the creature.

 

I was thinking I remember it being said that six of the ghollems were created 3 'male' and 3 'female'.

 

What we know is the female half of the source does not effect the male for sure, but maybe the male half does, and viceversa with the female constructs.

 

just a wacky thought. :?

[RobertAlexWillis]

What we know is the female half of the source does not effect the male for sure, but maybe the male half does, and viceversa with the female constructs.

 

That would be possible, except that the male shaped gholam thought to himself that he had never encountered anything that could hurt it. I'm sure he ran into saidin all the time back in the AOL.

[Emrys]

I am sure its not the opposite power that hurts them. However it could be a special weave for each kind

[Graendal probably did it]

I was always of the opinion that silver harmed the Gholam too. Although it was based on a comparison with were wolves, and the fact that Mat's medallion is made of silver. It is an open question whether it is the medallion and/or its ter'angreal-ness which make it effective against the Gholam.

I think a gholam would go to great lengths to avoid silver if they are vulnerable. And I doubt if such a valuable assassin would be used in a battle situation, so it is not likely to encounter it by accident.

 

Hmmm deathgate's and the Gholam, that might work, since its indirect. A bit like lobbing a fireball created with the power. The fireball itself isn't the power its a fireball, so it has a phyical effect, hence the gateway is an effect, not to be cancelled by the gholam.