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A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY

wvlr

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Everything posted by wvlr

  1. Wert, I have mixed feelings on this. To some extent I agree but by the same measure, I don't. She went seeking the Bowl of the Winds. Since the weather problems were effecting the entire world (Including Andor) I would say that a case could be made for her to be still addressing the needs of her realm. After all, she was one of the two that actually saw the place in the dream world, so she was needed to help locate it in the real world. But it was irritating to see how long it took them in Ebou Dar and in her POVs she seemed to not have a thought to - "Gee, I really need to get on with this so I can get to business back in Andor!"
  2. Oh but I do! Please be so kind and tell us.
  3. I agree with the general sentiments above. Many of the characters in the books have gotten in trouble and on occasion I thought - Damn - what is the matter with XXXX character. But it is believeable because people can get over confident or due to lack of information. But in KoD there are TWO such events that just went far beyond believeable and deep into the extreme annoying for me. Elayne was obviously going to get the throne so it was not all that interesting but her attack on the BA was so poorly concieved, implemented and without emotions on her part that I do not enjoy the chapters nearly as much as I like the rest of the books. Her Asedi sisters, the Warders and the soilders that all got killed because of her lack of preparation and then on top of that her lack of emotion and shame for her mistakes at the end was just too much. The other one is the Rand-Semi scene in KoD.
  4. Well historically, Physical (upper body) strength has frequently been a significant criterion for determining a leader - especially in small groups. This is considered the primary way that Men have generally dominated Women throughout history. I would well think that the WT would have started the same. A relatively small group of women - say a few hundred go together. Assuming that non of them really stood out domineering wise then the one that was strongest with the One Power, would easily have ruled. She would have thought "Well I'm stronger than all the rest. If they don't do what I say, I will just "shield" them until I get my way." Sure the others could have joined together to "beat" her, but she might well have had others that agreed with her. Whatever the case, it probably became the WT standard after that.
  5. Luckers, I agree with the first part but not with the second. Just because they can use the Bond in that way with a normal man, does not guarentee that they will be able to with a Channeler. We have already seen with the Rand/Alanna bond and the Merise/Jahar bond that it is not all that easy for the AS to (Control) Male Channelers. And until we see an AS try to use the Bond to Kill a Channeler - we will not be able to say with a "Certianty" that it will work.
  6. But I am so in harmony with my Faile Hate and Caddy Hate. It soothes my sole to hear 2000 other postings chant to the same rhythm
  7. The only one that I can think of that seems to cross the line on her not being a Black it her thought at the Cleansing "A shield, she decided. A captive Forsaken might prove very useful." (This is the same one Luckers mentioned a few posts above) Sure you could say that - according to her agenda - this could be seen as another "Grey" statement. But it does really seem unlikely that if she was a Black, that she would want to capture a Forsaken for Rand and company.
  8. Yes, this is one of the many major parts of AMoL that I am very anxiously waiting for. It has significant potential to cause a great deal of disruption to the Seanchan sul'dams and possibly beyond.
  9. I agree that Verin is one tough nut to call. For the most part I agree with Luckers that as many POVs that we see of her and her actions - it is hard to believe that she would be Black. But for the same reasons that BJ mentioned here - I just can not be completely certain. She is one of my most favorite characters and I will be really upset if that 5% possibility of her turning out to be Black comes true. I hope that RJ either completely wrote her part of AMoL or that he at least left really good notes on her.
  10. Are you saying that knowing that Rand was the Dragon - early in EotW would have spoiled it for you? If that is the case how did you ever get past the first few chapters? I think that it became obvious, at least to me, that Rand WAS the dragon real quick in the books. So if that was your criteria for fininshing, I am very surprised that you even finnishe the first book, much less the following books. Just a curiosity. ??? ??? ??? By the way, I have known several people that read the end - before they get there - and I also have never been able to understand the concept either. ??? ??? :P
  11. Since you asked: Caddy Caddy Caddy Caddy Caddy Caddy Caddy Caddy Caddy AND FAILE!!!!!!! Sorry I just could not resist! The Shame!!!!!!
  12. Well thanks for replying but we don't seem to be getting anywhere here & I just don't have that much time to put together posts that are not completely read or understood. I am sure that it is my fault - my posts are done on the fly while I am on break and so they are probably just not composed well enough for you and luckers to comprehend. Again, I am SURE that it is my fault, not your's so please don't take offense. Cheers!!! :) :) :)
  13. It is direct enough in MY book and I would think that it would be direct enough for the DEAD person as well. Dead is DEAD!!! I think that it says clearly that all "objects of power" are the White Towers, Caddy is AS so it is her responsibility to enforce this.
  14. I absolutely loved the irony involved. Poetic. On the balefireing a Sa'Angreal... I think everyone's spelled it out nicely. Who knows what that would have done. Definitely not adviseable with so much of the one power being channeled. :o I agree with both of these. On a side note - somewhat related - it is my opinion that the DO can probably thank Elza for the fact that more Forsaken wern't killed at the Clensing. She was controling Callendar and got directions from Caddy on where to "Blast" with it. Slight delays and slight angle changes could easily account for why she missed "every single time"! Osan'gar being the single delibrate exception. It is a shame that she did not confirm this in her few POVs.
  15. So what? I don't see a problem with using the tools you have to carry out the job at hand. And I agree with you. Unfortuantely, you took my statements completely out of context. -- I was responding to Luckers claim that: “She not once uses those ter'angreal in the books to get her own way.” I say that: 1. That is ridiculous because she has already developed her REPUTATION based on her use of them. Regardless as to whether someone knew that she had used those tools to help her earn that REPUTATION. All AS now treat her differently because of her past accomplishments. Accomplishments that were earned via those “Thingies”. Since AS visably treat her differently, this is obviously seen by NON AS who already regard most AS very highly, resulting in even higher respect given to Caddy from non-AS. The “Gee AS are scared of her – I better jump twice as high for her as I go for regular AS.” 2. We do not have a constant POV from Caddy throughout the books so we can not be sure what “Thingies” she might be using at any given time. We do know that she has “Thingies” that tell her if a male channeler is near and if he is holding Saidin. Because we see this at least once (CoT US HB Pg 540). So yes she is actively using her “Thingies” in her dealings with one person that we know of - Rand and she can’t help but use the Reputation that she earned in part from her historical use of the Thingies. Does she walk around telling people that she is going to hit them on the head with her Thingies if they do not do what she wants – NO – that is effectively handled by her REPUTATION. People are awed by her reputation. Have you read TDR? The entire book was Rand ignoring Moiraine's advice. Depending on the part of TDR you are referring to the answers to that vary – because for a while there he WAS acting quite strange. Beyond that YES Moiraine frequently gave him good advice in TDR and was more than a little irritated when he did not jump to do everything she suggested. But he rarely if ever refused to listen to the advice. In the end, her advice was not as good as the solutions that he came up with. Then the problem is not with Cadsuane but with White Tower policy. Regardless, the policy is not a particularly bad one. Indeed, it saves most men an unpleasant end. And it is far better than your idea of using the stedding as shelters. Why would the Ogier even agree to do so? Why would Far Madding agree to do so? Every where, people are scared out of their wits of men who can channel, regardless of whether they are doing so or not. “the policy is not a particularly bad one”?????? If they had inadvertently gentled the DR and the whole world was lost to the DO – I WOULD CONSIDER THIS TO BE BAD!!! I think that every non-Darkfriend would agree that it would be bad! That was the context of the statement. Why would Ogier or Far Maddingites refuse something that would save the world over the stupidity that was being committed? Ref WH US PB Pg 730. Aleis (of the FM Counsel) “We have no fear of Asha’man, Cadsuane” Until this incident – they had no care if a male OR female channeler was in FM, because they knew that said channeler could not channel within the city limits. FM also has a very tight security system set up so that not even a SWORD can enter or leave without their permission. Surely that could easily be adapted to include a branded male channeler. As far as Ogier are concerned, they have ALREADY shown their willingness to do what was necessary to save the world. OPPS! Thanks for correcting me – so it is even worse than I remembered! Verin's a dangerous lady--though she never actual confronts anyone, i reguard her to be about the most dangerous character in the series. Cadsuane herself notes that she is left uncertain about Verin, and reguards her warily. Moiraine too is strong and dangerous. But Rand dismisses both. Neither could have done what Cadsuane is doing, and that those are both strong willed women does not make Cadsuane less so--indeed i would still place her as stronger willed than either Verin or Moiraine. In a direct confrontation with either Cadsuane would win. Verin would never let such a confrontation happen, and Moiraine... well, it did happen in NS, and Moiraine was forced to flee under cover of dark. “Verin's a dangerous lady--though she never actual confronts anyone, i reguard her to be about the most dangerous character in the series.” Well it’s nice to agree with you about at least one little tidbit lately!! “Moiraine was forced to flee under cover of dark.” Come on! Moraine was only just raised and was caught up in other very urgent and important business that could not be delayed at the time. It really demeans your argument to even mention it. “In a direct confrontation with either Cadsuane would win.” No in a direct confrontation with Verin, Caddy would be DEAD!! She came DAMN close already and you know it! I am sorry but I can’t take this as gospel, if you do – that is OK to me - but to me the AS really seemed to be terribly sloppy about those things – look at all the runaways and AS rejects that left the Tower with that stuff. Look at Caddy she has had her stuff near forever and we know from Moraine that their possession of such stuff is supposed to be limited. But you are probably correct that that was the way that it was supposed to work. Well that is what they would like you to believe but if you believe it then how about if I sell you some prime beach front property in Arizona. I can guarantee you that it will be a steal! The fact is that you have no proof of this and especially for minor lords which is what we are talking about. If anything, this desire to give the “appearance” of no break in family line would ensure greater secrecy in any such adoptions that were needed due to infertility or deaths of the true line. That level of secrecy would preclude AS from ever being completely sure even for minor lords. What? Who was trying to cast dark aspirations on Caddy? And I could well be wrong but I thought that in EoTW, Moraine and Siuan commented that they had to be careful because Rand could quite easily get accidentally gentled before he was declared
  16. She not once uses those ter'angreal in the books to get her own way. In fact, most people she deals with have no idea they are even ter'angreal, so she doesn't even use the threat of them to get her own way. She uses her strength of will, and that strength is something Rand has and will need. Sorry Luckers, but we have insufficient data to say that she never did this and regardless it does not matter, because it that is like saying that Arnald Swartsniger did not use Steroids and other drugs to win the California Governership. Those drugs got him his body and his acting career - His REPUTATION and public “Face Time” so to speak, all of which he leveraged into the Governorship. The same goes for Caddy – She has used those “Thingies” to help her track down male channelers and bring them to the WT – At lease once Alone. These actions and the Ang’eral that she constantly wears (just like Grendal at the meeting) significantly effect her Asedi reputation and standing. And she Flaunts that Reputation – remember that first meeting? She says something like “I have found and captured more male channelers than ANY three Reds combined!” Just like Arnald she might not be currently actively using her “Boosters” but she still retains the enhanced body/reputation that she most likely would never have gotten without them. And by that very statement of hers above – she is very much actively “Flaunting it”. As far as “Strength of Will” is concerned, I do not see hers to be significantly better than quite a few other characters. Verin’s strength of will seems to be quite significant to me, but she does not use the crutch of abuse and outright antagonism that Caddy seems to have to rely on. That said, I have never seen Rand to refuse to listen to Verin’s good advise. The same went for Moraine. In two thousand years not one has been found by any sister until the Black bestirred themselves. Pevara found Talene through pure chance--and through the fact that she had access to the Oath Rod, which Cadsuane did not. No that is not true. Prior to the 13 BA stealing the things from the WT, the OR was available to any AS that wanted to use it. That is how the BA got it to remove the WT Oaths and take the BA Oaths. So Pevera managed to get the OR despite restrictions that Caddy would never have had to deal with. I seem to remember you acknowloging this in a different thread – am I wrong about that? Cadsuane was not aware of Gitara's foretelling, and did not see that any men were gentled or even captured in that time until Logain and Taim, both of which were clearly not the Dragon by method of their histories--which she investigated. What evidence to you have to support this? We have seen/heard of VERY little about Logain’s & Taim’s family history and none of it precludes the possibility that either or both of them could have been adopted at a very young age (baby) and raised as family. Face it, this is staged in a very brutal world and even in the modern real world children are frequently orphaned and adopted. Throughout history, if the adoption is done early enough, the child is often raised as “True blood family” without ever being informed of their adopted status. Show me the Quote that backs this up AND as I stated above: We have seen/heard of VERY little about Logain’s & Taim’s family history and none of it precludes the possibility that either or both of them could have been adopted at a very young age (baby) and raised as family. Face it, this is staged in a very brutal world and even in the modern real world children are frequently orphaned and adopted. Throughout history, if the adoption is done early enough, the child is often raised as “True blood family” without ever being informed of their adopted status. She did not know that Rand had been born, and even if she did, the two men who could channel she had access to in that time had both called themselves Dragons--leaving them, or even holding them to be teachers would have been inadvisable. They were too unpredictable, too likely to try and seize power themselves. Again, What I am saying is that it does not matter that Caddy did not know of the Foretelling. What if there had never been a Foretelling. What if the DR was one of those men that Caddy captured years before the Foertelling? What I am saying, is ANYTIME over the last 3000 years the DR could have been born on DM and been adopted just like Rand. And just like Rand - if he did not know it, he could have been gentled. Do you have any quotes where Rand refused to listen to Verin’s advice? Min’s advice? Caddy’s advice when she was not being as ASS? The Aril’s advice? I don’t mean where he listened to them & decided different, but where he completely refused to listen! Maybe I have amnesia, but I just can’t think of one. I am sure that there must be a case where it happened, so please enlighten me! Please!! PS. This is not saying that Rand is not an ASS in his own right – because he IS!!! A Royal ASS actually! But he usually listens to advise as far as I can remember – NO MATTER where that advice comes from. That’s pretty good for a crazy guy! To me his problem is not that he will not listen, but that he has Temper FITS. Well Duh!!! The guy is going crazy, has constant pain from his wounds, arms, hand(s), and has a nut case talking in his head. 75% of the people that I know, if they bump their head/finger/knee/elbow/etc. they fly off the handle for a few moments to several minutes. I hardly think that compares to what Rand has to put up with, so cut him a little slack.
  17. Thanks for the reply Hybrid, And although you are correct the I am being a little excessive about my condemnation of Caddy, I think that you skimmed over my points a little too much. Yes Perva STOLE the OR when it was under Lock Down! All the years that Caddy was hunting the BA, the OR was available to anyone who wanted it for any reason - that is how the BA kept removing their oaths. If Caddy is so damn intimidating to all the AS, I am sure that she could have found a way to use her near god-hood to pressure any particular AS to swear on it or keep her secluded until she either attacked Caddy - revieling her BA hood or said the oaths. After all, what kind of excuse can a AS use to refuse to say the oaths? Gee Caddy, I just don't want to. Bullshit! A normal AS would not refuse Caddy if Caddy insisted - unless she was Black. As soon as she refused - Caddy would know that she was Black. Once Caddy knows that she is Black - Caddy can do whatever she wants with her. Next is the issue of "well the DR had to be born on Dragonmount - well guess what. Rand did not know that he was born there either until he overheard Tam's feaver dream. What I am saying, is ANYTIME over the last 3000 years the DR could have been born on DM and been adopted just like Rand. And just like Rand - if he did not know it, he could have been gentled. The only thing that saved Rand was that Moriane was smarter than the average AS. AS were just being stupid for 3000 years. Sure it is understandable at first - with the Breaking and all. But once the WT was established - at some point the WT AS should have realized that genteling every male was not only unnecessary (Steddings and Far Madding were available to hold channeling males) but that it was stupid because they could accidentally gentle the DR and doom the world.
  18. Agreed! My interpetation was he abandoned SL not just because of the Callandor attack but because SL was starting to become "unstable". If it was soley because of Callandor he should have traveled far enough away to avoid Callandor attacks & quickly pre-weaved his backlash spell, then traveled back to SL & dropped the backlash weave & gated away before the next Callandor attack.
  19. The plan was not to Channel AT Rand but to channel something within the confines of SL that would cause the Cleansing weave to crash and/or bounce back at Rand. He did not need to See Rand to do this and the warding weaves that were protecting Rand would not be likely to protect him from his own weave bouncing back at him. With all the saidin & saidar power that he was using it would have probably created a massive backlash that could well have burned out everyone that was even with Rand. Dred might well have burned out all his Forsaken buddies as well - if they were too close. - Although that is just a guess on the last part. If he had only had the guts to stay a little longer & do it.
  20. The only (sad) crying that I would be doing is that she wasn’t balefired sooner. Her strength comes mostly from the “ang’eral/terang’eral” hair thingies that can be given to someone more deserving. Say that Seanchan ex-damaine with him or one of his girls Avi/Elayne. As far as her great wisdom is concerned – didn’t she say that she hunted Black Adaja and could not find ANY! Shit, the WT is full of them and even with her “aids” she could not even find even ONE! Perva went hunting and found some within just a few months. Caddy had YEARS and found NOTHING!! Sorry but that does not seem all that wise or competent to me. OK, that is a biggie, but let’s just skip it and look at something else: So in NS the WT has a Foretelling that the DR has been reborn. So can you tell me how many men (that could well have been the DR) that she found and had gentled during that time. Gee, to me that is really a stupid thing to do – what if you accidentally gentled the DR. (Actually, for the same reason – it was pretty stupid thing to EVER gentle them – so she & the WT are minus points big time for all those they gentled before the foretelling as well.) OK let’s cut her a little more slack and assume that in her infinite (unseen) wisdom she would not have accidentally gentled the DR. Now she knows that girls that can channel need someone to teach them, otherwise any number of catastrophes might happen to them. She also knows that saidin and saidar are completely different and so girls can’t train boys. So in all her undisplayed wisdom she miraculously knows that the DR is not going to need some or all of those men she gentled over the last 20+ years to teach him. She somehow knew that Lanfear would help the DR enslave Asmo to do that task. Gee, I never saw such a display of precognitive ability from her. I guess I must have missed it. Oh well, she is the Great and All Powerful CADDY, so what does she do, in her great wisdom, when she comes to him to try to be his advisor? She antagonizes the shit out of him and completely alienates him. Oh well she, in her great wisdom, must have known that he had a thing about killing women so that she would be safe and she obviously knew that Min would have a “vision” that would tell the DR that he HAD to put up with her Pompas Ass AS butt! Wait a minute – I don’t think she knew about Rand’s aversion to hurting women, or Min’s visions and I KNOW she did not know about THAT vision of Min’s. So yet once again Caddy shows herself to be not so wise – just Damn lucky!
  21. He was also outnumbered and outgunned. Of course, anyone with the balls would take on a superior force with one of the most powerful sa'angreals in existence, especially when all they could do was get annihilated. Where I come from, we call this "smart." Like snipers. The goal is to inflict maximum damage on the enemy with minimal damage to your own forces. That's why we don't do open warfare like in the American Revolution, where people walked up in lines and blasted at each other in the open until someone retreated. In regards to Demandred's effectiveness, I agree that it was a poor tactical decision. Every good strategian needs one thing, information. He was arrogant enough to believe that he'd accounted for every possible occurrence. However, that does not mean he is a bad strategian. It means he's arrogant. He made the correct decision in retreating. When you can't win a battle, you retreat to fight a different one. Excellent summary of my feelings on this - except for the end. If this had been a real situation - not fiction, I feel that although it was scareing the shit out of him, he should have gone through with his plan. It was an excellent plan and depending on how long it would have taken him to - weave his reversal/sabatoge spell - he should have. That is assuming it was something that did not take too long. Hell he was already in there and had already decided what he needed to do to create the "backlash", a few more minutes and he could have avoided all the running from the Challender blasts and the fight with Flynn. Instead he chickened out at the crutial moment of opportunity - He Obviously had NO BALLS! His problem with LTT all along MIGHT not have been that he was not Brilliant enough, but that he never had the guts to follow through. Look at LTT - back at the sealing of the Bore - when the females refused to help - he addapted his plan and did it without them. In my opinion going to the Bore in the middle of SG with all the forces of the DO against them would have been on par with going to SL during the Cleansing - but LTT & his 100 stuck with it and did the job. They had the Balls, Dred did not. Nuff Said!!!!
  22. Except Cadsuane definitely hates balefire I have a cure for that as well! ;D ;D ;D :o :o :o Believe me - if I was Rand and I Balefired Caddy's ass back to NS it would make me laugh so hard that I would cry! ;D ;D ;D
  23. I do that as well. To me it is not a problem with GrrM because the Spoiler Chapters that he releases/reads are always near the beginning of the book, so it is just kind of like a preview of things to come. Another thing that I find especially enjoyable about reading his Spoilers is that he frequently changes them as the book progresses so the spoiler you read before release will most likely be significantly different than what is actually published. On top of that, if you read several variations of the spoiler you can get a little "view" into his work and thought process as his book matures. Kind of like watching an artist at work. VERY Enjoyable! At least to me.
  24. Well if she is not going to be broken - then they should have Balefired her ass right then so that Rand could have his hand and eyes back. But I also do not agree with the line of thought that Semi will not be broken. We have already seen that Caddy can intemidate the hell out of prople and that is without an A'dam. We have also seen that Caddy plays by the rules only when it suits her, so I don't see any problem with her using an A'dam very roughly on Semi. We have seen quite a lot of Buildup for Caddy but I am still far from impressed. If we could see some Kick-butt interogation of Semi from Caddy where she really knocks the crap out of her - I would finally "almost" enjoy her typical Pompas Ass AS Character.
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