WoT Premier - Read At Your Own Risk!

[TheMountain]

53 minutes ago, CaddySedai said:

 

It could have been removed but its not a dealbreaker. I now consider the "Winespring Shotgun" to be my new favorite Weave ?

Spoiler

Yeah the "Winespring Shotgun" was awesome ?

 

Edited November 16, 2021 by TheMountain

[DaddyFinn]

So great to see that you enjoyed the episodes @TheMountain ? I'm tempted to read every spoiler here but friday is just around the corner ?

[themann1086]

Ok, now for things I either disliked or had mixed or multiple feelings on.

 

Spoiler

The pacing at the beginning and the end of Episode 1 felt weird. The early part resolves itself and isn't a big deal but the actual leavetaking the episode is named for is incredibly rushed. I don't know how they could have fixed this without messing with the pacing in the rest of the episode, but it still sticks out to me.

Spoiler

Cauthon family: yeah I'm not a fan of the changes to the elder Cauthons. On the other hand, I did feel that Mat felt very Mat-like within that dynamic, and his more vice-like behavior (gambling, petty thievery, etc) actually stems from his noble desire to protect and provide for his sisters. I really loved the scene during Winternight when he realizes they're missing, darts outside and sees the carnage, and steels himself to go be a big hero. You can almost see him think "I'm no bloody hero" right before he does it too. Great acting. I'm hoping that when the narrative returns to the TR we see that the elder Cauthons, shamed/inspired by their son, have turned things around.

Spoiler

Ok, time to talk about the elephant in the room. Perrin and his wife. Hoo boy. So, I don't mind that they created this character for Perrin to be married to. There's also a strain on their relationship or something? They're pretty clearly struggling with something together, which is fine! Even the healthiest relationships will have rough patches. But uh, what that is doesn't get explained and then she gets fridged. This angers me for several reasons. First, it is the year 2021 and we are still killing off women to provide character development for men. Not great! Second, RJ already does this in TSR when he has Whitecloaks kill off Perrin's entire family off screen! They could have repurposed some of them for this! Also does this mean we're going to have a repeat of this dynamic in future seasons? Ugh.

 

Lastly I'm angry that the scene works. It works! We're told in the books that Perrin is always cautious and afraid of hurting others with his strength, and sure ok, but this SHOWS us why he has very good reason to be afraid of himself and what he might do. It gives his arc (assuming it's somewhat similar) a lot more oomph than it otherwise would. Pretty much everyone in the theater gasped. I gasped and I suspected it was coming! Gah!

That's it for now. Maybe more thoughts after a rewatch Thursday night

[CaddySedai]

But as you said. It works. And it works well. 

 

It was a super shocking dramatic moment. lol

 

Annnnd to be fair in WoT women move the world. They run governments, control tribes, have magic powers...

 

Why wouldn't they also be the best character development? lol.

Spoiler

even in death lol

 

Edited November 16, 2021 by CaddySedai

[jeffreycwagner]

What about the level of language?  Did they use book curses or is there a bunch of modern F bombs and such?

 

What about Sex & Nudity?  Safe for family viewing?

 

What about Violence & Gore?

[TheMountain]

2 hours ago, DaddyFinn said:

So great to see that you enjoyed the episodes @TheMountain ? I'm tempted to read every spoiler here but friday is just around the corner ?

Me too ? I was steeling myself for major disappointment, but was very pleasantly surprised instead.

 

I'm not sure if I hid my warning in a spoiler, but my least favorite part was the first 10 minutes. If you're a book purist like me, grit your teeth through the beginning and I suspect you'll get drawn in and thoroughly enjoy the rest.

[themann1086]

15 minutes ago, jeffreycwagner said:

What about the level of language?  Did they use book curses or is there a bunch of modern F bombs and such?

 

What about Sex & Nudity?  Safe for family viewing?

 

What about Violence & Gore?

No F bombs. I do remember either an "ass" or "arse", can't remember which, and a "bastard". Don't remember what else there was.

 

As for sex and nudity,

Spoiler

There's an implied sex scene but it cuts when they start making out and we rejoin them after one of them has finished napping. There's also a bath scene but only a butt is shown briefly

 

For violence and gore,

Spoiler

Episode 1 has the most and some of it is pretty graphic but not Game of Thrones level. 2nd episode has a couple shocking moments but limited gore

Depends on how old and familiar with this type of material the family is

[king of nowhere]

36 minutes ago, TheMountain said:

Me too ? I was steeling myself for major disappointment, but was very pleasantly surprised instead.

 

I'm not sure if I hid my warning in a spoiler, but my least favorite part was the first 10 minutes. If you're a book purist like me, grit your teeth through the beginning and I suspect you'll get drawn in and thoroughly enjoy the rest.

if former skeptics are happy, that's the best endorsment. I've always been cautiously optimistic, but i'm gradually tossing caution to the wind

[TheMountain]

1 hour ago, jeffreycwagner said:

What about the level of language?  Did they use book curses or is there a bunch of modern F bombs and such?

 

What about Sex & Nudity?  Safe for family viewing?

 

What about Violence & Gore?

I vaguely remember one instance of crude innuendo from Mat that felt a bit too modern, but otherwise it was pretty tame.

 

The only instance of explicit nudity:

 

Spoiler

Lan's butt entering a bath with Moraine.

 

Somebody in our audience joked that it was one of the Seven Towers of Malkier ?

 

[Water and shade]

Question to all of those who went to premier i dont put much stock into the rumors surrounding a different dragon. I dont really even care about saidin and saidar changes that much but from the first few episodes did you get the feel that the choice of dragon would change. I think that would be the only real dealbreaker for me. That character is one of the best characters and arks ever in any medium. I really like the casting i just worry if they change that fact or if the actor cant pull off the more mature version of that character that we get in the later books. Cheers and thanks! 

[TheMountain]

13 minutes ago, Water and shade said:

Question to all of those who went to premier i dont put much stock into the rumors surrounding a different dragon. I dont really even care about saidin and saidar changes that much but from the first few episodes did you get the feel that the choice of dragon would change. I think that would be the only real dealbreaker for me. That character is one of the best characters and arks ever in any medium. I really like the casting i just worry if they change that fact or if the actor cant pull off the more mature version of that character that we get in the later books. Cheers and thanks! 

After two episodes? No. Nothing much beyond what we already know and can speculate on from the released teasers and trailers.

[themann1086]

57 minutes ago, Water and shade said:

Question to all of those who went to premier i dont put much stock into the rumors surrounding a different dragon. I dont really even care about saidin and saidar changes that much but from the first few episodes did you get the feel that the choice of dragon would change. I think that would be the only real dealbreaker for me. That character is one of the best characters and arks ever in any medium. I really like the casting i just worry if they change that fact or if the actor cant pull off the more mature version of that character that we get in the later books. Cheers and thanks! 

The biggest praise I have so far is the acting. They really collected an excellent, incredible cast. As for changing the Dragon Reborn, I know they won't do it but they're playing coy with it for new people. If you don't mind some spoilers for the first part of episode 1, click below

Spoiler

Moiraine arrives at the Two Rivers searching for candidates for the DR. We see her initiate a discussion with Nynaeve, the purpose of which is to ascertain her age (we learn she's 26) after which Moiraine pretty clearly dismisses her; from earlier context we know she's looking for someone 20 years old

If you read the books you know who it is. The fun is in how it will be revealed to both the characters and the audience

[Joe B]

11 hours ago, TheMountain said:

You know, Nynaeve is actually the only character I'm not sold on yet. To me, she isn't like in the books at all. She's fierce, but more in a "Momma Bear" way like you said when she feels like her fellow villagers are threatened. Her famous unjustified temper isn't really present and she comes across as calm and cool-headed most of her scenes. Even in the angry ones, she's in control and doesn't say anything that comes across as hot-headed.

I think I read an interview in which Zoe said she liked that the character had control over her emotions. I found it odd.

[TheMountain]

13 minutes ago, Joe B said:

I think I read an interview in which Zoe said she liked that the character had control over her emotions. I found it odd.

Yeah, I really don't find her compelling so far. Nynaeve is a favorite precisely for her horrible but hilarious temper and "everyone around me is an idiot" attitude, in combination with her "good traits."

 

She also doesn't come across as the same kind of person who had a "block" in the books.

Edited November 17, 2021 by TheMountain

[Joe B]

20 minutes ago, TheMountain said:

Yeah, I really don't find her compelling so far. Nynaeve is a favorite precisely for her horrible but hilarious temper and "everyone around me is an idiot" attitude, in combination with her "good traits."

 

She also doesn't come across as the same kind of person who had a "block" in the books.

Spoiler

Do you think she will have a block in the show, or if blocks will even be a thing? I can see them taking it out to avoid confusion with shields.

 

[CaddySedai]

Still. Its clearly not the doom and gloom some predicted. 

 

Hell even @TheMountain enjoyed it. Welcome to the Chosen ? We have punch and pie. 

[TheMountain]

8 minutes ago, Joe B said:

  Hide contents

Do you think she will have a block in the show, or if blocks will even be a thing? I can see them taking it out to avoid confusion with shields.

 

Spoiler

If she has a block in the show, just based on the first two episodes, it probably won't be for the same reason as in the books.

 

7 minutes ago, CaddySedai said:

Still. Its clearly not the doom and gloom some predicted. 

 

Hell even @TheMountain enjoyed it. Welcome to the Chosen ? We have punch and pie. 

Indeed ? I left the screening very happy, and my wife liked it too! She was noncommittal at first, but now we have plans to watch the third episode together this Friday ?

 

One cool thing I noticed at the screening... it was such a diverse group of fans! All ages and genders from all walks of life! I loved it.

[AusLeviathan]

5 hours ago, Water and shade said:

Question to all of those who went to premier i dont put much stock into the rumors surrounding a different dragon.

I always thought the different Dragon idea had no chance of happening and I still believe that it's extremely unlikely because it would require rewriting a significant amount of everything post EOTW.

 

That said, something I read from a person who claimed to have seen the first six episodes (and has been right in their descriptions from what's been confirmed by others) gave me a thought of where they could possibly change the situation with the Dragon whilst still keeping the overall story relatively the same.

 

Completely random theory incoming (spoilers for up to episode 6).

 

Spoiler

Apparently during episode 6 Moiraine and Siuan are discussing who the Dragon could be, even including Nynaeve as a possibility (despite her being too old) simply because of her unusual strength in the One Power. During this discussion they acknowledge a reference in the prophecies to a many headed Dragon but dismiss it.

 

I could see them going with the idea that Lews Therin split his soul on death and that Rand, Mat, Perrin and Egwene all are the Dragon Reborn in a way. They could even use this to tie in their character traits, e.g. Rand gaining Lews Therin's strength in the One Power, Mat's initial memories of battles and the Old Tongue coming from Lews Therin's memories, Perrin's fear of violence and Egwene's ambition would also match up well with Lew Therin.

 

It seems overly complicated of course but it's probably the only way to surprise people about who the Dragon is without needing to rewrite the later books.

 

Edited November 17, 2021 by AusLeviathan

[TheMountain]

4 minutes ago, AusLeviathan said:

I always thought the different Dragon idea had no chance of happening and I still believe that it's extremely unlikely because it would require rewriting a significant amount of everything post EOTW.

 

That said, something I read from a person who claimed to have seen the first six episodes (and has been right in their descriptions from what's been confirmed by others) gave me a thought of where they could possibly change the situation with the Dragon whilst still keeping the overall story relatively the same.

 

Completely random theory incoming (spoilers for up to episode 6).

 

  Hide contents

Apparently during episode 6 Moiraine and Siuan are discussing who the Dragon could be, even including Nynaeve as a possibility (despite her being too old) simply because of her unusual strength in the One Power. During this discussion they acknowledge a reference in the prophecies to a many headed Dragon but dismiss it.

 

I could see them going with the idea that Lews Therin split his soul on death and that Rand, Mat, Perrin and Egwene all are the Dragon Reborn in a way. They could even use this to tie in their character traits, e.g. Rand gaining Lews Therin's strength in the One Power, Mat's initial memories of battles and the Old Tongue coming from Lews Therin's memories, Perrin's fear of violence and Egwene's ambition would also match up well with Lew Therin.

 

It seems overly complicated of course but it's probably the only way to surprise people about who the Dragon is without needing to rewrite the later books.

 

This would probably make me do a hard 180 from my current positive take LOL. I hope this doesn't happen. 

[CaddySedai]

4 minutes ago, TheMountain said:

This would probably make me do a hard 180 from my current positive take LOL. I hope this doesn't happen. 

Hard agree on that being maybe the only thing that would stop me watching. This is The Wheel of Time...

Spoiler

Not Captain Planet. *strikes a pose* Strength! Memories! Fear! Ambition! HEEEEAAAART.... When your powers combine... I am The Dragon Reborn!

 

Though if the pump fake is that Cadsuane is actually the Dragon Reborn... I'd still watch. Ya know... ?

[Guire]

23 minutes ago, CaddySedai said:

Hard agree on that being maybe the only thing that would stop me watching. This is The Wheel of Time...

  Reveal hidden contents

Not Captain Planet. *strikes a pose* Strength! Memories! Fear! Ambition! HEEEEAAAART.... When your powers combine... I am The Dragon Reborn!

 

Though if the pump fake is that Cadsuane is actually the Dragon Reborn... I'd still watch. Ya know... ?

The Dragon on the winds of time. Bela is not the Dragon we want but the Dragon we need. Olver's costuming is very modern also.

Edited November 17, 2021 by Guire
add text

[CaddySedai]

Just now, Guire said:

The Dragon on the winds of time. Bela is not the Dragon we want but the Dragon we need.

Impossible, Bela is the Creator. No double dipping.

[Guire]

Just now, CaddySedai said:

Impossible, Bela is the Creator. No double dipping.

My religion's dogma embraces the trinity as one.  The Creator, the Dragon, and the Holy Horse. 

[AusLeviathan]

22 minutes ago, TheMountain said:

This would probably make me do a hard 180 from my current positive take LOL. I hope this doesn't happen.

 

16 minutes ago, CaddySedai said:

Hard agree on that being maybe the only thing that would stop me watching. This is The Wheel of Time...

I think they're going to end the season controversially for book fans regardless, whether it be what I suggested or something else.

 

They've put so much hype into the "Who is the Dragon Reborn?" question just to tell everyone the answer straight from the books? It seems so unlikely in the current age of subverting expectations and surprising people.

 

Plus they've been really secretive about the last two episodes and the entirely of season 2. We knew much of the first 6 episodes even before we saw the trailers and yet we know almost nothing from episode 7 onward except for a few photos and scenes that come directly from the books.

 

Something made them decide to be more protective of the production and I'm betting on it being a change they don't want revealed until the episode airs.

[CaddySedai]

See, thats where we are going to clash.

 

I believe in the Giant Bigwheel in the sky that shall roll over all reshaping the world in an endless cycle of rebirth.

 

May the tri-wheels be with you. 

 

CaddySedai

First Prime of the Holy Roman Order of the Bigwheel.