tv show spoilers S1E5: Blood Calls Blood

[FanofKnotai]

4 hours ago, Sabio said:

Also Whitecloaks are bullies, if the group is small or looks weak, like the Tinkers, they act.  People who look as if they may give them a fight or such they tend to leave alone or let pass without too much hassle.  

Not true. Bornhold tried to capture the group of 8 with only two of his men when they tried to leave Baerlon. And tried even harder AFTER he saw Moiraine channel. Also, when Egwene, Nynaeve, Elayne, and Verin were taking Mat back to TV after Falme, a small group of WC tried to detain them knowing they were “witches”. The WC are not afraid of a fight because they believe the Light will see them victorious despite any disadvantage. 

[FanofKnotai]

13 minutes ago, Agitel said:

 

Truly, Questioners are known for their balanced, measured, and fair judgment in the books.

 

They traveled with a likely Aes Sedai. They fled from Children of the Light. Who would flee if they had nothing to fear under the Light but darkfriends?

Quote

Truly, Questioners are known for their balanced, measured, and fair judgment in the books

 No, they in fact are not. But neither do they torture unnecessarily. Harass yes. Detain and rough-handle yes. But outright filleting of skin no. I believed the beating of the tinkers. I believed the whole encounter up until the filleting of the skin (and assumptions of her abilities) without cause

[Agitel]

10 minutes ago, FanofKnotai said:

 No, they in fact are not. But neither do they torture unnecessarily. Harass yes. Detain and rough-handle yes. But outright filleting of skin no. I believed the beating of the tinkers. I believed the whole encounter up until the filleting of the skin (and assumptions of her abilities) without cause

 

You're thinking regular Children. Questioners, the "Hand of the Light", are well known in the books to use torture in their questioning of suspected darkfriends to gain confessions.

[Guest Wolfbrother31]

48 minutes ago, LordyLord said:

Since Perrin didnt kill the Whitecloaks, what do you think will be the effect on the Larger story?

 He'll still be blamed because Valda saw his eyes turn yellow & he growled at him. 

 

So I don't think they'll be much change. 

[Guest Wolfbrother31]

14 minutes ago, FanofKnotai said:

No, they in fact are not. But neither do they torture unnecessarily. Harass yes. Detain and rough-handle yes. But outright filleting of skin no. I believed the beating of the tinkers. I believed the whole encounter up until the filleting of the skin (and assumptions of her abilities) without cause

 

Hm. I always read the Questioners as basically being Spanish Inquisitors - using torture to gain confessions - true or not. 

But don't recall now if there's a book entry that backs that. 

[Harad the White]

22 minutes ago, FanofKnotai said:

Truly, Questioners are known for their balanced, measured, and fair judgment in the books

A historical example of this "fair and balanced" judgment is Tomas de Torquemada, the Spanish Dominican friar who headed the Spanish Inquisition. I completely forgot that the WCs were the hero's of WoT.

[king of nowhere]

stepin hit me. Everything made it seem like he maybe could survive, until he suddenly didn't.

but they are setting things up for when it will happen to lan, of course. i should have expected it. good job, setting stuff up for later season; this is real epic fantasy.

 

loial is... very short. yes, i realize it's done for practical reasons, i'm still having a hard time reconciling him with the image in my head. rare thing, for me. i'm sure i will get over it when i see him interact with the others some more. i was waiting for him to explain the ta'veren business, maybe next episode.

[Guest Wolfbrother31]

2 minutes ago, Harad the White said:

I completely forgot that the WCs were the hero's of WoT.

 

I like Galad. I hope we get him in S2. 

[king of nowhere]

oh, i forgot to mention the tua'tahan. when they locked arms and made a human shield against the whitecloaks, i was all "yes! that's them! that's their culture, perfectly represented!"

[Raezold]

13 minutes ago, Wolfbrother31 said:

 

Hm. I always read the Questioners as basically being Spanish Inquisitors - using torture to gain confessions - true or not. 

But don't recall now if there's a book entry that backs that. 

 

There is. Don't ask me where though.
Though all Whitecloaks scenes are some of the worst scenes in this show so far, Valda torturing is actually on point. So no idea why he'd complain about that.

[Guest Wolfbrother31]

2 minutes ago, king of nowhere said:

loial is... very short. yes, i realize it's done for practical reasons, i'm still having a hard time reconciling him with the image in my head. rare thing, for me. i'm sure i will get over it when i see him interact with the others some more. i was waiting for him to explain the ta'veren business, maybe next episode.

 

I do think that thus far, the casting and the acting have been top notch. And I agree that, Matt, especially is legit. Sad he's gone next season. 

I think some of the CGI stuff will improve. 

 

My main concern is the writing & some over all direction. 

 

But, something that hasn't been mentioned that I, actually, really appreciate so far (that makes WoT - in my opinion, even this WoT, better than GoT) is that they are NOT shoving gratuitous nudity and sex in our faces. 

 

Though I was very uncomfortable for Maddy as the Nazi WC's scrubbed her down. 

[Harad the White]

2 minutes ago, Wolfbrother31 said:

 

I like Galad. I hope we get him in S2. 

And as you know the Questioners wrt to the WC, were the Inquisitors wrt to the otherwise tolerant Church.

[Joe B]

I seriously thought Stepin was on his way to kill Logain and Lan was racing to stop him. 

[Harad the White]

1 minute ago, Wolfbrother31 said:

makes WoT - in my opinion, even this WoT, better than GoT) is that they are NOT shoving gratuitous nudity and sex in our faces. 

In defense of gratuitous nudity...hey it happens irl. No one talks about gratuitous torture and violence.

[Guest Wolfbrother31]

Just now, Joe B said:

I seriously thought Stepin was on his way to kill Logain and Lan was racing to stop him. 

 

I thought that TOO! And THAT would have been a much better (though still not WoT) plot.

[Guest Wolfbrother31]

2 minutes ago, Harad the White said:

In defense of gratuitous nudity...hey it happens irl. No one talks about gratuitous torture and violence.

 

There's a lot of stuff that happens all the time that still isn't appreciated to be seen as entertainment.

 

And you're not wrong - perhaps we're just so desensitized to violence as well - could be subtler about a lot of things! 

 

But I appreciate the way they're doing it on the show so far (though I would have done without the Trolloc eating the wounded Trolloc scene too) ... There you go - a complaint about gore ?

[FanofKnotai]

17 hours ago, Skipp said:

Personally I rate the episode right in the middle, better than 1 and 2, worse than 3 and 4.  Ultimately I really enjoyed slowing the pace down a bit.  I loved all the nods to the books.

 

Loial, while not looking anything like I pictured was fantastic.  They have kept him practical but making him look quite different than humans.  The actor portrayed him brilliantly and I loved that he just kept on talking while Nynaeve talks with Rand.  He was so proud of himself for finding Egwene in the Tower gardens where Rand thought she might be.

 

The Egwene, Perrin and Valda scenes were also top notch.  I'm glad Perrin finally got to confess to someone.  Valda is still chewing the scenery and I love it.  The wolf attack was a little subpar but I understand that it can be difficult to make look better.  It is hard to train dogs to "attack" playfully.

 

So happy we got a mention of the forsaken finally.  I only spied 8 statues, I posted a Picture of them in the Forsaken thread.  Made my assumptions as to which each represented.

 

Also someone pointed out to me that Padan Fain was in TV for 2 different scenes following Mat and Rand.  9:36/37(on the left in a doorway) and 20:27(sitting in the doorway below the balcony) I think.  Bloody beautiful and I can't believe I didn't spot him myself.

Pagan Fain can also be heard whistling in episode two right before Mat decides to explore Shadar Logoth. It’s the same song in this episode (5)

[Harad the White]

2 minutes ago, Wolfbrother31 said:

There you go - a complaint about gore ?

Sorry but I will never equate the two, irl or on the screen.

[king of nowhere]

regarding valda, i suspect if he has a ter'angreal like the one mat gets? he thought egwene could channel, and he was provoking her into channeling. what kind of madmen would do that? what kind of madmen would do that with 7 aes sedai, and be still alive at the end?

maybe he can taunt aes sedai like that because he's got his little secret?

otherwise, i have a hard time making sense of his behavior.

[Harad the White]

2 minutes ago, FanofKnotai said:

Pagan Fain can also be heard whistling in episode two right before Mat decides to explore Shadar Logoth. It’s the same song in this episode (5)

That's new. I thought he was religious! ? But good catch. A big complaint in episode 1 was that they downplayed PF. Just building him up in a subtle and satisfying way.

[JaimAybara]

Good 1) I really liked how they incorporate the importance of hands and how some say they aren’t needed. Made sense and wasn’t explained in a way where you would think characters should already know. 

 

Good 2) Loved Perrin in this episode. Some may disagree but I liked it. The growl and him almost getting bigger and more menacing when he stood, more lithe, I really enjoyed that. I think there is a werewolf misdirect too. This is good. 
 

Good 3) Not making Egwene OP. Now we will get a true developmental journey. Made it feel like training is required and she will get better over time.
 

Good 4) I liked Loial. I really did. When he was talking over them as if they were not having a side conversation had me chuckling. Also not mad about how tall he is. Filling pockets full of books. Nice touch. *felt implied when he was getting his things together*.
 

Good/spittin straight fire 4) the prophesies being introduced. I wanted this. Now I have it. Thank you! 
 

Good 5) Valda, the actor for this character really impresses me. 

 

okay now the bad and it’s really just one for me, the good outweighs the bad: 

 

Bad 1) Lan. Just, no. He is stoic. Let him be stoic. Some may like it the way they went and I’m happy for you if you did. I didn’t. I liked the ritual, the ceremony, etc. just not centered on Lan and his emotions. Also, make him more competent. I’d like to see him school Rand a few times in the training yard or something. 

 

____________________________
 

Side Question neither good/or bad just curious: is Jain Farstrider a woman now? Or did Rand just imply that Egwene would pretend to be him? 
 

 

Edited December 3, 2021 by JaimAybara

[Harad the White]

2 minutes ago, JaimAybara said:

Good 4) I liked Loial. I really did. When he was talking over them as if they were not having a side conversation had me chuckling. Also not mad about how tall he is. Filling pockets full of books. Nice touch. 

Agreed. Just wonder what it would take to do both: achieve what you said plus make him 50% bigger. How is he going to mow down bad-guys like in the book?  Did the venues in the book there have big doors and high ceilings? Was Loial always stooping to leave/enter rooms? I sorta remember that.

 

Someone above mentioned perspective tricks with cameras to make him look even larger. Not sure that is enough to sustain the illusion. In LoTR they solved the opposite problem with Gimli. Wonder why the Loial problem is inherently more difficult.

[RhienneAgain]

Just watched after reading all the comments. I was actually quite pleasantly surprised as I felt the general reaction to this episode was quite negative but it was possibly my favourite episode so far (although that isn't saying a great deal as I'm not terribly impressed with the adaption).

 

A few thoughts:

 

- I read comments earlier on about whether Logain could still sense Rand's ability to channel even though be was gentled. I assumed his (flawlessly acted) maniacal laughing was because he could see Rand (and Mat) were strong ta'veren (don't think that skill is linked to channeling?).

 

- acting continues to be fine to great but the writing is what's letting the show down for me.

 

- I'm clearly in a minority but I thought the wolfdog attack looked ok.

 

- would Moiraine have been able to sense through the bond that Lan had been drugged? Can't honestly remember if this is covered in the books - maybe some precedent linked to forkroot tea but I can't recall.

 

- goodness, Lan is grim. I feel for the actor who is fine. It must be a nightmare for Henney if he's read the books trying to act like book Lan but given material that is so clearly aimed at creating a totally different character.

 

- the inclusion of Alanna's warders' sexuality felt really forced (again).

 

- transferring Nynaeve's first channeling from Healing Egwene of breakbone fever to Healing Lan made me sad. A little detail but I don't understand why they changed it.

 

- Loial was adorable.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Reader]

7 minutes ago, JaimAybara said:

Side Question neither good/or bad just curious: is Jain Farstrider a woman now? Or did Rand just imply that Egwene would pretend to be him?

Yes, Jain Farstrider is a woman now, but Birgitte is actually Ihvon, so it all balances out ok.

[JaimAybara]

15 minutes ago, Harad the White said:

Agreed. Just wonder what it would take to do both: achieve what you said plus make him 50% bigger. How is he going to mow down bad-guys like in the book?  Did the venues in the book there have big doors and high ceilings? Was Loial always stooping to leave/enter rooms? I sorta remember that.

 

Someone above mentioned perspective tricks with cameras to make him look even larger. Not sure that is enough to sustain the illusion. In LoTR they solved the opposite problem with Gimli. Wonder why the Loial problem is inherently more difficult.

If they do I will be super happy, if not that’s okay. I really like the look. And I love his demeanor. I think the demeanor shift will be quite significant for battles. What I reallllllly want is him losing his mind protecting the kids in Tear. I want Loial fighting tooth and nail to save the kiddos. That would be a wonderful scene if it makes it to screen.

Edited December 3, 2021 by JaimAybara
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