The Founding of Quahog (Peter's Progress) Mafia - Game Over

[Verbal32]

*is

[Verbal32]

 

I'm not mad, I'm just not enjoying the game.

 

 

Talk to me, Ben.  What aren't you enjoying? 

[Verbal32]

I mean, you have 3 viable options here:

 

(1) Follow my lead and we lynch the scum team and revel in our victory.

 

(2) Follow my lead.......straight over the cliff and we're all dead.

 

(3) Verbal, you're an idiot and we should do (4) instead.

 

 

 

What is your choice and why is it (3) ?

 

 

 

 

 

What's not to enjoy?!  ;-)

[BFG]

Ugh

[BFG]

^ if above it true, scum team is within Shad/Clov/BFG

 

 

:-)

Lol I was actually hoping it was a cop claim

[BFG]

Ugh

Incidentally this is unrelated to verbs posting :p

[Verbal32]

 

Ugh

Incidentally this is unrelated to verbs posting :p

 

 

I thought I may have accidentally given you indigestion or something.

 

I have that effect, sometimes.....I won't take it personally.

 

 

 

 

Much.  ;-)

[BFG]

Lol, why do you think Ben's town?

[Shad_]

^ if above it true, scum team is within Shad/Clov/BFG

 

 

:-)

I really don't know if I can take this seriously Boo

[Shad_]

I mean I know you all think I'm the greatest Werewolf player in the history of human kind and all the Champs winners wet their panties at the sound of my name, but I've actually got one of the worst win %s on DM and anyone seriously sussing me at this point is either a coward or a wolf.

[Gentled Ben]

 

 

I'm not mad, I'm just not enjoying the game.

 

 

Talk to me, Ben.  What aren't you enjoying? 

 

The long, long, long, long, long conversations between Shad/Clov about BFG that are largely over my head/make little sense to me, the long, long, long, long, long conversations between BFG and Clov about BFG that are largely over my head/make little sense to me, the fact that I'm the only one who thinks Shad is scum, not having really good reads on anybody, feeling generally drained by the game as it goes on. After wading through Shad and Clov last night, trying and failing to follow their long ramblings only to wake up to people today complaining that I'm not in the thread and so might be a wolf, I just don't have much gas left in my tank.

 

Sure, I'll sheep you. I don't really care much at this point. If you're a wolf, at least you've been an easy one to keep up with, and if you're town, maybe we'll get a wolf before they NK you. You go find the wolves, and I'll vote for them with you.

[Verbal32]

Question:

 

Lol, why do you think Ben's town?

 

 

 

 

 

Answer:

 

 

 

 

I'm not mad, I'm just not enjoying the game.

 

 

Talk to me, Ben.  What aren't you enjoying? 

 

The long, long, long, long, long conversations between Shad/Clov about BFG that are largely over my head/make little sense to me, the long, long, long, long, long conversations between BFG and Clov about BFG that are largely over my head/make little sense to me, the fact that I'm the only one who thinks Shad is scum, not having really good reads on anybody, feeling generally drained by the game as it goes on. After wading through Shad and Clov last night, trying and failing to follow their long ramblings only to wake up to people today complaining that I'm not in the thread and so might be a wolf, I just don't have much gas left in my tank.

 

Sure, I'll sheep you. I don't really care much at this point. If you're a wolf, at least you've been an easy one to keep up with, and if you're town, maybe we'll get a wolf before they NK you. You go find the wolves, and I'll vote for them with you.

 

[Verbal32]

Lol, why do you think Ben's town?

 

This is twice that Ben has used AtE in this day phase.  AtE in itself is not really alignment indicative, but again.....the way people are using techniques is what gives me the read.

 

 

The way Tiink uses wagonomics, the way Ben uses AtE.  I've made reads my whole mafia "career" on these types of posts, and while I've been wrong plenty.....I've been right more often on them, so I'll stick with it.

[Turin Turambar]

Verb, make your best two cases on your three suspects. Today is town's last chance.

[Shad_]

And on that note, in response to Clovdyx's comment that I have not moved off of Shad despite the fact that he will never be lynched this game, So what? I'm not going to call him town if I think he's a wolf, and if I'm wrong, and I'm tunneling on a townie that is obvious to the rest of the game, again, so what? It is not the first time I have been wrong, nor will it be the last, and I have already seen as bad and worse reads/tunnels from other, more experienced mafia players. That is just part of the nature of the game. In this game, either I am wrong, or I am the only one who guessed him correctly, and either way, the result will be the same--he will last at the very least until there are only three players, assuming the game goes that far. 

 

As the game goes on though, you all might want to question why the consensus town read, who is also the most active poster in the game, is still alive,

 

1) The reason why bold red matters is because villagers want to win, and scum have to pretend that they want villagers to win, so when it is pretty much impossible for a player to be scum, villagers and wolves alike let everyone know it.  Wolves can level a bit--it's what BFG is doing if she's scum--but they run the risk of drawing a great deal of attention for it for having reads that make no sense and are not based upon a rational assessment of the game.  Basically lynching me is an absolutely terrible, awful idea for the same reason that lynching Sooh when everyone who knows Sooh said she was beyond obviously a villager would have been an absolutely terrible, awful idea.

 

2) If you are town, scum pretty much never kill either of us because you have made it clear that the first five pages of content were sufficient to lock in your reads and they are wrong. I'm pretty confident that even if someone claimed a green peek on me you would call me a Godfather and carry on. Decent chance the game is already lost because of this.  Moreover, due to the lovers mechanics there is a decent chance that there will only ever be two night kills in this game regardless of who wins, meaning that the chances of me getting night killed were always incredibly more dependent on my PR equity than my play.

[Shad_]

tl;dr: if you're town you're doing that thing you did in Tennis mafia again and it was a bad idea there too

 

I recognize you're new and fiercely independent so I can't fault you for it in the short term, but if you would like to increase your chances of winning games dramatically it would be to your advantage to heed some players' advice.  Even if they are wolves, they won't steer you wrong really, because there are villagers watch them who will call them out if they try to.

[Verbal32]

 

^ if above it true, scum team is within Shad/Clov/BFG

 

 

:-)

I really don't know if I can take this seriously Boo

 

 

 

I mean I know you all think I'm the greatest Werewolf player in the history of human kind and all the Champs winners wet their panties at the sound of my name, but I've actually got one of the worst win %s on DM and anyone seriously sussing me at this point is either a coward or a wolf.

 

 

Listen broseph, I don't even wear panties, so there!  I don't care about win %, it doesn't mean much.  Being a solid townie and having your "teammates" tank the game for you is something you can't always control.

 

And take it seriously, that is my solve.  If you're town, then the others are the scum team, IMO.

 

 

Here's the big question:  if you are town, why aren't you jumping at the potential solve of BFG/Clov?  Didn't you even mention it before (somebody did)?  Why not question my town reads and make sure you agree, and we mechanically lock this game?

 

Why aren't you doing that?

[Clovdyx]

 

Why Tiinker?

 

Because of how he analyzed the wagons.  I'm also a big fan of wagonomics, and I use it all the time.  I also happen to loathe the No Lynch under almost all conditions, and it's more than he used wagonomics....but the way he used it, shows me that he's coming from a townie POV.  If not, then he's identified an amazing way to completely fool me, and I'm ok with that.

 

 

Can you show what you mean here?  

 

Because this seems like incredibly weak reasoning, and while I realize you weren't around over the weekend, I can't help but think it's not that much of a coincidence you're just now bringing it up that Tink seems to be one of the most likely lynch candidates.

[Shad_]

Here's the big question:  if you are town, why aren't you jumping at the potential solve of BFG/Clov?  Didn't you even mention it before (somebody did)?  Why not question my town reads and make sure you agree, and we mechanically lock this game?

 

Why aren't you doing that?

I actually dropped the possibility of a Clov/BFG scum team about 428958935 times in this thread before anyone else was willing to humor it.

 

And I chatted with both of them for about 348954895 pages and concluded that it was still possible but I needed to step back and direct my attention elsewhere.

 

And then I evaluated Tiink and he looked bad.

[Turin Turambar]

Ben, if Shad is a wolf, who is his partner? I ask because if you are town and you doubt you will get him lynched then the best thing you can do for town is try to find and lynch his partner.

 

Who knows? It might even link back to him.

[Shad_]

Beyond that, I'm cooking dinner and responded to the things I noticed on p54 that I noticed at a glance that were directly related to me. If you think I am ignoring the rest of that page because I haven't commented on most of it yet, ??? Do I strike you as someone who has been avoiding the thread in this game?

[Clovdyx]

 

 

 

I'm not mad, I'm just not enjoying the game.

 

 

Talk to me, Ben.  What aren't you enjoying? 

 

The long, long, long, long, long conversations between Shad/Clov about BFG that are largely over my head/make little sense to me, the long, long, long, long, long conversations between BFG and Clov about BFG that are largely over my head/make little sense to me, the fact that I'm the only one who thinks Shad is scum, not having really good reads on anybody, feeling generally drained by the game as it goes on. After wading through Shad and Clov last night, trying and failing to follow their long ramblings only to wake up to people today complaining that I'm not in the thread and so might be a wolf, I just don't have much gas left in my tank.

 

Sure, I'll sheep you. I don't really care much at this point. If you're a wolf, at least you've been an easy one to keep up with, and if you're town, maybe we'll get a wolf before they NK you. You go find the wolves, and I'll vote for them with you.

 

 

Just so we're clear....

 

1) You're going all in that Verb is town

2) You're going all in that he's right about Tink

 

Is this just because you're not feeling the game anymore, or do you actually read these players this way?  

[Clovdyx]

Listen broseph, I don't even wear panties, so there!  I don't care about win %, it doesn't mean much.  Being a solid townie and having your "teammates" tank the game for you is something you can't always control.

 

And take it seriously, that is my solve.  If you're town, then the others are the scum team, IMO.

 

 

Here's the big question:  if you are town, why aren't you jumping at the potential solve of BFG/Clov?  Didn't you even mention it before (somebody did)?  Why not question my town reads and make sure you agree, and we mechanically lock this game?

 

Why aren't you doing that?

 

 

So which one do you think is the townie?

[Verbal32]

 

 

 

Vote Count

Shad_ - 1 - Gentled Ben
Turin Turambar - 1 - Tiinker
Tiinker - 1 - Turin Turambar
Darthe - 2 - Sooh, Shad_
No Lynch - 1 - BFG

5 to lynch

Deadline in 4 minutes

 
 Trying to make sense of this lynch is not easy. I feel like it gives us such useless information. I can't even blame Shad for the outcome because a random lynch between 4 targets with one person on each train would be soo bad. I'm wariest of Verb and Clov for not voting and BFG for voting no lynch which imo is a bad play almost always unless you're near end game. The way that whole thing progressed just made it look like scum were just waiting around rather than actually trying to do anything.

 

 
 

Zero chance Ben and Shad are scum together imo. If Ben removes his vote from Shad then Shad doesn't have to stick his neck out last minute and vote Darthe in that way. They could've just let it go to random between myself, Turin, and Darthe. It's one or the other.

 
 

 

 

Not voting: Verbal, Darthe, Clov.
 
Trying to make sense of this lynch is not easy. I feel like it gives us such useless information. I can't even blame Shad for the outcome because a random lynch between 4 targets with one person on each train would be soo bad. I'm wariest of Verb and Clov for not voting and BFG for voting no lynch which imo is a bad play almost always unless you're near end game. The way that whole thing progressed just made it look like scum were just waiting around rather than actually trying to do anything.

 
I feel highly confident saying that would have never happened in that scenario.  
 
I "understand" your concerns about me, but Verb wasn't around for like a day.  I don't think I've seen him playing on weekends in the two and a half years I've been on the site.  I would be a hell of a lot more concerned about him if he had shown up to participate.  Not sure I understand the point about BFG.  What does Mafia!BFG gain by voting no lynch over picking a wagon or just abstaining all together?

 

 
No lynch is only good for mafia here and she provides it as another option. To top if off she only bothers to vote 10 minutes before deadline? Is that right? It's a way of pretending to contribute.

 

 
 

 

Alright, I feel better about the Darthe vote and thinking it's funny afterwards.

 

@ Ben if you are town you need to start the readjustment now, because I don't intend for us to lose this game over a nearly-intro-phase tunnel. Ask me what you need to ask me and let's walk through it and get your head back on the right track. I don't want to hear a bunch of "I can't trust anything you say because wolves can say anything" crap. That's not really how Mafia works and everyone has a limit to their scum range; that's why players get to be as good as confirmed villagers before there are any flips on the table. See: Sooh. If you have any intention of voting me in this game in the future, talk to me until you don't.

Okay, let's start with why townShad would begin that way. Go.

 

Still not feeling better about this, though.
 

 

I have. I thought this phase had ended with Sooh's flip. Are we still on Night, then?

 
No, it's day phase.Turin claimed exactly what Shad said he did, and for exactly the reasons Shad said, I'm not sure there's any benefit to really questioning Turin.  Your question to him made me wonder if you didn't see the claim or if you did and had some reason to believe he was still worth checking out today.

 

Then why didn't he die? He said he would commit suicide at the end of the phase. The phase ended. He's still here, apparently with a D2 pass, and he didn't even post a gif to "earn" it.
 

 

Vote Count

Shad_ - 1 - Gentled Ben
Turin Turambar - 1 - Tiinker
Tiinker - 1 - Turin Turambar
Darthe - 2 - Sooh, Shad_
No Lynch - 1 - BFG

5 to lynch

Deadline in 4 minutes

 
 
Not voting: Verbal, Darthe, Clov.
 
Trying to make sense of this lynch is not easy. I feel like it gives us such useless information. I can't even blame Shad for the outcome because a random lynch between 4 targets with one person on each train would be soo bad.I'm wariest of Verb and Clov for not voting and BFG for voting no lynch which imo is a bad play almost always unless you're near end game. The way that whole thing progressed just made it look like scum were just waiting around rather than actually trying to do anything.

 

Yes, this is a good point.
 

 

If BFG's a wolf then the wagonomics kind of go out the window, because she only voted No Lynch after the Darthe lynch was secured.

 
This is also just such a weird play. I might say that it's potentially her just trying to look like she's contributing somehow but having no lynch on the table that round just provides another good alternative for scum? It doesn't make any sense.
 
 

No, she's my strongest town read, and it's still fairly light. This is a tough game so far.

 
That is really odd to me. Has this changed?

 

IRT bolded: If she was scum, why wouldn't she vote for another town and tie the trains with two town wagons? Surely there was a townie with a vote on them. She could have ensured that a townie died without piling onto Darthe or drawing attention to herself with a no lynch vote. It seems like an odd play to make as scum, especially when I was the only one giving her a town lean at the time. Why do something bold, and strange if you're scum, and all but one player suspect you of being scum? Then, she is right out front for awhile engaging in RT discussions with Chris. 
 
So no, it hasn't really changed, but it is not much of a town lean.

 

 
Because if she's going to vote for town she'd have to build a case at least and as far as I can remember she wasn't skeptical of myself, Turin or Shad. I think her coming out and voting one of us over the AFK Darthe to tie trains would've looked super weird.

 

 
 

 

 

 

 

Alright, I feel better about the Darthe vote and thinking it's funny afterwards.

 

@ Ben if you are town you need to start the readjustment now, because I don't intend for us to lose this game over a nearly-intro-phase tunnel. Ask me what you need to ask me and let's walk through it and get your head back on the right track. I don't want to hear a bunch of "I can't trust anything you say because wolves can say anything" crap. That's not really how Mafia works and everyone has a limit to their scum range; that's why players get to be as good as confirmed villagers before there are any flips on the table. See: Sooh. If you have any intention of voting me in this game in the future, talk to me until you don't.

Okay, let's start with why townShad would begin that way. Go.

 

Still not feeling better about this, though.
 

 

I have. I thought this phase had ended with Sooh's flip. Are we still on Night, then?

 
No, it's day phase.Turin claimed exactly what Shad said he did, and for exactly the reasons Shad said, I'm not sure there's any benefit to really questioning Turin.  Your question to him made me wonder if you didn't see the claim or if you did and had some reason to believe he was still worth checking out today.

 

Then why didn't he die? He said he would commit suicide at the end of the phase. The phase ended. He's still here, apparently with a D2 pass, and he didn't even post a gif to "earn" it.
 

 

Vote Count

Shad_ - 1 - Gentled Ben
Turin Turambar - 1 - Tiinker
Tiinker - 1 - Turin Turambar
Darthe - 2 - Sooh, Shad_
No Lynch - 1 - BFG

5 to lynch

Deadline in 4 minutes

 
 
Not voting: Verbal, Darthe, Clov.
 
Trying to make sense of this lynch is not easy. I feel like it gives us such useless information. I can't even blame Shad for the outcome because a random lynch between 4 targets with one person on each train would be soo bad.I'm wariest of Verb and Clov for not voting and BFG for voting no lynch which imo is a bad play almost always unless you're near end game. The way that whole thing progressed just made it look like scum were just waiting around rather than actually trying to do anything.

 

Yes, this is a good point.
 

 

If BFG's a wolf then the wagonomics kind of go out the window, because she only voted No Lynch after the Darthe lynch was secured.

 
This is also just such a weird play. I might say that it's potentially her just trying to look like she's contributing somehow but having no lynch on the table that round just provides another good alternative for scum? It doesn't make any sense.
 
 

No, she's my strongest town read, and it's still fairly light. This is a tough game so far.

 
That is really odd to me. Has this changed?

 

IRT bolded: If she was scum, why wouldn't she vote for another town and tie the trains with two town wagons? Surely there was a townie with a vote on them. She could have ensured that a townie died without piling onto Darthe or drawing attention to herself with a no lynch vote. It seems like an odd play to make as scum, especially when I was the only one giving her a town lean at the time. Why do something bold, and strange if you're scum, and all but one player suspect you of being scum? Then, she is right out front for awhile engaging in RT discussions with Chris. 
 
So no, it hasn't really changed, but it is not much of a town lean.

 

Because if she's going to vote for town she'd have to build a case at least and as far as I can remember she wasn't skeptical of myself, Turin or Shad. I think her coming out and voting one of us over the AFK Darthe to tie trains would've looked super weird.

 

Then at the very least, she could have simply not voted, especially after she suggested it, and no one wanted to join her. Why stick out like that as a wolf? Is it really that hard to throw a vote on you, seeing as you hadn't been much more present than Darthe? I don't remember her giving you a town read prior to that.

 

 
In my previous post I mentioned that the people who I was most wary of were the people who did not vote because it looked like scum were just waiting for town to screw themselves. I feel like her not doing anything could've come across just as sketchy seeing as she was participating in the thread. I might be tunneling a bit too hard here but I still favour my view right now.

 

 

 
As a townie, these are the things going through my mind when I caught up and read EOD.  These are the wagonomics questions that come from a townie POV - they came from mine, and I'm town so.....
 
This is why I asked Tiinker to provide this info and he pointed me to the exact page it was on.  I was trying to follow his process and see if I arrived at the same conclusions.  I did.

[Verbal32]

 

Here's the big question:  if you are town, why aren't you jumping at the potential solve of BFG/Clov?  Didn't you even mention it before (somebody did)?  Why not question my town reads and make sure you agree, and we mechanically lock this game?

 

Why aren't you doing that?

I actually dropped the possibility of a Clov/BFG scum team about 428958935 times in this thread before anyone else was willing to humor it.

 

And I chatted with both of them for about 348954895 pages and concluded that it was still possible but I needed to step back and direct my attention elsewhere.

 

And then I evaluated Tiink and he looked bad.

 

 

I'm picking up on your sarcasm, heh.  So I was right, it was you that mentioned it.  I'm willing to humor it.

 

 

 

 

Beyond that, I'm cooking dinner and responded to the things I noticed on p54 that I noticed at a glance that were directly related to me. If you think I am ignoring the rest of that page because I haven't commented on most of it yet, ??? Do I strike you as someone who has been avoiding the thread in this game?

 

I never said you were avoiding the thread.  You're the top poster, and have been closely involved in every aspect - I'm not saying otherwise.  I am merely wondering why you decided to joke about whether you could take my post seriously instead of either excitement that if you worked it out with me and agreed, we have the game locked.....or anger that I'm a dumbass and about to tank the game.  Instead you chose to make a joke and proceed to start posting @ Ben instead.  I'm just curious, that's all.  :-)