I'd say 2, we are all about balance. Would it be cheating to peek with a spell? Feels a bit wolfy to me, lol.

Also don't like the tig-dice-DPR dynamic. At EoD, Dice and DPR were trolling Rand something awful, then next day DPR pops up with Dice is definitely mafia. Tig also drops everything (in - game) to state how incredibly wolfy Rand is, yet now is arguing about WIFOM, bpv, PRs and absolutely nothing of content to make it seem like her and DPR are definitely not singing from the same hymnsheet. If only Rand didn't give such a bad vibe off with his obsession with Dice. But the thread stinks. I would be hugely surprised if the wolves are slanking it this time. Definitely feels like they are active, and after whatever happened last night, probably aren't that happy either.

This worries me. This seems like a huge misrep, but if it is why has no one else commented? Yes, from a Dice life expectancy pov, it is delaying the inevitable, but from a mafia team pov, it keeps a PR on the game for potentially at least two nights. It fishes for the cop - take for instance if I was the cop experiencing my first ever false claim with two minutes to make a decision, or indeed a whole day with no one to talk to about it? It kills a townie, it invalidates any town peeks the real cop gets so long as the GF is out there... It doesn't buy me much seems like such an understatement, not even counting all this WIFOM. It worries me as I'm getting town vibes off Dice, which in itself is slightly worrying as town Dice underpressure is not this polite in my experience. Hate it. I feel Dice is town, but I don't think he is acting it. FML.

I'm still chewing over a lot. I really feel I'm missing something in turin/Verb rand/dice rand/DPR key+dice ithi+dice nyn/tig ed/DPR... Don't see a pattern forming. The only player I felt good about was Marsh and he was trying to kill me and you guys killed him anyway. Will sleep in it and post in the morning. Would be great if Lenlo and tig and Ed had popped in by then, but if not I'll see what I can do. At the moment DPR is my top wolf read. Because of Marsh. Because of his deflections. Because of his anti-town rhetoric. Though he did call my reasoning amazing so there is that. Top town read... Verb, maybe? By virtue of you all being more suspicious than the line up in the usual suspects. Maybe Nyn, but cannot help feel she is playing behind her questions that she never seems to do much with the answers to. Ithi at a push but I don't like her vibe and I don't like how she ignored 99% of D1 to lynch a townie. But in all honesty I've not liked much about this game at all so far. Y'all too sus or too clever for me.

I get a bad feeling off this defense of Dice without, well, anything. Surely this whole post says exactly nothing on whether Dice is or is not fake claiming? I don't have a clue either but I can state it a bit more succinctly than that. So don't like how this day is shaping up. It seems each hour I am less certain of anything. Why can my top town read not act townie? So unfair.

I'm not sure if showing implied physical intimacy is a worse way of having a relationship in story than Min telling people they are going to fall in love. So better be doing that then, love of my life I've never met before.

Bah, might make sense if you follow the quote to see quotes in it. Or you could have a look at Darthe's activity like I did, that would work too.

@DPR that quote was for your perusal.

Because Stone Cold says so. Or Darthe, I forget which.

The condemner randomly picks someone as a night action, no need to lynch.

Dude, this is the one post of mine you don't respond to with a sarcky meme? Wow, I suddenly feel so included 😄 This whole thing is sketching me out big time. I'm missing something, I know I am. Everytime it seems you guys are splitting into opposing camps it stops. Cause of course the wolves are never going to openly be a group. The only things I have concrete are DPR lied about Marsh's "slip", Ithi feels unhelpful, and I wish Dice hadn't claimed. And to be fair I'm not certain on two of those.

Though I suppose they would to stop him getting a red peek. Boo.

Wait. So if Dice was the hider, false claims cop then the mafia could have just wasted their Strongarm on an empty space, if they did not roleblock him? Have three players appeared grumpy today by any chance? It seems a bit complicated but lol.

But not the characters within it, and the whole point is about the Shadow influencing things. If they could just stand up and take over everything there would not be much of a story going on, imho. Elaida ties herself to the Andor line to help the Light, she takes over the Tower to help the Light, even all the nonsense about building a second higher Amyrlin's Tower is on some level about putting things the way they are meant to be, to help the Light. Making her just Alviarin's +1 at the party undermines all of that and makes Alviarin completely extraneous. It would be akin to making the Children of the Light just all be Darkfriends to make things easier to understand.

Another question: Tig and Nyn had diametrically opposite reactions to end of day. Tig thought Rand was scammy as could possibly be, Nyn thought Rand was totally consistent with being Town. Are these both valid opinions, and why has no one bothered either of them for their reasoning? Are they just flying under the radar or is that the whole fake, not fake claim thing is actually a pretense for all this antagonism? I kind of feel no one is going to answer this for multiple reasons but mostly as it has no easy answer if one at all. But it is bugging me so maybe someone can answer.

Wasn't a lot of your suspicion of Verb based on him avoiding voting for me? So if I was Town would that not lessen your suspicion of Verb?

Can I just ask, and this is a just question - I'm not Shad that can solve the game from only reading the D1 VC - but does anyone else get a strong emotional disconnect from Town and DPR in these two comments. Irritatingly I've had this pingpingpingpingpingping feeling before, but I don't remember if it was accurate. I think it was though....

Just pointing out Rand, the quote you had was talking about TOWNDice false claiming, but you have answered about MAFIADice false claiming.

Fatigue seems manageable, so I would just go for it. I wouldn't be surprised if Soul Veil found something so open to that as well. I think we should keep Nyra safe as long as she is so ickle. Question: must everything that has a name ending in "a" be female? Is it a law somewhere? Did we have a meeting at some point? Well, probably the Latin peoples did, or even PIE? I wonder how far back it goes...

Yeah, I just cannot be dealing with inconsistent players. They just ruin it for everyone else.

Just as well I don't have any personal feelings then. From your previous interactions with Rand, I was getting the feeling that you were supporting Dice as the Cop making a valid claim, and that Rand was being scummy in response. Does not the way that anyone looks at Rand's response switch diametrically if we assume Dice is mafia false claiming or actually the cop? Because Rand as mafia would know if Dice is false claiming or not, and would presumably be in on it. So you're saying that your interaction with Rand was regardless of whether Dice's claim was real or not? That seems difficult for me to process - surely that would have a huge impact on people's expectations? You have really upset my applecart of thoughts regarding this game just when I was getting it in order. So mean. Must be a wolf really, lol.

Obviously people died young and unexpectedly. But looking at average life expectancy can be misleading - as in a time of extremely high infant mortality, anyone surviving childhood was likely to live well past the mean age - due to mode, or er, median, or something, cannot be bother to look it up, lol. If everyone was dying in their early thirties, how would such a thing as the Triarii in the Roman army exist where a good third of the army was made up of veterans who I cannot find quickly a source on how old they were - I had thought 40 and above but taking a number off the top of my head is hardly much evidence. Something which is perhaps more telling is that a leading cause of death in Ancient Egypt were teeth abscesses as everyone had to eat bread, and Egyptians had not only grindstone grit to deal with by a high volume of fine particulate sand, which resulted in abnormally quick tooth wear. Ramses II was insane from the pain from his teeth and high on opiates for the last decades of his 92 years on this planet. I'm not saying any of this disproves what you say, but I think the picture is incredibly complex and not something that we modern people can understand, either in how fragile and disposable life was in those days as you point out, but also how tough those that survived it were.

This feels like an about face (though that could just be me) - or does this not affect your spat with Rand. If you think Dice is mafia, does that change your view on Rand's alignment?

Hope he recovers quickly. Re: your last point, I'm not going to promise something I cannot deliver. But I'll try to play nice 🙂

I'm processing a lot of information at the moment - not sure I really want to try and crunch it all down to one list at this point. Thanks for your feedback. Tbf, I'm not defending Verb, I'm a bit sketchy of the attacks on him, if you get the difference. Yes, he has passed Rand "bobbing his head in agreement" and I think Rand at that point was quoting or paraphrasing Nyn? Not sure. But tbf it was wolf!Verb that was using that tell to justify his sussing Seph iirc. The thing that is bothering me most at the moment is Tigraine. I don't get the anti-Rand argument. He's your son, for Pete's sake. (sorry, couldn't resist). But correct me if wrong - Rand should have picked up on Dice's hints. (I totally didn't, though not sure that carries much weight). Therefore he is scummy as get out. But this seems awful logic. If Town!Rand picked up the hints, he would have backed off, but he didn't. If wolf!Rand picked up the hints, he would have voted and suddenly been unreachable - killing the cop and having complete plausible deniability and WIFOM. Hanging about and arguing Dice isn't giving him enough to go on only seems compatible with Town!Rand who isn't getting the hints. Wolf!Rand deciding to not go for the cop kill in favour of some town cred (which according to Tig was actually the scummiest move ever, so hardly an effective gambit) seems really suboptimal play. But again we are getting to the point where I'm getting pinged by players an order of magnitude more than there are wolves. I would suck in a closed setup game. Or be in my element, lol. Yeah, probably not.