MAFIA KART WII [BASIC] - Mafia Sweep

[Cory Caboose]

It's not really a question of taking personal shots, though. That's obviously not cool. But quite a few players either get their panties in a twist over game related interrogation and playstyle forcefulness.... or prefer to play as a single unit and suck balls at being a team player, wanting to twist everyone's hand to see the game the way they do, thereby devolving the game. I'm just saying.... that also contributes to the overall atmosphere. Not just personal attacks. 

 

I think people who freak out over being suspected (and yes, they exist) deserve an eyeroll, but that wasn't the problem here. Playstyle forcefulness is different, I guess. There's nothing wrong with being aggressive and pushing your reads (hell, it's probably optimal to have at least a couple villagers capable of playing that way) but there's a line between being civil and non-civil. I am specifically talking about non-civil communication. If you think someone is scum, you can push them without yelling about how they are the worst mafia player you've ever played with; if you think someone has made a bad read, you can disagree with it vehemently without telling them they are horrible at making reads.

[Zander?]

 

It's not really a question of taking personal shots, though. That's obviously not cool. But quite a few players either get their panties in a twist over game related interrogation and playstyle forcefulness.... or prefer to play as a single unit and suck balls at being a team player, wanting to twist everyone's hand to see the game the way they do, thereby devolving the game. I'm just saying.... that also contributes to the overall atmosphere. Not just personal attacks. 

 

I think people who freak out over being suspected (and yes, they exist) deserve an eyeroll, but that wasn't the problem here. Playstyle forcefulness is different, I guess. There's nothing wrong with being aggressive and pushing your reads (hell, it's probably optimal to have at least a couple villagers capable of playing that way) but there's a line between being civil and non-civil. I am specifically talking about non-civil communication. If you think someone is scum, you can push them without yelling about how they are the worst mafia player you've ever played with; if you think someone has made a bad read, you can disagree with it vehemently without telling them they are horrible at making reads.

 

 

He's prolly NOT talking aboot me.....

[Celeste]

I love you Penny and I don't mean anything bad by saying you're sensitive to some pushes, okay? We all get like that sometimes

I agree with you though. I don't like to get attached with mafia but it happens and I just become this whole entire different scummy town play. But pushes like the one Darthe was doing I just get pissy over.

[Cory Caboose]

I mean, I used to have a lot of bad habits (and still certainly have a couple), so I'm not innocent here. I've tried my best to work them out of my game and I would wager a few notable players would say I've made a great deal of progress in that regard.

 

That's why I want the discussion to be as open as possible.

[Nynaeve]

I don't see the problem with telling someone they have horrible reads. If I'm town, I have no idea if that's actually true or not so I could be just talking out of my ass if I'm totally mistaken. And the reaction can sometimes be telling.  And if I'm scum, I'm trying to undermine the reads.... or just make the player feel insecure.

 

Calling people names? Not cool. Calling their reads names, however, is perfectly fine in my book and I will, personally, most definitely always say that if I believe it to be true. I get that you guys want to take the sugar coding approach... and that's okay I guess... but I'm not a sugar coding player (or person, really).

[Celeste]

I have seen a mafia member freak out from being pushed by other mafia members T.T

[Cory Caboose]

I have seen a mafia member freak out from being pushed by other mafia members T.T

 

... should I tell the story of teddyyyyyus caesar?

[Zander?]

 

I have all the faith in the world that Darthe can and will adjust, because I also remember how werewolf/mafia was played "competitively" only a year or two ago and it takes a lot to not default to that when you've done it for so long

 

And this is ultimately about COMMUNICATING EFFECTIVELY, which is a part of the game whether or not we want to act like this a personality conflict.

 

It's not like we've never seen players like Celeste at DragonMount before. That part is nothing new.

I agree with the bolded. After we got in the discussion about me only I was trying to get us out of that but people didn't want to move on.

 

 

Sometimes tho doing your own thing is fine.  But if you refuse to do anything that people are asking for you gotta be prepared for what comes from it.  And I dont mean personal attacks as they arent acceptable but flak for sure,

 

Like even tho I was pushing you I was almost like trying to coach.urge to do things to help yourself.

[Cory Caboose]

I don't see the problem with telling someone they have horrible reads. If I'm town, I have no idea if that's actually true or not so I could be just talking out of my ass if I'm totally mistaken. And the reaction can sometimes be telling.  And if I'm scum, I'm trying to undermine the reads.... or just make the player feel insecure.

 

Calling people names? Not cool. Calling their reads names, however, is perfectly fine in my book and I will, personally, most definitely always say that if I believe it to be true. I get that you guys want to take the sugar coding approach... and that's okay I guess... but I'm not a sugar coding player (or person, really).

 

That's not really what I said.

[Nynaeve]

I get that what I'm talking about is not what happened THIS game. I'm just throwing my two cents about the atmosphere topic at large.

 

I have to go now, though. So I guess I'm done.

[Cory Caboose]

Like... if you see someone make reads you don't like, I think something like "you are terrible at making reads, so who cares what you think" is unacceptable. "Wow, your reads are horrible" is acceptable. "I disagree with your reads on [whomever]" or "I don't agree with your reads at all" is better.

[alannalynn]

Like... if you see someone make reads you don't like, I think something like "you are terrible at making reads, so who cares what you think" is unacceptable. "Wow, your reads are horrible" is acceptable. "I disagree with your reads on [whomever]" or "I don't agree with your reads at all" is better.

YOU TOOK MY WORDS. Meanie.

 

I'm not sure "sugar-coating" is a good term. The game is meant to be competitive and we're meant to argue about reads and with each other by extension, but you don't have to always treat people with kids gloves, and you don't always have to attack. There's a point when you have to say "Okay, I think I've pushed them TOO far for their comfort level and I need to back off to maintain positive atmosphere for everyone" instead of "let's keep going and watch them have a mental breakdown... oops"

[Cory Caboose]

Laine I'm not kidding when I say I naturally don't read your posts now because you lack an avatar

 

It's life-tilting

[Cory Caboose]

I just think we're past the bygone era of "upset people intentionally to try and make a ~read on their reaction" type playing because A) there's better way to make reads and B) they just make the game exhausting for everyone and a conductive thread is probably more valuable than whatever you'll glean by rustling someone's jimmies.

 

I mean obviously if you have a rapport with someone you have a great deal more freedom as to how you can interact with them because you have an understanding.

 

Just be smart.

[alannalynn]

Laine I'm not kidding when I say I naturally don't read your posts now because you lack an avatar

 

It's life-tilting

Soundsss like a youuuu problemmm

 

Now you understand how I feel every time you change your avatar.

[Cory Caboose]

so many flavors Laine

 

so many

[alannalynn]

so many flavors Laine

 

so many

Is that also a you problem? I'm confuse.

 

ily

 

[Calder]

 

Like... if you see someone make reads you don't like, I think something like "you are terrible at making reads, so who cares what you think" is unacceptable. "Wow, your reads are horrible" is acceptable. "I disagree with your reads on [whomever]" or "I don't agree with your reads at all" is better.

YOU TOOK MY WORDS. Meanie.

 

I'm not sure "sugar-coating" is a good term. The game is meant to be competitive and we're meant to argue about reads and with each other by extension, but you don't have to always treat people with kids gloves, and you don't always have to attack. There's a point when you have to say "Okay, I think I've pushed them TOO far for their comfort level and I need to back off to maintain positive atmosphere for everyone" instead of "let's keep going and watch them have a mental breakdown... oops"

I agree with this. Although there are some players (no one in this game) that are an emotional breakdown waiting to happen. It is going to happen no matter what and that is just as toxic as people being overly aggressive.

[Nynaeve]

The thing is that in DM specifically, games are so meta driven nowadays that even if I were to try to tone it down, I'd prolly get lynched for it. Not that I have any intention to tone down my playstyle.... heh. But that's also something that's been nagging at me, cause there's this expectation to be more considerate but then for people willing to accommodate that expectation, there's quite often game related penalties. Just like in Cory's game in VS... when I EVENTUALLY toned down and said like... you know what? Don't see my case? w/e.... ignore me if you want. Just ignore X person too. And then I just get FoSed for it cause "Nyn usually takes the lead and is in your face and bla bla bla." So in my specific case, reducing aggressiveness has game implications.

 

So if some people would be willing to make a change (again, I'm personally not going to because I don't think there's anything wrong with how I play), I sure hope you're not gonna be jumping up their throat in games because they're reacting differently than what you've grown to expect. Time will prolly tell on that one, though. 

[Cory Caboose]

You can put yourself in a leadership position and be aggressive without demeaning people :confused:

I don't get it

[Cory Caboose]

I think we're talking about two different things Nyn

[Clovdyx]

Who wants my thoughts Bfg e?

[Clovdyx]

Who wants my thoughts Bfg e?

Okay phone, how the hell did you autocorrect here into bfg e?

[alannalynn]

I like Clov thoughts, they're yummy.

[Cory Caboose]

It's gonna be "thoughts and stuff".