Avi's Kids

[Kaznen]

Maybe they die soon after. Anyway, I think a lot of Kings and Queens will die in TG maybe Elayne is one of them, maybe not.

 

Everyone in Randland except for the Aiel think after the battle is over it will be back to business as usual. The AS think they will gentle Rand before he can break the world, the Asha'man will be hunted down for trying to rival the AS power base. The monarchs will go back to ruling their countries as they did before.

 

But the "new Breaking" will be a social upheaval that is caused by a lack of rulers maybe. Maybe other reasons.

 

But Elayne, like everyone else except the three ta'veren and most Aiel, have the same fatal flaw. Everyone except those three plan to fight for personal glory. The Seanchan and AS are the worst in that area but only the above mentioned are fighting the war becasue it has to be done.

 

sorry for going a little O/T there.

[Leafburner]

I think Kaznen is onto something. Although I don't believe Elayne or Min are going to die.

 

We know that the girls have a bond to one another. We know they can feel what the others are experiencing. Why would Avi not be able to feel - and I mean physically feel - what Elayne and Min are going through during childbirth? It may be just like having children of her own - only different.

 

Plus, I don't think Min can see auras around herself. So she wouldn't know she was due to be knocked up and that may be interfering with her interpretation of the Aura she sees around Avi, thus adding to the surprise. Min has been with Rand for a while now, plenty of time for him to plant his seed.

[Shai-tan]

Maybe all three ladies share a body! Like people think about Moridin and Rand!

[Luckers]

I don't see this being the case simply because i dont think Min would connect the birth with Avi in the way she did, were it the case.

[dr phil]

also there is also one other odd thing that could happen with rands and avi's kid. it seems pretty obvious yet no one has picked up on it. Shes gonna have 4 kids maybe its due to rand being tavern or his super sperm who knows.

 

MAybe what happens is that none of the avi's 4 children can channel. that would seem very odd in the eyes of everyone. think about it. RJ has stated in a n interview i believe that being able to channel the OP is to due with genetics and the soul. avi and rand can both channel and at great strength so its presumed through genetics that there kids will channel. but the twist is that they wont be able to.

 

Dont ask my why they wont be able to channel but it seems so obvious to me. what do u guys and girls think about this line of thinking

[Almearafan]

New poster here...Been reading the boards for a couple of years though.

 

I believe that Avi's Kids will be different due to the bond that she shares with Rand, Min, and Elayne. I don't think it's yet been mentioned by Robert Jordan whether a bonded woman (AS or otherwise) has had children while bonded). Add to that the fact that there is a multibond thing going on with the two other girls and all 3 having Rand bonded to them, there could be an 'odd' effect.

 

I'm not sure what the result of this effect would be, goodness knows I'm nowhere near as creative as Robert Jordan...LOL. But I think that the oddness that Min referenced will specifically be related to the bond, and I don't believe that it will have anything to do with the children not being able to channel. I think they will be born with the Spark.

 

I really like the idea that they would be able to channel both Saidan and Saidar, however; I'm not sure if it's a possibility in the WOT world. Jordan said that the ability to channel is genetic and sex based, however; if there is a proper balance in these children that was brought about by the bond, then I guess it could be a possibility without them having to be hermaphrodites. For some reason I don't really think that Jordan would go this route though.

 

Maybe one of each will be strong in each of the powers...but that would leave one power out.

 

What if they're all bonded to each other, therefore paving the way for Uberbabies of some sort. Meaning that they would gain extra strength from each other...etc. from the very beginning of their lives as brothers and/or sisters. Just like the AS/Warder bond.

 

It could be something as simple as all of them having birthmarks in the shape of a dragon.

 

Peace to all...we'll just have to wait and see.

[Ilyena]

I like some of the ideas you've brought up Al'meara Fan, But the problem with the bond affecting the babies is that Elayne is bonded also, and the babies weren't affected in anyway noticable to Min's vision.

[Almearafan]

Great point Ilyena. I had forgotten that part. Can't wait to find out what the real deal is.

[Leafburner]

also there is also one other odd thing that could happen with rands and avi's kid. it seems pretty obvious yet no one has picked up on it. Shes gonna have 4 kids maybe its due to rand being tavern or his super sperm who knows.

 

MAybe what happens is that none of the avi's 4 children can channel. that would seem very odd in the eyes of everyone. think about it. RJ has stated in a n interview i believe that being able to channel the OP is to due with genetics and the soul. avi and rand can both channel and at great strength so its presumed through genetics that there kids will channel. but the twist is that they wont be able to.

 

Dont ask my why they wont be able to channel but it seems so obvious to me. what do u guys and girls think about this line of thinking

 

I'm not sure. How old does a child have to be before it can be determined whether the possess the potential to learn to channel?

 

The reason I bring this up is that there is only limited time as I see it to accomplish Avi's conception and ultimate birth so far as to then determine that there is something odd in her children not being able to channel.

 

I don't think RJ will leave this viewing of Min's as one of the unexplained mysteries at the end of the series. That's why I think Min will discover that she is pregnant with twins and they'll realise that because Avi is not pregnant, the oddity is that she is having 4 children vicariously through Min and Elayne.

[Luckers]

I think the BWB suggested ten years old before it could be detected.

[boberbobscow]

maybe itll be something more mndane like there born down syndrome or something or maybe they will al bee born with the dragons on their arms or maybe they will be dragons?

[Luckers]

Maybe they will be dragons? Four of them... poor, poor Avi.

 

Although there is a thought, what if the oddness is that their birth kills Avi?

[Wolfsbane]

 

I really like the idea that they would be able to channel both Saidan and Saidar' date=' however; I'm not sure if it's a possibility in the WOT world. Jordan said that the ability to channel is genetic and sex based, however; if there is a proper balance in these children that was brought about by the bond, then I guess it could be a possibility without them having to be hermaphrodites.[/quote']

 

Simply.

No.

 

In the Guide I believe, I read it 4/5 summers ago in a rush when I ACTUALLY managed to read it, it talks about Shara at length. Male channelers are kept alive for breeding stock because of their increased likelihood to breed channelers. Nothing more. Avi wouldn't be strong enough to equal Rand's power in saidin even if it was remotely fesible, now Nynaeve knocking boots with Rand while Lan's playing Malkieri king.. THAT'D be an uber baby.

 

What hasn't been explored are the prolonged effects of the taint, on the offspring of a male channeler. Could the taint affect Avi's kids because it was later on than Elayne's, when Rand had deteriorated further before saidin was cleansed?

RJ said in an interview that the effects of the taint were irreversible and would remain at where they had halted.. he's hearing LTT, he's losing his vision.. just a small hop, and his line and tackle could be just as easily.. "affected".

Why did it have to be me that brought it up?

Least I didn't start the 'hermaphrodite-theory'.. That's just too funny.

Saidin and Saidar can be used together in the method of the two Choedan Kals, but when combined.. That's how we got the Bore peeps. Using Saidin and Saidar as one.

That'd be friggin' hilarious though.. Rand, and maybe our other two favourite ta'verens die, most of the known world is wiped out but the DO is imprisoned.. and all it takes is a hermaphrodite being able to channel and boom, 'nother Bore.

So please stop the herm-theory.

For the collective logic of DM.

 

I'm growing increasingly wary about RJ's involvement in DM and wonder if he's prowling the threads seeing if we're on to him.

 

"Aww jeez.. They got the Graendel thing.. Well, better not reveal that in WH like I was planning. Might as well drive a few of 'em nuts." (unofficial quoting of Robert Jordan, but you know he did it).

 

Should prove interesting what comes out of Avi, and Elayne.. but I don't think Min's the birthing type.. The regret in her voice when she said Elayne should've had some tea equivalent for birth control in randland kinda spelled it out for me.

I still like the Aiel adoption theory for Avi cause it does make sense.. So I ask you, who do we KNOW are pregnant?

 

-Elayne, DUHHH freaaking UHHHHHHHHHH

-Faile, she was gonna tell Perrin then oops, ROAD TRIP!! *sigh*.. Let's just be grateful it's over.

-Min?

 

That's four kids at least by my count.

Is Faile gonna die? Will Perrin move on to Berelain?

 

 

I'm Erik Nighthowl.

I'm Tyarrine Il'yair'mael.

And I'm Ed Wallace.

All these answers and more, this 60 minutes.

 

That was fun.. something to chew on. Ciao.

 

Wolfs

[sunking]

Yes ive been thinking for a very long time that faile may die! Glad to know im not the only one. but since there is only one more book i seriously doubt it.

 

ok i have a crazy theory about avi's babies. Maybe they are born being able to channel both sadiar and saidan? maybe. its a reach though.

[sunking]

oops i didnt see the previous page. tee hee hee. but i did have that same idea even if it was later.

[Wolfsbane]

you mean individually right? like a circle of dudes and girls and a single person 'directing' both Powers, but not using them as one.

 

meh.. the reaction (i got) from Min was that these kids were gonna be "different" AKA- special, and/or evil.

Morridin's kids-- check

Taint babies----- check

Herm-babies------ No check

 

Wolfs

[Luckers]

Wolfsbane, the bore wasn't created by using saidin and saidar as one, it was created because Mierin wanted to find a source that could be channeled as one in that manner. The actual drilling though was accomplished by a simple male/female link and a talented channeler melding the flows in a weave specifically intended to have that effect. Even were a hermanphrodite born with an ability like that, they wouldn't create another bore... unless of course they grew very educated in physics and learnt how to make the appropriate weave... i imagine also that it took a large circle, or the use of angreal or sa'angreal, so a single hermanphrodite channeler probably wouldn't have the strength anyway, even if their were as strong as rand in both sides of the source.

 

Additionally, the choedan kal arn't required for a male/female link, they are simple sa'angreal that allowed rand to channel more. Additionally Nynaeve isn't as strong as Rand, nor is aviendha all that weak. She's as strong as egwene, who could have used the choedan kal according to Verin.

 

The sharans are slightly misguided in their practices. Yes the exclusive gene pool likely has something of a husbandry effect, but there are channelers born outside the cloisters of the ayyad, those with the spark are assumed to be born from an indiscretion of the ayyad, and those with the learner gene likely are never found. Its a waste of a wide scale resource, though likely that has to do with them not wanting those people that arn't bron in the ayyad way coming to have the power of the ayyad in that society... after all, they rule through deciet, and while they could handle one or two non-indoctrinate people every now and again, they probably wouldn't be able to handle all the learners left out. Additionally, the men arn't kept alive, they are killed at 20, or sooner if the spark asserts itself. They are made to breed though.

 

Finally, since when was Faile preganant? Did i miss something?

[Zyrshnikashnu]

Faile' date=' she was gonna tell Perrin then oops, ROAD TRIP!![/quote']

Well that's a new way of putting it. I can't say I've ever heard it referred to as a "road trip." :P

[Wolfsbane]

Hmm.. I recall in tFoH when Rand is seeing the different lives of Aiel that it mentions that only two people will be involved in the experiment (Lanfear and some other guy) using the One Power combined. I can't recall where it mentioned they were merely looking for it.

And they mention Faile being pregnant when it goes into her view point in PoD I beleive, she hints at the fact that she was pregnant and Perrin didn't know yet.

I'm assuming you got your info on the Ayyad from the Guide, so I will trust that over my limited time with the Guide a few summers back.

 

Has anyone found the quote from Min when she looks at Avi and knows her kids will be "different?" It's right when Rand and Elayne are.. er-hem.. and Avi, Min and Birgitte are leaving talking about how Elayne should have had some tea.

 

And finally, for further reference of course, when you are captured by Shaido and made to wear white even though you are the next in line to become Queen to Saldaea, your friends are the ex-Queen of Andor, the Queen of Ghealdea, and an inn-bouncer's shrew, it constitutes a Road Trip.

cheers,

 

Wolfs

[Zyrshnikashnu]

Hmm.. I recall in tFoH when Rand is seeing the different lives of Aiel that it mentions that only two people will be involved in the experiment (Lanfear and some other guy) using the One Power combined. I can't recall where it mentioned they were merely looking for it.

That was The Shadow Rising. I should be able to locate the passage without much difficulty...

 

Mierin had said today was the day. She said she had found a new source for the One Power. Female Aes Sedai and male would be able to tap the same source' date=' not seperate halves. What men and women could do united would be even greater now that there would be no differences. And today she and Beidomon would tap it for the first time--the last time men and women would work together wielding a different Power. Today.[/quote']

[Wolfsbane]

Thank you long complicated name..

*CTRL+C'd!!!*

Zyrshnikashnu. Your diligence is greatly appreciated by Wolfsbane Corporation and Conglomerate Empire.

"Ach, my squiggly-spoog."

 

So much happened in tSR and not enough in tFOH that I always push the excess into book #5. It's sad really, but Mierin was right- the True Source. That man and woman would only be united under the Shadow's power.

 

Now, getting back on track with Avi's kids, do we know they will be Rand's? Even if he was in another body, it would still sorta be Rand's, but what if she was raped or Compelled to to by... Hmmm.. Demandred, maybe?

Is there anything in the reading that suggests that the kids are indeed Rand's.. but different..? Min may me assuming they are Rand's cause of all of their bond to Rand and their love for him.

 

Zyrshnikashnu, to the WoT-mobile!

 

Wolfs

[Zyrshnikashnu]

Sorry, I don't have that book with me. You're going to have to find someone else for the quote. :P

[prophetman]

Unless RJ suddenly adopts an incredibly dark outlook for his characters, I doubt Avi will be raped/ compelled. That really wouldnt have much of a point to it. More likely that Rand will head on over to Arad Doman, see Avi, say "im a lecher" and then proceed to get, and i paraphrase, "funky wit it".

[Wolfsbane]

Yes, it would seem he'd be taking something from Terry Brooks with that theory (Sword of Truth right? Richard was born from.. yeah).

 

If Avi gives birth to Perrin, Rand, Mat, and.. uhh.. Birgitte maybe? (counting on they all die in TG), it wouldn't be the same. I just don't think that would be RJ's take on it, but that's just me. Honestly, we all want Mat to go home and take control of Seanchan with Tuon, Perrin to raise Manetheran from the ground, and Rand to.. well.. get freaky wid dose hawt gurrrrls.. MoL should prove interesting.

 

Wolfs

[Luckers]

That would be somewhat... incestuous. Far from being his own grandfather, rand would be his own father...

 

I don't see Avi allowing herself to be raped. I mean that chick is pretty bad ass, and fairly damn strong in the power. She'd not be an easy target.

 

Additionally, Wolfsbane, on Mierin and the drilling of the bore, the guy she was working with was named Biedomon, nad they were heading up a group of researcher who were looking for a source that both men and women could channel, rather then them having to use seperate halves. They thought they found that in the Dark Ones power, which they detected outside of reality, so they gathered, linked, and through the old method driled a hole through the fabric of reality. A specific quote would be...

 

"Mierin had said today was the day, she had found a new source for the One Power. Female Aes Sedai and male would be able to tap the same source, not seperate halves. What men and women could do united would be even greater, now there were no differences. And today she and Beidomon would tap it for the first time - the last time men and women would work together using a different Power. Today."

 

As for Faile, i totally missed that. Do you have any quotes?