[Standard] The Matrix Reloaded - Game Over

[Yates]

  On 10/28/2015 at 1:54 PM, cory caboose said:

Yates I will absolutely destroy you if you want to make this a thing that we do to eachother

 

My boxing gloves are laced and my mood has soured

I don't even know what you are talking about.  Enlighten me?

[Zander?]

  On 10/27/2015 at 9:34 PM, Sili Quirrels said:

Higher bar for corylynn...

 

 

Cause GOAT's are gonna GOAT imo

 

 

:wub:

[Yates]

  On 10/28/2015 at 2:13 PM, Thane Vakarian said:

fwiw, you're ok for now yates. 

Gee.  Thanks.  

[Yates]

  On 10/28/2015 at 2:16 PM, cory caboose said:

x = (wolf equity (max) + self-clear potential (min)) / activity

I loled. But true.

[Yates]

You guys have me for more or less the rest of today. I've got a huge travel day tomorrow so you won't see me tonight or tomorrow until evening if at all.

[Cory Caboose]

  On 10/28/2015 at 1:18 PM, Yates said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 5:47 AM, Sooh said:

Clov and Yates are players I need time to read, as I stated in my post. I probably won't have a good solve for either of them D1. I'm still looking of course, but in terms of making conclusions about their alignment I feel it's premature.

But you have zero problems solving Corlanna before lunch?

 

^

 

Is this something you are purporting to be about me or about Sooh? LMK

[Shad_]

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:51 PM, Yates said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 3:43 AM, Shad_ said:

Nothing preventing a wolf discussing team mate Hallia  or nothing preventing w/w coaching?  I think it's an important distinction here.

Can you explain when it makes sense to do so?

 

 

Yeah.  Remind me tonight if I haven't by then.

[rackcitysteelers]

  On 10/28/2015 at 5:17 AM, Shad_ said:

 

  On 10/27/2015 at 11:12 PM, rackcitysteelers said:

Well I had some posts queued up but I lost them so oh well. But I think the push on me is stupid but not scummy. I think it was silli that was saying they were expecting me to finally say something when I got back but I pretty clearly stated in my post that I wasn't going to actually be able to catch up until later. So now I'm gonna give you some thoughts.

 

I don't really set out with a concrete strategy, but the Lenlo thing was kinda just looking for actions. I wasn't entirely happy with Lenlo's reactions to it but it wasn't terrible and I have a bigger scum read anyways.

 

I think Zander is scum. I thought his opening post felt forced but some people said it was just him so I was like whatever. Someone else pointed this out (I forget who) but he's spent a lot of time just defending and backing people up. It's a pretty easy tactic to lay low and get on some people's good side. Zander said that he had been attacking people though, but it wasn't a high risk one. He just jumped on the popular Lenlo bandwagon. His reasoning wasn't good either, Lenlo imo was pretty clearly just using a mostly gut read on that person who had barely posted so I didn't get why Zander was making a big deal about it. It felt like a weak reason to jump on a popular bandwagon. I'm gonna Vote: Zander

 

 

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  On 10/28/2015 at 3:07 AM, rackcitysteelers said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:41 AM, Clovdyx said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:29 AM, rackcitysteelers said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:17 AM, Clovdyx said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:15 AM, rackcitysteelers said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:08 AM, Clovdyx said:

Things that make me say, "Hmmm..."

Penny for you thoughts?

 

Your argument is not very good, and Sili following you - if serious - is terribad.

 

I obviously disagree on the argument so we'll just agree to disagree on this point

 

 

I'm sure you do, but I don't see how.  The initial post thing is whatever - if you don't know Zander, it might feel forced, but I can pull dozens of examples of posts like that where he was town.  I think it was Yates that summed it up perfectly...it's 100% null for him.  

 

Defending and backing people up is a pretty fair claim, but as I said with Pral, not sure that's really scummy.  Finding townies significantly narrows down the possible pool for mafia, so there's a lot of value there, and I would say it's usually easier to find a few good town reads on D1 than a strong mafia read (barring an absolute screw up).  In terms of laying low...I would fully buy that if it were true, but for Zander, specifically, this is hardly the case.  The guy has over a hundred posts and has been one of the most active players in the game.

 

Biggest issue is your claim of him piling on.  I don't think Lenlo was really a popular wagon at all when Zander voted; he had votes from you and Sili.  In a phase where it's 9 to lynch, 2 votes don't mean a whole lot.  It means even less when there's five days left in the phase and neither your vote nor Sili's had much backing behind it.

 

 

The initial posting thing wasn't really a big part of my argument at all, it was just the event that made his posts stand out to me while I was catching up.

 

When I said lay low, I meant it as in he wasn't saying anything offensive that would draw attention to himself. I think he phrased his words carefully. On post 435 Pralaya posted some quotes of his that emphasize it. Note that in none of them does he say he thinks someone is town. He imo is calculating with his language, instead phrasing it as him not thinking that town or mafia (Player) would do that but he also leaves some doubt in the posts so he could possibly wiggle out of it later without looking too bad. I think it's a very clear scum tactic.

 

Lenlo may have only had 2 votes then, but he put it to three which is a third of the vote. The rest of the votes were really spread out at the time too. Not only that, but there were a couple of people who had said things about Lenlo around there that they were iffy. It's not crazy to think that Zander was hoping to start a little run.

 

 

 

In red are you referring to Lenlo's vote on Laine, which prompted Zander's initial vote? If so, let's recalibrate a little here. Zander's initial vote on Lenlo was a joke. Just like, accept that. It's a Zander thing. Moreover, I don't think town!Zander would pause to think that putting Lenlo at 3 is a bad look. That definitely does not mean that scum!Zander would not see the joke as a convenient opportunity to 'start a little run' as you characterize it in your quote. So with that in mind, here are the first three posts in which Zander converts to a serious vote. How does this impact your opinion?:

 

 

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  On 10/26/2015 at 1:17 AM, Zander said:

 

  On 10/25/2015 at 3:50 AM, Lenlo said:

 

  On 10/25/2015 at 2:40 AM, Sili Quirrels said:

My vote on lenlo is based on this: and I've already said this in the thread.

 

His posts were forced, they lack content, he hadn't until just now after i implied he should, addressed his wagon in a concerted way which may or may not be scum who is playing it safe and hoping the storm will pass. I obviously, being me after all, will not like this behavior. I am glad he finally addressed his wagon.

 

more later when i get home.

Forced/Lacked content - I assume your talking about post #51? That post wasnt even 3 pages into the game and it was my first post. Your using that to say im forcing my posts/lacking content? Whats your opinion on Pral, Nomi or say Dice then? None of them have posted much and what they have hasnt been content. Id like to see if you have a similar opinion about them or are singling me out for some reason.

 

The wagon - Concerted? So a planned way? You mean I ignored something that was just two people ranting at me without telling me what for? Now that you have actually told me what im being bothered about I can answer it, but you cant expect someone to respond to something that was never mentioned.

 

i dont know if its just me but this post is very meh imo. im gonna have to go back and read his posts.

 

  On 10/26/2015 at 4:13 AM, Zander said:

 

  On 10/26/2015 at 3:57 AM, Lenlo said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Page 4 - Sili goes crazy. Hes kinda spamming the thread here, most of it is pointless. Why?

 

Thane has 2 posts. Nothing of content in them. Checks in then checks out

 

Rack hasnt actually contributed at all. Hes just pushed something with no reason and then let Sili do all the work. atleast in terms of my train. He did alittle bit of poking at Zander but nothing serious. I feel like he might be pushing me early as a reaction train? Like see what people do, who jumps on a quick bandwagon, how I defend myself. Just get some overall reactions. Seeing how he plays it out will be interesting and telling imo.

 

Zander posted a good amount, but mostly just light hearted stuff. I want MEAT. Quick to jump on me, and stay on me I might add, when I vote Corlanna jokingly.

 

Clov disagrees with Rack on Zander, but thinks hes town. Also engages Sili abit. Hes not afraid to confront people

 

Lots of inactives this game. We have to be careful about people pushing them for weak reasons, as I think that would be an easy for the scum to rack up some easy days/kills.

 

Cory not saying anything meaningful, votes Sooh. Cmon Coreh. Help me out here.

 

Hallia soft defends me for no reason. Its not major but something worth noting imo.

 

Sooh pokes at Sili, doesnt back it with a vote. I dunno why but I kinda feel like she is testing the waters for a Sili push. Have nothing to back this up atm sadly.

 

Dice gettin friendly with Sooh.

 

Yates comes in guns blazing. I noticed Sili is questionable of it, but I like it.

 

Sili, lots of votes, lots of posts, moderate amount of content imo. Got into it with Yates. Gets pissy at me when I dismiss his and Racks push on me because it has nothing to it. I asked if he was drunk. Apparently this was stupid. Im still amused by it. After I respond to him though, he finally posts a good meaningful, more than 1 line post. I liked it.

 

Tab posts. Says nothing.

 

Shad is playin. I cant really get a read on him for some reason, but hes posting content so... yay? I wanna like him but I feel like I need something more, so I can make sure its not just me liking him cause he defended me/chatted with me.

 

Nomi. Votes Yates jokingly, even though Sili has been going at him. Odd?

 

 

 

 

I had quotes, but it kinda went up in flames cause DM. I have work I need to do tonight, so im just gonna post my notepad thoughts that came up as I was reading. Heres my current list.

 

 

(In not particular order)

 

Town:

Clov

Yates

Lenlo

 

Null to Town:

Rack

Shad

Sili

 

Null:

Hallia

Parlaya

Corlanna (Cory/Alanna)

Taborline

Dice

BFG

Nomi

 

Null to Scum:

Thane

Zander

Sooh

 

Scum:

 

 

 

[v]Sooh[/v]

 

I wanna see how this goes, and maybe shed some light on Dice and Sili in the process.

 

  On 10/24/2015 at 6:50 AM, Thane Vakarian said:

*peeks in*

 

wow, i was surprised that the PM arrived. Seems like we have a game after all

 

*hands out drinks and stuff to nibble on*

 

*stretches*

 

alright, will the wolves just out themselves so we can get wrecking?

 

  On 10/24/2015 at 7:15 AM, Thane Vakarian said:

*feels loved*

 

remind me not to send you chocolate in the future.....

 

So your top 3 Scum reads:

 

So you have Thane null to scum based on the above posts.

Sooh based on sussing Sili

Me for being lighthearted and voting you.

 

 

this is just a horrible list man.

 

  On 10/26/2015 at 4:21 AM, Zander said:

 

  On 10/26/2015 at 4:14 AM, Lenlo said:

Thane: Not doing anything at all. Just checking out.

Sooh: General tone and a bad feeling.

You: High post count, little content.

 

Disagree? Please, gimme somethin to work with.

Thane: Have you ever played with Thane before...its early D1 extremely normal for Thane atp imo

 

Sooh: I don't think her tone is off. bad feeling i can agree with a bit because unlike innocent till proven guilty Sooh is always wolf till proven town to me. but ive mislynched or helped to enough times to give her some more time before coming to a conclusion like that.

 

lolololololol----Sorry Sooh

 

Me: HI IM ZANDER

 

It almost seems like you were just picking names out of a hat.

 

 

And you complained about leaving my vote on you when you voted Corlanna first then i voted you. and your vote was there till you made the comment and voted Sooh.....

 

im pretty happy keeping my vote where it is brah.

 

 

 

I'm talking about Lenlo listed someone who had barely posted in his bottom three and Zander asked why that person stood out over others who had barely posted. Lenlo was saying that their posts just felt off and everything which I felt was a valid response since I think gut reads are a good starting point for suspicions. Anyways, Zander kept attacking Lenlo for it, asking for specifics when a gut read isn't going to get more specific than that. A gut read is a gut read. I felt as though it was a poor reason to push someone.

 

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:47 PM, Yates said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 3:07 AM, rackcitysteelers said:

The initial posting thing wasn't really a big part of my argument at all, it was just the event that made his posts stand out to me while I was catching up.

As I read this post it looks more and more like a narrative you are trying to support and less like a read. What if I told you I had a night 0 peek on Zander? Where would you look then? My concern - not knowing your alt - is that you are potentially scum who knew that the old Zander meta was that he got mislynched a lot and you thought he might still be low hanging fruit. See how these things work?

 

I looked at his posts and behavior this game and it seemed scummy to me. He's been trying to appear as though he's contributing without adding anything worthwhile which is a clear scum tactic. And I'm not an alt, I'm from a different site so I know nobody's metas.

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:51 PM, Taborline said:

Rephrase that question maybe, what were you hoping to achieve, Rack? I didn't feel the benefit for Town from your Lenlo posts.

 

I mean, I said it in the post itself. I don't really plan that far ahead and I mostly wing it. It was early in the game so I decided to just have some fun and push someone random, see where it led. 

[Yates]

  On 10/28/2015 at 2:38 PM, cory caboose said:

Is this something you are purporting to be about me or about Sooh? LMK

About Sooh. I certainly don't think you are easier to alignment solve than Clov or I. I don't even think LAINEY is that easy to alignment solve. Unless you think I'm wrong about this and somehow Sooh knows how to alignment solve you easier than either of us? Is this a thing I don't know about?

[Yates]

  On 10/28/2015 at 2:53 PM, rackcitysteelers said:

I looked at his posts and behavior this game and it seemed scummy to me. He's been trying to appear as though he's contributing without adding anything worthwhile which is a clear scum tactic.

Okay but:

 

What if I told you I had a night 0 peek on Zander? Where would you look then?

[Cory Caboose]

Sooh has read me with confidence early as a villager before in several games I can think of

 

It's probably something she'd do in either role and she typically reads me ~okay as a villager after interactions

 

I don't remember talking to her much or exactly what she said so I'll brush up

[Zander?]

  On 10/27/2015 at 11:12 PM, rackcitysteelers said:

Well I had some posts queued up but I lost them so oh well. But I think the push on me is stupid but not scummy. I think it was silli that was saying they were expecting me to finally say something when I got back but I pretty clearly stated in my post that I wasn't going to actually be able to catch up until later. So now I'm gonna give you some thoughts.

 

I don't really set out with a concrete strategy, but the Lenlo thing was kinda just looking for actions. I wasn't entirely happy with Lenlo's reactions to it but it wasn't terrible and I have a bigger scum read anyways.

 

I think Zander is scum. I thought his opening post felt forced but some people said it was just him so I was like whatever. Someone else pointed this out (I forget who) but he's spent a lot of time just defending and backing people up. It's a pretty easy tactic to lay low and get on some people's good side. Zander said that he had been attacking people though, but it wasn't a high risk one. He just jumped on the popular Lenlo bandwagon. His reasoning wasn't good either, Lenlo imo was pretty clearly just using a mostly gut read on that person who had barely posted so I didn't get why Zander was making a big deal about it. It felt like a weak reason to jump on a popular bandwagon. I'm gonna Vote: Zander

 

Let me address some of this crap:

 

No

 

My simple and very basic understanding of Mafia  Lunch Wolves- Identify Town and don't let them be mislynched.  I'm also a person who says what I feel and I dont care what others think man.  If i see something sticking out to me Ill comment on it regardless.  I defend my peeps dude and got their back.  Dont like it, too bad my friend Zander gonna Zander.

 

I've been told im pretty loveable so I always assume I'm on EVERYONE'S good side...unless you're a wolf....wolves don't like me as much.  lolololololol

 

In a 16 person game I was what the 3rd vote....takes 9 to lynch 3 days before DL.  Popular bandwagon.....nope try again homie.

 

That read list looked horribad imo.  I dont always pick out the wolves for the same reasons as most but I get there homie.  And if something looks odd or bad to me imma jump all over it.

 

Dude im ENFP... I AM GUT READS!!!!  its what i do.  and Thanes 2 "hey what's up" posts atp wouldnt give anyone enough for a gut read man.  So again I say nope to that as well.

 

 

TL DR- IM NOT GETTING MISLYNCHED THIS GAME.  I understand you don't know my meta so I'll not consider this wolfy but I'll see what you do from here...

 

[Clovdyx]

Did you ever check out page 13?

[Cory Caboose]

Yes but I don't remember if I learned anything

I remember your post about BFG and it being what you'd do or something

Should I look again? Am I missing something

[Zander?]

  On 10/27/2015 at 11:21 PM, Sili Quirrels said:

[v]zander[/v] okay.

 

 

  On 10/27/2015 at 11:21 PM, Sili Quirrels said:

=P

 

 

i pretty sure im safe in assuming this is a joke vote and the fact that Sili is just doing whatever he wants without regard for what others think about leads me to feel more strongly in my Town read of Sili atp.

[Zander?]

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:17 AM, Clovdyx said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:15 AM, rackcitysteelers said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:08 AM, Clovdyx said:

Things that make me say, "Hmmm..."

Penny for you thoughts?

 

 

Your argument is not very good, and Sili following you - if serious - is terribad.

 

 

 

i love you

 

:wub:

 

I'm glad im not the only one who thought this.....lololololololol

[Clovdyx]

Irt Hallia - I fully understand your point about her not interacting with you, but my gut said she was almost confirmed town after her stance on your slot. I realize that it was based around something Alanna said and not you, but I just have a hard time believing that mafia!Hallia would list you among her strongest scumreads.

 

You read her better than most, you're one of the people that most staunchly defend her (regardless of your alignment), and it was just so against the grain.

 

I'm also not sure I believe she would use that argument as scum. I didn't even notice Lainey's comment about Hallia until she quoted it, so it seems like something Hallia would have really had to pay attention to to notice.

[Clovdyx]

  On 10/28/2015 at 3:07 PM, cory caboose said:

Yes but I don't remember if I learned anything

 

I remember your post about BFG and it being what you'd do or something

 

Should I look again? Am I missing something

Her initial post to me was a reference to a conversation she and I had in pm about a week ago (how we never had a good town/town game).

 

It was perfectly within the rules to bring up, but kinda ehhh to me. Which is why I said I'd totally do it ldo

[rackcitysteelers]

  On 10/28/2015 at 2:58 PM, Yates said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 2:53 PM, rackcitysteelers said:

I looked at his posts and behavior this game and it seemed scummy to me. He's been trying to appear as though he's contributing without adding anything worthwhile which is a clear scum tactic.

Okay but:

 

What if I told you I had a night 0 peek on Zander? Where would you look then?

 

 

If you claimed a result on him I'd probably wait before throwing down another vote. I've got a few people that I'm keeping an eye on but not anyone who stands out as much to me as Zander does.

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 3:04 PM, Zander said:

 

  On 10/27/2015 at 11:12 PM, rackcitysteelers said:

Well I had some posts queued up but I lost them so oh well. But I think the push on me is stupid but not scummy. I think it was silli that was saying they were expecting me to finally say something when I got back but I pretty clearly stated in my post that I wasn't going to actually be able to catch up until later. So now I'm gonna give you some thoughts.

 

I don't really set out with a concrete strategy, but the Lenlo thing was kinda just looking for actions. I wasn't entirely happy with Lenlo's reactions to it but it wasn't terrible and I have a bigger scum read anyways.

 

I think Zander is scum. I thought his opening post felt forced but some people said it was just him so I was like whatever. Someone else pointed this out (I forget who) but he's spent a lot of time just defending and backing people up. It's a pretty easy tactic to lay low and get on some people's good side. Zander said that he had been attacking people though, but it wasn't a high risk one. He just jumped on the popular Lenlo bandwagon. His reasoning wasn't good either, Lenlo imo was pretty clearly just using a mostly gut read on that person who had barely posted so I didn't get why Zander was making a big deal about it. It felt like a weak reason to jump on a popular bandwagon. I'm gonna Vote: Zander

 

Let me address some of this crap:

 

No

 

My simple and very basic understanding of Mafia  Lunch Wolves- Identify Town and don't let them be mislynched.  I'm also a person who says what I feel and I dont care what others think man.  If i see something sticking out to me Ill comment on it regardless.  I defend my peeps dude and got their back.  Dont like it, too bad my friend Zander gonna Zander.

 

I've been told im pretty loveable so I always assume I'm on EVERYONE'S good side...unless you're a wolf....wolves don't like me as much.  lolololololol

 

In a 16 person game I was what the 3rd vote....takes 9 to lynch 3 days before DL.  Popular bandwagon.....nope try again homie.

 

That read list looked horribad imo.  I dont always pick out the wolves for the same reasons as most but I get there homie.  And if something looks odd or bad to me imma jump all over it.

 

Dude im ENFP... I AM GUT READS!!!!  its what i do.  and Thanes 2 "hey what's up" posts atp wouldnt give anyone enough for a gut read man.  So again I say nope to that as well.

 

 

TL DR- IM NOT GETTING MISLYNCHED THIS GAME.  I understand you don't know my meta so I'll not consider this wolfy but I'll see what you do from here...

 

 

 

All I hear is "That's just how I am! I'm the lovable wacky guy who speaks his mind!" which doesn't sway me any.

[Zander?]

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:30 AM, Hallia said:

As I said, I would catch up when I got home today.  Doing so now.

 

 

looking forward to it Poutine Lover!!!

 

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:40 AM, cory caboose said:

Yates I'm almost entirely sure what you are thinking and it's a matter of environment. I don't feel particularly compelled to intervene. Sometimes I need to drive discussion and other times I don't. See whatever I said to AJ in HoC, it's a matter of comfort level and figuring out where I am going to be most useful.

 

I'm at the point at DM where villages are good enough that I can do what I need to do to get the most accurate reads. If you want angry bully backhand slap Cory to awaken and start demanding things I can do that if you push me to a certain level of aggravation.

 

 

SPICY response

 

 I LIKE IT!!!

[Yates]

  On 10/28/2015 at 3:13 PM, rackcitysteelers said:

I've got a few people that I'm keeping an eye on but not anyone who stands out as much to me as Zander does.

For example? Who are these people? I have to assume you have stuff out there for them to respond to so you can alignment solve them as well so it shouldn't be a State secret, right?

[Zander?]

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:41 AM, Clovdyx said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:29 AM, rackcitysteelers said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:17 AM, Clovdyx said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:15 AM, rackcitysteelers said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:08 AM, Clovdyx said:

Things that make me say, "Hmmm..."

Penny for you thoughts?

Your argument is not very good, and Sili following you - if serious - is terribad.

I obviously disagree on the argument so we'll just agree to disagree on this point

 

 

I'm sure you do, but I don't see how.  The initial post thing is whatever - if you don't know Zander, it might feel forced, but I can pull dozens of examples of posts like that where he was town.  I think it was Yates that summed it up perfectly...it's 100% null for him.  

 

Defending and backing people up is a pretty fair claim, but as I said with Pral, not sure that's really scummy.  Finding townies significantly narrows down the possible pool for mafia, so there's a lot of value there, and I would say it's usually easier to find a few good town reads on D1 than a strong mafia read (barring an absolute screw up).  In terms of laying low...I would fully buy that if it were true, but for Zander, specifically, this is hardly the case.  The guy has over a hundred posts and has been one of the most active players in the game.

 

Biggest issue is your claim of him piling on.  I don't think Lenlo was really a popular wagon at all when Zander voted; he had votes from you and Sili.  In a phase where it's 9 to lynch, 2 votes don't mean a whole lot.  It means even less when there's five days left in the phase and neither your vote nor Sili's had much backing behind it.  

 

 

 

I cant hate this post at all!!! 

 

it may be shameless but Im feeling better about Clov.  That being said I can't read him all that well and he's capable of making posts like these as either alignment but wheres theres some heat coming against me, would he just pass up the chance to add fuel to fire if he was scum imo...no.

[Clovdyx]

Words hurt, Zander. :(

[Shad_]

  On 10/28/2015 at 2:53 PM, rackcitysteelers said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 5:17 AM, Shad_ said:

 

  On 10/27/2015 at 11:12 PM, rackcitysteelers said:

Well I had some posts queued up but I lost them so oh well. But I think the push on me is stupid but not scummy. I think it was silli that was saying they were expecting me to finally say something when I got back but I pretty clearly stated in my post that I wasn't going to actually be able to catch up until later. So now I'm gonna give you some thoughts.

 

I don't really set out with a concrete strategy, but the Lenlo thing was kinda just looking for actions. I wasn't entirely happy with Lenlo's reactions to it but it wasn't terrible and I have a bigger scum read anyways.

 

I think Zander is scum. I thought his opening post felt forced but some people said it was just him so I was like whatever. Someone else pointed this out (I forget who) but he's spent a lot of time just defending and backing people up. It's a pretty easy tactic to lay low and get on some people's good side. Zander said that he had been attacking people though, but it wasn't a high risk one. He just jumped on the popular Lenlo bandwagon. His reasoning wasn't good either, Lenlo imo was pretty clearly just using a mostly gut read on that person who had barely posted so I didn't get why Zander was making a big deal about it. It felt like a weak reason to jump on a popular bandwagon. I'm gonna Vote: Zander

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 3:07 AM, rackcitysteelers said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:41 AM, Clovdyx said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:29 AM, rackcitysteelers said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:17 AM, Clovdyx said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:15 AM, rackcitysteelers said:

 

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:08 AM, Clovdyx said:

Things that make me say, "Hmmm..."

Penny for you thoughts?

 

Your argument is not very good, and Sili following you - if serious - is terribad.

 

I obviously disagree on the argument so we'll just agree to disagree on this point

 

 

I'm sure you do, but I don't see how.  The initial post thing is whatever - if you don't know Zander, it might feel forced, but I can pull dozens of examples of posts like that where he was town.  I think it was Yates that summed it up perfectly...it's 100% null for him.  

 

Defending and backing people up is a pretty fair claim, but as I said with Pral, not sure that's really scummy.  Finding townies significantly narrows down the possible pool for mafia, so there's a lot of value there, and I would say it's usually easier to find a few good town reads on D1 than a strong mafia read (barring an absolute screw up).  In terms of laying low...I would fully buy that if it were true, but for Zander, specifically, this is hardly the case.  The guy has over a hundred posts and has been one of the most active players in the game.

 

Biggest issue is your claim of him piling on.  I don't think Lenlo was really a popular wagon at all when Zander voted; he had votes from you and Sili.  In a phase where it's 9 to lynch, 2 votes don't mean a whole lot.  It means even less when there's five days left in the phase and neither your vote nor Sili's had much backing behind it.

 

 

The initial posting thing wasn't really a big part of my argument at all, it was just the event that made his posts stand out to me while I was catching up.

 

When I said lay low, I meant it as in he wasn't saying anything offensive that would draw attention to himself. I think he phrased his words carefully. On post 435 Pralaya posted some quotes of his that emphasize it. Note that in none of them does he say he thinks someone is town. He imo is calculating with his language, instead phrasing it as him not thinking that town or mafia (Player) would do that but he also leaves some doubt in the posts so he could possibly wiggle out of it later without looking too bad. I think it's a very clear scum tactic.

 

Lenlo may have only had 2 votes then, but he put it to three which is a third of the vote. The rest of the votes were really spread out at the time too. Not only that, but there were a couple of people who had said things about Lenlo around there that they were iffy. It's not crazy to think that Zander was hoping to start a little run.

 

 

 

In red are you referring to Lenlo's vote on Laine, which prompted Zander's initial vote? If so, let's recalibrate a little here. Zander's initial vote on Lenlo was a joke. Just like, accept that. It's a Zander thing. Moreover, I don't think town!Zander would pause to think that putting Lenlo at 3 is a bad look. That definitely does not mean that scum!Zander would not see the joke as a convenient opportunity to 'start a little run' as you characterize it in your quote. So with that in mind, here are the first three posts in which Zander converts to a serious vote. How does this impact your opinion?:

 

 

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  On 10/26/2015 at 1:17 AM, Zander said:

 

  On 10/25/2015 at 3:50 AM, Lenlo said:

 

  On 10/25/2015 at 2:40 AM, Sili Quirrels said:

My vote on lenlo is based on this: and I've already said this in the thread.

 

His posts were forced, they lack content, he hadn't until just now after i implied he should, addressed his wagon in a concerted way which may or may not be scum who is playing it safe and hoping the storm will pass. I obviously, being me after all, will not like this behavior. I am glad he finally addressed his wagon.

 

more later when i get home.

Forced/Lacked content - I assume your talking about post #51? That post wasnt even 3 pages into the game and it was my first post. Your using that to say im forcing my posts/lacking content? Whats your opinion on Pral, Nomi or say Dice then? None of them have posted much and what they have hasnt been content. Id like to see if you have a similar opinion about them or are singling me out for some reason.

 

The wagon - Concerted? So a planned way? You mean I ignored something that was just two people ranting at me without telling me what for? Now that you have actually told me what im being bothered about I can answer it, but you cant expect someone to respond to something that was never mentioned.

 

i dont know if its just me but this post is very meh imo. im gonna have to go back and read his posts.

 

  On 10/26/2015 at 4:13 AM, Zander said:

 

  On 10/26/2015 at 3:57 AM, Lenlo said:

 

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Page 4 - Sili goes crazy. Hes kinda spamming the thread here, most of it is pointless. Why?

 

Thane has 2 posts. Nothing of content in them. Checks in then checks out

 

Rack hasnt actually contributed at all. Hes just pushed something with no reason and then let Sili do all the work. atleast in terms of my train. He did alittle bit of poking at Zander but nothing serious. I feel like he might be pushing me early as a reaction train? Like see what people do, who jumps on a quick bandwagon, how I defend myself. Just get some overall reactions. Seeing how he plays it out will be interesting and telling imo.

 

Zander posted a good amount, but mostly just light hearted stuff. I want MEAT. Quick to jump on me, and stay on me I might add, when I vote Corlanna jokingly.

 

Clov disagrees with Rack on Zander, but thinks hes town. Also engages Sili abit. Hes not afraid to confront people

 

Lots of inactives this game. We have to be careful about people pushing them for weak reasons, as I think that would be an easy for the scum to rack up some easy days/kills.

 

Cory not saying anything meaningful, votes Sooh. Cmon Coreh. Help me out here.

 

Hallia soft defends me for no reason. Its not major but something worth noting imo.

 

Sooh pokes at Sili, doesnt back it with a vote. I dunno why but I kinda feel like she is testing the waters for a Sili push. Have nothing to back this up atm sadly.

 

Dice gettin friendly with Sooh.

 

Yates comes in guns blazing. I noticed Sili is questionable of it, but I like it.

 

Sili, lots of votes, lots of posts, moderate amount of content imo. Got into it with Yates. Gets pissy at me when I dismiss his and Racks push on me because it has nothing to it. I asked if he was drunk. Apparently this was stupid. Im still amused by it. After I respond to him though, he finally posts a good meaningful, more than 1 line post. I liked it.

 

Tab posts. Says nothing.

 

Shad is playin. I cant really get a read on him for some reason, but hes posting content so... yay? I wanna like him but I feel like I need something more, so I can make sure its not just me liking him cause he defended me/chatted with me.

 

Nomi. Votes Yates jokingly, even though Sili has been going at him. Odd?

 

 

 

 

I had quotes, but it kinda went up in flames cause DM. I have work I need to do tonight, so im just gonna post my notepad thoughts that came up as I was reading. Heres my current list.

 

 

(In not particular order)

 

Town:

Clov

Yates

Lenlo

 

Null to Town:

Rack

Shad

Sili

 

Null:

Hallia

Parlaya

Corlanna (Cory/Alanna)

Taborline

Dice

BFG

Nomi

 

Null to Scum:

Thane

Zander

Sooh

 

Scum:

 

 

 

[v]Sooh[/v]

 

I wanna see how this goes, and maybe shed some light on Dice and Sili in the process.

 

  On 10/24/2015 at 6:50 AM, Thane Vakarian said:

*peeks in*

 

wow, i was surprised that the PM arrived. Seems like we have a game after all

 

*hands out drinks and stuff to nibble on*

 

*stretches*

 

alright, will the wolves just out themselves so we can get wrecking?

 

  On 10/24/2015 at 7:15 AM, Thane Vakarian said:

*feels loved*

 

remind me not to send you chocolate in the future.....

 

So your top 3 Scum reads:

 

So you have Thane null to scum based on the above posts.

Sooh based on sussing Sili

Me for being lighthearted and voting you.

 

 

this is just a horrible list man.

 

  On 10/26/2015 at 4:21 AM, Zander said:

 

  On 10/26/2015 at 4:14 AM, Lenlo said:

Thane: Not doing anything at all. Just checking out.

Sooh: General tone and a bad feeling.

You: High post count, little content.

 

Disagree? Please, gimme somethin to work with.

Thane: Have you ever played with Thane before...its early D1 extremely normal for Thane atp imo

 

Sooh: I don't think her tone is off. bad feeling i can agree with a bit because unlike innocent till proven guilty Sooh is always wolf till proven town to me. but ive mislynched or helped to enough times to give her some more time before coming to a conclusion like that.

 

lolololololol----Sorry Sooh

 

Me: HI IM ZANDER

 

It almost seems like you were just picking names out of a hat.

 

 

And you complained about leaving my vote on you when you voted Corlanna first then i voted you. and your vote was there till you made the comment and voted Sooh.....

 

im pretty happy keeping my vote where it is brah.

 

 

 

I'm talking about Lenlo listed someone who had barely posted in his bottom three and Zander asked why that person stood out over others who had barely posted. Lenlo was saying that their posts just felt off and everything which I felt was a valid response since I think gut reads are a good starting point for suspicions. Anyways, Zander kept attacking Lenlo for it, asking for specifics when a gut read isn't going to get more specific than that. A gut read is a gut read. I felt as though it was a poor reason to push someone.

 

Yeah, I thought you were probably talking about Thane but I didn't want to assume it straight away

 

So here's what I'm looking at:

 

You said: "He just jumped on the popular Lenlo bandwagon. His reasoning wasn't good either, Lenlo imo was pretty clearly just using a mostly gut read on that person who had barely posted so I didn't get why Zander was making a big deal about it. It felt like a weak reason to jump on a popular bandwagon."

 

Clov said: "Biggest issue is your claim of him piling on. I don't think Lenlo was really a popular wagon at all when Zander voted; he had votes from you and Sili. In a phase where it's 9 to lynch, 2 votes don't mean a whole lot. It means even less when there's five days left in the phase and neither your vote nor Sili's had much backing behind it."

 

You said: "Lenlo may have only had 2 votes then, but he put it to three which is a third of the vote. The rest of the votes were really spread out at the time too. Not only that, but there were a couple of people who had said things about Lenlo around there that they were iffy. It's not crazy to think that Zander was hoping to start a little run."

 

What's bugging me is that when Clov objected that Zander's vote was insignificant you offered a counterargument instead of saying "that's not what I was talking about".  But you seem to recognize that the vote was just in jest and the "piling on" came later.  It shows me you were probably thinking more about formulating a rebuttal to Clov than about your opinion of Zander.

[Zander?]

  On 10/28/2015 at 12:49 AM, dicetosser1 said:

 

 

  On 10/27/2015 at 3:06 PM, Zander said:

 

  On 10/27/2015 at 3:03 PM, Lenlo said:

No he's saying what you just said is something he said and thus got caught I believe.

 

 

HEY!!!!!  Wolves arent allowed to answer for me!!!!!

 

 

 

 

  On 10/27/2015 at 4:40 PM, Zander said:

 

  On 10/27/2015 at 4:38 PM, Lenlo said:

Silis got a gun?

 

Someone post Jamie's got a gun music video for me quick!

 

 

it dont matter Lenlo, you'll be a lunched wolf before that happens!!!

 

 

So you think Len is mafia?? why?

 

 

 

Ive touched on this Dice already.  It started with a joke about his vote on Corlanna, then the reads list thats was awful, all he keeps really saying (atp im doing my catchup) was Zander's being Obnoxious, he's not doing anything blah blah blah and not seeming to focus on anything else.  And that reading to me as....