Age of Legends [standard] Mafia - Game Over

[Nynaeve]

You're saying that he would have gotten strung up pretty quickly if he were town.  Normally, I might agree with you.  But there's no hammer this game.  So all piling on would do is park votes on somebody that's going to flip town, without actually contributing to the lynch.  In ~40 hours, they would be looking terribad.

 

Ah, I forgot, my bad.

 

Still kinda feel good about it, though. If you're right about Crusher.... I'd say he was almost eager to jump in on this. He followed up like five minutes after Kivam brought it up. If Shad is also a townie... then I would have expect scum to see how this plays out first before "picking sides". 

 

Honestly? At this point Crusher kinda looks just as bad as Shad. Would be willing to switch if people aren't sold on Shad.

[Nynaeve]

In the meanwhile, Kivam is more busy with promoting policy lynching me cause I am not playing like he thinks a townie should play. Instead of taking into account what's happening around him.

 

Hey, Kiv. is that townie?  I heard you're the guy to ask.

[Kivam]

Nyn basically covered this, but I wanted to point out, I really, really hated this list when I first saw it.  I'm caught up so I've seen your reasoning post, and it makes MORE sense to me, but I'm still not sure I agree with it.

 

You were meant to. It had no reasons given and had some pretty strange calls (with thought process behind them, including some that were primarily reaction fishing, but not obvious thought process). Yet I basically had to push to be pushed on it. Why is that, do you think? 

 

 

I can see Calder being town, so I don't have any issues with that.  Hallia and Dice...I don't have a problem with.  I already said my piece on Hallia, but I can see why others would have her as null.  Shad's position isn't bad.

 

But I'm not sure I've seen enough from AJ to feel anything about him, besides he's an experienced player who doesn't make awful posts.  What do you think he's contributed to the game that's been "calling out the right things"?  The only thing I remember him calling out is his approach to peeks and making a comment about Laine.

 

I don't have much experience with Nolder, so I can't back or refute your claim that mafia!Nolder is self-conscious.  I just remember him being pretty quiet in TUS, and the fact he hasn't said much so far this game makes me not feel good about him.

 

Crusher I would expect to be lower for you, given the meta you provided, and I really don't like that you're essentially giving him a base when you seemingly have reason to push him.

 

 

Having Thane and Nyn as your top two scumreads is awful though.  I was a little worried about Nyn earlier when I saw she was just doing a bunch of one-liner multiquotes, but her sinking her claws in is EXACTLY how she plays, and I don't think she's been wrong to push Shad with anything she has.  None of her points were completely wrong or blatantly made up, and she obviously has a high level of conviction.  

 

Thane...eh, I'll be honest.  He always sound scummy to me.  I have a hard time reading his posts and not automatically concluding he's scum, so I wouldn't mind suspicion of him at this point, but the strongest suspect?  Really?

 

re the bold - yes, those.  That's enough on D1 for me to moderately greenread him.  Doesn't mean I trust him, and his silence since then is not helpful, but for D1 he's not in my WTL

 

Re Crush ... as I said, D1 for him it's not unusual for him to be jokey and not provide much red meat (he likes to keep the red meat for himself).  I do agree with you that the latch onto my post on Nyn was opportunistic.  Nyn isn't a player who's as careful with her words as some others might be, and frankly I was expecting her to respond with something along the lines of "I meant that I felt that I was making good observations", which was the back end of that quote ("I feel that I've been legitimately scumhunting and making good observations").  In fact, I had originally bolded the full clause in her original post, read the back end and went "oh, so that's what she meant", and decided to unbold the remainder and throw the point out there anyway to see what fishies might bite.

 

Was hoping to let that play out a bit longer before unvoting, but I think it's potentially landed a whale, particularly combined with the misdescription of Nyn's meta and the fact that he suddenly had content to provide once I identified "sliding Crush" as a sign of "scum crush".

 

[unvote]

 

[v]Crusher[/v]

 

As for Thane.  Yes.  He honestly feels completely different than any game I've ever played with him, and I've played a few.  Usually he gets scumread for content, but he's being much less controversial this game.  Usually he's bouncy and gregarious, and he's much more contained this game.  He remains firmly in my WTL.

[Kivam]

In the meanwhile, Kivam is more busy with promoting policy lynching me cause I am not playing like he thinks a townie should play. Instead of taking into account what's happening around him.

 

Hey, Kiv. is that townie?  I heard you're the guy to ask.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JlVqfC8-UI

[Nynaeve]

I feel so violated.

[Shad_]

Shad goes quiet in the meanwhile.... because why not? Best best? Scum is between Shad/ Alanna/ Kivam/ Crusher

Oh I'm sorry, do you have a problem with me not F5ing my computer 24/7 to see what your next dumbshit accusation is? The amount of times you two have called me out for inactivity in this game is retarded. But you ignored my last question to you, so who went quiet?

[Shad_]

I'll tell you what. You come finish painting my basement and I'll make sure I can reply to all posts in under your 10 minute deadline in the meantime.

[The Crusher]

 

Nyn basically covered this, but I wanted to point out, I really, really hated this list when I first saw it.  I'm caught up so I've seen your reasoning post, and it makes MORE sense to me, but I'm still not sure I agree with it.

 

You were meant to. It had no reasons given and had some pretty strange calls (with thought process behind them, including some that were primarily reaction fishing, but not obvious thought process). Yet I basically had to push to be pushed on it. Why is that, do you think? 

 

 

I can see Calder being town, so I don't have any issues with that.  Hallia and Dice...I don't have a problem with.  I already said my piece on Hallia, but I can see why others would have her as null.  Shad's position isn't bad.

 

But I'm not sure I've seen enough from AJ to feel anything about him, besides he's an experienced player who doesn't make awful posts.  What do you think he's contributed to the game that's been "calling out the right things"?  The only thing I remember him calling out is his approach to peeks and making a comment about Laine.

 

I don't have much experience with Nolder, so I can't back or refute your claim that mafia!Nolder is self-conscious.  I just remember him being pretty quiet in TUS, and the fact he hasn't said much so far this game makes me not feel good about him.

 

Crusher I would expect to be lower for you, given the meta you provided, and I really don't like that you're essentially giving him a base when you seemingly have reason to push him.

 

 

Having Thane and Nyn as your top two scumreads is awful though.  I was a little worried about Nyn earlier when I saw she was just doing a bunch of one-liner multiquotes, but her sinking her claws in is EXACTLY how she plays, and I don't think she's been wrong to push Shad with anything she has.  None of her points were completely wrong or blatantly made up, and she obviously has a high level of conviction.  

 

Thane...eh, I'll be honest.  He always sound scummy to me.  I have a hard time reading his posts and not automatically concluding he's scum, so I wouldn't mind suspicion of him at this point, but the strongest suspect?  Really?

 

re the bold - yes, those.  That's enough on D1 for me to moderately greenread him.  Doesn't mean I trust him, and his silence since then is not helpful, but for D1 he's not in my WTL

 

Re Crush ... as I said, D1 for him it's not unusual for him to be jokey and not provide much red meat (he likes to keep the red meat for himself).  I do agree with you that the latch onto my post on Nyn was opportunistic.  Nyn isn't a player who's as careful with her words as some others might be, and frankly I was expecting her to respond with something along the lines of "I meant that I felt that I was making good observations", which was the back end of that quote ("I feel that I've been legitimately scumhunting and making good observations").  In fact, I had originally bolded the full clause in her original post, read the back end and went "oh, so that's what she meant", and decided to unbold the remainder and throw the point out there anyway to see what fishies might bite.

 

Was hoping to let that play out a bit longer before unvoting, but I think it's potentially landed a whale, particularly combined with the misdescription of Nyn's meta and the fact that he suddenly had content to provide once I identified "sliding Crush" as a sign of "scum crush".

 

[unvote]

 

[v]Crusher[/v]

 

As for Thane.  Yes.  He honestly feels completely different than any game I've ever played with him, and I've played a few.  Usually he gets scumread for content, but he's being much less controversial this game.  Usually he's bouncy and gregarious, and he's much more contained this game.  He remains firmly in my WTL.

 

You are so full of shit dude.  You tell people my scum meta is joking in the beginning of games?  Please show me a game Im scum or town I didn;t joke around in the beginning.   Just one.  Then you vote me because you are telling me my meta is wrong for Nyn? So Im scum for being wrong about Nyn's meta while you lied about mine?

 

Wow.  You would get slaughtered at JN for trying this crap.  But hey if these guys want to get duped by you, then fine.

 

unvote vote Doggin.

[Shad_]

RAAAAAGE ITT

[Nynaeve]

I'll tell you what. You come finish painting my basement and I'll make sure I can reply to all posts in under your 10 minute deadline in the meantime.

 

I like painiting

[Nynaeve]

 

Shad goes quiet in the meanwhile.... because why not? Best best? Scum is between Shad/ Alanna/ Kivam/ Crusher

Oh I'm sorry, do you have a problem with me not F5ing my computer 24/7 to see what your next dumbshit accusation is? The amount of times you two have called me out for inactivity in this game is retarded. But you ignored my last question to you, so who went quiet?

 

 

What did you ask?  I was sorta busy having a melt down. It's a bit time consuming.

[Nynaeve]

If you're referring to you asking for me to quote stuff, I did answer that.

[Clovdyx]

Now, since I've been asked a couple times about Calder, I'll start with some opinions of him from our main site.  For the record, IR means InjuredReserve, his name on the forum.

 

 

 

 

Ranked 4th on our home site, after not playing for...six months?  A year?

 

He'd be my number 1 if he played more

 

There was a point where people considered lynching him just because they didn't want to have to deal with him as scum, and if he was town why allow the cult to recruit him. Enough said best player

Ranked 1st on our site, back when it was thriving.

 

 

 

It seems like everyone forgot what IR was capable of in his absence… I don’t know how he does it, he just owns pretty much everyone… Gets to the front of the pack and gets the support he needs to remain untouchable for a long-ass time and more often than not it will be good for the Town for a while…Then he will turn around and obliterate them.

 

I used to be one of those SwAg/Chg top players bandwagoners, but after seeing what IR's done the past couple of games, he gets away with things they could never do. He's the best and if he isn't, then he's my favorite so I don't care.

 

Could tell half the Mafia players to jump off a cliff and they'd do it without question.

 

This is a smart man who understands how to build a fanbase and manipulate the situation he’s put in. Doesn’t hurt that he’s been been given power roles since his recent Mafia revival, but you can’t deny how he’s leveraged that to his advantage. Haters gon hate, but there’s a reason people gravitate towards his approach and style. IR is an artist that you can’t help but be mesmerized by. Would love to see him run a game.

 

 

 

Off the top of my head, I don't recall the guy getting lynched.  Ever.  I'm certain it's happened, but I don't recall it.  I point this out because I want to demonstrate that - first and foremost - he is a very good mafia player.  He's been playing longer than I have, which is why I asked Shad how knowing he's played once or twice changes the perception.

 

I made the comment to Calder about not claiming scum early, because he's done that before.  I'm almost certain he's done it as town, and I know for a fact he's done it as mafia.  He has no problem being the center of attention as either alignment.  I'm not surprised he's turned it down a notch here because he DOESN'T have a reputation he can float by on, but I think he'd really only care marginally; he's an incredibly intelligent person, he has very good tone, and he can spin most things in his favor. 

 

Yes, he is very argumentative.  No, that is not particularly alignment indicative - though recency bias makes me lean towards mafia, because I don't remember the last time the guy was town for more than a phase or two.  He's either dead or recruited N1.

 

Yes, he will talk in circles.  Again, I wouldn't associate that with either alignment.

 

Yes, he will try to manipulate and deceive people.  That's more inherently promaf than protown, but I'd certainly put him as FPS enough to gambit something fierce. 

 

Now, I will say that all of this is tentative, because I've only seen him play off WF once.  It was a game on Vendetta Strada, and if I'm not mistaken, he was investigated as mafia very early (N0?  N1?) and lynched afterwards.  That didn't really work out so well.     So with him not being familiar with site meta and presumably not being familiar with anyone but me, I don't know how he'll do.

 

 

TL;DR - Exceptionally good player.  Reminds me of me.  Could underwhelm a bit due to new environment.

[Kivam]

 

 

Nyn basically covered this, but I wanted to point out, I really, really hated this list when I first saw it.  I'm caught up so I've seen your reasoning post, and it makes MORE sense to me, but I'm still not sure I agree with it.

 

You were meant to. It had no reasons given and had some pretty strange calls (with thought process behind them, including some that were primarily reaction fishing, but not obvious thought process). Yet I basically had to push to be pushed on it. Why is that, do you think? 

 

 

I can see Calder being town, so I don't have any issues with that.  Hallia and Dice...I don't have a problem with.  I already said my piece on Hallia, but I can see why others would have her as null.  Shad's position isn't bad.

 

But I'm not sure I've seen enough from AJ to feel anything about him, besides he's an experienced player who doesn't make awful posts.  What do you think he's contributed to the game that's been "calling out the right things"?  The only thing I remember him calling out is his approach to peeks and making a comment about Laine.

 

I don't have much experience with Nolder, so I can't back or refute your claim that mafia!Nolder is self-conscious.  I just remember him being pretty quiet in TUS, and the fact he hasn't said much so far this game makes me not feel good about him.

 

Crusher I would expect to be lower for you, given the meta you provided, and I really don't like that you're essentially giving him a base when you seemingly have reason to push him.

 

 

Having Thane and Nyn as your top two scumreads is awful though.  I was a little worried about Nyn earlier when I saw she was just doing a bunch of one-liner multiquotes, but her sinking her claws in is EXACTLY how she plays, and I don't think she's been wrong to push Shad with anything she has.  None of her points were completely wrong or blatantly made up, and she obviously has a high level of conviction.  

 

Thane...eh, I'll be honest.  He always sound scummy to me.  I have a hard time reading his posts and not automatically concluding he's scum, so I wouldn't mind suspicion of him at this point, but the strongest suspect?  Really?

re the bold - yes, those.  That's enough on D1 for me to moderately greenread him.  Doesn't mean I trust him, and his silence since then is not helpful, but for D1 he's not in my WTL

 

Re Crush ... as I said, D1 for him it's not unusual for him to be jokey and not provide much red meat (he likes to keep the red meat for himself).  I do agree with you that the latch onto my post on Nyn was opportunistic.  Nyn isn't a player who's as careful with her words as some others might be, and frankly I was expecting her to respond with something along the lines of "I meant that I felt that I was making good observations", which was the back end of that quote ("I feel that I've been legitimately scumhunting and making good observations").  In fact, I had originally bolded the full clause in her original post, read the back end and went "oh, so that's what she meant", and decided to unbold the remainder and throw the point out there anyway to see what fishies might bite.

 

Was hoping to let that play out a bit longer before unvoting, but I think it's potentially landed a whale, particularly combined with the misdescription of Nyn's meta and the fact that he suddenly had content to provide once I identified "sliding Crush" as a sign of "scum crush".

 

[unvote]

 

[v]Crusher[/v]

 

As for Thane.  Yes.  He honestly feels completely different than any game I've ever played with him, and I've played a few.  Usually he gets scumread for content, but he's being much less controversial this game.  Usually he's bouncy and gregarious, and he's much more contained this game.  He remains firmly in my WTL.

 

You are so full of shit dude.  You tell people my scum meta is joking in the beginning of games?  Please show me a game Im scum or town I didn;t joke around in the beginning.   Just one.  Then you vote me because you are telling me my meta is wrong for Nyn? So Im scum for being wrong about Nyn's meta while you lied about mine?

 

Wow.  You would get slaughtered at JN for trying this crap.  But hey if these guys want to get duped by you, then fine.

 

unvote vote Doggin.

 

 

<snip>

 

3 - Crusher is doing his "jokey no content" dance that he does more as scum than town, which is especially odd given how eager he was for another game (he was pushing for one last one on JN, too).  But he is a light scum lean because it's D1 and that fits with townCrush as well.  It's more something to keep an eye on as the game goes on; if he stays in this mode D2, I'll be seriously concerned.  (And no, this isn't something I'd rather sit back and let develop, because few ppl here have played with Crush enough for me to want to take this to my grave if I die N1, and I'd rather have scumCrush adjust and be caught for content than risk that)

 

<snip>

 

Yep, I was absolutely telling people that this is something you do as scum but not town.  Care to try that again?

[Shad_]

Oh. I get your explanation for voting me but I wanted to know why you thought my interaction with robot dude today looked so bad. I kind of got the impression you were annoyed with both of us and lost interest in following the discussion but then you later talked about my responses to him like I was digging for an excuse to pile mud on him. I'm not sure how you get to that, kind of felt the exact opposite from my perspective: I'd respond and he'd consistently change the context in a way to make me look suspicious.

[Clovdyx]

If anybody needs me, I'm going to go snap necks of literally everyone that works for my insurance company for being <Verbal gets mad when I write these words>.

[Nynaeve]

Oh. I get your explanation for voting me but I wanted to know why you thought my interaction with robot dude today looked so bad. I kind of got the impression you were annoyed with both of us and lost interest in following the discussion but then you later talked about my responses to him like I was digging for an excuse to pile mud on him. I'm not sure how you get to that, kind of felt the exact opposite from my perspective: I'd respond and he'd consistently change the context in a way to make me look suspicious.

 

Initial stuff was more prominent in what bothered me with you. What happened later in the game when you guys got into the whole... lying thing.... well, at some point you just lost me and I didn't understand what you were talking about or arguing. But none of it really made me feel better about you. That's basically it.

 

I should have time tomorrow to do a bit of a reread..... maybe I'll feel differently reading it all with my brain not going squish.

[Kivam]

@BFG: Read that "vote: Doggin" as a vote for me; Doggin94it is the screen name I use at JN (for the edification of Clov and Calder ... picked that SN while John Abraham dogged it in the 2004 playoffs to protect his knee for pending FA), where Crush usually plays.

[Kivam]

I feel so violated.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKV2k-SOk8Q

[BFG]

@BFG: Read that "vote: Doggin" as a vote for me; Doggin94it is the screen name I use at JN (for the edification of Clov and Calder ... picked that SN while John Abraham dogged it in the 2004 playoffs to protect his knee for pending FA), where Crush usually plays.

Got it :)

[BFG]

Would appreciate it if you'd blame any mistakes in the next couple of hours on

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

VC incoming!

[BFG]

Official VC 1.7

 

Calder (1): Shad

 

Shad (2): Calder, Nyn

 

Laine (1): AJ

 

Dice (1): Nolder

 

Hallia (1): Clov

 

Crusher (1): Kivam

 

Kivam (1): Crusher

 

Not voting (5): Hallia, Thane, Zander, Laine, Dice

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Official VC 1.6

 

Calder (1): Shad

 

Shad (2): Calder, Nyn

 

Laine (1): AJ

 

Thane (1): Kivam

 

Dice (1): Nolder

 

Nolder (1): Clov

 

 

Not voting (6): Hallia, Thane, Crusher, Zander, Laine, Dice

 

Think I may have caught something on reread

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not sure why think any of that is definitionally not opportunistic

 

Because I feel that I've been legitimately scumhunting and making good observations.....and all you gotta say is.... oh that looks opportunistic. There's nothing about Shad's content so far that makes him look even slightly town imo. So I don't understand how you'd get that impression or why you think this is a v/v situation. But, w/e.

 

 

[unvote] [v]Nyn[/v]

 

Nyn, the red is verbiage that it doesn't make any sense for any townie to use under any circumstances, ever. A townie doesn't "feel that" they've been legitimately scumhunting, they simply do it ... and say so straight out.

 

Reading back and seeing this again, this looks like the "wrongly fingered scum's" lament ["how dare townie scumread me for doing ABC; yeah, I am scum, but that's exactly what I'd do as town, so they're wrong!"].

 

 

 

[v]Hallia[/v]

 

First of all, shame on you all for not even acknowledging a WWSD lynch on Nolder (in case anyone is interested, that stands for "What would Swag do?", which is a reference nobody but IR is going to get).  Second, this vote is not a joke.  I won't pretend to be particularly good at understanding Hallia - she's basically the exact opposite person I am - but what I do know is that she's not afraid to throw opinions out there with a reasonable amount of conviction to them.  And she'll back them up.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Morrrrrning

 

Catching up I like the whole Calder, Shad, Clov interaction. I dunno how to feel about Laine.

 

Dislike Dice so far. Null on Zander.

 

I don't have any real issue with the comment about Dice.  I haven't noticed him enough to make an opinion of him, myself, so that's whatever to me.  The null on Zander and Laine are kind of strange to me.  There are half a dozen players she didn't mention, why did she mention those two, specifically?  

 

But what I hate about this post is her stance on Calder/Shad/me.  "I like it" means literally nothing towards game solving.  The most obvious answer would be that she thinks we all sound like likely town in it, but I don't see HOW a townie reaches that conclusion.  Don't get me wrong - both Shad and Calder COULD both be town, but I have a hard time thinking anybody without TMI looks at that objectively and concludes them being on the same side is the likeliest scenario.

 

 

 

 

Think I may have caught something on reread

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not sure why think any of that is definitionally not opportunistic

 

Because I feel that I've been legitimately scumhunting and making good observations.....and all you gotta say is.... oh that looks opportunistic. There's nothing about Shad's content so far that makes him look even slightly town imo. So I don't understand how you'd get that impression or why you think this is a v/v situation. But, w/e.

 

 

[unvote] [v]Nyn[/v]

 

Nyn, the red is verbiage that it doesn't make any sense for any townie to use under any circumstances, ever. A townie doesn't "feel that" they've been legitimately scumhunting, they simply do it ... and say so straight out.

 

Reading back and seeing this again, this looks like the "wrongly fingered scum's" lament ["how dare townie scumread me for doing ABC; yeah, I am scum, but that's exactly what I'd do as town, so they're wrong!"].

 

Does Batmanning the shit out of this game count?  That is a nice little pick up that not even sure I would notice if you didn't point it out.  What I did notice was the pressure she added to the Calder/ Chad thing that did not seem like scum hunting.  Again less inquisitive that I associate with town Nyn and more antagonistic that I don't. 

 

vote nyn

 

 

 

 

Nyn basically covered this, but I wanted to point out, I really, really hated this list when I first saw it.  I'm caught up so I've seen your reasoning post, and it makes MORE sense to me, but I'm still not sure I agree with it.

 

You were meant to. It had no reasons given and had some pretty strange calls (with thought process behind them, including some that were primarily reaction fishing, but not obvious thought process). Yet I basically had to push to be pushed on it. Why is that, do you think? 

 

 

I can see Calder being town, so I don't have any issues with that.  Hallia and Dice...I don't have a problem with.  I already said my piece on Hallia, but I can see why others would have her as null.  Shad's position isn't bad.

 

But I'm not sure I've seen enough from AJ to feel anything about him, besides he's an experienced player who doesn't make awful posts.  What do you think he's contributed to the game that's been "calling out the right things"?  The only thing I remember him calling out is his approach to peeks and making a comment about Laine.

 

I don't have much experience with Nolder, so I can't back or refute your claim that mafia!Nolder is self-conscious.  I just remember him being pretty quiet in TUS, and the fact he hasn't said much so far this game makes me not feel good about him.

 

Crusher I would expect to be lower for you, given the meta you provided, and I really don't like that you're essentially giving him a base when you seemingly have reason to push him.

 

 

Having Thane and Nyn as your top two scumreads is awful though.  I was a little worried about Nyn earlier when I saw she was just doing a bunch of one-liner multiquotes, but her sinking her claws in is EXACTLY how she plays, and I don't think she's been wrong to push Shad with anything she has.  None of her points were completely wrong or blatantly made up, and she obviously has a high level of conviction.  

 

Thane...eh, I'll be honest.  He always sound scummy to me.  I have a hard time reading his posts and not automatically concluding he's scum, so I wouldn't mind suspicion of him at this point, but the strongest suspect?  Really?

re the bold - yes, those.  That's enough on D1 for me to moderately greenread him.  Doesn't mean I trust him, and his silence since then is not helpful, but for D1 he's not in my WTL

 

Re Crush ... as I said, D1 for him it's not unusual for him to be jokey and not provide much red meat (he likes to keep the red meat for himself).  I do agree with you that the latch onto my post on Nyn was opportunistic.  Nyn isn't a player who's as careful with her words as some others might be, and frankly I was expecting her to respond with something along the lines of "I meant that I felt that I was making good observations", which was the back end of that quote ("I feel that I've been legitimately scumhunting and making good observations").  In fact, I had originally bolded the full clause in her original post, read the back end and went "oh, so that's what she meant", and decided to unbold the remainder and throw the point out there anyway to see what fishies might bite.

 

Was hoping to let that play out a bit longer before unvoting, but I think it's potentially landed a whale, particularly combined with the misdescription of Nyn's meta and the fact that he suddenly had content to provide once I identified "sliding Crush" as a sign of "scum crush".

 

[unvote]

 

[v]Crusher[/v]

 

As for Thane.  Yes.  He honestly feels completely different than any game I've ever played with him, and I've played a few.  Usually he gets scumread for content, but he's being much less controversial this game.  Usually he's bouncy and gregarious, and he's much more contained this game.  He remains firmly in my WTL.

 

 

 

 

 

Nyn basically covered this, but I wanted to point out, I really, really hated this list when I first saw it.  I'm caught up so I've seen your reasoning post, and it makes MORE sense to me, but I'm still not sure I agree with it.

 

You were meant to. It had no reasons given and had some pretty strange calls (with thought process behind them, including some that were primarily reaction fishing, but not obvious thought process). Yet I basically had to push to be pushed on it. Why is that, do you think? 

 

 

I can see Calder being town, so I don't have any issues with that.  Hallia and Dice...I don't have a problem with.  I already said my piece on Hallia, but I can see why others would have her as null.  Shad's position isn't bad.

 

But I'm not sure I've seen enough from AJ to feel anything about him, besides he's an experienced player who doesn't make awful posts.  What do you think he's contributed to the game that's been "calling out the right things"?  The only thing I remember him calling out is his approach to peeks and making a comment about Laine.

 

I don't have much experience with Nolder, so I can't back or refute your claim that mafia!Nolder is self-conscious.  I just remember him being pretty quiet in TUS, and the fact he hasn't said much so far this game makes me not feel good about him.

 

Crusher I would expect to be lower for you, given the meta you provided, and I really don't like that you're essentially giving him a base when you seemingly have reason to push him.

 

 

Having Thane and Nyn as your top two scumreads is awful though.  I was a little worried about Nyn earlier when I saw she was just doing a bunch of one-liner multiquotes, but her sinking her claws in is EXACTLY how she plays, and I don't think she's been wrong to push Shad with anything she has.  None of her points were completely wrong or blatantly made up, and she obviously has a high level of conviction.  

 

Thane...eh, I'll be honest.  He always sound scummy to me.  I have a hard time reading his posts and not automatically concluding he's scum, so I wouldn't mind suspicion of him at this point, but the strongest suspect?  Really?

re the bold - yes, those.  That's enough on D1 for me to moderately greenread him.  Doesn't mean I trust him, and his silence since then is not helpful, but for D1 he's not in my WTL

 

Re Crush ... as I said, D1 for him it's not unusual for him to be jokey and not provide much red meat (he likes to keep the red meat for himself).  I do agree with you that the latch onto my post on Nyn was opportunistic.  Nyn isn't a player who's as careful with her words as some others might be, and frankly I was expecting her to respond with something along the lines of "I meant that I felt that I was making good observations", which was the back end of that quote ("I feel that I've been legitimately scumhunting and making good observations").  In fact, I had originally bolded the full clause in her original post, read the back end and went "oh, so that's what she meant", and decided to unbold the remainder and throw the point out there anyway to see what fishies might bite.

 

Was hoping to let that play out a bit longer before unvoting, but I think it's potentially landed a whale, particularly combined with the misdescription of Nyn's meta and the fact that he suddenly had content to provide once I identified "sliding Crush" as a sign of "scum crush".

 

[unvote]

 

[v]Crusher[/v]

 

As for Thane.  Yes.  He honestly feels completely different than any game I've ever played with him, and I've played a few.  Usually he gets scumread for content, but he's being much less controversial this game.  Usually he's bouncy and gregarious, and he's much more contained this game.  He remains firmly in my WTL.

 

You are so full of shit dude.  You tell people my scum meta is joking in the beginning of games?  Please show me a game Im scum or town I didn;t joke around in the beginning.   Just one.  Then you vote me because you are telling me my meta is wrong for Nyn? So Im scum for being wrong about Nyn's meta while you lied about mine?

 

Wow.  You would get slaughtered at JN for trying this crap.  But hey if these guys want to get duped by you, then fine.

 

unvote vote Doggin.

 

 

[Clovdyx]

Sexy vote spread.  I'd be happy with a Crusher/Hallia/Shad lynch today, but Shad would be a distant third to either of them.  

[Nynaeve]

Should go to bed soon. Maybe. 

[The Crusher]

 

 

 

Nyn basically covered this, but I wanted to point out, I really, really hated this list when I first saw it.  I'm caught up so I've seen your reasoning post, and it makes MORE sense to me, but I'm still not sure I agree with it.

 

 

You were meant to. It had no reasons given and had some pretty strange calls (with thought process behind them, including some that were primarily reaction fishing, but not obvious thought process). Yet I basically had to push to be pushed on it. Why is that, do you think? 

 

 

I can see Calder being town, so I don't have any issues with that.  Hallia and Dice...I don't have a problem with.  I already said my piece on Hallia, but I can see why others would have her as null.  Shad's position isn't bad.

 

But I'm not sure I've seen enough from AJ to feel anything about him, besides he's an experienced player who doesn't make awful posts.  What do you think he's contributed to the game that's been "calling out the right things"?  The only thing I remember him calling out is his approach to peeks and making a comment about Laine.

 

I don't have much experience with Nolder, so I can't back or refute your claim that mafia!Nolder is self-conscious.  I just remember him being pretty quiet in TUS, and the fact he hasn't said much so far this game makes me not feel good about him.

 

Crusher I would expect to be lower for you, given the meta you provided, and I really don't like that you're essentially giving him a base when you seemingly have reason to push him.

 

 

Having Thane and Nyn as your top two scumreads is awful though.  I was a little worried about Nyn earlier when I saw she was just doing a bunch of one-liner multiquotes, but her sinking her claws in is EXACTLY how she plays, and I don't think she's been wrong to push Shad with anything she has.  None of her points were completely wrong or blatantly made up, and she obviously has a high level of conviction.  

 

Thane...eh, I'll be honest.  He always sound scummy to me.  I have a hard time reading his posts and not automatically concluding he's scum, so I wouldn't mind suspicion of him at this point, but the strongest suspect?  Really?

 

re the bold - yes, those.  That's enough on D1 for me to moderately greenread him.  Doesn't mean I trust him, and his silence since then is not helpful, but for D1 he's not in my WTL

 

Re Crush ... as I said, D1 for him it's not unusual for him to be jokey and not provide much red meat (he likes to keep the red meat for himself).  I do agree with you that the latch onto my post on Nyn was opportunistic.  Nyn isn't a player who's as careful with her words as some others might be, and frankly I was expecting her to respond with something along the lines of "I meant that I felt that I was making good observations", which was the back end of that quote ("I feel that I've been legitimately scumhunting and making good observations").  In fact, I had originally bolded the full clause in her original post, read the back end and went "oh, so that's what she meant", and decided to unbold the remainder and throw the point out there anyway to see what fishies might bite.

 

Was hoping to let that play out a bit longer before unvoting, but I think it's potentially landed a whale, particularly combined with the misdescription of Nyn's meta and the fact that he suddenly had content to provide once I identified "sliding Crush" as a sign of "scum crush".

 

[unvote]

 

[v]Crusher[/v]

 

As for Thane.  Yes.  He honestly feels completely different than any game I've ever played with him, and I've played a few.  Usually he gets scumread for content, but he's being much less controversial this game.  Usually he's bouncy and gregarious, and he's much more contained this game.  He remains firmly in my WTL.

You are so full of shit dude.  You tell people my scum meta is joking in the beginning of games?  Please show me a game Im scum or town I didn;t joke around in the beginning.   Just one.  Then you vote me because you are telling me my meta is wrong for Nyn? So Im scum for being wrong about Nyn's meta while you lied about mine?

 

Wow.  You would get slaughtered at JN for trying this crap.  But hey if these guys want to get duped by you, then fine.

 unvote vote Doggin.

 

<snip>

 

3 - Crusher is doing his "jokey no content" dance that he does more as scum than town, which is especially odd given how eager he was for another game (he was pushing for one last one on JN, too).  But he is a light scum lean because it's D1 and that fits with townCrush as well.  It's more something to keep an eye on as the game goes on; if he stays in this mode D2, I'll be seriously concerned.  (And no, this isn't something I'd rather sit back and let develop, because few ppl here have played with Crush enough for me to want to take this to my grave if I die N1, and I'd rather have scumCrush adjust and be caught for content than risk that)

 

<snip>

 

 

Yep, I was absolutely telling people that this is something you do as scum but not town.  Care to try that again?

 

Oh please. Of course you hedge it.