[Standard] 11/10 Top Tier Vanilla+ Game Thread

[Andrej]

Another thing that's made it sort of hard for me to really get a grasp of the game considering the majority of my work has been through catch ups:

 

STOP POSTING SUCH DAMN WORDY RESPONSES

 

Seriously, the less you say to make the point the better. I can't even explain how many times my eyes have glazed over and I just started skimming posts because I literally did not feel like reading through them. You know who you are.

[Andrej]

In short my WTL list would be

 

Krak
Hallia

Tress

Kivam

Wombat

Darthe

[dicetosser1]

lynching the inactives aj?? arnt u one who gets @nol for that?

[Andrej]

No.

 

Also my sample size of games with Nolder is limited to like 2, literally, so I don't even know why you'd bring that up specifically unless it was a direct attempt to discredit me.

 

Which is scummy, Dice. Scummy indeed.

 

Who do you think would be a good lynch outside of sheeping Nyn's reads?

[Andrej]

Also killing inactive players early on is generally a GOOD thing. Especially in recent history of DMafia where wolf teams just allow TvT violence to destroy the game so they can skate to an easy Lylo victory. I would say a high % of times low volume = wolf

 

In short, if you aren't going to play I would rather you die because 1) you aren't helping Town and 2) you could always be scum lurking. As a player I would prefer to get bested in a ML situation from a competent and talented wolf than be forced to pick among question marks at Lylo because players don't commit or are too shy/scared to post in games.

[dicetosser1]

No.

 

Also my sample size of games with Nolder is limited to like 2, literally, so I don't even know why you'd bring that up specifically unless it was a direct attempt to discredit me.

 

Which is scummy, Dice. Scummy indeed.

 

Who do you think would be a good lynch outside of sheeping Nyn's reads?

 

wasnt meant to discredit. i actually thought you were one that i had seen getting into it with nol on this topic. if not you i apologise

[dicetosser1]

Also killing inactive players early on is generally a GOOD thing. Especially in recent history of DMafia where wolf teams just allow TvT violence to destroy the game so they can skate to an easy Lylo victory. I would say a high % of times low volume = wolf

 

In short, if you aren't going to play I would rather you die because 1) you aren't helping Town and 2) you could always be scum lurking. As a player I would prefer to get bested in a ML situation from a competent and talented wolf than be forced to pick among question marks at Lylo because players don't commit or are too shy/scared to post in games.

 

how does this change   if at all for you later game?

[Andrej]

 

No.

 

Also my sample size of games with Nolder is limited to like 2, literally, so I don't even know why you'd bring that up specifically unless it was a direct attempt to discredit me.

 

Which is scummy, Dice. Scummy indeed.

 

Who do you think would be a good lynch outside of sheeping Nyn's reads?

 

wasnt meant to discredit. i actually thought you were one that i had seen getting into it with nol on this topic. if not you i apologise

 

You're misremembering then. I've literally played 3 games with Nolder (Star Wars, Clash of Ancients, Avengers) and I have never been on this topic with him iirc. In the Star Wars game I was scum and he was town, I replaced out and I don't think we interacted at all the game. In CoA we were both scum, so were you, so any and all arguments were likely fabricated. In Avengers I was scum again and him town but I don't think we interacted very much and I was pretty much outed D1 thanks to Dawn recruiting me and being scummy enough to be viewed that same phase. So yeah - not sure who you are actually thinking of but I've never argued against lynching inactives with Nolder. In fact, there are several games where I have PUSHED inactive lynches and I'm sure I've mentioned it a few times in the various Mafia discussion threads.

 

 

Also killing inactive players early on is generally a GOOD thing. Especially in recent history of DMafia where wolf teams just allow TvT violence to destroy the game so they can skate to an easy Lylo victory. I would say a high % of times low volume = wolf

 

In short, if you aren't going to play I would rather you die because 1) you aren't helping Town and 2) you could always be scum lurking. As a player I would prefer to get bested in a ML situation from a competent and talented wolf than be forced to pick among question marks at Lylo because players don't commit or are too shy/scared to post in games.

 

how does this change   if at all for you later game?

 

I'm not exactly sure what you're asking me. Clarify please?

[dicetosser1]

ok if you think killing inactives can be good at the beginning. what about if an inactive gets near to end game? is it still good to kill them then?  would you hold off cause we are near end game etc??

 

 

that make sense?

[Andrej]

Yeah I understand the question now.

 

Which is kind of my point. Kill them early so that we don't get into a situation later in the game where we are unsure of someone's alignment because of their contribution level. I would rather go into Lylo and misvote someone because the last wolf fooled me than having to guess because a villager hasn't played much. Get my point?

 

Knock them out early and the picture as the numbers dwindle will become much more clear. Wolves get easy mislynch targets in later phases from inactive players who aren't around/can't defend themselves (not to mention the lurkers/slankers could easily be wolves) and I don't necessarily want to count on the Vigs to eliminate them in the Night phases because they have their own suspect list/agendas they want to follow.

[dicetosser1]

fair enuff   thanks for that  

[Andrej]

Cool.

 

Do you think I'm wrong on my list?

 

Who/why?

[Andrej]

FTR Krak's last post ITG was 4 days ago and was just a copy/paste of a quote he had made previously to justify him voting Sili (a confirmed townie).

 

His last LOG IN was two days ago, which shows he isn't particularly interested in participating in this game.

 

Wolfy behavior in my opinion.

[dicetosser1]

i think you are wrong on kiv and wom. Kiv im watching as i said before because he seems to intentionally post in ambiguous way. but im leaning town. tho i dont know where i stand with this talk of he's pushing hunt the SK because he is the SK.

 

Wom   I dont think wom does what he did at EOD as scum. that simple

 

 

i remember one post of kraks aside from some rubbish saying hi and stuff with nyn and lee  but that one seemed good  but its not enuff to form an opinion on

 

 

hally has done less then krak. if you want to lynch inactives she'd be first i guess

 

darthe....i can see the points but my guts leaning town.

 

tress im waiting to see this catch up

[dicetosser1]

i tend not to assign blame to inactivity like that   if theyve been posting up a storm in that period at one of the Orgs then ok  but if like TOTALLY gone for days? then no  RL rules us all in the end

[Andrej]

Fair enough Dice. I wouldn't be SUPER surprised if both Wombat/Kivam were villagers. I admit that my suspicion on Kivam is mostly OMGUS because he voiced me as a scum read earlier and I *know* that I'm not mafia or a SK in this instance, so that affects how I look at him and his posts.

 

Darthe is a very tinfoily case, I admit, but I think it has some merit was the game progresses. I don't think I'd advocate lynching him yet until I can get a better idea of his game so far through ISO and keeping a closer watch on him going forward, but in a F7/F5 situation I may start to seriously consider him as a suspect.

 

The thing with Krak is that he hasn't been around and I remember him having odd placement of Yates in his big reads list. I need to ISO him and look more closely to solidify that but for now I'm content letting the inactive players know that their absence is both unappreciated and intolerable. Play or die.

[DPR]

From a numbers perspective, lynching inactives is far more likely to end badly for the town. 

 

RL happens and no on can control that. But If a player ain't shown' up to play, they just need to be replaced.

[Nynaeve]

Halli Is gonna have to drop some truths and provide some reads. If her content seems iffy then it looks iffy. We'll see.

[Nynaeve]

Now I'm gonna go have coffee. Couldn't sleep all night and then I woke up at 1 PM -_- But at least my head is better.

[DPR]

Halli just got back from a Disney trip. I messaged her yesterday cause I'm co-mod in another game she's in. Anyways she should resurface today.

 

I'm never really for inactive lynches unless we have zero direction. Low info lynches and it's not a valid reason. In Halli's case it sucks that she didn't drop a line about not being around in any of the games she was in. And yet if she was scum I tend to believe she'd be more likely to provide a reason if she wasn't gonna be around. To avoid attention.

 

As for Krak. Aside from Discworld where he changed his playstyle completly (imo), in all other games I've played with him he's been a low poster he's a student and he typically doesn't have a lot of free time. Now obviously it would be fun if everyone posted sufficiently (under my standards) but I'm not gonna go into a play style discussion. Out of my interaction with Krak I get a light town lean. I think we butted heads and he dropped a reactionary vote because he obviously doesnt get women (no one really does, amirite? xD).

 

Anyways yeah. I'm not switching to blindlynching inactives unless it's apparent to me that they are coasting and it's not just play style and RL.

 

I read this in a literal sense and laughed. 

[Nynaeve]

Heh.

[Nynaeve]

I accidently deleted my post when I was trying to quote it on my phone. Sorry Tommy!

 

DPR you're a life saver for quoting it. <3

[Nynaeve]

Halli just got back from a Disney trip. I messaged her yesterday cause I'm co-mod in another game she's in. Anyways she should resurface today.

 

I'm never really for inactive lynches unless we have zero direction. Low info lynches and it's not a valid reason. In Halli's case it sucks that she didn't drop a line about not being around in any of the games she was in. And yet if she was scum I tend to believe she'd be more likely to provide a reason if she wasn't gonna be around. To avoid attention.

 

As for Krak. Aside from Discworld where he changed his playstyle completly (imo), in all other games I've played with him he's been a low poster he's a student and he typically doesn't have a lot of free time. Now obviously it would be fun if everyone posted sufficiently (under my standards) but I'm not gonna go into a play style discussion. Out of my interaction with Krak I get a light town lean. I think we butted heads and he dropped a reactionary vote because he obviously doesnt get women (no one really does, amirite? xD).

 

Anyways yeah. I'm not switching to blindlynching inactives unless it's apparent to me that they are coasting and it's not just play style and RL.

note: if you're ISOing me I accidently deleted the post above.

 

 

 

Also after thinking about it Halli not giving notice is just null, really. I have seen scum sometimes just not post and then later on provide as an excuse. So it really shouldnt be a point in her favor.

 

I'll look up later what posts she made. Can't recall anything.

[Nynaeve]

Oh she only has 3  xD

[Kivam]

Just getting back and starting to catch up, but I have to leave for an appointment in a bit.  Will work through what I can before I go and then come back

 

Pray, if you seriously are town here, don't ever be the first one to point to a post after someone flips scum and be like "haha, thank God this spews me town"

 

It just looks INCREDIBLY wolfy dude, and YOU'D be responsible for a mislynch on you here were that to happen. Let SOMEONE ELSE point that kind of thing out, yeesh.

 

@Kivam: I think that argument in general is as useless as an extra butthole on my elbow. Killing the SK is all fine and dandy, but the SK isn't exactly going to flare up a sign that says "Lynch me! I'm the SK!" so hunting for them would be basically more dubious than hunting mafia.

 

Let's find not-town and burn them with fire till they're dead, kk? Good.

 

Someone tell me whether Des has played in a SK game before, because if he has, this post is jumping up and down and waving its arms. 

 

Play this logic out, if you would: A SK is not going to do anything to make themselves huntable ... so, therefore, we ought to give up now or start random lynching once the scum is gone?  Pray that the SK was dumb enough to choose BPV over seer confirmation and that our seer will find him ?  Hope that a townie vig makes a pure lucky hero shot, or that scum does our work for us with an accidental NK?  No.

 

We need to be actively looking for the SK, because a lynch remains our best weapon.  Again, we shouldn't ignore obvious mafia because we are looking for a SK, so if we have a solid case on scum (or better, a seer view) we lynch them, but we can't get so lost in the weeds of associative logic that we forget that a SK doesn't have any. 

 

There are only three player types who don't want the town thinking this way: (1) an inexperienced player who doesn't know; (2) an experienced but bad player; or (3) a SK.  Which is why every time someone says "no, let's not keep our eyes out for SK possibilities", my antenna raise and stay raised.

 

@everyone: your thoughts on which of the 3 categories Des fits into?