[Standard] 11/10 Top Tier Vanilla+ Game Thread

[Nynaeve]

 

CFD you? lol  You were the leading train way before deadline.

 

 

Fake.

At that time I was still 2-3 votes behind. That was a last minute push by him, but if you want to think it as bussing, I have no words.

 

 

 

1. The deadline was when you were sleeping because of time zones. So you trying to manipulate it to 'oh man, Yates, nice try. PFFT trying to lynch me when I'm sleeping' is lol worthy.

 

2. You were a leading train the majority of the day. Since about the time you subbed in. There wasn't anything 'sneaky' about it, like you're trying to portray it.

 

3. You having no words about this possibly being bussing is funny.

 

4. Your read list left a lot to desire. I don't see GOAT Pral in the building.

 

5. Arsis was wolfy

 

 

 

This all spells out duh.

[Pralaya]

The rest of the scum are RB and two vigs.

 

All three are vital for scum to win this game. That is why your whole push is funny - when your big argument is that the GF was bussing the other important roles on D1.

[Cass]

 

Kivam positioning himself as town leader. Good or bad?

 

Depends on how pushy he gets.

 

You and Verb need to have a big day.

 

Wombat is larking.

 

Cass is - WFI - apologizing that her post count and style are going to change... Knock me over with a feather that doesn't. Explains the Desploitation.

 

Des is such an asshat that it's impossible to tell if he's wrecking ball the town or dragging his wolf team down. Either way, he's a terrible distraction.

 

We'll be needing to hear from the inactives today. Silence is suspect.

 

Party on.

 

 

Could also be that I'm just a complete noob who's inexperienced at the nuances of the game so should learn to shut her mouth some.

I think you mentioned something earlier about me having an over-inflated ego. Perhaps you were right. Help me out here potential-Scum who doesn't like answering my questions.

 

What are your thoughts on Wombat? And if you want to make me believe you, you had better make them good.

[Pralaya]

4. Your read list left a lot to desire. I don't see GOAT Pral in the building.

 

5. Arsis was wolfy

4. Was based on 1/3rd of the game. Of course it left a lot to desire.

5. Can't help that

[Nynaeve]

The rest of the scum are RB and two vigs.

 

All three are vital for scum to win this game. That is why your whole push is funny - when your big argument is that the GF was bussing the other important roles on D1.

 

Wow you're right. Yates always plays it's safe. 

 

[Thane Vakarian]

HEY GUYS I THINK I MADE A MISTAKE DO YOU THINK WE COULD SWING A DPR CFD?

so, this is the only mention i can find for a CFD EOD.... by Wombat... for DPR....

 

 

The funny thing is I can't even really articulate a single reason why Sili is an objectively bad lynch; it just feels wrong in this moment.

Lack of traction.

 

We can just lynch Pral. Arsis was not playing his normal Town game and Pral can't even bother to play his slot. At least Sili is engaging the thread and looking like normal Sili to me.

 

No mention of CFD... just lynch Pral. Could've been mentioned so he'd gain towncred in case a wolf would be lynched. Would've been credible too, imo. 

 

 

 

The funny thing is I can't even really articulate a single reason why Sili is an objectively bad lynch; it just feels wrong in this moment.

Lack of traction.

 

We can just lynch Pral. Arsis was not playing his normal Town game and Pral can't even bother to play his slot. At least Sili is engaging the thread and looking like normal Sili to me.

 

 

Nice try Yates. Trying to CFD me when I was sleeping. Now I need to look at who else was on my wagon and on Sili's because I am pretty sure they were evenly split up.

 

entire post here.... yeah, not buying it. IF you post stuff like this, make sure you have your facts straight. Slippery slip here..

 

vote:##PRAL

[DPR]

 

 

Kivam positioning himself as town leader. Good or bad?

 

Depends on how pushy he gets.

 

You and Verb need to have a big day.

 

Wombat is larking.

 

Cass is - WFI - apologizing that her post count and style are going to change... Knock me over with a feather that doesn't. Explains the Desploitation.

 

Des is such an asshat that it's impossible to tell if he's wrecking ball the town or dragging his wolf team down. Either way, he's a terrible distraction.

 

We'll be needing to hear from the inactives today. Silence is suspect.

 

Party on.

 

 

Could also be that I'm just a complete noob who's inexperienced at the nuances of the game so should learn to shut her mouth some.

I think you mentioned something earlier about me having an over-inflated ego. Perhaps you were right. Help me out here potential-Scum who doesn't like answering my questions.

 

What are your thoughts on Wombat? And if you want to make me believe you, you had better make them good.

 

 

Believe me - don't believe me. It doesn't matter. You listening to others will get you into trouble every time.

 

And no, it can't be that yesterday you posted material that Kivam compared to his own posts, but today you're an inexperienced noob. Sorry.

 

My thoughts on Wombat are that Wombat knows full well what he's doing and he has a reason for doing it. You want to know more about him, you should hit him up for some conversation. heh

[DPR]

 

HEY GUYS I THINK I MADE A MISTAKE DO YOU THINK WE COULD SWING A DPR CFD?

so, this is the only mention i can find for a CFD EOD.... by Wombat... for DPR....

 

 

The funny thing is I can't even really articulate a single reason why Sili is an objectively bad lynch; it just feels wrong in this moment.

Lack of traction.

 

We can just lynch Pral. Arsis was not playing his normal Town game and Pral can't even bother to play his slot. At least Sili is engaging the thread and looking like normal Sili to me.

 

No mention of CFD... just lynch Pral. Could've been mentioned so he'd gain towncred in case a wolf would be lynched. Would've been credible too, imo. 

 

 

 

The funny thing is I can't even really articulate a single reason why Sili is an objectively bad lynch; it just feels wrong in this moment.

Lack of traction.

 

We can just lynch Pral. Arsis was not playing his normal Town game and Pral can't even bother to play his slot. At least Sili is engaging the thread and looking like normal Sili to me.

 

 

Nice try Yates. Trying to CFD me when I was sleeping. Now I need to look at who else was on my wagon and on Sili's because I am pretty sure they were evenly split up.

 

entire post here.... yeah, not buying it. IF you post stuff like this, make sure you have your facts straight. Slippery slip here..

 

vote:##PRAL

 

 

You and Nyn have built a nice little pen here. Pral's vote on Tress also smacks of distancing. 

[Barmacral]

 

 

 

Kivam positioning himself as town leader. Good or bad?

 

 

Awkward.

 

If he is town why on Earth would you point this out so dramatically so soon??

 

Kiv? You still Scum?

 

 

Town leader basically means he's taking the lead and directing the game, not that he's actually town. I'm calling it to attention because if he's leading the town as scum we're going down hard, but if he is town then we're doing well. It isn't something that can be ignored.

 

 

 

Yes, Barm I totally agree. And that was kinda my point. How the hell do we figure out if Kiv is Scum????

 

This has been pivotal for me for ages now, for obvious reasons, and I still can't figure it out. 

 

Theoretically, if DPR AND KIV are Scum we need them voted out ASAP. But.....

 

I'm starting to waver. And I hate it 'cos I don't know who is screwing with my head.

 

Is our safest bet here to look a WHOLE LOT HARDER  at Wombat???

 

Supposing even IF DPR and Kiv ARE SCUM... Is there any reason why we wouldn't lynch Wombat first?

 

Aaarrrrgh!!!! I don't have enough experience with this stuff!!!

 

HELP!

 

 

 

PS. Only answer this if you are Town. That would help a whole lot too. Cheers.

 

 

How to catch them? Evidence, DPR and Kiv are good, but they make slips too. With the new evidence of all the dead people, especially yates, go back and read how they interact with them (and others). Looking at Wombat is A safe bet and to be encouraged, but don't tunnel in on him, look at everyone else too.

 

Kivam's accusation of Wombat is also of him being the SK, not scum. While good to get rid of them, scum are more important. Dig into Wombat for your own reasons, but not for Kiv's.

 

 

Kivam positioning himself as town leader. Good or bad?

 

Depends on how pushy he gets.

 

You and Verb need to have a big day.

 

 

About as big as yours. Less so possibly since you're in the spotlight a lot more.

[hazelkrs1]

 

Also I think Wombat looks legitimately wolfy for his posturing near EOD yesterday.

 

He acts like it was a "near-CFD" he led, but SILI WAS THE LEAD WAGON THE WHOLE TIME. Furthermore the "results" of his reaction test looked entirely sided towards assuming Sili would flip town (also his thing about me looking worse with a Sili townflip was absolute dogshit), he even said at the end "hope Sili flips SK" which smacks of TMI

 

I think Wombat saw himself getting town read yesterday, and his whole demeanor changed. Started posturing a lot more, acting generally obnoxious like a wolf grinning to himself about being miscleared. I think he felt he would be able to fairly easily "lead" a lynch on Sili and keep DPR from being CFD'ed upon

 

This is actually not a bad point.  I saw that too - but I have a different read on why, and I think your tunnel on Wes is not helping you think this through, since you're viewing everything through that prism.  IIRC, Wombat's play changed just about right after I pointed out to Cass that a SK wants to be in the muddled middle, because looking too townie will get them night killed.  Prior to that comment, he was playing about as strongly "straight up town" a game as I could ask for.  After it, he started playing differently.  Not necessarily overtly scummy ... but there was a large shift in his game play.

 

So, question/challenge for the group: Go review Wombat's play before and after this post on page 44

 

Oh, and pending re-evaluation, [v]##vote Wombat[/v].   

 

 

The post I quoted from Wombat was actually before that- on page 40.

 

So eh call it tinfoil, call it confbias, but you trying to take credit for his change in behavior makes me think this could be distancing on your part.

 

 

Are you insane?  You do understand that if you are hard claiming seer - which is what your last posts look like - you are dead tonight since with the JK dead there's no townie role that can stop a kill, right?  I was trying to give you some cover, you goof, but you've blown that pretty hard core.  The other options are you are really committed to seer cover and willing to die for it as a vanilla townie - which would be very odd given that only 2 other claimants are out there so odds are good that (if it ain't you) the Seer did the smart thing and never claimed at all - or you are scum and will be left alive.  If you're still breathing Day 3, we can consider that option, but my best evaluation is you won't be. 

 

 

 

OK, seer cover people (Darthe, Andrej, Des): who did you view last night, what was the result, and why?

 

Hahahahaha

 

NO

 

 

Seriously, you asking me to reveal immediately like this Kivam- holy hell that reeks of scum.

 

WHY IN THE SEVEN HELLS WOULD I REVEAL A FINDING AT DAYBREAK WHEN I CAN HOLD ONTO THAT AND CATCH WILVES WITH IT?????

 

:smh:

 

 

 

OBVIOUSLY I know with the JK dead I'm not going to live long enough for another viewing.

 

OBVIOUSLY I'm not going to let today's lynch be secured without revealing my viewing at some point- sheesh kind of offended you would even think I'd be dumb enough to not get that out

 

Regardless, revealing my findings from last night right at daybreak is a total noob move, and I sir am not a noob. I don't want to let scum play it safe, I want them to sweat and worry about tripping over themselves once I DO reveal.

 

And I really think you'd be experienced and wise enough to know how protown of a move this is.

 

 

And even self conscious and preemptively dismissing the dadv thing- yeah I def think there's a very good chance of him being scum here.

 

I'm pretty good at judging town!Womby as well, he's usually obvtown to me fairly early when he is. Early on his tone looked good, but halfway through the day he took a scummy nosedive

 

What the hell is DADV?  Seen it mentioned once or twice, don't recognize the abbreviation

 

Dead Air, Dead Villager. It describes a situation where EOD happens without much scrambling, or anyone freaking out about whether the lynch is right or not. That kind of lack of activity often spells out a situation where the lynch is happening on a townie

 

Or in other words, EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED YESTERDAY. I think Stelio and I were the ONLY people who were actively trying to push different things to figure something out, and both of us expressed doubt of Sili flipping scum. So many other people were content to leave votes parked on Sili for a long amount of time, or drop in lazy votes towards EOD without bothering to engage Sili and see if they were right, or discuss the other options on the table.

 

That's why I was waving my arms like a crazy person yesterday trying to get people to get off Sili, but eh wolves obv weren't going to jump off, and townies not acting concerned about it at all ENABLED those wolves in being able to slank it so hard.

 

 

this gif.

 

And good game Yates, def fooled me.

 

 

 

 

The funny thing is I can't even really articulate a single reason why Sili is an objectively bad lynch; it just feels wrong in this moment.

Lack of traction.

 

We can just lynch Pral. Arsis was not playing his normal Town game and Pral can't even bother to play his slot. At least Sili is engaging the thread and looking like normal Sili to me.

 

 

Nice try Yates. Trying to CFD me when I was sleeping. Now I need to look at who else was on my wagon and on Sili's because I am pretty sure they were evenly split up.

 

 

CFD you? lol  You were the leading train way before deadline.

 

 

Fake.

 

 

Yeah I also thought that post looked pretty fake.

 

However, I also actually really liked his case on Tress tbh...

 

I think there's a VERY good chance of there being one scum between Tress and Pray, and I doubt they're wolves together.

[Pralaya]

 

The rest of the scum are RB and two vigs.

 

All three are vital for scum to win this game. That is why your whole push is funny - when your big argument is that the GF was bussing the other important roles on D1.

 

Wow you're right. Yates always plays it's safe. 

 

 

This is not about playing safe. The setup is clearly not designed for bussing. You are over-reaching here.

[hazelkrs1]

The rest of the scum are RB and two vigs.

 

All three are vital for scum to win this game. That is why your whole push is funny - when your big argument is that the GF was bussing the other important roles on D1.

 

This was a bad defense to make Pray.

 

Yates don't GAF about the risk of a gambit, he cares more about the payoff and wifom it can bring to the table. As Nyn pointed out, he's NOT one to play it very conservative.

 

Prepost edit: You seem to think this setup doesn't encourage bussing just because the scum team is heavily powered.... FAIL.

 

N1 Scum Vig loses it's utility after N1. Same for N2 Vig after N2. RB'er not as effective after early on too.

 

PLUS, it sells a bus/distancing move THAT MUCH MORE if the target is a PR.

 

So no, your point about this setup not favoring bussing is pretty bad.

 

HOWEVER, I CAN see town!Pray believing this argument, so eh.

 

 Pral's vote on Tress also smacks of distancing. 

 

Believe it or not, recent events had actually made me start to SLIGHTLY reconsider my read of DPR, but this post gives me skeptical face on him again. Looks like him trying to link the two, I didn't think Pray's vote on Tress looked like distancing.

[Nynaeve]

This is not about playing safe. The setup is clearly not designed for bussing. You are over-reaching here.

 

Is this really your line of defense?  "What would scum not do"? 

 

Noted xD

[Pralaya]

This was a bad defense to make Pray.

 

Yates don't GAF about the risk of a gambit, he cares more about the payoff and wifom it can bring to the table. As Nyn pointed out, he's NOT one to play it very conservative.

 

Prepost edit: You seem to think this setup doesn't encourage bussing just because the scum team is heavily powered.... FAIL.

 

N1 Scum Vig loses it's utility after N1. Same for N2 Vig after N2. RB'er not as effective after early on too.

 

PLUS, it sells a bus/distancing move THAT MUCH MORE if the target is a PR.

 

So no, your point about this setup not favoring bussing is pretty bad.

 

HOWEVER, I CAN see town!Pray believing this argument, so eh.

Exactly. We are talking about D1 bussing here. Not late game bussing.

Read your own statement and read what I am trying to say and connect.

[DPR]

 

 

About as big as yours. Less so possibly since you're in the spotlight a lot more.

 

 

Man, I'm always in the spotlight. I do what I do. Activity ain't one of my problems in life.

 

What are the the chances a scum team leaves me and Kiv on the board? Several possibilities here - but only several. Whadya think?

[hazelkrs1]

That being said, I think I'm actually going to table the DPR read for a little bit. Would rather get a wide scope of everything, and maybe his bad and scummy play can be excused partly on rust, partly on not being used to new DM environment, and partly on me even (considering our history). I STILL think his push on Sili yesterday, regarding "evidence" was mightly wolfy, but eh we're not out here to catch ONE scum, but to pokecatchemall.

 

So I want to at least reread all of Yates' posts obviously, and if possible reread all of D1 to see how others interacted with him.

 

Off the top of my head tho, I'm about ready to lock clear Dice. Despite me just mentioning Yates' penchant for gambits, I actually don't think he'd "clear" a teammate with his opening seer claim thing. Dice's reaction and seeming to genuinely believe Yates had "cleared" him also kinda seems like genuine town Dice as well. Don't expect anyone else to take this as gospel, but yeah I don't think Dice is mafia here at least. MAYBE SK, for how quick he jumped on board being "cleared", but don't think he's teammates with Dice

[hazelkrs1]

 

 

 

About as big as yours. Less so possibly since you're in the spotlight a lot more.

 

 

Man, I'm always in the spotlight. I do what I do. Activity ain't one of my problems in life.

 

What are the the chances a scum team leaves me and Kiv on the board? Several possibilities here - but only several. Whadya think?

 

 

Wanted to resist the urge to comment, but eh screw it

 

HIGHLY doubt scum would have killed either of you last night, if you WERE town (either or both of you). Kivam was actually one of the train candidates yesterday and has some stuff against him, and you, well, you seriously are playing extremely scummy so if town I doubt scum would kill one of the scummiest mislynch opportunities in the game.

 

ALSO think this could be you trying to lay the foundation for voting Kivam at some point, on the grounds that he should have been NK'ed already.

 

Anyways.

[hazelkrs1]

 

This was a bad defense to make Pray.

 

Yates don't GAF about the risk of a gambit, he cares more about the payoff and wifom it can bring to the table. As Nyn pointed out, he's NOT one to play it very conservative.

 

Prepost edit: You seem to think this setup doesn't encourage bussing just because the scum team is heavily powered.... FAIL.

 

N1 Scum Vig loses it's utility after N1. Same for N2 Vig after N2. RB'er not as effective after early on too.

 

PLUS, it sells a bus/distancing move THAT MUCH MORE if the target is a PR.

 

So no, your point about this setup not favoring bussing is pretty bad.

 

HOWEVER, I CAN see town!Pray believing this argument, so eh.

Exactly. We are talking about D1 bussing here. Not late game bussing.

Read your own statement and read what I am trying to say and connect.

 

 

D1 Bussing/Distancing doesn't mean the lynch is GUARANTEED to be secured on the scum. Don't be daft.

 

And again, bussing a teammate that flips a PR just sells the bus that much more.

 

Don't act like these arguments don't exist, I'm not stupid and Nyn isn't either. Stop trying to treat the issue like it's black and white, it looks wolfy.

[hazelkrs1]

Fyi for anyone wanting to do an iso on Yates, don't forget the period on the end of his name.

 

His username is "Yates."

[DPR]

 

 

 

 

About as big as yours. Less so possibly since you're in the spotlight a lot more.

 

 

Man, I'm always in the spotlight. I do what I do. Activity ain't one of my problems in life.

 

What are the the chances a scum team leaves me and Kiv on the board? Several possibilities here - but only several. Whadya think?

 

 

Wanted to resist the urge to comment, but eh screw it

 

HIGHLY doubt scum would have killed either of you last night, if you WERE town (either or both of you). Kivam was actually one of the train candidates yesterday and has some stuff against him, and you, well, you seriously are playing extremely scummy so if town I doubt scum would kill one of the scummiest mislynch opportunities in the game.

 

ALSO think this could be you trying to lay the foundation for voting Kivam at some point, on the grounds that he should have been NK'ed already.

 

Anyways.

 

 

Thank you Captain Obvious. In related news, water is still wet.

 

But I'll throw ya a bone since you're the Seer Cover expert - thrill us with your thoughts on Yates claim.

[Thane Vakarian]

Yates claimed seer (for seer cover) to gain town cred. It's not rocketscience imo.

[Pralaya]

D1 Bussing/Distancing doesn't mean the lynch is GUARANTEED to be secured on the scum. Don't be daft.

 

And again, bussing a teammate that flips a PR just sells the bus that much more.

 

Don't act like these arguments don't exist, I'm not stupid and Nyn isn't either. Stop trying to treat the issue like it's black and white, it looks wolfy.

Again, we are looking at a specific context. Namely the argument that Yates was trying to bus me on D1 when I had a good probability that I would be lynched over Sili. Even you changed your vote after Yates made it, if I am not wrong. All my points are based on this specific context and how it does not make sense at all.

 

It is possible, of course, but not probable.

[Nynaeve]

lol

[Nynaeve]

(that was at Thane xD)

[Kivam]

 

Kivam positioning himself as town leader. Good or bad?

 

 

Awkward.

 

If he is town why on Earth would you point this out so dramatically so soon??

 

Kiv? You still Scum?

 

 

LOL.  It's especially awkward because Barm, of all people, know I play town-leader whether I'm town or scum, and it ends up either being very good or very bad, depending.  So it's an odd question, and not much of a reaction poke either (since the people who've played with me know that, and the others wouldn't be expected to).

 

I'm still town, and you should still not trust me.  Go reread the thread, make your own call.  I'm just identifying something to look for.