No sex in my books, ever.

[richglennon]

Hi all,

 

New to the boards. I am re-reading from book 1 and am about halfway thru book 5 now. This is my sixth time reading thru. Am I the only dork out there who prepares to read a new installment by reading the first ten volumes? Just to remember? Ive read about 3000 pages since Jan 1st and still cant remember half of it.

 

Anyway, I know I always kinda disliked it, but I guess I have to come out and say it after reading George Martin's Fire and Ice series. Why cant Jordan relax his grip on male/female relationships? Why are the women always so friggin uptight or cast in such a bad Light (no pun) in the WOT? As I remember after reading 15000 pages or so, only Perrin and Zarine get it on, and that is a maybe (nobody ever gets pregnant in the series). God knows how they reproduce in the Two Rivers. I guess only the Aiel get it on.

 

I know Tolkien had his limitations. No Hobbit on Hobbit love. At least he pushed the whole sexual envelope with Aragorn sorta lusting after Eowin, but still promised to Arwen. (Why the hell did Peter Jackson develop the part for Liv Tyler? Ok, we all know.)

 

I still love the books, dont get me wrong. I just hope when Harriet writes the final volume, they can finally let loose, get married, have an orgy, or something.

 

Richie

[Thor]

wtf?

 

Sounds like you haven't got a clue.

 

And Tolkien did write a lot about relationships, Simarilion was full of them. Beren and Tinuviel kicked as s.

[richglennon]

I said that Tolkien had a clue. Learn to read. Even in the 40s, sex wasnt so taboo. I was just wondering when and where it became such an issue for the WOT books in the 90s

[Tea with the Dark One]

There is sex in WoT. If you will recall, Rand knocks boots with Aviendha, Min, and Elayne (the sly dog) and Elayne gets prego with twins. How about Mat and Tylin? And Mat and half the serving women from the Aryth Ocean to the Spine of the World? Logain gets it on with one of the Aes Sedai he bonded. How about any mention of "pillow friends" in the white tower . . . including Elaida? I'm sure there are several more references that I'm missing. Wasn't it part of Liandrin's punishment that she become the toy of some lecherous darkfriend? No sex?

wtf?

[RobertAlexWillis]

Hey guys ... he said he was only halfway through book 5. At that point, it had all been pretty buttoned up.

 

So you know, rich, there is alot more sex in the second half of the series. Everyone just had to get to know other people first .... except Mat, who just had to get away from Nynaeve and Egwene. Believe me, by the end of Book 11, Perrin is the one getting the least action.

[Thor]

Yeah, I think even Lan got more than Perrin, lol that makes me feel really sorry for Perrin considering Lan's mental state. :lol:

[Guest Egwene]

I am happy that there isn't more graphic sex in the books. If that was what I was looking for... there are plenty of books available that concentrate on that topic. I have enough imagination in that department to fill in what is only suggested at for myself, thank you very much

[richglennon]

Like I said, still on book 5 for the sixth time. I totally forgot about what you guys said about the later books.

 

I guess the most annoying thing when you read them again is that Jordan never fails to add the line:

 

(Rand, Mat, Perrin) "X always knows how or what to do around girls. I bet if he were here, blah, blah. He would know how to handle this" I think we have all deduced that they are around 19 when the series started. I am sure they all know what to do with their Heron marked swords, smith hammers, or bo-staffs. I guess, its just reading the books too much.

[richglennon]

And Egwene, sorry. I know those books too.

 

I dont know how to describe it. It's not just the sex. he more you read them, the more you love them, and the more you want to strangle them. I guess it's just the innocence of the characters I guess.

 

Trust me, I wouldn't keep reading them over and over if they were not the best modern fantasy epic. You have to admit though, certain things start to annoy you after a while besides me.

[Guest Egwene]

I think that the line 'what to do around girls' is more generally about understanding women rather than about never having had a girlfriend. I believ most men still have problems with that line when they are eighty, lol.

[richglennon]

It should be interesting though. Rumor has it that since he is now very sick, Harriet, his wife, will compile his uber-notes/endings/ etc.. and write the last 1600 pages or so to complete the last book. Maybe she will let up on us guys?

[Mat Cauthon]

It should be interesting though. Rumor has it that since he is now very sick' date=' Harriet, his wife, will compile his uber-notes/endings/ etc.. and write the last 1600 pages or so to complete the last book. Maybe she will let up on us guys?[/quote']

 

I haven't heard that. At the top of the page we have a link to Robert Jordan's blog. He actually is doing really well right now. His wife will have to do it if God forbid RJ dies or gets too sick before he can finish, but I am pretty sure that at the moment RJ is the one working on it still.

[Guest Egwene]

I guess it depends on what you are looking for in a book, Richglennon. And for me, honestly, I'd rather have RJ's way of very little graphic sex than for example the earth chidren series in the later books where sex happens every twenty pages and frankly, is a real turn off after a while.

 

Kids do grow up far more innocently in most rural enviroments. They are far more likely to marry their childhood sweetheart than kids in town. Everyone knows everyone else, and being sexually promiscous is just not an option unless you want to get on the wrong side of most other people you know. So people have steady relationships, and the 'Egwene/Rand promised to each other' scenario is quite common. It also means that you grow up with those sort of values and like some of the characters in the book, aren't in a hurry to shake them off.

 

There are bits and pieces in the books that I would have prefered to be different, but overall, I sometimes feel that RJ must have written them based on knowing exactly what I like to read. The one and only character that I loathe with a passion is the false prophet.

 

As for the rumours... looking at the latest Blog entries, things are looking up, and I am sure RJ will do as much as he can himself. Also, whilst maybe accepting some help from Harriet, he'll keep control of what is happening. All endings and major plot developments would have been settled on a long time ago anyway.

[richglennon]

That is good to hear. Havent kept up on his news as of lately. I just remember reading that his wife is his number one editor and critic and knows the whole undecimology (just take Latin and add ology). I hope he can keep writing forever and that this last one is out before they nail shut his coffin.

[Kaznen]

I guess it depends on what you are looking for in a book' date=' Richglennon. And for me, honestly, I'd rather have RJ's way of very little graphic sex than for example the earth chidren series in the later books where sex happens every twenty pages and frankly, is a real turn off after a while. [/quote']

 

Amen, in the Earth's Children series the constant graphic sex became a distraction.

 

"Okay, Ayla and Jondalar are having sex, again, I'll flip ahead a couple pages...still having sex, a few more...still having sex..."

[richglennon]

And screw it. I have read these books way too much. I still have my original copy of Eye of the World, pages falling out and all. I agree, that when I first read it when I was a teen, it was amazing and pure fantasy. I guess that is why I read them still; just to forget. It is 17 years later and I am more jaded and have seen some of the sickest, most amoral things I could never have imagined when I was 12. Sign up for a tour if you want to see how the world really is.

 

Anyway, Im sorry, I digress. I see your point though, if not in a naive way. Remember, these books are written for adults.

[Tea with the Dark One]

Hey guys ... he said he was only halfway through book 5. At that point' date=' it had all been pretty buttoned up.[/quote']

 

My bad. When richglennon said this was his sixth re-read I assumed he meant that he had read all 11 books five times and was working his way through the series a sixth time. I'm on my fourth re-read of the whole series and am currently at 3/4 thru TDR. Didn't mean to spoil anything for you. Apologies.

[RobertAlexWillis]

My bad. When richglennon said this was his sixth re-read I assumed he meant that he had read all 11 books five times and was working his way through the series a sixth time. I'm on my fourth re-read of the whole series and am currently at 3/4 thru TDR. Didn't mean to spoil anything for you. Apologies.

 

Actually, its funny, now that I look back at what he said, I think you were right ...

 

 

Which makes his comments kind of silly ....

 

 

At any rate, there's plenty of sex going on.

[kmlau]

The thing about his wife writing the end of novel is from a fortune (i think its fortune) magazine interview of RJ when he first got diagnosed the condition, but I think god wont let RJ die yet :D .

 

And about the sex part, I think RJ has done it just right. Song of ice and fire is way over the top. The sex there which simply from the first book already describes lots of incest and *ahem* underaged *ahem* sex, and certainly other quite vulgar scenes, that was my biggest put off for the ice and fire series.

[Leopoled Boothe]

Good gawd man, think about what you're asking for here!!!! We all know how much intricate detail RJ can go into when just describing a woman's dress. If he did the same when describing sex we would be reading lines that would make John Holmes blush. Let us be thankfull that RJ does not include graphic sex in his novels.

[cannon]

At least he pushed the whole sexual envelope with Aragorn sorta lusting after Eowin' date=' but still promised to Arwen.[/quote']

 

I don't remember this from the books at all. It's been a little while since I read them, but it was my impression that Eowyn had a crush on Aragorn that was completely unreturned.

 

It was just the movies which turned it into the brief romantic possibility. And that was only because at that point Arwen was seriously considering leaving Middle-Earth, which also never happened in the book. In the book, they had been sworn to each other for some time, and it was always her intention to rule with Aragorn when he gained the crown.

[Leopoled Boothe]

I don't remember this from the books at all. It's been a little while since I read them, but it was my impression that Eowyn had a crush on Aragorn that was completely unreturned.

 

That's how I remember it too. Eowyn was attracted Aragorn, but as far as Aragorn was concerned Arowen was his one and only and he never gave Eowyn a second glance. In the movie there was a bit of flirtation between Eowyn and Aragorn but in either book or movie "lusting" never entered the equation on the part of either character.

[Slinx]

Read Chris Bunch if you want sex involved.

 

Actually, I think I can understand Rich, he just wants to see the characters get laid.

 

I know when I read a book from a male's POV and a female is introduced as 'attractive' or the like, then my mental state is 'he needs to do her and run'.

[mightisright]

If your looking for more graphic romantic scenes RJ has done some...He hints at many things in WoT, but if you read his Conan novels you can see how he would finish his hints. Much spanking ensues.

[Lady Saravhem]

:shock: His books dealing with the Fallon family have sex situations as found in what some call bodice rippers, but the story lines are much more developed then those of historical romances with lots of action. I have only read the first two and they are good. Stories about a South Carolina family 1st set during the Revolutionary War 2nd set around time of the War of 1812 and Luisiana Purchase.

People in these stories have more sex then even Conan thought about.

His Conan character to me seems almost a cross between Matt and Perrin. Kind of wierd I know.

I'm outta here!