Clash of Divinity - Advanced Mafia - Day 7 - Reckoning

[Darthe]

I'm for it. I think Darthe is full of poop since D2. If I'm wrong, I blame Darthe for having terrible rhetoric. 

 

Vote Darthe again

 

This is also a slip up.  Rhetoric is only needed by those who have reason to convince a group of their standpoint.  I have no reason to do so because I have only presented truth.  Your attempts to discredit me are, indeed, the quickest way to get me killed but they are subpar ways of discerning truth which is why I will inevitably be victorious.  Even if it causes my death.  

[Tommyrod]

 

I'm for it. I think Darthe is full of poop since D2. If I'm wrong, I blame Darthe for having terrible rhetoric. 

 

Vote Darthe again

 

This is also a slip up.  Rhetoric is only needed by those who have reason to convince a group of their standpoint.  I have no reason to do so because I have only presented truth.  Your attempts to discredit me are, indeed, the quickest way to get me killed but they are subpar ways of discerning truth which is why I will inevitably be victorious.  Even if it causes my death.  

 

 

How mad will you be if we just softball this one in and I promise to kill Rags if you were telling the truth?

[Darthe]

Mad?  Not really mad.  Sort of disappointed but I am regularly disappointed in mafia.  People tend to forgoe logic in favor of what they want to believe.  It loses me a lot of games because I am not great at rhetoric, I don't often bother with convincing people who are too moronic to recognize the truth as it is.

[Tommyrod]

 

Rags, what faction are you now? Help me figure out this game.

 

I'd lynch Darthe. I'm finding both Darthe and Dice hard to believe at this point. If I had to guess, I'd say the roleblocker (if one exists) is town, so I don't see a town roleblocker blocking both "cops" last night. 

 

This is a completely fake post.  From the beginning, where you ask what faction someone is as if they will ever answer with anything other than town, to the "help me figure out this game" to the "Hard to believe" bit and "Don't see a town roleblocker blocking BOTH "cops" last night" bit.  

 

A) people never claim anything other than town or third party.  Asking that is just setup.  

B) Assuming a roleblocker is town and then calling them town after is leading.

C) if said roleblocker did exist then assuming it could block both cops is logical fallacy, which is to say that Tom is using this to push his beliefs onto other people

 

Combine this with the fact that Tom did not have the vig shot he claimed to yesterday, my failed view, and the fact that his supposed vig kill is no more reliable than the actions any of us may have submitted  and I strongly suspect that Tom is not a vig at all.  That last night's kill was the work of his cultafia team.  Him and Rag.

 

 I can further show Tom to be playing in a way that does not fit with his town MO because Tom is attempting to use the fact that Turin sided with me as means to get me lynched.  This is, in fact, null because if this game is multi-cultafia then any leader of a cultafia who believed a PR found another member would wholeheartedly support them.  

 

Here is the final piece though.  Tom says he is a night vig now.  He had major suspects day one.  Why did he not kill them or claim the kill from then when he claimed this one?  It cannot be reconciled anymore than Rag's failing to reveal or even defend himself before Tom did so near the end of yesterday.

 

 

I got a bad view on another player.  If I am correct then Rag is another leader and Tom is working for him.  Perhaps an N1 recruit.  You all vote Rag, if he flips town then you have me clear as mafia and can lynch me.  This angle serves me no gain, especially not the one Rag argued (that I was doing it to defend Turin) because Turin is dead and because Rag wasn't a threat to Turin when I revealed and attempted to get Rag killed.

 

I repeat, Vote Rag

 

Missed this post before. All I can go by is what I know. I know my own alignment, I know my own ability, and I have to sift through everything else. It's really confusing with 4 factions and people's alignments changing nightly. Your play appears to have shifted a bit in D2, and you got @ Rags with an unverifiable claim and pressured me to kill him on the spot even though if your claim was true, I would have died. 

 

I'm not sure why you think I'm a god now. Yes, I bluffed being a day vig, but is that scummy? I got people talking, I got people worried. 

 

Keep in mind I have no reason to believe your view on me would have failed. What did your result actually say? Because you now have two unverifiable night claims... that's obviously gonna make me suspicious. 

 

Also: Turin didn't side with you in thread. He actually took an opposite stance to you, which is what made me suspicious of your link when you got @ Rags because Rags got @ Turin. 

 

As for my decision for the vig kill:

-Dice claimed cop

-Darthe claimed role cop

-Dap started looking reasonably good at EOD1 so I was afraid to shoot him. He also looked good after I said I shot Clae.

 

I went for the person I thought was a good candidate to either be useless or recruited, Clae, and she turned out to be a town PR. FML. It sucked, but it doesn't make me scum.

 

I guess what it comes down to is it's hard for me to believe anyone. Your story and your presentation seems sketchier than Rags's. 

[TheRagnarok]

you keep harping on this silly 'fail to defend' thing.  For most of the day you never even bothered to say what it was you had, and then when you did, it was bull.  You can't defend when there is no case.  And now you just happen to get no result again?  That seems totally reasonable. 

 

And your last sentence in this is a lie.

[Tommyrod]

Mad?  Not really mad.  Sort of disappointed but I am regularly disappointed in mafia.  People tend to forgoe logic in favor of what they want to believe.  It loses me a lot of games because I am not great at rhetoric, I don't often bother with convincing people who are too moronic to recognize the truth as it is.

I don't mean to get into a whole debate about an off-topic subject, but I need more help from you in believing you're town. Rags is doing a better job of sounding authentic than you are. 

[Tommyrod]

Rags, give me your thoughts on the remaining players in this game.

[dicetosser1]

 

 

I'm for it. I think Darthe is full of poop since D2. If I'm wrong, I blame Darthe for having terrible rhetoric. 

 

Vote Darthe again

 

This is also a slip up.  Rhetoric is only needed by those who have reason to convince a group of their standpoint.  I have no reason to do so because I have only presented truth.  Your attempts to discredit me are, indeed, the quickest way to get me killed but they are subpar ways of discerning truth which is why I will inevitably be victorious.  Even if it causes my death.  

 

 

How mad will you be if we just softball this one in and I promise to kill Rags if you were telling the truth?

 

 

 

i wont believe your promise.  your fakeclaiming day vig is the same as lying. i wasted all day trying to convince you do do a true town action that you couldnt do.

 

 

 

also i was NOT roleblocked. I asked a question of the mod re resolutions. he forgot about answering me til after midnight my time and i forgot to put an action in without an answer before i went to bed

[dicetosser1]

Rags does have a point about scum 101. i dont know where i sit there.so im going another direction

 

 

Vote Hally

[Tommyrod]

 

 

 

I'm for it. I think Darthe is full of poop since D2. If I'm wrong, I blame Darthe for having terrible rhetoric. 

 

Vote Darthe again

 

This is also a slip up.  Rhetoric is only needed by those who have reason to convince a group of their standpoint.  I have no reason to do so because I have only presented truth.  Your attempts to discredit me are, indeed, the quickest way to get me killed but they are subpar ways of discerning truth which is why I will inevitably be victorious.  Even if it causes my death.  

 

 

How mad will you be if we just softball this one in and I promise to kill Rags if you were telling the truth?

 

 

 

i wont believe your promise.  your fakeclaiming day vig is the same as lying. i wasted all day trying to convince you do do a true town action that you couldnt do.

 

 

 

also i was NOT roleblocked. I asked a question of the mod re resolutions. he forgot about answering me til after midnight my time and i forgot to put an action in without an answer before i went to bed

 

Okay, well, why do you have no result? Who did you scan? That may help us. 

[dicetosser1]

Tommy read my answer again. i didnt put in a NA

[Tommyrod]

Yeah, missed that.

I hate you all.

[Hallia]

I've never heard of someone forgetting to put in a NA. O.o

 

Still wasn't recruited, just a regular peoples.

[Tommyrod]

I've never heard of someone forgetting to put in a NA. O.o

 

Still wasn't recruited, just a regular peoples.

:(

[TheRagnarok]

4. Darthe - Either lying about investigating me or he got messed with N1.  Him getting no result N2 leads me to believe he is lying.
6. WBK Ley 2.0 - Null to town lean. 
7. GF - Claimed Doctor, hasn't done crap.  I could see him being recruited because of this.
8. Hallia - Has had some sketchy comments, but I know she is relatively new so torn on which way this goes.  Could go her way.
9. Dap - Don't remember a lot he has done.
10. Chuckles Tommy - Town lean.
13. Golden - Don't remember a lot he has done.
15 Dice - Investigator who didn't get his results in?  It does make me wonder if power townies lose their ability upon recruitment. 

 

A lot of forgettable people.

[Darthe]

 

 

Rags, what faction are you now? Help me figure out this game.

 

I'd lynch Darthe. I'm finding both Darthe and Dice hard to believe at this point. If I had to guess, I'd say the roleblocker (if one exists) is town, so I don't see a town roleblocker blocking both "cops" last night. 

 

This is a completely fake post.  From the beginning, where you ask what faction someone is as if they will ever answer with anything other than town, to the "help me figure out this game" to the "Hard to believe" bit and "Don't see a town roleblocker blocking BOTH "cops" last night" bit.  

 

A) people never claim anything other than town or third party.  Asking that is just setup.  

B) Assuming a roleblocker is town and then calling them town after is leading.

C) if said roleblocker did exist then assuming it could block both cops is logical fallacy, which is to say that Tom is using this to push his beliefs onto other people

 

Combine this with the fact that Tom did not have the vig shot he claimed to yesterday, my failed view, and the fact that his supposed vig kill is no more reliable than the actions any of us may have submitted  and I strongly suspect that Tom is not a vig at all.  That last night's kill was the work of his cultafia team.  Him and Rag.

 

 I can further show Tom to be playing in a way that does not fit with his town MO because Tom is attempting to use the fact that Turin sided with me as means to get me lynched.  This is, in fact, null because if this game is multi-cultafia then any leader of a cultafia who believed a PR found another member would wholeheartedly support them.  

 

Here is the final piece though.  Tom says he is a night vig now.  He had major suspects day one.  Why did he not kill them or claim the kill from then when he claimed this one?  It cannot be reconciled anymore than Rag's failing to reveal or even defend himself before Tom did so near the end of yesterday.

 

 

I got a bad view on another player.  If I am correct then Rag is another leader and Tom is working for him.  Perhaps an N1 recruit.  You all vote Rag, if he flips town then you have me clear as mafia and can lynch me.  This angle serves me no gain, especially not the one Rag argued (that I was doing it to defend Turin) because Turin is dead and because Rag wasn't a threat to Turin when I revealed and attempted to get Rag killed.

 

I repeat, Vote Rag

 

Missed this post before. All I can go by is what I know. I know my own alignment, I know my own ability, and I have to sift through everything else. It's really confusing with 4 factions and people's alignments changing nightly. Your play appears to have shifted a bit in D2, and you got @ Rags with an unverifiable claim and pressured me to kill him on the spot even though if your claim was true, I would have died. 

 

I'm not sure why you think I'm a god now. Yes, I bluffed being a day vig, but is that scummy? I got people talking, I got people worried. 

 

Keep in mind I have no reason to believe your view on me would have failed. What did your result actually say? Because you now have two unverifiable night claims... that's obviously gonna make me suspicious. 

 

Also: Turin didn't side with you in thread. He actually took an opposite stance to you, which is what made me suspicious of your link when you got @ Rags because Rags got @ Turin. 

 

As for my decision for the vig kill:

-Dice claimed cop

-Darthe claimed role cop

-Dap started looking reasonably good at EOD1 so I was afraid to shoot him. He also looked good after I said I shot Clae.

 

I went for the person I thought was a good candidate to either be useless or recruited, Clae, and she turned out to be a town PR. FML. It sucked, but it doesn't make me scum.

 

I guess what it comes down to is it's hard for me to believe anyone. Your story and your presentation seems sketchier than Rags's. 

 

Okay, let's examine this.  I know my alignment and my ability as you do.  I received a result on night one that stated "Darthe, town role cop." which strikes me as beyond odd to get from another player in a recruiting game.  I intended to hold off on testing that result because it wasn't strong enough on its own to readily achieve a lynch and because while that strikes me as scummy enough on its own I also wanted to see the day play out some.  However, when you claimed day vig I saw quite a few possibilities for the town to gain a lot of info very quickly and to get verifiable information about Rag either through his death or through your own.  It wouldn't even cost the town a lynch.  That would be more than worth it if we managed to kill one of the Gods.  This both makes perfect sense as a plan and could have cracked the game wide open.  Town has yet to follow through but it will either today or after I flip.  However, having to kill a town PR to confirm that the town PR is telling the truth about a negative investigation they already know they got directly goes against the interests and potential gains of the town because it both removes a town PR and, if I am correct, gives Rag an extra chance to recruit.  That is far too large to allow me to ignore for any reason other than to confirm Dice yesterday by killing the Elder God that was Turin.  

 

My result for tonight was No Info, Sorry.  Something that I responded to.. unpleasantly.  I got my ears nipped a bit tbh, but that is neither here nor there.  How much plainer do I have to be before we lynch the person I got a view on?  It is the safer more logical choice for town to do even in the event that I am lying!  Rag didn't even bother to claim otherwise.  He piddled around for an entire day before messing with it.

[Tommyrod]

4. Darthe - Either lying about investigating me or he got messed with N1.  Him getting no result N2 leads me to believe he is lying.

6. WBK Ley 2.0 - Null to town lean. 

7. GF - Claimed Doctor, hasn't done crap.  I could see him being recruited because of this.

8. Hallia - Has had some sketchy comments, but I know she is relatively new so torn on which way this goes.  Could go her way.

9. Dap - Don't remember a lot he has done.

10. Chuckles Tommy - Town lean.

13. Golden - Don't remember a lot he has done.

15 Dice - Investigator who didn't get his results in?  It does make me wonder if power townies lose their ability upon recruitment. 

 

A lot of forgettable people.

 

...! That's an interesting idea.

[Tommyrod]

 

 

 

Rags, what faction are you now? Help me figure out this game.

 

I'd lynch Darthe. I'm finding both Darthe and Dice hard to believe at this point. If I had to guess, I'd say the roleblocker (if one exists) is town, so I don't see a town roleblocker blocking both "cops" last night. 

 

This is a completely fake post.  From the beginning, where you ask what faction someone is as if they will ever answer with anything other than town, to the "help me figure out this game" to the "Hard to believe" bit and "Don't see a town roleblocker blocking BOTH "cops" last night" bit.  

 

A) people never claim anything other than town or third party.  Asking that is just setup.  

B) Assuming a roleblocker is town and then calling them town after is leading.

C) if said roleblocker did exist then assuming it could block both cops is logical fallacy, which is to say that Tom is using this to push his beliefs onto other people

 

Combine this with the fact that Tom did not have the vig shot he claimed to yesterday, my failed view, and the fact that his supposed vig kill is no more reliable than the actions any of us may have submitted  and I strongly suspect that Tom is not a vig at all.  That last night's kill was the work of his cultafia team.  Him and Rag.

 

 I can further show Tom to be playing in a way that does not fit with his town MO because Tom is attempting to use the fact that Turin sided with me as means to get me lynched.  This is, in fact, null because if this game is multi-cultafia then any leader of a cultafia who believed a PR found another member would wholeheartedly support them.  

 

Here is the final piece though.  Tom says he is a night vig now.  He had major suspects day one.  Why did he not kill them or claim the kill from then when he claimed this one?  It cannot be reconciled anymore than Rag's failing to reveal or even defend himself before Tom did so near the end of yesterday.

 

 

I got a bad view on another player.  If I am correct then Rag is another leader and Tom is working for him.  Perhaps an N1 recruit.  You all vote Rag, if he flips town then you have me clear as mafia and can lynch me.  This angle serves me no gain, especially not the one Rag argued (that I was doing it to defend Turin) because Turin is dead and because Rag wasn't a threat to Turin when I revealed and attempted to get Rag killed.

 

I repeat, Vote Rag

 

Missed this post before. All I can go by is what I know. I know my own alignment, I know my own ability, and I have to sift through everything else. It's really confusing with 4 factions and people's alignments changing nightly. Your play appears to have shifted a bit in D2, and you got @ Rags with an unverifiable claim and pressured me to kill him on the spot even though if your claim was true, I would have died. 

 

I'm not sure why you think I'm a god now. Yes, I bluffed being a day vig, but is that scummy? I got people talking, I got people worried. 

 

Keep in mind I have no reason to believe your view on me would have failed. What did your result actually say? Because you now have two unverifiable night claims... that's obviously gonna make me suspicious. 

 

Also: Turin didn't side with you in thread. He actually took an opposite stance to you, which is what made me suspicious of your link when you got @ Rags because Rags got @ Turin. 

 

As for my decision for the vig kill:

-Dice claimed cop

-Darthe claimed role cop

-Dap started looking reasonably good at EOD1 so I was afraid to shoot him. He also looked good after I said I shot Clae.

 

I went for the person I thought was a good candidate to either be useless or recruited, Clae, and she turned out to be a town PR. FML. It sucked, but it doesn't make me scum.

 

I guess what it comes down to is it's hard for me to believe anyone. Your story and your presentation seems sketchier than Rags's. 

 

Okay, let's examine this.  I know my alignment and my ability as you do.  I received a result on night one that stated "Darthe, town role cop." which strikes me as beyond odd to get from another player in a recruiting game.  I intended to hold off on testing that result because it wasn't strong enough on its own to readily achieve a lynch and because while that strikes me as scummy enough on its own I also wanted to see the day play out some.  However, when you claimed day vig I saw quite a few possibilities for the town to gain a lot of info very quickly and to get verifiable information about Rag either through his death or through your own.  It wouldn't even cost the town a lynch.  That would be more than worth it if we managed to kill one of the Gods.  This both makes perfect sense as a plan and could have cracked the game wide open.  Town has yet to follow through but it will either today or after I flip.  However, having to kill a town PR to confirm that the town PR is telling the truth about a negative investigation they already know they got directly goes against the interests and potential gains of the town because it both removes a town PR and, if I am correct, gives Rag an extra chance to recruit.  That is far too large to allow me to ignore for any reason other than to confirm Dice yesterday by killing the Elder God that was Turin.  

 

My result for tonight was No Info, Sorry.  Something that I responded to.. unpleasantly.  I got my ears nipped a bit tbh, but that is neither here nor there.  How much plainer do I have to be before we lynch the person I got a view on?  It is the safer more logical choice for town to do even in the event that I am lying!  Rag didn't even bother to claim otherwise.  He piddled around for an entire day before messing with it.

 

 

Hasn't Rags argued with you, though?

 

Rags, your response? 

[Darthe]

He has started to but you yourself said that his responses initially were pitifully underdone.  

[Tommyrod]

Yeah, I thought so for a bit. Then I thought you were reaching. Now I don't even know who to believe. You're both doing a bad job of arguing, honestly.

If either of you showed some WIM I could probably get behind whomever made a better argument. 

[Darthe]

 

4. Darthe - Either lying about investigating me or he got messed with N1.  Him getting no result N2 leads me to believe he is lying.

6. WBK Ley 2.0 - Null to town lean. 

7. GF - Claimed Doctor, hasn't done crap.  I could see him being recruited because of this.

8. Hallia - Has had some sketchy comments, but I know she is relatively new so torn on which way this goes.  Could go her way.

9. Dap - Don't remember a lot he has done.

10. Chuckles Tommy - Town lean.

13. Golden - Don't remember a lot he has done.

15 Dice - Investigator who didn't get his results in?  It does make me wonder if power townies lose their ability upon recruitment. 

 

A lot of forgettable people.

 

...! That's an interesting idea.

 

 

 

Rags does have a point about scum 101. i dont know where i sit there.so im going another direction

 

 

Vote Hally

 

Dice this is why you're never written into lists of advanced players.  You have a direct issue in front of you and you're wussing out on it.  Worse, you just brought up a point that Rags is using against me that can ALSO BE USED AGAINST YOU!  WHAT ARE YOU DOING?

 

I'm fairly annoyed with this^  

[Darthe]

Yeah, I thought so for a bit. Then I thought you were reaching. Now I don't even know who to believe. You're both doing a bad job of arguing, honestly.

 

If either of you showed some WIM I could probably get behind whomever made a better argument. 

WIM?

[TheRagnarok]

 

Okay, let's examine this.  I know my alignment and my ability as you do.  I received a result on night one that stated "Darthe, town role cop." which strikes me as beyond odd to get from another player in a recruiting game.  I intended to hold off on testing that result because it wasn't strong enough on its own to readily achieve a lynch and because while that strikes me as scummy enough on its own I also wanted to see the day play out some.  However, when you claimed day vig I saw quite a few possibilities for the town to gain a lot of info very quickly and to get verifiable information about Rag either through his death or through your own.  It wouldn't even cost the town a lynch.  That would be more than worth it if we managed to kill one of the Gods.  This both makes perfect sense as a plan and could have cracked the game wide open.  Town has yet to follow through but it will either today or after I flip.  However, having to kill a town PR to confirm that the town PR is telling the truth about a negative investigation they already know they got directly goes against the interests and potential gains of the town because it both removes a town PR and, if I am correct, gives Rag an extra chance to recruit.  That is far too large to allow me to ignore for any reason other than to confirm Dice yesterday by killing the Elder God that was Turin.  

 

My result for tonight was No Info, Sorry.  Something that I responded to.. unpleasantly.  I got my ears nipped a bit tbh, but that is neither here nor there.  How much plainer do I have to be before we lynch the person I got a view on?  It is the safer more logical choice for town to do even in the event that I am lying!  Rag didn't even bother to claim otherwise.  He piddled around for an entire day before messing with it.

 

 

 

I messed up quoting this so re-did it.

 

Let's examine this post,

 

1.  You start out with a false statement, claiming that we know your ability and alignment.

2.  You give yourself an excuse for waiting to out said information.  So it wasn't enough to lynch me over but it was enough to shoot me over?  Yeah, makes sense. 

3.  I like how you stated that town will follow through with it.  Nice psychological strategy. 

4.  The most likely scenario is that you were recruited by Turin N1.  I have been on Turin all game so you made up the claim in the hopes I'd get lynched over him which keeps your Elder God alive.  Well worth it.  However, Dice stepped up and your plan backfired.  Now you are stuck with a claim.  Not to mention a claim that you can backtrack from immediately when I flip town due to the vagueness of the result.  But you can't give an actual result for anyone else N2 because you're full of it so have to claim being blocked. 

 

You backed yourself into a corner with the fakeclaim. 

 

 

4. Darthe - Either lying about investigating me or he got messed with N1.  Him getting no result N2 leads me to believe he is lying.

6. WBK Ley 2.0 - Null to town lean. 

7. GF - Claimed Doctor, hasn't done crap.  I could see him being recruited because of this.

8. Hallia - Has had some sketchy comments, but I know she is relatively new so torn on which way this goes.  Could go her way.

9. Dap - Don't remember a lot he has done.

10. Chuckles Tommy - Town lean.

13. Golden - Don't remember a lot he has done.

15 Dice - Investigator who didn't get his results in?  It does make me wonder if power townies lose their ability upon recruitment. 

 

A lot of forgettable people.

 

...! That's an interesting idea.

 

I've played a game like this before and that happened.  Sometimes people got new abilities.

[Tommyrod]

Want it more / win it more 

 

Wanna make an about-face and just lynch Dice? I'm only half joking... 

[TheRagnarok]

 

Yeah, I thought so for a bit. Then I thought you were reaching. Now I don't even know who to believe. You're both doing a bad job of arguing, honestly.

 

If either of you showed some WIM I could probably get behind whomever made a better argument. 

WIM?

 

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