[Basic] Christmas Mentors & Maffia

[_CLOUD]

He's obviously not reading the game dude.

[Tommyrod]

He's obviously not reading the game dude.

Well I haven't read the last 4 pages fully either, but still. It's pissing me off. How do we tell shitty town apart from mafia?

 

I am getting new pings if I go into lazy tone-read mode instead of logic-read mode. Fun

[_CLOUD]

 

He's obviously not reading the game dude.

Well I haven't read the last 4 pages fully either, but still. It's pissing me off. How do we tell shitty town apart from mafia?

 

Do what I do. Flip a coin.

[csarmi]

VoteCount Day01#12

 

 

01 - Peace: -> Elf -> Golden

02 - Cloud: -> Elf -> Turin -> Hoof -> Turin

03 - Krak: -> Cloud -> Hoof

04 - GoldenEyes: -> Elf -> Via

05 - TommyRod: -> Peace -> Turin -> Hoof -> NULL -> Nolder

06 - Leelou: -> Nolder -> Hally

07 - Theodora: -> Golden

08 - Elffern: -> Peace -> NULL

09 - Hally: -> Golden

10 - BFG: -> Golden -> NULL -> Nolder

11 - Via: -> Golden

12 - Nolder: -> Hally

13 - BlackHoof: -> Peace

14 - Turin: -> Tommy -> NULL

 

 

 

Peace - 1 - Hoof

Golden - 4 - Peace, Thea, Via, Hally

Hoof - 1 - Krak

Hally - 2 - Nolder, Leelou

Turin - 1 - Cloud

Nolder - 2 - BFG, Tommy

Via - 1 - Golden

 

Not voting: Elf, Turin

8 to lynch.

Deadline: 2013-12-29, 20:00 GMT

Countdown: http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?iso=20131229T21&p0=50&msg=ChristmasMM-D1

[Tommyrod]

Nolder should be 2, with BLG and myself combined on the tally 

 

I dislike that 2 people still haven't voted. 24 hours left

[csarmi]

Say what?

[Tommyrod]

Say what?

Silly Salami.

[Krakalakachkn]

##unvote

[elffern]

##vote nolder still got 3 pages of reread left so this is subject to change (probably to Turin if that's the case by the looks of it ... gah , no words for those posts) I'll expand more on folder later, but, basically posts so fluffy you could sell them at a carnival amongst other things. But in case I fall asleep or something le vote.

[Krakalakachkn]

B.) Explain. this looks like filler on your part.

Your entire read on Golden was filler. You threw in Despo a few times and that was it.

[csarmi]

VoteCount Day01#13

 

 

01 - Peace: -> Elf -> Golden

02 - Cloud: -> Elf -> Turin -> Hoof -> Turin

03 - Krak: -> Cloud -> Hoof -> NONE

04 - GoldenEyes: -> Elf -> Via

05 - TommyRod: -> Peace -> Turin -> Hoof -> NULL -> Nolder

06 - Leelou: -> Nolder -> Hally

07 - Theodora: -> Golden

08 - Elffern: -> Peace -> NULL -> Nolder

09 - Hally: -> Golden

10 - BFG: -> Golden -> NULL -> Nolder

11 - Via: -> Golden

12 - Nolder: -> Hally

13 - BlackHoof: -> Peace

14 - Turin: -> Tommy -> NULL

 

 

 

Peace - 1 - Hoof

Golden - 4 - Peace, Thea, Via, Hally

Hally - 2 - Nolder, Leelou

Turin - 1 - Cloud

Nolder - 3 - BFG, Tommy, Elf

Via - 1 - Golden

 

Not voting: Turin, Krak

8 to lynch.

Deadline: 2013-12-29, 20:00 GMT

Countdown: http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?iso=20131229T21&p0=50&msg=ChristmasMM-D1

 

See you guys in the morning. AJ, your turn.

[Tommyrod]

Updated to be current again. New info is after each dashed line ---

 

01 - Peace

 

The meta-aware opening of "yo" in #13. He hasn't posted poop until #114 when he sheeps Cloud's vote on Elf out of the blue. He gets snarky as poop when I question that move, and makes an art out of dodging my question for a while. Very uncomfortable with the continuation of dodging, particularly in #127 with "why is it necessary to regurgitate Cloud's reasons?" This one pings me harder the second time, because town should know why they're doing what they're doing. It should roll right off the tongue because they have an organic thought process. They develop suspicions and act on them. Yet Peace has difficulty articulating any reasoning for his vote on Elf. No bueno.

 

When I ask if this is normal behavior, Cloud and Leelou both say yes. It doesn't mean I am going to give him a free pass for that, though. Peace gets uber snarky when I ask for more detail from other players on his play. Then he backtracks and says I'm very town in #151... I don't know how I feel about this one. Yes, townies do this sometimes, to see how people will react. But I've also seen mafia back down with a "hah! just testing you!" excuse. I'll put him down as slightly scummy by this point. Using the 2+2 forums and my ego as a counter-point is working outside of the game instead of inside it... I dislike that behavior a lot.

 

Peace blows off Elf's vote on him with a "you need to re-read" comment in #177, which I dislike because he is twice now refusing to give reasonable justification for his original action when prompted. Why can't he produce an argument off the cuff? Ping. I dislike how he jumps on Nolder in #184 after Leelou already cast doubt on Nolder. He follows up with that in #189, which is good.

 

Peace attacking my "you can show me you're town by scumhunting" comment in #198 by trying to spin it as pigeon-holing Turin smells like crap on second read. I've never had someone do that to me before and it doesn't even make sense. But that aside, it stinks because Peace and Turin have had no interaction with each other yet both have defended each other... why would they both be assuming I am scum and they are town? This only makes sense if they are masons or mafia. I'm guessing the latter based on their refusal to be transparent and dissect the gameplay within the thread, instead me-too-ing and OMGUSing and ignoring a large portion of the game's activity up to this point (Turin even moreso).

 

Peace backs off of me in #207 by saying "it's the only thing about your player that had pinged me." To me this is a weird statement since that shouldn't have been a ping at all, I'm sure I've done other more pingworthy things... it makes me think he knows I'm town and wants to feel out for mislynch weakness in me since I'm the new guy and people won't defend me based on meta.

 

I'm surprised to see Peace using me to attack Elf in #236. I can't disagree with what he's saying though, Elf not questioning Nolder is a legit concern and I *can* see why Peace would think them scummy, though I'd like to see him follow up on it if he actually thinks so. In #245 he says "when I am scum I purposefully do not defend others" which is a poop post because I rarely see town make "I'd never do that as scum!" posts. He makes it hard to clear him if he's town. Votes for Golden in #279, and I can't really disagree with that. This may be a case of townies (Peace and myself) with very different styles that don't mesh well.

 

---

 

Peace is taking a strong stance against Golden in #305. I would expect them to not be a mafia-mafia team, at the very least. I also agree with his reasoning, despite it being meta based. His responses to Cloud’s questioning seem okay, but I dislike how he says I am misinterpreting his words since that’s what he did to me :P and I also don’t like that he said he doesn’t care if he gets lynched in #341. I’ve seen mafia say that a lot… combined with his “when I am scum I purposefully do not defend others” comment in #245 I would consider these to be scum tells. His “this isn’t debate club” post in #405 was stupid, other people noticed too. He questions Theo’s vote on Golden in #450, which is good.

 

 

02 - Cloud (mentored by Darthe)

 

Opening was timid but doesn't bother me on second read. The chat between Cloud and Leelou felt natural. He could be posting just to get posts on the board when the game starts like #22 and #23. This isn't damning by itself, though, more of a supplement. Not sure what Cloud meant by me chasing shadows in #50. I like that he asked for more details from Theo in #75, but the fact that it all just falls flat bothers me. He inadvertently defends me in #107 when he says he disagrees with Elf's comment that OP analysis is scummy. Has decent reasoning in #110: I can see why he votes for Elf in that same post, so that vote feels natural. Cloud's reasoning against Elf in #141 is fluid; he's a town lean of mine. Cloud is still on-point in #228, though I don't think Elf has the droids we're looking for. Pushing for Peace is actually a good thing; dude is scummy. His scum reads are Elf and Nolder... I disagree with the first and need more info for the second. Looks like he's starting to get suspicious of Turin in #231 which is good. Town reads on Leelou, Peace and Tom. If Cloud ends up being mafia this could be a "rule of threes" thing but I doubt he is at this point.

 

I like that Cloud was beaten into reason by Elf and calls her town in #272 so I think Cloud is my strongest town read so far. Voting for Turin is icing on the cake.

 

---

 

He’s up for voting Hoof or Turin in #332 and puts some suspicion on Peace; I found it interesting that Peace responds with “vote me then.” He says Peace is a town read of his so this looks like a probe instead of a sus, actually. More good play from Cloud if that’s the case. He dissects Hoof’s post well in #384 and highlights a few good points about Hoof’s logic. I like everything he's done since.

 

 

03 - Krak (mentored by Verb)

 

Opening was fine in #30. Says Cloud has the scummiest intro in #44. I don't think it's the scummiest. @Krak, was this a meta read on Cloud? I forgot Krak was in this game until he re-appeared in #238. It's very very fluffy, but he seems to agree Turin is scummy... but gives him an out. Let's see if Krak gets more involved. Oh damn, #239 was bad. Does the "teaching how to play" thing that Turin hates but I notice Turin doesn't call him out on it in this game like Turin called out me and Nolder. But what's really bad is the vote for Cloud, who isn't scummy, and with no justification. Peace just laughs at the name "Clarthe" that Krak invented and ignores his no-justifcation vote. Ping for both of them. I notice that Krak as of #247 is still questioning Cloud, which is good in a way because he didn't just vote-and-run, but I still don't like it. He votes for Cloud again, saying he forgot, and makes a self conscious comment about how multi-posting used to be a scum tell. That's a small ping.

 

@ Krak, tweakin'? I dunno what you're asking me.

 

---

Krak, Krak, Krak. I don’t know what to do with you. You just throw spears out at random, hoping to catch fish. #368 “Buddy much?” is aimed at nobody in particular as far as I can tell, and then you don’t follow up on it. Aren’t you curious as to why Nolder has you as a town read? He’s happy to float along with the thread though, as shown in #377 with his hard-hitting “Lol” comment. Votes for Hoof in #388 after Cloud does the work; gives no reasoning. Ping. Cloud points out how this vote doesn’t make sense since he thinks Cloud is scum yet suddenly thinks Hoof is scum without explaining why.

 

Here’s a perfect example of how Krak is sniping at people randomly: #460 when he tells Turin “this jives not at all with your earlier gameplay.” While I agree with that, there’s something off about it. No buildup, no followup. As if he doesn’t care what people say but just wants to appear active. If Turin is mafia this could be a distancing attempt. Calls Turin’s post crap in #464. Okay, at least now he is following up a bit. I actually agree with what he says about Turin here, and it’s aggressive enough that I no longer think this would be scum distancing. Him asking me for comment on it shows he’s a bit proud of his post and wants someone to agree, so… that moves him back into null territory for me.

 

 

04 - GoldenEyes (mentored by Despothera)

 

Self conscious opening in #29. I have no idea what he's saying in #65, looks spammy. Comes back in #208 after a long absence and reads both me and Turin as town and makes some reads with little to no justification. Could be actually busy and not mentally invested, but ping anyway. More christmas wishes in #227; sick of that stuff, lol. Talk about the damn GAME! Elf vote in #277 feels pretty random; I agree that Elf isn't hunting, but that's mostly due to defending against Cloud. She should get more involved from here on out.

 

---

 

Returns in #393 with a defensive post, says he’ll post more reads tomorrow. The fated moment occurs in post #479, with a big reads list. Scum in Peace, Nolder, Theo, Elf, Hallia, Turin. Town in Krak, Tom, Leelou, Hoof. I wish he was more involved in the game rather than posting from the past, but being willing to take hard stances on people is a good sign, though he has too many mafia. If you have 6 mafia suspects you should figure out how they slot together. Has a bad defense against Via in #487 and an OMGUS vote. Pingworthy, but what’s more notable is the argument between Golden and Via almost feels staged. Something to keep in mind for later.

 

 

06 - Leelou (mentored by Wombat)

 

Opening seemed okay to me. Her chatter with others still feels natural and not forced by the time I enter the thread. She rebuffs me right off the bat, which is probably more town indicative than not; mafia would be more likely to sheep me (since I'm asking people to do so) and observe if I lead a mislynch to start with. It sucks that she won't try to analyze OP's though. Leeloo is getting a little too off-topic for my liking around the time #84 comes around. Votes for Nol in #104; he hasn't posted yet. Why not vote for someone else who hasn't posted like dan? Could be something, could be nothing. She's still jokey around #117 but at least comments on how Elf was backpedaling on suspicion of me. Still grinding against me in #126, but it feels genuine. Leelou is my first comfortable town read. (Looks like Cloud agrees with me in #128 and Peace grinds against that.)

 

Leelou is spot on when she says Elf is beating a dead horse and Hoof is just making consensus reads. Strong town read, like Cloud.

 

---

 

Leelou’s commentary of Turin in #319 is accurate and they wouldn’t be wolf/wolf aligned either. She defends Hallia being inactive in #322 but then votes for her based on that reasoning?

 

 

07 - Theodora (mentored by Key)

 

Lame opening in #12. Being friendly with Blackhoof right off the bat in that post. THEN calls Hoof scummy in #74. Not that I... blame her... but this could be a case of scum-on-scum jostling. This happens surprisingly often in early game, where mafia will point out something dumb that mafia have done and not follow up on their suspicions but later can say "hah! I knew it!" When Cloud asks about it, she instantly backs down. Which is funny, since that Hoof post pinged me hard. I would expect a townie to probe into it a bit more?

 

---

 

Claims to be sick in #415 as a reason for inactivity… well, whatever. Reads list in #416 came less than 20 minutes after the mention that she had to catch up… a little too fast, maybe. Seems to be a very followery post like what I think Hoof is doing. Literally nothing said in this reads list is new information except for the case on Golden. Says Peace and Golden are mafia and votes for Golden. We’ll see if this is legit or not if Golden flips. Asking Turin for follow-up info is good I guess.

 

                                                             

08 - Elffern (mentored by Dap)

 

Opening is corny but not scummy in #26. Disappears for a while and then calls me too eager in #93. But that's not the most interesting part... saying Hoof is obviously scummy and not doing anything about it is. Is Hoof the least valuable player in every game or something? People don't seem to take his antics seriously, which could be dangerous if he gets to coast to endgame without serious scrutiny. Elf throws a little suspicion on me in #106 by saying that OP analysis is looking for an easy excuse to lynch. But what bothers me is the way Elf instantly retracts once Cloud disagrees. Is Elf a very timid player?

 

Elf reappears in #137 and defends and says "I haven't seen anything else suspicious." I dislike that post a lot. He defends himself, says he's got nothing to add, and adds misdirection by asking Peace to explain himself when I questioned him. Hmm. His defense is getting a little too fluffy for my liking in #153 and #154. Comments like "maybe I'm rusty." I'm noticing he tends to end posts with a misdirection question. Elf's vote for Peace in #176 is OMGUSing I think, which is kinda funny.

 

Elf is still trying to get info out of Peace by #186, so I am doubting that they would be scumbros. The Cloud/Elf fighting by post #234 is too involved to be staged, so they aren't scumbros at least. I think it's funny that Elf says she's not fond of OMGUSing yet that's pretty much exactly what she did to Peace, lol. Who is Toddy? Is that me? Based on how Elf said Cloud is probably town, and I think Cloud is town, I believe this long winded argument is town-on-town violence (aka towning).

 

Elf is right in #258 that we need to hear more from Hally, Theo and Golden, at a minimum.

 

---

Not much more to say. Feel pretty good about Elf being town.

 

 

09 - Hally (mentored by Yates)

 

Opening post #27 pinged me on second read considering how little has been said by Hallia. It's both off-topic and me-too-ing the friendly chat that Theo and Hoof had already. Notably, Hally joins in on Hoof's spam-fest in #53. Damn, Hally hasn't said poop so far. She comes back in #223 with more Christmasy stuff. 3 posts in 3 days? That's pretty inexcusable since she's showing that she's still aware of the game and hasn't forgotten about it. If Peace/Turin end up cocky/lazy masons and not mafia, I'd turn attention here, especially the Hally/Theo/Hoof trio as they've been chummy for no apparent reason.

 

---

 

Hallia’s return to the game in #386 pinged me because the sole thing she finds to comment on is Goldeneye’s one-off post from a while back? She says she agrees with Golden about Tommy and Turin being town and thinks Cloud is town. This post from Hallia is one of those I see a lot with mafia talking to mafia and trying to distance from each other by having different reads (like on Cloud). Bad post. Disappears for a while again and mentions an excuse for being gone… not a great re-entrance. Defends Turin with the most forced post I’ve seen in a while, #446. Calls out Peace’s “not a debate club” comment, that actually makes me feel better about Peace being town since I’m starting to lean scum on Hallia.

 

Oooh, I hate post #496 from Hallia where she votes for Golden. This seems like a mafia wagon building.

 

 

11 – dansyc/Via (mentored by Kaylee)

 

Appears in #413 and does EXACTLY what I said town do early in the game: pop in without having read fully :P If Via is town then you guys have to give me chocolate. Although it makes me laugh that in #433 Via says town doesn’t do this. It’s what you just did! You claiming mafia, bro? Okay post questioning my leans in #438 but like I responded, the stance on Leelou and Halla is odd to me. May have caught a scumslip by Krak in #484. Vote for Golden looks sudden but I see the reasoning at least.

 

12 - Nolder

 

Appears in #165, hella late. He goes after Cloud right away. Throws out some fluffy comments in #178 but I agree with what he says about Peace here. I'm noticing that he's grinding against Cloud and Leelou, two of my town reads so far, so I'll be curious to see how that develops. Grinding against Peace and Turin is good, I think. Is Nolder an inexperienced player? I like that he's questioning Peace's reasonings in #211 because Peace has been pretty bullpoopy so far. He points out how Peace defended Cloud defending me (lol) but I think he should be focusing on the Peace-Turin interactions more than Cloud. His "dragonmount can jump off a cliff" comment in #212 is a ping. Oh, and @Nolder, WF is WalterFootball forums. His behavior is hard to pin down in #243... he's got a mix of fluff, defense and attack here. I don't think going after Cloud is the right move now, and picking out one Peace post to say it looks good feels bad to me. He actually comments on Krak's "teaching" thing and self-consciously says he'll tone it back. That strikes me as weird interaction.

 

---
 

He comes back and is a bit too spammy for my liking, asking me how I like DM is meh. He quotes my reads list but doesn’t actually read it, lol. He has a lot of spammy posts actually. Okay, he finally responds to me in #351 and says Krak is his only lean, and it’s a town lean. I ask him to elaborate and he never does. Could be bad news bears. He sort of respond sto my question in #374 but his answer was terrible. He doesn’t know why Krak is his town lean? He promises to let me know why… hasn’t yet.

 

Votes for Hallia in #411 (for inactivity) and then Leelou follows up with another vote in the very next post. I don’t really know what to make of that, could just be crossposting. I have a scum read on Nolder overall. If Nolder is scum I bet Krak is too.

 

 

13 - BlackHoof

 

Weak opening in #8 and #11. I'm not a fan of the cthulu jokey stuff. Post #51 just reeks of bullpoop trying-too-hard-to-be-harmless stuff. He outright ignores any attempts at discussing the game so far. He's still spammy in #85, but what pings me about this is his comment "normally you would be on the money" regarding him being scummy. Who the hell writes a comment like this? It's too self conscious. Votes Hallia right off the bat in D1 #92 for literally no reason. Really stupid. But what's stupider is how this reinforces the spam-party that Theo, Hoof, and Hally are having now. I'm finding it to be a little too... comfy. More spam in #102. The spam is pinging me harder now.

 

Disappears until #281 and opens with suspicion on Cloud for back-flipping on his scum read on Elf... even though that argument took up a third of the thread and was very organic. This looks like a lousy excuse to keep suspicion on Cloud. Then in that same post, defends Elf by attacking Goldeneye's vote. Well, which is it? I haven't seen Hoof defend Elf before this, so it seems like a good way to put suspicion on just about everyone involved. As he continues to do when he FOS on Peace and then votes for him. So Hoof basically appears, put suspicion on everyone involved, and then leaves. Haha, wtf?

 

And then when I make that post about low-posters being suspect... he reappears to defend himself and put suspicion on Dan. I *hate* that because Dan has zero posts, so he can't be anything but null at this point. Scum love to push mislynches onto inactives because they're easy targets. Big ping. Says one of Cloud or Peace are mafia... well no poop, you're voting for Peace? Why say "one of?"

 

I'm starting to think there's a real good chance of a Theo/Hoof/Hally scumteam.

 

---

Blackhoof finally starts posting in a meaningful way in #383. He’s got town reads on Tom, Elf, and thinks one of Cloud or Peace is scum. Okay. Another MQ post in #407 that thinks Peace is scummy. Seemingly continues to ignore how Cloud achieved satisfaction with Elf’s defense and uses Cloud’s questioning of Elf as “tunneling” justification to keep Cloud a suspect, but the logic behind that just isn’t there. Pingworthy. Calls out Nolder again for mentioning Krak as a scum read… this would be okay if multiple people hadn’t already done so. Feels like a bit of a followy post overall, not producing new content, and ignoring events that have already transpired within the game. This could bring Hoof back into scum territory.

 

 

14 - Turin (advised by Pray)

 

#88 is his opening... to wish a merry christmas? Whatever. He's gone for a while and comes back in #169 asking why his opening looks busy and what that means. So we've got >150 posts and he only cares to defend himself in a pretty lousy way? Ping! Also refuses my attempt to start a wagon on Peace in #170. Good to keep in mind for later. He's self conscious and sassing me for lousy reasons (like Peace was) in #173... and then mentions how he's NOT defending Peace. Ping pong!

 

Turin returns in #188 and is once again defensive and shows no interest in getting to the bottom of things. His first paragraph is about personal attacks and only defends himself and OMGUS's me without looking around the rest of the thread. Bad ping. I'm noticing Peace and Turin have yet to interact with each other. In #191 he posts about how he dislikes people who "teach" and links me to Nolder. It's hard to follow his logic in that post. He ends it by saying he'll be out for a while, which also pings me, as mafia likes to "appear" active without actually being active, and thus tends to check out. It matches his vibe of really only being defensive so far, and having defended Peace despite not having communicated with him at all.

 

---

Turin returns in #390 and is uber aggressive with me in a way that feels forced. He acts like since I’m not an Innocent Child I am mafia for trying to lead the town, what kind of reasoning is that? BFG isn’t exactly a shining beacon of activity, nor is he automatically right because he’s confirmed town. You should know this. The entire post is a tunnel OMGUS that doesn’t go anywhere. “Now you’re in the spotlight” great… but you aren’t convincing anyone of your apparently very strong mafia read on me. So this pings. His reads list in #392 should be kept in mind for later when we lynch mafia.

Arguing semantics with me about my phrasing is getting to be a real bore in this game, and is the kind of “scumhunting” that I’ve seen mafia using against me in another recent game. Missed the fact that I questioned Krak already, as if trying to link us together. Ping. Has a bit of fencesitting on Krak in #400; this is actually enough to move Krak into a scum read for me. Turin/Krak as scum team? I would have added Peace before but I’m not sure now. The way Turin starts teaching the town about what scum does within that same post that he condemns Nolder for giving “advice” is pingworthy also.

 

Continuing to discuss how Cloud and I agree on things and therefore must be mafia in #429 is stupid and lazy play. Reeks of fake scumhunting. I do love how Turin calls Cloud Bossypants yet is arguably the most resistant and stubborn player here, and with lousy reasoning to boot. A lot of his stance is hypocritical.

 

His long post in #440 is hard to navigate but mainly reads as him being unwilling to clear any townies so that he doesn’t have to go back on his reads later and makes it easier for him to jump onto any wagon. His comment that we used the same phrasing means we’re aligned in mafia QT is laughable. More lazy reasoning that is outside of the actual gameplay. That’s a trend I’m noticing with Turin… he likes to skirt around the meat of the game and focus on scraps of skin on the periphery, which is no bueno. He then says in #422 that “all posting on thread is gameplay” yet makes a habit of ignoring the actually important parts and focusing on phrasing and semantics. Yikes. Big ping from these posts and hypocritical reasoning. He’s now my #1 mafia suspect again. In #443 he puts suspicion on Leelou for a “meta defense.” Wut?

 

Him asking me “why are you trying to make it about anyone else” in #473 is bizarre. We are supposed to be discussing the game, and that post was addressed to Peace, not him. Does he agree with me about Peace and Golden? I have no idea. I am glad he is questioning Krak again in #474 but this is like the fifth person to do so. His dramatization of how Peace, myself and him interacted early game seems bizarre. Is Turin usually this… stubborn and borderline delusional? He attacked Krak in #475 but I again can’t tell if he’s actually suspicious of Krak or not. If I can’t follow his thinking, it makes me uncomfortable. He ends his post by wanting to bring the discussion to gameplay mechanics/philosophy rather than scumhunting. Not a good look.

 

 

 

Tl;dr:

 

Most likely mafia pairings at this point: one of Turin/Krak (they probably aren’t aligned), if it’s Krak then Nolder is likely to be mafia also, if it’s Turin then odds of Peace being mafia go up; someone in the Hoof/Hallia/Theo pile, probably Hallia or Theo more than Hoof. The Via/Golden interaction and OMGUS vote feels forced to me. Hallia jumping on Golden’s wagon makes me feel better about Golden not being mafia though. It’s possible we are looking at Hallia/Theo/Via scumteam? Krak/Nolder?

 

Townies: Cloud, Elf, Leelou, BFG. Not a bad start to the game, having 4-5 strong townies this early means the game should proceed rather smoothly.

 

I’m gonna vote for Hallia since her reasoning is the hardest to follow and has so little content. Focusing only on Golden's post for the first half of the game, yet agreeing with him and then instantly voting him later as a wagon was building, and defending Turin is all too much weirdness for me to handle. Comments on the weirdest things, is always living in the past, has tripped one of my biggest scumtells (the one I said I'd reveal after the day is over), and I can't follow her thought process at all.
 

##Vote Hallia

[Krakalakachkn]

I wish I were scum with Nolder, that would be fun.

 

 

The buddy much comment was aimed at Cloud for responding to your post with "yes Sir" which is ver strange. It implies a chain of command which makes no sense unless you're on a scum team and Cloud recognizes your authority. Which I could see if you had a power role, but I have a harder time seeing Clarthe acknowledge you as top scum hunter.

 

Unless your game plan was to both be the most active poster/scum hunters and plow through the game Leeroy Jenkins style.

 

That said, it's a null read for me at the moment. NULL, but not forgotten.

 

 

I plan on doing ISO's later and Nolder will surely be one.

[Tommyrod]

I wish I were scum with Nolder, that would be fun.

 

 

The buddy much comment was aimed at Cloud for responding to your post with "yes Sir" which is ver strange. It implies a chain of command which makes no sense unless you're on a scum team and Cloud recognizes your authority. Which I could see if you had a power role, but I have a harder time seeing Clarthe acknowledge you as top scum hunter.

 

Unless your game plan was to both be the most active poster/scum hunters and plow through the game Leeroy Jenkins style.

 

That said, it's a null read for me at the moment. NULL, but not forgotten.

 

 

I plan on doing ISO's later and Nolder will surely be one.

 

You know by now that this is what I do -- smash and smash the game until town wins. Soz you don't like it.

 

Looking forward to your Nolder post :)

[_CLOUD]

 

You didn't misrepresent anything I said because as far as you were concerned I hadn't said anything, that's where the misrepresentation is.

 

This was a mistake on your part, anyone can make mistakes, that's fine.

 

You are saying though that you didn't search out what posts I made before you did your option post - as it happened I posted more which would have given you something to comment on about me. You didn't search and you didn't notice that my post count in the thread has gone up.

 

There is a difference between saying 'Via has had only one post so no opinion on her yet' and 'I don't think Via has added anything to the game and her opinions don't matter to me'.

 

Now that you've dismissed a players options because they picked you up on an error you made, town has some information to work on, now or in the future.

 

As I say, anyone can make a mistake, that's not a real issue. I am surprised by your response and your OMGUS vote though, wasn't expecting such a big response to my comment

 

 

I think Via defended herself well against Golden, and it seems to me he could easily be scum trying to rile people up.

 

##vote Goldeneyes

 

 

I actually don't think Via has defended herself that well. She had a decent argument, but her post in reponse to Golden's accusation was too long-winded and she ended up backing away from her original statement that Golden was skimming and ended up calling it just a mistake. How could Via possibly know if it was a honest mistake or not, and even if it was a honest mistake it still doesn't exclude the possibility of Golden being mafia. My question to you is if you could expand on your reasoning how you think Golden was trying to rile people up?

[BFG]

 

 

Why is it necessary to regurgitate Cloud's reasons?

Am I supposed to read your mind as to why you randomly voted without reasoning?

 

All: is this normal behavior from peacesells?

 

Yes. He tends to be very stubborn as town and has caused some of the worst instances of town on town arguing I've seen in recent memory.

 

 

 

Personal attacks after I put doubt on you isn't very Christmaslike :(

 

It's not very town like either

 

##Vote Peaceinthemiddleeast

 

I wouldn't be surprised if we've hit scum already

 

-Self conscious (evidenced by OP gimmick)

-Sheep voting with no discussion, expecting the wagon to take off

-Overly defensive and gets into personal attacks on Day 1 (lol)

 

Definitely the most suspicious play so far

 

Follow me to the promised land

 

I only agree with you about his touchy attitude in this game, but the rest is null. Do something useful and follow me on Elf instead.

 

You're starting to make me think you're not just applying pressure.

You seem to want to actually lynch Elf ASAP.

 

I dunno Cloud, Hoof is a perfect example of Day 1 lynches. 

Wow, really scummy nudge of that tired old joke.

Were you going to try to get me lynched tomorrow too?

 

 

 

 

100% caught up now and don't like Cloud's play at all so far.

He seems less like someone who is posturing for information and more like someone actually trying to achieve a lynch.

Our Day just started, I don't think it would be wise to end it just yet. He is my top suspect for a scum at the moment.

 

 

 

 

 

I don't actually find him especially scummy right now, and I want to see what he says. And I am aware there are other paths my line of reasoning could take, but it seems best to go down the worst possible case first.

This is the most reasonable approach to Day 1.

 

Why?

 

Pressuring people, even if you don't actually find them scummy, to see what they say is pretty much essential for a successful Day 1.

 

 

 

 

I'm not protecting you.

Yeah, you kind of were.

 

Or, he was pointing out an issue and the defense was secondary. This is actually good stuff because it can be crossed referenced later in the game. Even if he were defending..why discourage the behavior?

 

You don't defend people who's alignment you aren't sure of.

Especially not this early. It either means you're a townie flying blind or you're a scum who is buddying.

If people are getting pressure it's usually a good idea to let them speak for themselves before commenting.

This isn't any different than what I was telling BFG.

  

 

 

 

 

Why is it necessary to regurgitate Cloud's reasons?

 

Because if you say nothing at all you're not held accountable.

You can just make up any BS later. If you just repeat someone else's reasoning it can be analyzed and called bad or good.

It's about broadcasting your towniness to other players, which so far you've failed to do.

 

It's not "all about broadcasting towniness" although that is a good way to start. It's also all about causing people to react in ways that give clues to their alignment. Again, you are playing the "I'm gonna teach the town how to play card and look townee myself for doing it.

 

*shrug* It's not a card it's just what I do.

Especially in basic games. I like to give my thoughts on game theory and tactics.

I do this in games and outside of them. Again if you think anything I've said is wrong or misleading feel free to point it out.

 

 

 

 

 

I didn't feel it was enough to vote on, but it was/is enough to poke with a stick, and also get day one going further than merry Xmas posts.

Elf is using the classic "his play was scummy but it wasn't enough to vote him" scum tactic.

 

Could just be more of the same attacks we've seen from Cloud but this was a fair observation.

I don't know that I would go so far as to call it a "classic scum tactic" but it is absolutely something to note later in the game I think.

 

 

Also what tommyrod said peace, explanation?

 

And also notice how she is trying to shift the attention towards to Peace who voted for her after it was already explained that his lack of reasoning isn't anything out of the ordinary. Her prod towards Peace and her later vote on him means means that she is afraid of OMGUSing me. A townie would be less self-conscious about her votes than she has been thus far.

 

This is much less reasonable.

We want to try to include everyone on Day 1 and not let anyone slip under the radar so we have stuff to analyze as the game goes on.

Not only that, but I think an explanation was absolutely called for.

Just because Elf isn't concentrating solely on defending from your accusations does not mean he (she?) is trying to shift attention.

This further goes to show me that you think Elf SHOULD be the center of attention. Stop tunneling and address the game at large.

 

 

1. There isn't anything wrong with not having scum reads at the start of the game, and I never expected you to have them. What is pinging however is that even though Tom is your only scum read you didn't want to commit and vote for him.

That's not unusual for Day 1.

 

@Nolder's case on me:

 

You are calling me out for being too eager, which is actually true because I have been really looking forward to this game. However, since when is eagerness a scumtell? It only conveys excitement for a game which isn't an exclusive emotion for the mafia own. You don't say anything about the content of my posts themselves which is very scummy, and instead only go on how I'm being eager.

Since when is eagerness to lynch a scumtell? Always.

The town has two guaranteed powers. The ability to talk and reason things out during the day, and the ability to vote to lynch someone.

Rushing through the game at any point is ill advised at best. At worst it can be a complete disaster.

Of course I'm someone who is impatient and I hate when we wait until the deadlines but there is absolutely a happy medium in there somewhere.

Trying to rush the day to me seems scummy. I don't need to dig deeper into your posts than that because really...you have nothing.

And I'm not faulting you for that exactly. The game has only been going for how many hours? And this is a game which builds from nothing. That's why we joke around and throw some silly votes. We start attacking each other for those silly accusations knowing that they will lead to reactions and more solid reads and cases. If you are town and you really think you have a scum pegged on Day 1 you need to make a damn good case and so far all I've seen is normal day 1 stuff from Elf. You wanna convince me to lynch Elf? Give them a noose to hang themselves with, aka give it more time. We have no deadline so there is zero need to rush a lynch at this time.

 

 

 

The long quotes have been edited, hopefully DM will allow me to post in one go.

 

I find this play almost the complete antithesis of his Town play in the Walking Dead. In WD he was aggressive, pressured lots of people and got results. Here he's saying we need to look at everybody, but from memory he's looked at Peace, Cloud and apparently Krak, as Town in WD he actually did this. He also defends Elf after specifically stating that defending other players is a bad move. Worst is when he talks about the need for townies to apply pressure to the other players as we need to get reactions. In WD he states this is done primarily through outing, yet despite stating Cloud is his top read he doesn't vote or really do anything to apply any pressure. Just skimmed Enter the Dragon and his Day 1 play seems a lot closer to his WD play instead of this. 

 

In fact his first vote is on Hallia for inactivity, this isn't out of character for him, but not analysing her posts is, but holidays, busy, meh.

 

 

Ignoring the WD game, I still find his play here bad. Has a mafia read which he doesn't vote and instead votes for an inactive later on. Defends Elf although he should have no Idea of her alignment and calling other people out for the same. Waits till start Day 1 to question setup, would seem to make more sense for a Night conversations, since we had one.

 

 

 

Nolder, why have you been up Cloud's ass in this game when he is arguably the most pro-town player in this game? Who are your top 3 scumreads right now?

You can make that argument if you want to. I'll laugh and call you dumb though.

 

As for scumreads.

I'm reluctant to narrow my focus to just three people right now, it's too early in the game for that.

Especially given that so many people have barely posted.

If I've noticed something off or wrong or whatever I've called people on it.

Nothing has been held back thus far so what you've seen is what you get.

 

I will say that out of everyone Krak has been the only one to give me a town vibe thus far.

 

 

He seem to be presenting a false choice, in a couple of ways.

 

First, stating top three reads in no ways means you can't have others, or that you can't change your mind later. However I can understand a reluctance to do as you're told,

Second, that pushing a vote is going to lead to a fast lynch, this last is just bizarre and one that he repeatedly uses against Cloud.

 

 

Would still appreciate perspective from people who have played with him more, but this apathetic play just seems strange.

[BFG]

@Cloud

1, what parts of Turin's posts did you disagree with specifically, instead of a generic disagree with pretty much everything he posted on page x... I thought some of it was reasonable, and null on a little more, so interested to know where we disagree.

2, sorry missed that post

3, you've questioned it in two of the three games we played together.

[BFG]

That post is so Tom-like!

 

[_CLOUD]

I will answer your questions tomorrow, BFG. I will go to bed now.

[Tommyrod]

 

That post is so Tom-like!

 

 

[Turin Turambar]

I will respond to your intro above and number the replies to the broken up post below... 

We differ on what constitutes a personal attack fair enough. I call your post a poor Despo Impersonation I beilieve. It appears that some of the players are either trying to emulate the styles of their mentors or are just absorbing some of it through the shared QTs. I have only very limited experience with you playing but you seem quite different in this game. Who knows? maybe I am reading too much into all this. But if I notice something I will mention it. 

 

For the record I personally am not sensitive to personal attacks, or swearing or hearing that things I do are terribad or anything else. I think I did once get upset in a game and had to take a break for about a day. That was because a player was making attacks against a person that was not allowed to respond. So call me whatever you wish but one thing from the bottom of this post. You are seriously mistaken if you think I am crying into anything due to what anyone here says about me. 

 

I do find it very odd that you could have had a town read on me, especially a strong town read on me and then had it flip to solid mafia based on this post which is primarily a continuation of the stances I have taken all game long.

 

I love irony. I believe the phrase I used was a poor "impression", meaning seeking to emulate but not quite getting there. which seems to be continuing now with your choice of several of Despo's favorite words and phrases. Maybe you really do think along similar lines. If so then just tell me I'm wrong. or stupid or whatever phrase you care to use.

14 - Turin (24 posts)- Scum. I understand some people are more sensitive than others, but the sensitive ones that refuse to admit they are sensitive frustrate me. I agree with Leelou here, I think Turin is looking for a reason to vote out someone he doesn't like."you suck at mafia" is not a personal attack, it is a value statement of one person's perception of anthers play within a game that is inherently subjective. I don't personally care what anyone says about me in any game and I think it's naive to believe people will not target your emotions knowing you dislike personal pressure, because it is likely to yield result. And I am personally offended by any comparison to Despo, who only aspires to the level of emo I am capable of . For all your sensitivity to personal attacks, you do seem to like calling people "poor imitations"- you may want to google irony #392, @400, @434.  I actually had a town read on you until this post, which was terribad. I cut out the first half, which you can just look up if you want more context

 

 

 

 

2.Think about this. Who knows the alignment of more players? Town or mafia? So who is more likely to be able to point and say that someone is of a particular alignment? And having town reads that you are too confident of in early game is very dangerous. it leads to following which leads to sheeping which leads to mislynches.The other problem I have with the out of the blue "player X is town" post is that it is worthless unless you actually provide real reasons. The first problem is that you could be WRONG.. you say that player X is town, you get killed and people start thinking that since you were town and thought they were town then they are likely town. point of discussion it is fine but I try to erase those posts when I see them. Why do you think Leelou is tow or did you just make it up? 

 

3. Those were only 2 examples that immediately came to mind. there are many mre if one wants to go look. The point is that if town lets the first person to jump up and wants to lead do so they are setting themselves up for failure. you need to vet your leaders first and then see where they lead. to follow blindly is foolish IMO  You only have 1 vote do not give it to someone else to use. Town is a team they do not need someone telling them who to vote and who not to vote. I guess I don't like the town captain thing at all. If they are heading the wrong way and get killed town is too likely going to continue on following the last woshes of the dead leader. He must have been on the right track so mafia killed him right?

 

4. your interactions with Tommy do not seem like natural town interactions for early D1. it was too immediate and to trusting. a complete web of trust as Dap would say. Maybe it is just me but I don't trust anyone that early, that much. (well except ithi in interest of full disclosure but that is because she will be investigated and/or killed early in most games) But your other actions like the appearance of pushing the mod for a deadline which usually helps mafia work to get a mislynch and the cheerleading do not sit right. As to defending, I believe that a very big part of the "case" on me was that I was defending Peace while IMO I was pointing out that i thought the initial comment from Tommy that Peace was no very adept was very much an attack. So in the words of Rambo "they drew First Blood". then for Tommy to get huffy about Peace's retort about ego felt off. Good for the goose and good for the gander.

 

5. I thought this was D1 of a mafia game? you look for any slip that you can find. Someone I believe said that mafia was nit picking.(I find it a little odd that you use that particular phrase as that is the same phrase that Tommy has used. maybe it was set out as a talking point in your QT).So only some are allowed to do it. very well will you give me a list of who is allowed to pick nit and parse words and so forth. As well as against whom we are allowed to this to. kthx.

 Nitpicking is a common word and a very appropriate one to use in that situation. This is reaching.

 

6. blow your own horn much? "I am the greatest", LOL. post count doesn't mean squat once it is at an acceptable level. And it could easily be argued that your high post count is a sign of you trying to push lynches(mislynches) and get thru to N1 so you and the rest of your team can use your given gifts. It is what you have said that makes me question your motivation. You did ask the MOD for a deadline. you have made the obligatory "when we gonna get today's lynch done?" post. So your attempt to give yourself the title greatest scumhunter is denied. especially since you are currently voting a townie. As to Nolder, I don't agree that you should try to vote merely for pressure but the point of you pushing the day along was valid IMO for the other reasons I gave not for the fact that you pushed hard on someone.

 

---

 

9.  Wrong read above about you. Leelou has done some things herself to give me a mafia feel. the hanging on tothe Nolder vote well past the time it was warranted. hell even she said she wasn't trying to get him lynched. since then she has also just follwed Nolder onto a low poster in the attempt to get post out of them. This is actually the same type of activity that I decried in my opinion on Nolder. that her vote isn't really a vote to lynch but to achieve some other goal. possibly as simple as parking her vote. (which is what she accused me of BTW even tho I have been fairly adamant in my conviction that Tommy is possible mafia and bears closer watching)

FOS'ing without voting. I don't like it.

 

10. See above. Your eagerness shows by your other actions. Nolder using your hard push of a case against elf  was incorrect and I stated it as such. I do find that your 180 on her is a bit odd. You were trying to convince everyone to vote her and now she is so town that you are defending her hard. On D1? it does seem a stretch. Oh and I always keep my story straight as mafia. That is why Darthe always says I'm town. lol

 

11. care to put your money where your mouth is? tell me definitively who the 3(or 4) anti-town people are right now. Tell me in order how we should vote them. Once you are wrong about someone you volunteer to be the next day's lynch. If you are as good as you think then you will either be dead in the next two nights or the game will be over quickly. If you keep going after me and agree then you will be dead tomorrow. (Here is where he calls it a martyr play and no townie would do such a thing...)

That's just pretty gross. Waiting to see how many days you could wait to NK? Cause that's how it comes off. Then straight up threatens.

This is starting to feel like flailing and for no reason at all. The dude has 1 vote on him and I picture him slowly sobbing into a paper towel.

 

12' so mafia together then? LMAO  or maybe you just buddied up to him and his ego fell for it. 

 

So where is the actual case on my mafianess again? it merely looks like you disagree with what I am saying about Tommy and yourself. And Leelou also. The rest is mostly you defending yourself. TBH you look a lot like me when I am mafia and Ithi is town. follow along and be good. hide in the leaders baffles. then when the mislynches add up point at him as the one leading the town astray. It is easy as long as the leader buys in. At least until you have to choose between losing a teammate for cred or disagreeing with the leader.

 

##unvote

 

give me your list if you agree to the terms

 

 

IMO that post was so much fail that I gotta put him in the scum column, cause he seems intelligent enough not to be incompetent town. I'm kinda annoyed cause I had Turin as a strong town read up until this post. Turin, do you stand by everything here? Why did you seem to go aggro all of a sudden? 

 

1.) Nitpicking: it is  a fairly common word choice, but I did notice that it was used by both of them. Do you disagree that nitpicking is a part of mafia. Not all slips will be huge. picking at that little discrepancy can produce good result in the quest to discover the mafia.

 

2.) Read to the end. If it isn't clear I will explain why I didn't vote anyone with this post. But it appears that Cloud didn't take me up on my offer.

 

3.)  read it more carefully. Maybe it was because you were tired from going through all the ISOs. Cloud has been saying that he is the greatest scumhunter in the game. I said put your money where your mouth is. You pick who you want me to vote for. If you are as good as you think then either (1) mafia will get tired of dying everyday and NK him soon proving he is town with his flip, or (2) the game will be over soon because town will eliminate the mafia quickly. The caveat to the deal was that if he leads a townie lynch (like say on me) after that town flip he volunteers to be the next day's lynch. Therefore, if he accepts the deal and pushes my lynch today, he would be forced to accept his own lynch tomorrow, because I will flip town.  

 

Recap:

"too intelligent to be incompetent town": this is a derivative of the too smart to be wrong=>mafia argument that Despo uses. It is an awful argument because as everyone knows. Town is uniformed so can be frequently wrong. 

 

If you knew me you would know that I play a lot by feel and tone. And am a fan of the conspiracy theory. I am sometimes very right and sometimes very wrong. Sometimes in the same game. Hell sometimes in the same post. Two examples of games I was mostly right but stubbornly stuck to bad ideas I had convinced myself of were the LEGO HP mafia this year in the White Tower and Nolder's? Labyrinth game in Thrak.( I think that was last year) some of the players here may remember how right and how wrong I was in both of those games. Bottom line is everyone is wrong sometimes and we all have been fooled before. 

 

Again. I don't really see how if you had me as a "strong town read" until this post that your opinion would be so changed by my continuation of the same line of reasoning and thought I have used the entire game.

 

I stand by everything I say. except typos. I don't think I made any here.

 

Agrro? how so? There was attitude given in my direction. I decided to give a little back. goose and Gander and all that. Could it be that my attitude was so shocking or at a different level. Possible but I don't see it that way. Trust me on this one, even if you disagree with everything else I say. I am not bothered by what is said to or about me. I do however think that sometimes responding in kind is the best way to eliminate the verbal garbage. 

[Turin Turambar]

@ Turin - I thought you didn't like it when people put themselves down as town in their read lists and stuff - or is it different because you are doing it?

 

@ Krak - you have misquoted Turin in your post at 464 - what makes it worse is that you have included Turin's post in yours. I don't know whether you have just misread, or have tried to twist Turin's words here, but tried to do it subtly by just swapping two words round

 

That is true about the list. I normally will not include myself at all but I did it since I copied from the player list and I happened to be at the bottom. I think I did try to make it clear that my "read" on myself was based on info not available to everyone. I thought I may have even overexplained it.

 

 

Careful on Krak, someone might think you are nitpicking  

[BFG]

@Cloud

1, what parts of Turin's posts did you disagree with specifically, instead of a generic disagree with pretty much everything he posted on page x... I thought some of it was reasonable, and null on a little more, so interested to know where we disagree.

2, sorry missed that post

3, you've questioned it in two of the three games we played together.

3. Just checked, just once. Sorry again

[Turin Turambar]

 

So where is the actual case on my mafianess again? it merely looks like you disagree with what I am saying about Tommy and yourself. And Leelou also. The rest is mostly you defending yourself.

 

My case on you was built around me disagreeing with your statements and pointing out how you are trying to make a couple of players look scummy because of them. I don’t see any reason why you think someone is scummy just because he has good town reads, or is attempting to lead the town, or is working together with someone else to lynch another player, or is being eager during a mafia game. These things don’t make someone mafia because they happen in every game; they can't even be called scum tells which you shouldn't base any serious reads off in the first place, and yet they form the entire case for why you think a couple of people are scum. This is the reason why I’m suspicious of you.

 

 

In response to your argument that I was rushing through Day 1:

 

Like you said you said you can’t really pressure someone without having the intent to lynch; it doesn’t convey the same level of threat behind your actions and the person you are going after won’t feel pressured. You may think that I was trying to rush through Day 1 but I have only been aggressive in my casing to try and gain as much info as I possibly can which allows me to generate better reads. I ended up pushing for a deadline because I noticed that the activity in the thread was starting to dwindle and a deadline would force more players who were laying low to step up their game, share their reads and vote.

 

 

What are you on about? I mentioned no ill will. ALL posting on thread is gameplay. it is there to be scrutinized. that is how this game works.

 

My question. is why do you think you can tell others what to do? Because you posted on thread specific instructions regarding not voting Elffern since you were no longer voting her => she must be town.

 

I agree with you that all posting on thread is gameplay, but I still felt the need to point it out to you because you were getting so worked up over my playstyle.

 

I was interested in how Golden would react to my arrogant post. I never expected him to actually follow me around.

 

You are trying to have it both ways tho. you disagree with my ideas of what is reasonable on D1. I think that you should be careful about putting anyone too firmly into the town pile as it were too early in D1. I don't follow the psychobabble so maybe that is the disconnect. I say that players working in virtual lockstep at the time you and Tommy were is alarming. If for no other reason that it leaves you very vulnerable to following mafia by trusting your reads too strongly. I don't trust that much so your method is foreign to me.

 

good town reads: only time will tell if they are or not. IMO the risk is greater than the reward by allowing yourself to think anyone not MAD confirmed is town too early in the game. And early D1 is too early to me. 

 

Town leader: if mafia and followed due to charisma or brute force can do irreparable damage to town. This goes back to giving town reads too early. Also. beware of the person that is looking to take that mantle from the start. Especially if they live thru a few days.

 

Eager play: mafia is more likely to attempt to push something to see if they can get an easy mislynch or at least a nice juicy claim.

 

To say these things are not mafia tells because they happen every game doesn't work for me. Maybe I have an alternate view from you but it has worked well for me in the past to find mafia. Just as you use what works for you. 

 

 To be fair though town players should push lynches also. I really don't have a problem about pushing people if you think they are mafia. The problem I had was basically asking for a deadline. Especially since you had already been trying to use bad consolidation voting as a reason for your push. It looked like you were trying to set the conditions for your argument. prepare the battlefield if you will. As far as prodding the MOD because of actiivity, believe it if you will, I don't so another difference of opinion.

 

 

I must be missing where I was getting worked up. whatever. I must say that I am not fond of you now saying that you made that post to Golden "for reactions"  How about the one regarding the Hallia votes? My problem with doing things "for reactions" is that it damages credibility because you are backing away from direct statements you are making. So if you do it once or twice or three times, how do we know when you are actually being serious? we have to ask and then accept what you decide after it has had a chance to play in the room already. Float the idea and only stand by the ones that are popular. politician.

 

So do you refuse my offer to vote where you wish if you accept the consequences of a mislynch?

[Hallia]

 

 

 

 

 

Nice try but you're reaching. I ISO'd everyone but you because I wanted to give you a chance to post and frankly you've done nothing of value in this game. Everyone else can feel free to check their post count as well. Super shady voting on an incorrect post count though, I didn't misrep anything you said. Pathetic, I'll immediately dismiss your opinions now 

 

 

 

That right there