[Basic] The Walking Dead Mafia - Game Over. Theo Wins!

BFG · November 24, 2013

Aannnnndd, goes to check the wiki on bombs :dry:

Andrej · November 24, 2013

Last VC updated.

BFG · November 24, 2013

So for people that understand Balance - would a bomb balance the lovers (in theory a 2 for 1 Townie for mafia, vs a 1 townie for 1 mafia for Town)? Or do we think there would be something else?

peacesells · November 24, 2013

Despo said something earlier about Golden eyes about face on Dap once day 2 started. It was strange to me a bit as well but I couldn't put a finger on it till the reveal. There was a concerted effort to go after GE today, and I thinking the scum team picked up on this change.

That would put Err as the most likely suspect per this post:

see now there is something wrong with this post.... u said that you dont intend to defend your vote on Despo..... and Peace understood them and sided with you because its was a logical..... but then in the same post you are willing to admit that you think you were wrong about Despo

i see it again as not only contradictory but also an example of your and Peaces alliance.

And that's why I am not bothering with you. It's possible to justify why you voted for someone at the time and then believing you were wrong after. I'm not apologizing for voting Dap and then changing my mind. I never said I thought I was wrong about Despo, way to misquote.

ok its fine if you do not want to re-defend your position against Dap and Des... but can you answer this

you spent better part of the day 1 going after dap and des and trying to convince everyone why they were scums. now for you to change that stance in the last 24 hour and cast your L1 vote against Lenlo there must have been a really really good reason... how about you tell us what it was??

Err is the one really pushing to lynch GE. He picked up on the cop role and is trying to manipulate a cop lynch.

UNVOTE VOTE ERR

Andrej · November 24, 2013

Vote Count 2.5

Peace (3) - Dap, Despo, Theodora

Leelou (1) - Goldeneyes

Err (2) - BFG, Peace

Not Voting: Mish, Err, Leelou, Ishy
10 alive, 6 to lynch.

Deadline: 10PM PST, Tuesday, Nov. 26

BFG · November 24, 2013

Will admit I was surprised at Leelous postcount as I don’t remember much from her play. She hasn’t offered many opinions and seems to be playing a quiet game.

Checks in

‘no desire to eat human flesh’ – it’s a joke comment but implies that the mafia are zombies (of interest because of the number of people that think it will be a faction of the survivors http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3087567 and again http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3087687

Defends ‘meta’ & soft defends Ishy, watching Dap (random show chatter) http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3088847

Asks Pral why he’s worried about trains forming wants game to move, fluff, Ape? Doesn’t like Des’s unvote votes Des http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3089855

Makes light of Des’s mafia reads

Fluff

Leans mafia on Des http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3089974

Says Dora is nudging Des train and staying on Dap http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3090094

Back and forth with Dap over being tied with Peace

Pulls postcount

Asks for deadline

Calls Des out on voting Golden

Comments on Errs comment about him & Mish – also notices Mish has been absent from game http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?p=3090655

Says people need to take a stance on the trains http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3090681

Picks up Mishes confusion between games

Des train going nowhere, will look at Peace & Lenlo

Votes Peace http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091227

I wouldn't say Dap is necessarily cleared, but if you are looking at the way people maneuvered, wouldn't one of them be a better vote candidate than Dap himself?

Votes Lenlo near deadline http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091411 (and reason) http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091429

Responds to Nolder – don’t know what he’s getting up in arms about (regards Len & Pral) http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091631

Votes Goden (no reasons given, hasn’t mentioned Golden yet in thread) http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091983

Brings up Postcount, and promises reads. http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092158

Unvotes http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092255 says she’s not wordy, says voted Golden for looking coached, explains mass claims to Dora.

Asks Dap why she’s on the top of his list http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092278

So at the moment I'm wary of Leelou

BFG · November 24, 2013

^and looking forward to hearing her reads

BFG · November 24, 2013

Still people that I'm looking at (will have to wait till tomorrow now).

But...

Leelou is Town.

How come?

michellem · November 24, 2013

BFG; I did pick up on Err using similar wording, but I forgot it when I was gonna write my post, cause like I said I lost my notes halfway >.< I use a firefox-plug in called Quicknotes for my mafia notes, it's in the browser itself, and it saves everything until I choose to delete it. But FF decided to update while I was in the middle of my reread and all my notes (and this also includes notes on mafia games I'm planning, so I'm kinda pissed about it) was suddenly gone. But yes, I was gonna point out that connection between Dora and Err.

Leelou · November 24, 2013

I know this is going to sound like an excuse, but I keep trying to go through the thread and my internet keeps crashing today. I have a bad wire outside and the weather conditions are horrible and it's 100x worse today than it's ever been. Sorry, but I am not going to really be able to ISO and go through the thread today. I've tried.

Andrej · November 24, 2013

Sort of off topic but does anyone have big plans for Thanksgiving?

Depending on what Phase we are in during that time I might put the game on hold.

PM me if you have any issues please.

dapianoplay3r · November 24, 2013

Any reason why I'm the top of your scum list?

Those weren't in order. You three are just my team pick ATM :)

hazelkrs1 · November 25, 2013

It is a true claim, Despo, otherwise I would have chosen a less controversial character or I would have never ever hinted that my character is among those, that you listed as possible mafia. Why to drag the attention on me?

It could be that the mod didn't provide any safe fake claims, and that you didn't want to guess what characters were safe to claim, so decided to try and use this opportunity to try and "clear" yourself.

Just because something seems a bit unusual for a mafia to do doesn't mean they would never do it. Scum try off-the-wall stuff all the time.

Desp, I am T-dog. I am a bomb. Hence, the reason for the soft claim. Cause, you know me...I don't soft claim.

I would peg Shane as a serial killer.

VOTE THEO

Unvote.

Bomb would sorta make sense for T-Dog, he does sacrifice himself for Carol. And to answer someone else, bomb would also sort of balance town Lovers.

However, a Cop, Lovers, a Bomb, AND a SK in a basic game (not to mention a possible Doc)? I don't see it, and with AJ being a new mod I think there's a pretty good chance he got it balance checked.

I'm actually thinking this is a good way to test your claim. I could buy Shane as a SK, but if Theo ends up flipping as one, I won't really believe your bomb claim, which of course is a convenient fake claim for scum.

Vote Theo.

Sort of off topic but does anyone have big plans for Thanksgiving?

Depending on what Phase we are in during that time I might put the game on hold.

PM me if you have any issues please.

I'm good, no big plans.

This does remind me tho, I'm off for the next couple of days after tonight, so might not be as active.

Babar Hasan Khan · November 25, 2013

Err:

I’m finding Errs play to be all over the places, and think he’s definitely underplaying his knowledge (or at least his posts on setup seem to contradict each other). On the one hand he appears to have knowledge of how to balance a game, the potential of roles that act as recruiters(?) or resurrections. But then both asks about lovers and talks (briefly) about lovers theory. Disappears for a couple of days then reappears just after the lynch and suddenly becomes active. After voting Peace he then seems to tunnel on Golden, up until his reveal – his mafia targets are Dora & myself (with no reasoning) and then Peace (as Peace shows interest in lynching somebody other than Golden, despite saying he wants talk during Day 2) and myself (now on gut)

i agree that we shouldnt lynch and end the day without discussing what happened in the last 24 hours.... deadline is on tuesday... we shouuld make use of the time.... having that said i m not taking my vote off golden any time soon....

Golden has jumped on every one who had the highest vote at the time of posting the votes... there has been only one exception to this rule.... you!!! and now you coming to deflect votes from him... convinces me more you are the scum.... i mentioned i thought u were a scum (75%) at the end of the D1 post.... now its more of a 90%

and so that you do not accuse me later in the game for being L3, L2 or L1 vote....... i will vote for you next!

(http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092049)

(although I will say that when Golden revealed he didn't automatically vote for Peace after unvoting, so he is thinking things through)

So what sort of talk does he want?

Here he asks about special roles using examples of inspector/doctor http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3087778

Then wonders if there might be some reanimation/recruitment role which suggests some knowledge of advanced roles (fine so far – setup varies between groups) http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3088055

Votes no lynch because of it (potential reanimation) (itself strange, because Town need to lynch in order to win) http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3088056

Votes Peace to ‘hear them defend’ http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3088116 [on a side I find it interesting that Mish picks up on Dora voting Ishy using similar language, but seems to ignore this, (Dora did follow up on Ishy though) (http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3090986)]

Briefly joins off-topic conversation, then disappears for 2 days.

Town vibe off Nolder for his voting & unvoting. Votes Goldeneyes for coming in late on trains http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3090592 makes a very strange post that sort of links him and Mish.

Says that Lenlo & Mish can’t afford to be neutral

Responds to Goldens ‘wonders who he’s protecting’ with a no one to protect by giving him an only vote, only has vote trains to go on.

Thinks Dap is more likely to be Towny because of the high vote train.

Thinks that if Golden is walker than so are Dora and myself

Implies that he’s been working at avoiding notice/conflicts by applying that reasoning to Mish http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091471

Thinks Golden is mafia

END Day 1, Lenlo/Pral flip Town lovers, and suddenly becomes active.

Accuses Golden of jumping again to Des http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091475 and then puts Lenlo at L-1 http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091481 (I don’t understand why this last would be an issue – Town needs to lynch, this was 2 hours before deadline, and there weren’t enough people around to secure a lynch on anyone other than Peace or Lenlo, one of whom soft-claimed a role)

Implies some knowledge of game balance (2 teams of mafia would need the numbers reducing) http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091478

Surprised that 2 people are dead http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091485 and suggests 2 mafia teams again or vigilante roles.

‘Lovers theory makes sense now’ http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091508, this implies that he has heard of lovers before so why did he need to ask about the 2 kills?

Blame on voters http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091510 – and the people who weren’t around to secure a lynch?

Mafia list is now: Golden, Peace, BFG

Nighttime talk

Start Day 2:

Votes Golden http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091993

Tells everyone else to stop at L1 or L2 to talk – just ugh http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092000

Says that Golden should address the Town with justifications http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092006 (but doesn’t say what the justifications needed are)

A couple of strange posts http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092037 says that his reason was based off voting pattern, but if there’s a chance he’s townie would like to hear it. And http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092040 ‘its not L3’ um yes it is. L-3 says that 3 votes are needed to lynch him that’s it. That’s what that vote did. Would have been the first if he’d checked the post earlier…

Says he will vote Peace next http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092049

Says that mafia only have nighttime chat http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092057

Might unvote to prevent a short day

Unvotes http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092192

Has to reread and will (presumably) be looking at Ishy, Mish, myself, Leelou & Peace

for now

vote Err

thank you for summarizing things now i can present how i see the same posts that you are quoting.

Inquisitive nature:

I still think that figuring out how many mafias, godfathers, lovers, doctors and inspectors to expect is necessary to make informed decisions.... and i am going to ask more follow up questions if something is not clear

Yes, I thought Nodler was the most potentially a towny... and now we all know he was

I suspected Golden most because how he changed his votes in the end of day one... i thought Dap was a towny and Golden was going after him just to lynch him... and i thought he had no good reason to go after lenlo for which i asked for justifications...... Dap and Lenlo turned out to be towny too

i was wrong about Golden but that was based on the people who he went after in D1.....

I saw Golden and Peace as being on the same side... so thats y i suspected Peace also along with Golden

i thought there might be 2 mafia teams at first also because of title "kill the dead and fear the living" and also we had characters which even tough belonged to the living turned out to be not that good in the series.... one mafia theory makes more sense now that we have a bomb in the game

yes it was the L3 vote, what i meant was that it would not have been if only i checked the post a little earlier since i had clearly expressed the mistrust of Golden.

i will reread things yes keeping an eye of ishy, mish mostly and also BFG, leelou, peace but as of now i must admit i m a little lost since the guy i was gunning for turned out innocent....

Babar Hasan Khan · November 25, 2013

Despo said something earlier about Golden eyes about face on Dap once day 2 started. It was strange to me a bit as well but I couldn't put a finger on it till the reveal. There was a concerted effort to go after GE today, and I thinking the scum team picked up on this change.

That would put Err as the most likely suspect per this post:

see now there is something wrong with this post.... u said that you dont intend to defend your vote on Despo..... and Peace understood them and sided with you because its was a logical..... but then in the same post you are willing to admit that you think you were wrong about Despo

i see it again as not only contradictory but also an example of your and Peaces alliance.

And that's why I am not bothering with you. It's possible to justify why you voted for someone at the time and then believing you were wrong after. I'm not apologizing for voting Dap and then changing my mind. I never said I thought I was wrong about Despo, way to misquote.

ok its fine if you do not want to re-defend your position against Dap and Des... but can you answer this

you spent better part of the day 1 going after dap and des and trying to convince everyone why they were scums. now for you to change that stance in the last 24 hour and cast your L1 vote against Lenlo there must have been a really really good reason... how about you tell us what it was??

Err is the one really pushing to lynch GE. He picked up on the cop role and is trying to manipulate a cop lynch.

UNVOTE VOTE ERR

can you really say the sentence that has been bolded was wrong? and was it wrong to ask y?

Theodora · November 25, 2013

It is a true claim, Despo, otherwise I would have chosen a less controversial character or I would have never ever hinted that my character is among those, that you listed as possible mafia. Why to drag the attention on me?

It could be that the mod didn't provide any safe fake claims, and that you didn't want to guess what characters were safe to claim, so decided to try and use this opportunity to try and "clear" yourself.

Just because something seems a bit unusual for a mafia to do doesn't mean they would never do it. Scum try off-the-wall stuff all the time.

Desp, I am T-dog. I am a bomb. Hence, the reason for the soft claim. Cause, you know me...I don't soft claim.

I would peg Shane as a serial killer.

VOTE THEO

Unvote.

Bomb would sorta make sense for T-Dog, he does sacrifice himself for Carol. And to answer someone else, bomb would also sort of balance town Lovers.

However, a Cop, Lovers, a Bomb, AND a SK in a basic game (not to mention a possible Doc)? I don't see it, and with AJ being a new mod I think there's a pretty good chance he got it balance checked.

I'm actually thinking this is a good way to test your claim. I could buy Shane as a SK, but if Theo ends up flipping as one, I won't really believe your bomb claim, which of course is a convenient fake claim for scum.

Vote Theo.

Sort of off topic but does anyone have big plans for Thanksgiving?

Depending on what Phase we are in during that time I might put the game on hold.

PM me if you have any issues please.

I'm good, no big plans.

This does remind me tho, I'm off for the next couple of days after tonight, so might not be as active.

I am Shane and Vanilla, Despo. I cannot reveal more of my role but I don't know why you try to flip it on me when we could get Peace this time. Err gives good reads, sounds pro-town, just like Nol was. As I said, when you mentioned the five characters (including Shane), I could have stayed low and not admit my character is one of the listed above.

Andrej · November 25, 2013

Vote Count 2.6

Peace (2) - Dap, Theodora

Leelou (1) - Goldeneyes

Err (2) - BFG, Peace

Theodora (1) - Despo

Not Voting: Mish, Err, Leelou, Ishy
10 alive, 6 to lynch.

Deadline: 10PM PST, Tuesday, Nov. 26

BFG · November 25, 2013

Any reason why I'm the top of your scum list?
Those weren't in order. You three are just my team pick ATM :)

Err:

I’m finding Errs play to be all over the places, and think he’s definitely underplaying his knowledge (or at least his posts on setup seem to contradict each other). On the one hand he appears to have knowledge of how to balance a game, the potential of roles that act as recruiters(?) or resurrections. But then both asks about lovers and talks (briefly) about lovers theory. Disappears for a couple of days then reappears just after the lynch and suddenly becomes active. After voting Peace he then seems to tunnel on Golden, up until his reveal – his mafia targets are Dora & myself (with no reasoning) and then Peace (as Peace shows interest in lynching somebody other than Golden, despite saying he wants talk during Day 2) and myself (now on gut)

i agree that we shouldnt lynch and end the day without discussing what happened in the last 24 hours.... deadline is on tuesday... we shouuld make use of the time.... having that said i m not taking my vote off golden any time soon....

Golden has jumped on every one who had the highest vote at the time of posting the votes... there has been only one exception to this rule.... you!!! and now you coming to deflect votes from him... convinces me more you are the scum.... i mentioned i thought u were a scum (75%) at the end of the D1 post.... now its more of a 90%

and so that you do not accuse me later in the game for being L3, L2 or L1 vote....... i will vote for you next!

(http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092049)

(although I will say that when Golden revealed he didn't automatically vote for Peace after unvoting, so he is thinking things through)

So what sort of talk does he want?

Here he asks about special roles using examples of inspector/doctor http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3087778

Then wonders if there might be some reanimation/recruitment role which suggests some knowledge of advanced roles (fine so far – setup varies between groups) http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3088055

Votes no lynch because of it (potential reanimation) (itself strange, because Town need to lynch in order to win) http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3088056

Votes Peace to ‘hear them defend’ http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3088116 [on a side I find it interesting that Mish picks up on Dora voting Ishy using similar language, but seems to ignore this, (Dora did follow up on Ishy though) (http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3090986)]

Briefly joins off-topic conversation, then disappears for 2 days.

Town vibe off Nolder for his voting & unvoting. Votes Goldeneyes for coming in late on trains http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3090592 makes a very strange post that sort of links him and Mish.

Says that Lenlo & Mish can’t afford to be neutral

Responds to Goldens ‘wonders who he’s protecting’ with a no one to protect by giving him an only vote, only has vote trains to go on.

Thinks Dap is more likely to be Towny because of the high vote train.

Thinks that if Golden is walker than so are Dora and myself

Implies that he’s been working at avoiding notice/conflicts by applying that reasoning to Mish http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091471

Thinks Golden is mafia

END Day 1, Lenlo/Pral flip Town lovers, and suddenly becomes active.

Accuses Golden of jumping again to Des http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091475 and then puts Lenlo at L-1 http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091481 (I don’t understand why this last would be an issue – Town needs to lynch, this was 2 hours before deadline, and there weren’t enough people around to secure a lynch on anyone other than Peace or Lenlo, one of whom soft-claimed a role)

Implies some knowledge of game balance (2 teams of mafia would need the numbers reducing) http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091478

Surprised that 2 people are dead http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091485 and suggests 2 mafia teams again or vigilante roles.

‘Lovers theory makes sense now’ http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091508, this implies that he has heard of lovers before so why did he need to ask about the 2 kills?

Blame on voters http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091510 – and the people who weren’t around to secure a lynch?

Mafia list is now: Golden, Peace, BFG

Nighttime talk

Start Day 2:

Votes Golden http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3091993

Tells everyone else to stop at L1 or L2 to talk – just ugh http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092000

Says that Golden should address the Town with justifications http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092006 (but doesn’t say what the justifications needed are)

A couple of strange posts http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092037 says that his reason was based off voting pattern, but if there’s a chance he’s townie would like to hear it. And http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092040 ‘its not L3’ um yes it is. L-3 says that 3 votes are needed to lynch him that’s it. That’s what that vote did. Would have been the first if he’d checked the post earlier…

Says he will vote Peace next http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092049

Says that mafia only have nighttime chat http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092057

Might unvote to prevent a short day

Unvotes http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/86079-basic-the-walking-dead-mafia-day-2/?view=findpost&p=3092192

Has to reread and will (presumably) be looking at Ishy, Mish, myself, Leelou & Peace

for now

vote Err

thank you for summarizing things now i can present how i see the same posts that you are quoting.

Inquisitive nature:

I still think that figuring out how many mafias, godfathers, lovers, doctors and inspectors to expect is necessary to make informed decisions.... and i am going to ask more follow up questions if something is not clear

Yes, I thought Nodler was the most potentially a towny... and now we all know he was

I suspected Golden most because how he changed his votes in the end of day one... i thought Dap was a towny and Golden was going after him just to lynch him... and i thought he had no good reason to go after lenlo for which i asked for justifications...... Dap and Lenlo turned out to be towny too

i was wrong about Golden but that was based on the people who he went after in D1.....

I saw Golden and Peace as being on the same side... so thats y i suspected Peace also along with Golden

i thought there might be 2 mafia teams at first also because of title "kill the dead and fear the living" and also we had characters which even tough belonged to the living turned out to be not that good in the series.... one mafia theory makes more sense now that we have a bomb in the game

yes it was the L3 vote, what i meant was that it would not have been if only i checked the post a little earlier since i had clearly expressed the mistrust of Golden.

i will reread things yes keeping an eye of ishy, mish mostly and also BFG, leelou, peace but as of now i must admit i m a little lost since the guy i was gunning for turned out innocent....

(Guess I wasn't clear.)

I have three problems with your play.

1, your level of knowledge isn't consistent. Some can be explained by the difference between online play and real life play, clarifications about roles is also fine as traditional roles used will vary between groups. But you seem to have enough knowledge to suggest untraditional roles/set-ups (such as resurrection(?) or recruitment, 2 mafia teams...), you don't seem to have had any problem with the concept of a bomb, but you didn't catch/understand lovers, even though lover was part of the coroners description, and you later referred to a 'lover theory' which sounds to me like it's a concept you had heard before and thus 'acting dumb' on thread.

2, you became a lot more active once day ended, missed deadline and were absent/lurking for 2 days during Day 1. You also left your vote parked on someone that was never going to gain traction (although as someone else said, you don't know about DM's noob first day pass so this last is meh, but considering the vote was made less than 24 hours to deadline, you didn't seem to spend much time arguing it)

3, Trying to direct Towns play (this is the most important). On the one hand you didn't want anyone else to vote Golden as you wanted discussion, yet you were voting him yourself. The moment Peace came and voted someone else (with stated reasons of trying to build discussion around something that happened yesterday) you jumped on him for trying to derail the lynch on Golden. So you want discussion (or say you do, because that's a Townie thing to say), but the instant someone else tries to say something it's effectively 'no, we're here to lynch Golden...' So what exactly was it you wanted to discuss?

BFG · November 25, 2013

Any reason why I'm the top of your scum list?
Those weren't in order. You three are just my team pick ATM :)

???

hazelkrs1 · November 25, 2013

Okay, finished my reread. Almost lost all my quotes right at the end there when DM went down for a sec, but thank God for the backspace button I was able to recover em.

Guess I'll be nice and spoiler this WoT.

hi ho

Did you just call Leroy a ho?

Leelou, you mafia?

Nope and I have no desire to eat human flesh. You?

Vegan, thanks. So no.

Somewhat interesting early interaction between Ishy and Leelou. Ishy soft-defends Leelou, and then they both are actually the ones who sort of start the "mafia=zombies" thing. I wanted to keep an eye on who pushed that concept the most on reread, felt there was a good chance I'd catch scum there.

just thinking out loud... since this is walking dead..... what if the lynched person comes back as one of the walkers?!?!?!

no Lynch

Forgot about this from Err early in the game. Very off the wall move, introduces setup talk and uses that to springboard to no lynch vote. Weird.

Vote Count 1.5

BFG (1) - Nolder
Lenlo (1) - Despo
Dap (1) - Ishy

No Lynch (1) - Err

Not Voting: Lenlo, Peace, BFG, Mish, Theodora, Pralaya, Dap, Goldeneyes, Leelou

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

I will confirm that dead players will not be resurrected. It was a fun mechanic I had tinkered with when I came up with the game concept, but I don't think it would fit into a Basic set-up. Play on.

well in the case the dead will not be resurrected.... i take back my vote
unvote no Lynch

and vote for someone to hear them defend :P

vote Peace

Also wanted to mention I feel slightly better about Peace on reread, especially because of some of the people I saw floating votes and fos's against him. This is one of them, just an off post. Could even be that Peace and Err are teammates and this was one of those half-hearted distancing attempt votes.

It's a very simple zombie MMO.

I was quite addicted to it for awhile several years ago.

Did you get bitten there and now you return as a walker?

Add Theo to the list of peeps trying to push the "mafia=zombies" angle.

They cant go any faster than baby waddle. Long as not more than one were good. Besides its the people you gotsta worry about

knew there was something I meant to ask.

bolded - do you have extra information? Assumed as a zombie tv series it would be the zombies we need to worry about.

And BFG as well, altho she does it much more subtly.

So is our mafia with themed name? Walkers/Zombies?

Theo pushes it harder...

Indoanna jones game
your checks gunna bounce buddy cos im town bitches

Awwww yeeeeeeah that was a great game! Probably one of my favourites ever. It was awesome.

Des pokes, Nolder probes, Dap babbles, Len jokes, I see everything is as normal, haven't noticed anyone groaning or walking weird yet.

And Mish as well.

AJ!

Is this a real photo (the second pic) of one of our mobsters? Like Wanted Dead or ... erm Dead poster?!

Now it's easy then, everyone start smelling the person next to you for rotting smell and be aware of falling human parts! I found a nose! Whose is it?

Okay now it's just ridiculous. Good news is, I feel even better about my vote on Theo now. She def pushed this concept the hardest out of everyone in the early going. Def think she was pushing a scum agenda here.

Why is there a dap train forming already?

Why are you so worried about trains forming? It's how we gain info. Plus the game started on the 18th, it almost seems like a long time for a train to start forming.

Only thing that stands out so far is the slightly odd vote on Pray. Not only is a bit early to start voting inactives (early to even determine who IS inactive really), it's also an odd move for her, I don't often see her push the activity angle, and she often starts off every game with a joke vote on one of her friends or something. Don't remember anything else from her other than that right now tho.

1. Not lately. And I'm really only lovey-dovey with a few people. My vote is currently just randomly on someone not really showing up to the game yet.

1. Right, but why are you so concerned with those not quite immersing themselves in the game yet when people we're still checking in? You know I have no love for inactives either, but isn't it a tad early to make the determination of who is inactive yet?

1. I just want the game to start moving and not stall out.

I thought this was a nice catch in my reread. Total contradiction in actions/words here with Leelou. First she asks why Pray is concerned about trains forming, and says Dap's train hadn't formed that fast. So apparently she is pro-trainbuilding.

And yet, during this escapade, she has her vote on Pray, cause he was one of the lowest voters. I forgot to grab the vote quote, but she even says she wants to spread the votes around. At the time she voted, Dap had 2 votes and everyone else had 1, and she voted another outlier instead of adding to one of the other trains.

She also says she wants the game to start moving and not stall out... but if you vote for outliers, there's a good chance the game actually WILL stall out, since with all the votes spread out there's not any real pressure on anyone.

Big FOS for this @Leelou.

Des train is going no where right now, when I get home I want to look at Peace's and Lenlo's posts.

I think I'm back in serious mode for all games...maybe.

Oh and then, much later she says she's back in serious mode... yet acted like her vote on Pray was to try and get the game to serious mode quicker. Again, seems like a contradiction to me.

Good morning again.

Also forgot about this... dunno how it makes me feel in regards to Peace however. On one hand, it makes it seem like AJ would def have T-Dog as a character in the game (and he'd be town btw). On the other, Peace could have picked T-Dog as a safe claim specifically because of this post.

Eh. /shrug

hazelkrs1 · November 25, 2013

Ended up having to break it up into two:

Guys, I'll need some help, please - if the Mafia game is based on a real series like this one. Does our alignment has something to do with our character's faith? I was a bit intrigued by what AJ said - look at the name of the day "...Fear the living". And I know what happens to Andrea (Despo's claimed char), not to spoil anyone's pleasure of the series but she well...you know.

Interesting find here... we all now know Theo is Shane apparently, and says she is town... yet she tries using the same logic used against her character claim against mine here, talking about how (real spoiler here)

Andrea dies. and yet, Andrea fights off that nerdy dude that turns into a Walker, and gets injured herself... but she kills herself before she ever became a Walker. Shane, on the other hand, tries to murder Rick, and then turns into a Walker and tries to eat him.

Why would she try using this logic against me at that point, knowing her character? Doesn't add up at all.

^nudging the Des train and staying on dap

What logic would it have if I do that. It was a simple question.

I saw Theo using this defense several times in my reread, the ol "I wouldn't do that as mafia" defense. Since she's new I'll explain why it's a bad defense:

Mafia will do anything to get a win. There isn't one way to win, there are many diff ways they might be able to get an edge or fool others into thinking they're town. You can't really say "I wouldn't do that as scum" since we have no way of knowing your true intentions, and whether or not you'd try something a bit off-the-wall. Many mafia like to hide in plain sight after all.

Mish and me have done good so far avoiding conflicts... which could mean either of the two extremes a very veryyy innocent and vanilla towny or a supper evil scum.

This is still weird, and I still don't remember hearing a good explanation for it.

i agree... and if Goldeneyes is a walker then theodora and BFG are most likely his (infected) accomplices

Err also joins the peeps pushing the "mafia=walkers" thing.

^^This guy is being coached in a QT, bank on it. He'll be getting my vote tomorrow. And who does it appear that he and his scummates want gone? Think about it for a minute.

So with that being said, makes me feel that scum are pushing a big game hunting agenda and I won't bite.

Don't like that Ishy brings up the big-game hunting thing here. I personally don't think it makes much sense for mafia to big-game hunt when driving a lynch, if anything it runs the risk of awaking the sleeping giant and getting themselves in the spotlight. If big-game hunting happens, I think it's much more likely to happen with the NK, not the lynch.

For that matter, he also seems to buddy me a bit later (don't think I grabbed that quote) when he says my train looked scum-led. It very well may have been, but Ishy deserves a faint FOS for the buddying.

I would like to change my vote and I would like you to see my point.

So, let's see Peace - honestly, I cannot figure out some of your posts, like you are playing too many games at once, which annoys me. These are good enough reasons for me not to be in a game. Also, first he is inactive, then post some random quotes and when pressured to take position, he is suggesting Despo's scumm.

Unvote Dap

Vote Peace

This was another of the votes on Peace I didn't like. First she overexplains a bit at the start, seems like she might be a bit too self-conscious of how others perceive her changing her vote.

More importantly, she joins the train on Peace, but for justification makes it seem like she wants to lynch him on policy, for being in a number of games at once. This is obviously a scummy move; putting a rather late vote on someone (mighta put him at L-3 or L-2, can't remember, but also distancing from the lynch in a way, by voting for policy instead of for who you think would be scum.

Des: Plays a very townie game to me. He's similar to how I've seen him as town recently. Plus he wants a long D1, with lots of discussion and competing trains, wich is a pro-town move, but not forced so as it seems he's looking for town cred. I do not agree with his train in the slightest.

Dora, oooh this girl is all over the place. First she votes Ishy to "see how he would defend"... Uhm, defend against what? She continues to just focus on him for a while. Then she accused BFG for diversion, when it was Dap who brought up the off-topic talk, and Err and Gold also was part of it. Then she moves her vote to Dap, putting him at L-1, with a very, very thin reason. Her extremely premature VT claim... Eh. And then some set-up talk used to nudge on Des and create a distraction. Also, very defensive.

Nol, I can't get a proper read on him yet, sometimes he seems very townie, and then he does some things that I feel are questionable (his first vote on BGF, his quick vote on Dap after Dap's silly posts to Ishy, his jump on Des after Des' unvote). My gut says mafia.

Ishy, no good read yet, he started off spammy and fluffy, next time he came on he responded to a bunch of posts but didn't really say anything properly game-related. Null read so far.

Lenlo, starts off wanting the game to chill down, and continues to mostly spam and joke through the rest of the game. He doesn't place a vote until today, the day of deadline, with an vote on Des, giving us 3 equal trains if my math is correct. His reasons for voting Des is BS, as what he critized Des for is exactly the way Des was in the Weasly-game, where he was town. Len wasn't in that game though, but still.

Dap, been joking a fair bit, but also posting some good game content inbetween. Tenous town lean so far. I feel like the train buildt on him was buildt on air and wishes, I can't see a good reason for that train tbh.

Peace, few posts, little content. Confuses players. Null read, think the train o him is also buildt on very thin grounds.

BFG, also high on my potentional scum-list. First off her very quick jumping on Len accusing him of having extra information when he said it was people you had to look out for (look at the thread title, d'uh. ) She keeps prodding him. Joined in the off-topic talk, null tell in itself, but interesting since she's the only one Dora targeted accusing of diversion. Nitpicks on Dap's grammar for his "and if I know I'm not mafia" (wich I too would say is a pretty common way of phrasing things in an discussion), and prods at Des for asnwering "for" Dap. And then her quickly following Nol onto Des.

Leelou, like I mentioned a bit more spammy than I'm used to seeing her, it's a null read so far but I'm keeping an eye on her. Her "random" vote on Pral felt off. Gets a bit snippy at Dap when he tries to link her with Peace.

Gold: Had an epic slip. Seems way too knowledgable for a newbie. Way pingy, top mafia read atm, but D1 newbie pass and all, meh. Also had a weird vote on Nol where it seemed like character fishing? I haven't seen the show, but it was something about an eye patch made of a baseball, it sounded so specific that I guessed it was related to a character. Very defensive.

Pral comes in late with a "jokey" vote on Peace, says nothing more, than suddenly votes BFG without a reason... Need to talk more. Null read.

Verb, as also mentioned before, way more spammy than I'm used to seeing him. I don't know what to make of it though, because the last game I saw him in he was mafia and acting totally different. Keeping an eye on him.

Err: Has little real game content, not until p13. Has a town read on Nol and scum read on Gold. And then he links me and himself for some unknown reason. I didn't really understand that part, had a slight role fishing (?). He's new too and so ofc don't know about the newb d1 free pass so his vote on Gold is a null tell. No read on atm.

I don't remember if I've even covered everyone playing, or if I even got in all I was going to (lost my notes halfway through because of a Firefox hiccup and couldn't be bothered to redo them when I was already over the time limit I'd set myself) There might even be some halffinished sentenced in there but right now I just wanna get this posted because deadline is ticking closer. But my main suspects are Lenlo, wich is where my vote will be going, Gold, and then I think the third is either Dora or BFG, but I'm leaning more towards Dora.

Vote Lenlo

I like this post, like every bit of it (except for her mixing games up for a sec and adding Verb to the list lol). Like her reads, her reasoning, everything. Def town read on her atm.

Saturday morning here *yawns*

Morning

Ok, Theodora claims one of the roles that Des said could be mafia and says it's Town, can't see anything more specific than that

Two of BFG's posts after a long hiatus. She was fairly active at the start of the game, but didn't post nearly as much for a while after picking up a couple of votes... then comes back with this, even tho there was much more to comment on.

Didn't find much from BFG on my reread, but she could be trying to lay low on purpose. FOS.

just in case i dont survive the night.... you know where i stand at now

Scum list:

GoldenEye (95%)

Peace (60%)

BFG (20%)

Don't like Err throwing out the "Just in case I don't survive the night..." thing. Seems like a fake way to try and look townie, and I HIGHLY doubt the mafia team would have been looking to NK Err if he was town. Seems completely unnecessary to say.

I'd be happy to address your issues with me if you asked for some specific justifications. Besides that, there's not much I can really say other than to state I'm town, which anyone would do so it's a pretty worthless statement to make.

at this time i think u should address the whole town with justifications......

And I also don't like Err trying to proxy himself into "the whole town" here. He shouldn't need to make comments like that, if he wants justification for something, he can ask for it specifically. Again, seems like an unnecessary thing to say in an attempt to earn town cred.

BFG · November 25, 2013

Des/Peace what evidence do you have for a serial killer? We had one kill last night so I don't see any evidence for one other than your flavor?

Desp, I am T-dog. I am a bomb. Hence, the reason for the soft claim. Cause, you know me...I don't soft claim.

I would peg Shane as a serial killer.

VOTE THEO

Unvote.

Bomb would sorta make sense for T-Dog, he does sacrifice himself for Carol. And to answer someone else, bomb would also sort of balance town Lovers.

However, a Cop, Lovers, a Bomb, AND a SK in a basic game (not to mention a possible Doc)? I don't see it, and with AJ being a new mod I think there's a pretty good chance he got it balance checked.

I'm actually thinking this is a good way to test your claim. I could buy Shane as a SK, but if Theo ends up flipping as one, I won't really believe your bomb claim, which of course is a convenient fake claim for scum.

Vote Theo.

How about we vote Peace to test his claim? (Hear me out - I had a long time in the Dead thread with Csarmi talking about numbers during the Weasley game).

Essentially if we lynch Town today (whether 1 or 2 players) we enter lylo for the rest of the game. If we lynch one Town then it becomes 6v3 (5v3 overnight unless the Doc protect works) If we lynch Town again it becomes 4v3 (3v3 unless the doc...). Normally the mafia win once they equal or exceed Towns numbers. If we lynch two Town today then it becomes 5v3 (4v3 overnight unless...) So it becomes lylo during Day 3 either way if we vote Town today. Of course not voting Town wouldn't take us to lylo...

So how about we vote for the person to hammer Peace. If Peace is lying we've caught mafia. If he's not then either the person who voted is mafia (who would be lynched anyway) (taking us to 6v2 (5v2) and not lylo) or that person's Town in which case they'd have been voted anyway, and both situations take us to lylo. This removes the confusion around Peace, since I don't see how he can be cleared (if there's a GF then a cop viewing doesn't clear him).

This also depends on enough people being around at deadline to vote somebody else if the person in question refuses to hammer Peace (although AJ has said there will be no consequences if we can't reach a majority (but not to make a habit of it)). So, needing people around at deadline is a real logistical problem with this working.

There may well be holes in this logic (other than logistics), please feel free to poke them.

fwiw at the moment Err would currently be my choice to hammer, but there are a few other people I want to look at tonight.

And as an addendum this (the numbers) is all assuming 3 mafia.

hazelkrs1 · November 25, 2013

TL,DR/Summary:

Ishy, Leelou, Theo, BFG, and Err were the peeps I noticed pushing the "mafia=zombies" angle. Obv they aren't all scum, so some may have just been misguided, but I def think there's prob a scummer or two in there. Of that group, Theo pushed it the hardest by far, whereas BFG did so in a much more subtle way (asked a question to Lenlo that implied she thought zombies could be mafia).

The early votes and fos's against Peace were pretty bad. Especially didn't like Theo's vote on him yesterday that used policy for justification (him being in multiple games at once). T-Dog does seem likely to be in the game, so there's also that. However, the bomb claim is still convenient so we can't dismiss him outright.

BFG was active at the start, then seemed to go into hiding for a while after getting a couple of votes. Didn't see much from her on reread, I think she's done a good job of staying under the radar.

Ishy buddied me a bit and said people could have been big-game hunting when driving lynches yesterday, I don't really agree.

Err threw out a lot of "noobtells", but some of them could have been on purpose. Especially stuff like when he said he thought mafia could only talk at night. Dude played mafia irl, so I know he still has to be watched carefully, even if he is new to forum mafia. He also seemed to try including himself with town a good bit, which obviously pings.

Leelou tried skirting the serious/not serious line day 1 methinks. Her defense of her Pray vote doesn't really hold up considering she said she wanted to get the game going, yet voted for an outlier and said she wanted to keep the votes spread around (which prevents trains from forming, which prevents followup pressure, etc.). Then she later came in and fos'd Pray for being worried about a train forming on Dap too quickly. Contradiction there makes me VERY uncomfortable about her.

However, I easily found the most pings from Theo during my reread. Opportunistic voting on trains, overexplains her intentions, not to mention her being Shane and yet also trying to use me being Andrea to try and discredit me. Obvious scum.

[Basic] The Walking Dead Mafia - Game Over. Theo Wins!

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