Merlin Mafia [Advanced!]- Town Wins!!!

[michellem]

Dap did. I'll go find that too.

[michellem]

This post from Dap on page 54:

http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/82400-merlin-mafia-advanced-day-3/?p=2943285

 

I'm not gonna quote it, cause it's a typical Dap monster post. But it's in the middle there.

[peacesells]

 

Nonono, they need to also state that they are not anti-town and that they win with the town. Otherwise you can find role technicalities that allow them to slip through the cracks.

 

I actually agree with this. A symp would be telling the truth if they said "I am town" but lying if they said "I win with town"

 

How about "I am town and win with town" as a quote to say?

 

 

Hmmm, this is pure speculation on my part, but what are the chances that Hallia could be fake claiming in order to allow the real cop of this game to avoid being RB by the mafia?

slim to none.

Town my their nature are dumb. They are uninformed and if someone starts claiming their character or role they get all trigger happy and call them out thinking they have a sure mafia. That's why fake claiming as town is far more risky and fun than doing so as mafia

The fact that Vam even speculates this is odd.

 

Here's what Hally posted first on Day 2 and Day 3.

 

And of course I was blocked >.<

>.< Stahp blocking meeeeee

If she was not the real cop and was fake claiming, why would she know that she was being role blocked? I think the point of that statement was that she is faking and so doesn't know. She is faking everything (Women )

But you seem to be deliberately obtuse in this

Normally, if you don't have a role and are role blocked, it doesn't do anything - only if you actually have a role do you know you were being roleblocked. that's what faking is... You pretend (for the record I believe hally ) The fact that she's posted this twice reinforces the belief that she was telling the truth about her claim.

Add to that the fact that she's not been counterclaimed, and you have a plausible assumption that Hally is indeed the cop.

I agree with the counterclaim part but your logic on the faking and role block is flawed

 

doubtful, since the real cop in your scenario wouldn't know that and would probably have counter claimed by now.

I agree that its doubtful. Unless the real cop in this game decided that he or she could help the Town better by not counter claiming and thus avoid being RB by the mafia.

if she were faking they could use it as a cover and check her that night. It's a smart move if you have the balls

I believe that Hallia is probably the cop. But what if she is not? Then when the real cop is revealed she dies. It's pretty simple

Now, let me ask, why does Vam bring up the possibility of her not being the cop? to discredit her. But atleast he discredits using fairly consistent and logical ideas. Your attempts to discredit him are lacking to say the least He himself admitted that he believes that Hally was probably the cop. So the interaction here is odd. However I agree with that last part

 

Where is Thorum? Probably enjoying family time over the weekend. However, if I add my vote to his train, he is still at least two more votes away from being lynched. Also, I am finding his interactions with Wombat to be suspicious. Therefore;.....

 

VOTE Thorum

It sounds to me like Vam was laying the groundwork for the scum to come in and lynch Thorum without his getting a word in. In a game like this, two votes is nothing. On a weekend on DM? So the nonchalant vote is interesting. He can claim that he didn't hammer, and that it was someone else who actually lynched Thorum.

Now you're thinking a bit.

My thoughts on this

I see no reason for Lancelot not to be in the game. Even though he buggers off according to the wiki he is still relevant. I don't see him as mafia but SK backup does fit at a small stretch (really cool thing for a mod to do BTW).

Anyway I don't think he would know who the mafia are so I don't see his interaction with wombat as an indication of mafia working together. I do see potential for it it be a SK jumping on something they think would benefit them but no mafia on mafia action IMO

For Mish's benefit:

I am town. I win only with town. There is no other way I can win. (I copied Peace's statement, as it is stronger than just saying "I'm town")

 

And finally, I didn't like Vam's whole line about the cop. Given that he himself admitted that he believed that Hally was probably the cop, I think he was adding nothing but unnecessary speculation to the game. Yup I agree thereAdd to that a vote on Thorum at the end of the day that put him up to L-2 with that being part of the reason that he voted has me thinking that we found one. Unvote, vote: Vam.

Right onwards

 

Nonono, they need to also state that they are not anti-town and that they win with the town. Otherwise you can find role technicalities that allow them to slip through the cracks.

Wtf are you talking about? I didn't like it when Pete and Lily started this nonsense and I don't like you perpetuating it.

How can you be both town and anti-town?

How can you be town and not win with the town?

A symp

I think I've explained it but they are a mafia sympathiser, but they are town. They start as town and generally have a way to become mafia. This means until this point they are not mafia

It's kinda mods call but if they can't see the QT then IMO they are part of the town

If they can then they are mafia

 

But this does look oddly jumpy at the idea of changing the wording. There is no reason not to change the wording so why does it matter?

I was content to let you sit as a confirmed player for now but you are heading down the scummy road

 

 

Darthe now you're overcomplicating things. I'm gonna ask that nobody does that. I'm not supposed to do all the work for town you know.

This was a redeeming post mish

Made me lol

 

About the Krak asking about the ST thing. It doesn't bother me too much. He just asked what the role was and as far as I can find he has been in no games with a LD in before (yes I went though old games)

 

 

 

 

There it is.  I cut off the bottom half of his WOT.  I must be tired not catching that.

 

So that blows Kraks excuse.  UNVOTE   VOTE KRAK

 

I'm going to bed.

[dapianoplay3r]

WOAH WOAH WOAH WOAH!

 

Dap, did you say you went through KRak's old games? And there was never an LD? But he said he was the LD in the last game he was in!

 

 

 

 

And no, no sign of Snow :/

I just did a content search and looked though them

I missed that sorry

 

What game is he taking about?

[michellem]

I don't know what game; I quoted the relevant post on this page. He says it was the last game he played in.

[michellem]

Last page, sorry.

[dapianoplay3r]

I wanted to stalk it

Before I go to bed

If I vote krak it won't hammer him will it?

[dapianoplay3r]

Ill risk it

It doesn't look like he is

 

unvote vote krak

[Tyler Glembo]

VC? 

 

If Krak isn't hammered I'll do so based on the arguments so far.  I'd prefer to see a Vam lynch but I'm not sure we can do that in the time remaining.

[WWWwombat]

VC?

 

If Krak isn't hammered I'll do so based on the arguments so far. I'd prefer to see a Vam lynch but I'm not sure we can do that in the time remaining.

Lol really?

 

If you're intending to blind hammer Krak, why do you care about the vote count?

 

Also, why are you acting like the deadline is an hour from now when it's actually ten hours from now?

[Tyler Glembo]

 

VC?

 

If Krak isn't hammered I'll do so based on the arguments so far. I'd prefer to see a Vam lynch but I'm not sure we can do that in the time remaining.

Lol really?

 

If you're intending to blind hammer Krak, why do you care about the vote count?

 

Also, why are you acting like the deadline is an hour from now when it's actually ten hours from now?

 

 

That's interesting Wombat.  On D1 when I tried to vote who I thought was scummiest with 10 hours to go you called me out for acting like there was too much time, starting a new train and not going along with what was the obvious lynch.  Now on D3 when I say I'd like to see a VC first and not "blind hammer" with 10 hours left you respond to me as though I think there is not enough time.  It seems to me that you are saying : 10 hours = too much time = not enough time.  

 

To answer your question, I'd like to see the VC because, as I said, I'd rather see a Vam lynch.  If Vam has enough votes to be a reasonable train I'm going to put my vote on him.  If not, then for the sake of achieving a lynch I'll put my vote on Krak before deadline.

[WWWwombat]

Also, how can you tell who we can and can't lynch if you don't even know the VC?

 

And what makes you so eager to blind lynch Krak? You afraid you'll miss your chance to bus?

[WWWwombat]

 

 

 

VC?

 

If Krak isn't hammered I'll do so based on the arguments so far. I'd prefer to see a Vam lynch but I'm not sure we can do that in the time remaining.

Lol really?

 

If you're intending to blind hammer Krak, why do you care about the vote count?

 

Also, why are you acting like the deadline is an hour from now when it's actually ten hours from now?

That's interesting Wombat. On D1 when I tried to vote who I thought was scummiest with 10 hours to go you called me out for acting like there was too much time, starting a new train and not going along with what was the obvious lynch. Now on D3 when I say I'd like to see a VC first and not "blind hammer" with 10 hours left you respond to me as though I think there is not enough time. It seems to me that you are saying : 10 hours = too much time = not enough time.

 

To answer your question, I'd like to see the VC because, as I said, I'd rather see a Vam lynch. If Vam has enough votes to be a reasonable train I'm going to put my vote on him. If not, then for the sake of achieving a lynch I'll put my vote on Krak before deadline.

There's a middle ground between putting a second vote on someone 10 hours before deadline and blind hammering someone 10 hours before deadline. I suggest you find it next time.

[Tyler Glembo]

Also, how can you tell who we can and can't lynch if you don't even know the VC?

 

And what makes you so eager to blind lynch Krak? You afraid you'll miss your chance to bus?

 

I think you are misinterpreting, and it feels like you are doing it purposely.  If you aren't a ST and really are town I have to say I've thought you were scum from the get go.  

 

I can't tell who we can and can't lynch and that is why I want a VC.  It seems to me that Krak is the biggest train and Despo is the second, but I'm not sure how close either is.  I also don't know how close Vam is.  Hence, I'd like to see a VC so I can figure out exactly what you're asking.

 

And what are you talking about with blind lynching Krak?  I didn't vote.  I said that I would if needs be.  Are you looking at my actions or are you reacting to what my actions could be?

[Tyler Glembo]

 

There's a middle ground between putting a second vote on someone 10 hours before deadline and blind hammering someone 10 hours before deadline. I suggest you find it next time.

 

 

Oh yes, good point.  I blind hammered Krak and totally missed the middle ground.  That middle ground would have been stating an intent to vote without actually voting, but somehow that just flew right past me! [/sarcasm]

[Krakalakachkn]

Right. Give me a minute.

[WWWwombat]

UNOFFICIAL VOTE COUNT

 

Womby (1/9): Thorum
Vambram (3/9):  Hallia, peace, Razen
kraka (6/9): Mish, Bob, Tigraine, alannalynn, Despo, Player
Despo (3/9): Womby, Vambram, Darthe

 

 

 

Coulda done that yourself if you really cared, TG.

[Krakalakachkn]

I counted 7/9, but maybe I made a mistake.

 

 

 

 

I was indeed a Lie Detector in my last game.  Seeing how it was at least 6 months ago or more, I have no idea what game it was.  What I do know is that my account, along with several others, got screwed up a month or two ago and I lost some content.  All I can say is that I was the LD, but there was no silvertongue that I was aware of.

[Krakalakachkn]

 

WOAH WOAH WOAH WOAH!

 

Dap, did you say you went through KRak's old games? And there was never an LD? But he said he was the LD in the last game he was in!

 

 

 

 

And no, no sign of Snow :/

I just did a content search and looked though them

I missed that sorry

 

What game is he taking about?

 

 

Content Search?  Did you search the mafia board, or all boards?

[WWWwombat]

 

Also, how can you tell who we can and can't lynch if you don't even know the VC?

 

And what makes you so eager to blind lynch Krak? You afraid you'll miss your chance to bus?

 

I think you are misinterpreting, and it feels like you are doing it purposely.  If you aren't a ST and really are town I have to say I've thought you were scum from the get go.  

 

I can't tell who we can and can't lynch and that is why I want a VC.  It seems to me that Krak is the biggest train and Despo is the second, but I'm not sure how close either is.  I also don't know how close Vam is.  Hence, I'd like to see a VC so I can figure out exactly what you're asking.

 

And what are you talking about with blind lynching Krak?  I didn't vote.  I said that I would if needs be.  Are you looking at my actions or are you reacting to what my actions could be?

 

 

I'm not misinterpreting.  I am interpreting your words perfectly.  Whether they convey the meaning you meant them to convey is your issue, not mine.

 

You said:

 

"If Krak isn't hammered I'll do so based on the arguments so far. I'd prefer to see a Vam lynch but I'm not sure we can do that in the time remaining."

 

Emphasis mine.  No mention of a possible roleclaim.  If that doesn't imply a desire to blind hammer Krak in the imminent future, nothing does.

[wheeloftime13]

Official Vote Count 

Womby (1/9): Thorum
Vambram (2/9):  Hallia, Razen

kraka (7/9): Mish, Bob, Tigraine, alannalynn, Despo, player, peace

Despo (3/9): Womby, Vambram, Darthe

deadline is Tuesday at 20:00 EST 
http://www.timeandda...lin Mafia Day 3

[Krakalakachkn]

 

 

Nonono, they need to also state that they are not anti-town and that they win with the town. Otherwise you can find role technicalities that allow them to slip through the cracks.

 

I actually agree with this. A symp would be telling the truth if they said "I am town" but lying if they said "I win with town"

 

How about "I am town and win with town" as a quote to say?

 

 

Hmmm, this is pure speculation on my part, but what are the chances that Hallia could be fake claiming in order to allow the real cop of this game to avoid being RB by the mafia?

slim to none.

Town my their nature are dumb. They are uninformed and if someone starts claiming their character or role they get all trigger happy and call them out thinking they have a sure mafia. That's why fake claiming as town is far more risky and fun than doing so as mafia

The fact that Vam even speculates this is odd.

 

Here's what Hally posted first on Day 2 and Day 3.

 

And of course I was blocked >.<

>.< Stahp blocking meeeeee

If she was not the real cop and was fake claiming, why would she know that she was being role blocked? I think the point of that statement was that she is faking and so doesn't know. She is faking everything (Women )

But you seem to be deliberately obtuse in this

Normally, if you don't have a role and are role blocked, it doesn't do anything - only if you actually have a role do you know you were being roleblocked. that's what faking is... You pretend (for the record I believe hally ) The fact that she's posted this twice reinforces the belief that she was telling the truth about her claim.

Add to that the fact that she's not been counterclaimed, and you have a plausible assumption that Hally is indeed the cop.

I agree with the counterclaim part but your logic on the faking and role block is flawed

 

doubtful, since the real cop in your scenario wouldn't know that and would probably have counter claimed by now.

I agree that its doubtful. Unless the real cop in this game decided that he or she could help the Town better by not counter claiming and thus avoid being RB by the mafia.

if she were faking they could use it as a cover and check her that night. It's a smart move if you have the balls

I believe that Hallia is probably the cop. But what if she is not? Then when the real cop is revealed she dies. It's pretty simple

Now, let me ask, why does Vam bring up the possibility of her not being the cop? to discredit her. But atleast he discredits using fairly consistent and logical ideas. Your attempts to discredit him are lacking to say the least He himself admitted that he believes that Hally was probably the cop. So the interaction here is odd. However I agree with that last part

 

Where is Thorum? Probably enjoying family time over the weekend. However, if I add my vote to his train, he is still at least two more votes away from being lynched. Also, I am finding his interactions with Wombat to be suspicious. Therefore;.....

 

VOTE Thorum

It sounds to me like Vam was laying the groundwork for the scum to come in and lynch Thorum without his getting a word in. In a game like this, two votes is nothing. On a weekend on DM? So the nonchalant vote is interesting. He can claim that he didn't hammer, and that it was someone else who actually lynched Thorum.

Now you're thinking a bit.

My thoughts on this

I see no reason for Lancelot not to be in the game. Even though he buggers off according to the wiki he is still relevant. I don't see him as mafia but SK backup does fit at a small stretch (really cool thing for a mod to do BTW).

Anyway I don't think he would know who the mafia are so I don't see his interaction with wombat as an indication of mafia working together. I do see potential for it it be a SK jumping on something they think would benefit them but no mafia on mafia action IMO

For Mish's benefit:

I am town. I win only with town. There is no other way I can win. (I copied Peace's statement, as it is stronger than just saying "I'm town")

 

And finally, I didn't like Vam's whole line about the cop. Given that he himself admitted that he believed that Hally was probably the cop, I think he was adding nothing but unnecessary speculation to the game. Yup I agree thereAdd to that a vote on Thorum at the end of the day that put him up to L-2 with that being part of the reason that he voted has me thinking that we found one. Unvote, vote: Vam.

Right onwards

 

Nonono, they need to also state that they are not anti-town and that they win with the town. Otherwise you can find role technicalities that allow them to slip through the cracks.

Wtf are you talking about? I didn't like it when Pete and Lily started this nonsense and I don't like you perpetuating it.

How can you be both town and anti-town?

How can you be town and not win with the town?

A symp

I think I've explained it but they are a mafia sympathiser, but they are town. They start as town and generally have a way to become mafia. This means until this point they are not mafia

It's kinda mods call but if they can't see the QT then IMO they are part of the town

If they can then they are mafia

 

But this does look oddly jumpy at the idea of changing the wording. There is no reason not to change the wording so why does it matter?

I was content to let you sit as a confirmed player for now but you are heading down the scummy road

 

 

Darthe now you're overcomplicating things. I'm gonna ask that nobody does that. I'm not supposed to do all the work for town you know.

This was a redeeming post mish

Made me lol

 

About the Krak asking about the ST thing. It doesn't bother me too much. He just asked what the role was and as far as I can find he has been in no games with a LD in before (yes I went though old games)

 

 

 

 

There it is.  I cut off the bottom half of his WOT.  I must be tired not catching that.

 

So that blows Kraks excuse.  UNVOTE   VOTE KRAK

 

Excuse for what?  For asking what a Silvertongue is?

 

 

I've been told to look it up, and know that it's not on mafiascum, not even linked on the LD definition page.  Thus, I asked what one was.  I don't think that was too shady or needed an excuse.  Also, nobody has answered me yet.  Does a silvertongue have any abilities other than being invisible to the LD?

[Tyler Glembo]

I'm not misinterpreting.  I am interpreting your words perfectly.  Whether they convey the meaning you meant them to convey is your issue, not mine.

 

You said:

 

"If Krak isn't hammered I'll do so based on the arguments so far. I'd prefer to see a Vam lynch but I'm not sure we can do that in the time remaining."

 

Emphasis mine.  No mention of a possible roleclaim.  If that doesn't imply a desire to blind hammer Krak in the imminent future, nothing does.

 

 

 

I think the key thing in your statement are the words "emphasis mine."  Exactly. 

 

Anyways, if your VC is reasonably accurate then vote Vam.  And again, I'll switch and vote Krak based on the arguments so far. 

[Tyler Glembo]

@Krak - maybe I've missed it, but you haven't claimed yet, correct?

[michellem]

I don't think I've seen a single game with a lie detector where the mafia doesn't have a silver tongue.