Cults in Mafia

[dapianoplay3r]

In ligjt of basels game i thought i would start a discussion about cults

 

so afew questions

1. Should they be a part of games or shpuld mods have to call the game a bastard mod game or warn of the cult

 

2. How do you play as; Cult, Mafia against cult, or town against cult?

 

3. How shpuld Mods balance a game around a cult?

 

 

Personally i dont like them but i think they have theur parts in the game and should be allowed in adcanced games. I dont like jesters either but they are still part of life.

I think the.main issue is people have forgotten how to deal with a cult and are a little scared of them.

I remember way back when, and when i played cult i considered it more challenging.than mafia or town.

 

So tips for cult. Be wary. There ate roles to trip you up annd screw you over. Try to limit the number of mafia you take and let the one you have inflience the others. If the mod doesnt let the post on the mafia QT once recruited you need to get rid or recruit the others asap. They will figureout their teammate is.missing but still on the game thread and willl go after ypu asap.

As mafia pay attenntion. If your teammates start guiding yoy something might be up. Dont bargin with themm. They dont need you to win and are just using you

(a note on this. I believe once recruited dony try help your mafia buddies. They aent your team annymore and you dont owe them anythinng)

As town you need to get rid of the cult first. The mafia shpuld have the same goal as you and its one of the few times ill leave mafia alive. Its why i say cult is hard. Everyone hates them.

Its also one of the few times i say check the people not contributing. The CL is alone to start with so wont want attention. Unlike mafia who start strng cult need to build strength. You need to stop them before that.

 

As for mods saying there is a cult. I think they shpuldnt have to and it will scare players away. If you pay attention you shoud be able to guess there might be one anyway.

I think if we had more cult games people would learn to deal with.it and it wouldnt have such a stigma

 

so thats my 2¢

 

Im for cult in games and i think we need to learn to play with cults abd not be afraid

[dapianoplay3r]

Oh yea. Cults should be limited to abput the size of mafia. Then they shpuld have no more recruits or another limitibg factor

PRs should become vanilla when it comes to cult imo. They have more infornation than mafia or town so tthey dont need roles

[Turin Turambar]

I hope this isn't relating to an ongoing game.

[Mrs. Cindy Gill]

just ended I think

[dapianoplay3r]

I waited

game ended this morning

 

unless you have something to share turin.

[Niniel]

It's over.

 

I hate cult games unless I'm in it from the start. Lol My BT game had cult but no mafia. Rand (BG) was joat and one of his abilities was to protect against recruiting.

[dapianoplay3r]

But why? To me they are just another form mafia

 

recruiting just seems to freak people out

[Mrs. Cindy Gill]

the fear is a good thing.

[dapianoplay3r]

Id rather have a cult than a solo personally

[Turin Turambar]

Oh. Okay. I wasn't following that game so didn't know it was done. Just that Basel had a game he was modding in SG.

 

My view is that there is nothing wrong with Cult in the game of mafia. I don't get the fear that is generated by them. I think it may stem from the reliance on verifying townies thru cop views and the like. I have played in a couple of games as cult and we won both of them against fairly long odds.

 

When town in any mafia game, you need to look for all the anti-town elements. Not just mafia and not just cult. They will give you some opportunity to  suss them out.

 

The QT thing is a difficult one to resolve but I think that recruited players should be allowed to talk on their old QT regardless. It is too big a tell if someone goes silent on a QT. This actually happened in one of the games I played. REd and Kae were a neighborhood watch team. WE recruited Red but then she couldn't post and Kae led her lynch nearly immediately. In a different recent game that had limited recruit ability again Red got recruited as part of a mason pair and was allowed to keep posting in mason QT. She ended up being the last anti-town left but did get caught due to game thread conversations.

[dapianoplay3r]

Ive always considered cult a hard to win role

 

but yes youve touched on a whole 'nother issue there. People are far too used to relying on the PRs

 

people need to learn that the doc and cop arent your only tools. There are games that dont even onclude those roles.

 

I think they should be allowed to keep posting its far to obvious if you cant. As mafia you can also feed the cult missinformation if you think about it

Cult xan be used

[Basel Gill]

I normally don't like dealing with cult as a player myself, although I have heard it is a lot more fun when you are on the cult side. I've never played as cult. But I'd also heard it can be fun to mod a game with cult, and it seemed like something I wanted to run at least once in my career. I did make efforts to limit the cult by giving the recruitment a percentage chance to fail, but the cult kept beating the odds. I don't know that I'll ever use cult again, based on how the game actually wound up going.

[dapianoplay3r]

I once played cult leader. I got mafia first nighht but then the town double agent the second. She outed us and Ed outed the mafia

Game kinda exploded and ended pretty fast

[dapianoplay3r]

Oh and basel like i PMed you i think.it was fair. I have an issue with.how the players handled it but it was fair

 

i love how you limited the recruits but i disagree that they might of kept theur ORs

[Niniel]

I don't like cult because (unless you find the cl early) you have to start all over each day. The people you "know" are on your team might not be anymore. I have been cl twice and that is fun. Right now I prefer small basic games.

[dapianoplay3r]

Its the samme with a mafia framer or rolling godfather

 

your relying on verifacation not play

[Turin Turambar]

In every game I have played that had recruitment only two I believe let the recruited keep their previous role. Both were Darthe's games. (Game of Thrones and Ultimate showdown). In fact one caused us a major issue when we recruited someone in hopes of using their role only to find out they became vanilla. TBH it would have been almost too easy to win if we could have kept that role for the mafia team. Just taking it from the town was probably worth it tho.

 

With recruits in the game it means you need to keep track of what people are doing. No one can be vetted forever unless they are specifically unrecruitable which is somewhat rare(and you need to be able to convince people of that fact) When people chang alignment it is common to see at least some change in game play.

 

Tina's game was a trip. I got recruited Night 2 and the CL and Ithi (recruited N1) were both killed that night. There was no way we should have won that game. We were begging for a kill from tina so we could have a chance.

[dapianoplay3r]

I just read the basel cult QT. Dice was mafia but not allowed to share his.teammates names

 

personally i dont mind name sharing. It creates a kinda awkward alliance that the two teams have to bare and the town can use this to their advantage

[Basel Gill]

I just read the basel cult QT. Dice was mafia but not allowed to share his.teammates names

 

personally i dont mind name sharing. It creates a kinda awkward alliance that the two teams have to bare and the town can use this to their advantage

I took this off a previous game (Ama's WoT game, in fact). It seemed unfair to the mafia to have the cult know who the whole mafia team was. In that one, the cult also seemed to figure out on their own who the mafia team were. DPR's thread on how to setup and mod a game has some talk on cult, and I found myself liking the percentage to recruit ideas mentioned there. The idea there was to give PRs that get recruited one shot then become vanilla, I thought to instead try a small percentage to keep the power altogether and that's what I submitted to DPR. He was fine with it, and the only suggestion he had was to reduce the mafia by one member since the reduced chance of recruiting mafia gave them a numerical boost.

 

The other way around, with mafia knowing who cult was, was done by the cult's choice. And Darthe's plan was to not be fully truthful about this; notice that he told Dice to say you instead of Talya when naming the cult.

[dapianoplay3r]

Yea i saw that lol

[Darthe]

Cult is considered Bastard on MS, not because of the nature of it but because of the ways that it can destroy game balance.  

 

Cops and other investigative roles are practically rendered useless unless they can prevent a person from being turned.

 

Beyond that, strategies such as the one employed in basels game (The cult recruited a mafia member and used him to broker a deal with the mafia, granting them voting majority because the two teams together were larger than town) are not beyond means.  One way that this can be combatted in cult games is that the mafia member is replaced upon being converted to cult and the replacement has no knowledge of the previous team. Still, that is a sucky thing to have happen to you in a game.

 

One of my favorite things about the Cult (or least favorite) is that if they do gain a mafia member they can control the NK.  If recruited, most often the cults powers are stripped away to avoid this but if that isn't done it can be havoc.

 

Of course, a cultafia is almost certainly going to win if the CL isn't dead within a day or two.

[Basel Gill]

I don't think I will ever use a cultafia. That's way too bastard... even for the person who made survivor a town role.

[Turin Turambar]

I played a game that cult could either kill or recruit each night with both being a percentage chance of success. It was a bit of a comedy of errors as our actions kept failing at the worst times. It was not blocking on the town and mafia's parts it was just the luck of the draw as it were.

[dapianoplay3r]

I dont think.town survivor is that evil

[dapianoplay3r]

Was thqt game balanced and who won?