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How do the Seanchan create the O'dam?


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One possibility that I'm surprised no one has mentioned yet is Ishamael:

The Stag and Lion[/i]']

"I whispered in Artur Hawkwing's ear, and the length and breadth of the land Aes Sedai died. I whispered again, and the High King sent his armies across the Aryth Ocean, across the World Sea, and sealed two dooms. The doom of his dream of one land and one people, and a doom yet to come. At his deathbed I was there when his councilors told him only Aes Sedai could save his life. I spoke, and he ordered his councilors to the stake. I spoke, and the High King's last words were to cry that Tar Valon must be destroyed."

 

Unless I'm mistaken, Ishy could have sent bloodknife rings and blueprints for a'dam with Luthair's armies.

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One possibility that I'm surprised no one has mentioned yet is Ishamael:

The Stag and Lion[/i]']

"I whispered in Artur Hawkwing's ear, and the length and breadth of the land Aes Sedai died. I whispered again, and the High King sent his armies across the Aryth Ocean, across the World Sea, and sealed two dooms. The doom of his dream of one land and one people, and a doom yet to come. At his deathbed I was there when his councilors told him only Aes Sedai could save his life. I spoke, and he ordered his councilors to the stake. I spoke, and the High King's last words were to cry that Tar Valon must be destroyed."

 

Unless I'm mistaken, Ishy could have sent bloodknife rings and blueprints for a'dam with Luthair's armies.

 

We don't know about blood knives(although it is highly unlikely) but we know for certain he didn't do so so with the a'dam. It was created by a channeler named Deain on the Seanhan continent who was with the Armies of Night and give it to Luthair.

Edited by Suttree
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If I were AS, especially Elayne who has a bit of experience with ter'angreal, I would be spending some time trying experiment with ways of disrupting them in action either with the OP or other ter'angreal. I don't know if this is possible, but it's definitely been show that you can accidentally disrupt the proper functioning of a ter'angreal. Seems like a good way to fight Seanchan would be to try to target the a'dam. If you could somehow nullify that on the field, especially on a mass scale it would be a crippling blow.

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Egwene's (?) already done this - unclipping the collar while duelling.

An inverted / reversed weave (which the Seanchan can't see) designed to open A'dam would do the trick.

 

Unfortunately I don't think it can be done easily by saidin channelers without taking great risks - crazy things happen when a saidin channeler even physically touches an A'dam - if they used OP on an A'dam, it would probably be worse.

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Isn't Elayne musing in the books that fancy (ter/sa)'angreal would require men and women to work together? Or is that a fandom thought that I took to be true? If so, there were basically no male channelers to experiment with, and the forsaken are so ridiculously distrustful towards each other that they would never link to make anything useful. Though, maybe Moridin might pull something off with his control of Lanfear and Moggi; I can also not begin to imagine that AOL scientists wouldn't know anything about ter'angrealology (love that term!).

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Sure AoL had the knowledge and technology but the 13 AoL-ites locked up in SG may not have had it to the degree required. How many 21st century scientists could build or reverse engineer an internal combustion engine or just a gear-box even if they know all the principles? It requires dexterity and mechanical skill as well as OP knowledge.

Since self-evidently copies were made, somebody must be capable of this.

It's reasonable to assume its Semi herself -though we can't rule out the others.

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Isn't Elayne musing in the books that fancy (ter/sa)'angreal would require men and women to work together? Or is that a fandom thought that I took to be true?

 

It almost certainly is correct. RJ has told us many times that the best op works required men and women together.

Edited by Suttree
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How many 21st century scientists could build or reverse engineer an internal combustion engine or just a gear-box even if they know all the principles? It requires dexterity and mechanical skill as well as OP knowledge.

 

I knew that the OP existed in our world. That is the only way the internal combustion engine can work!!!!

 

Jokes aside, I agree with Sharaman. Talents vary between channelers, even back in the AoL. The Forsaken were greedy and selfish people, their Talents mostly always were targeted to whatever helped them most. Semi was the best healer ever, but she failed at something I think. Even Nyn states that she thought Moggy was odd because the Forsaken were supposed to have all this knowledge but Moggy seemed to not have a ton of it.

 

Semi most likely copied the Domination Band, but is it really that hard? Creating a brand new ter'angreal is hard as Elayne states time and again, but copying them isn't that difficult for those with the knowledge and the aptitude. Semi was scary strong, she probably did with with a blink.

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How many 21st century scientists could build or reverse engineer an internal combustion engine or just a gear-box even if they know all the principles? It requires dexterity and mechanical skill as well as OP knowledge.

 

I knew that the OP existed in our world. That is the only way the internal combustion engine can work!!!!

 

 

:rolleyes:

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Ishy is very smart and so are a couple of other Forsaken...They must have their ways.

 

Obviously, the 13 Forsaken were not the best AS of AoL, ranked 1-13, just the Dark Siders top tier. LTT was #1 and we know that there had to be other top ranked Light Side AS and that the large majority of AS were still Light Siders.

 

Even in current Randland, I would say that Nyaneve (curing severing, madness...possibly death in AMOL) is a better talented healer than Semirhage. Obviously Semirhage had greater knowledge.

 

Probably Egwene has passed Moghdien in TAR in terms of talent (broke through Moghdiens TAR trap in the earlier books, broke the damane collar in TAR which Moggy could not do, even defeated Messana with relative ease). Lastly, Egwene can probably block balefire now, learning this lesson from Perrin, very unlikely any of the Forsaken can do this.

Edited by Entreri
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She can only block balefire in TAR, because it isn't real, but she was having issues with things like that because she was thinking of TAR as the real world instead of something that she can change at will.

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Wasn't Semi and investment banker or something?

 

Also, Moggy accepts what happens in TAR as real, that's how she got captured. I don't know for sure if Egwene has internalized Perrin's message or not, we'll have to see more of her in TAR. I guess there were no wolf brothers to teach the light side AS back in the War of Power.

 

Umm, sorry, that was off topic. Put me down with those who believe that amongst all the Damane there are those who create the A'dam.

Edited by Viperswhip
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She can only block balefire in TAR, because it isn't real, but she was having issues with things like that because she was thinking of TAR as the real world instead of something that she can change at will.

 

If you are balefired in TAR, same thing happens as in Randland. In that sense it is real, see what happened to Rahvin. Perrin has opened up her mind and next time I wager Egwene will block balefire in TAR.

 

Even Ishamael has no clue, he probably thought that balefire in TAR would take care of Rand. I would also wager that Callandor can split balefire is Randland.

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You are missing the point. Balefire is real in TAR only if you make it real. Men who can channel normally have to enter in the flesh, like Rand and Rahvin did. When entering in the flesh, I believe, they not only admit that TAR is real by making it as another plane of existence, but they can also override most anything a Dreamer can do while in the dream.

 

So yes, if balefire hits you in TAR, poof you are gone, but if you understand the rules of TAR and understand that you can change the world because you are real and it is not, you can do anything.

 

When Perrin was hit with balefire, he knew that the world he was in was not real and that he could change it, so he made it so the balefire could not affect him. Eggy was thinking as an Aes Sedai and not a Dreamer, she was thinking that she could attack everything with that power, thus making it real. She forgot that she was in control and didn't remember until Messana collared her.

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You are missing the point. Balefire is real in TAR only if you make it real. Men who can channel normally have to enter in the flesh, like Rand and Rahvin did. When entering in the flesh, I believe, they not only admit that TAR is real by making it as another plane of existence, but they can also override most anything a Dreamer can do while in the dream.

 

I can see how entering physically and willfully would maximize the thought that what is sensed is in essence real, but that's not necessarily the case. I'd chalk it up to inexperience, not being men. Surely if either were Dreamers beforehand they'd have a clue that the rules are open to their imaginations.

 

So yes, if balefire hits you in TAR, poof you are gone, but if you understand the rules of TAR and understand that you can change the world because you are real and it is not, you can do anything.

 

Again they were both physically (too strongly) there. I wonder what would happen to an unprepared Dreamer hit by balefire,, if it's strong enough to hit them before they sleep does the body disappear in the real world? I tend to think that there's just a body in a bed.

 

When Perrin was hit with balefire, he knew that the world he was in was not real and that he could change it, so he made it so the balefire could not affect him. Eggy was thinking as an Aes Sedai and not a Dreamer, she was thinking that she could attack everything with that power, thus making it real. She forgot that she was in control and didn't remember until Messana collared her.

 

Egwene was definitely in the heat of the moment letting instinct kick in. I think this was a HUGE clue to ending TG for this turning.

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