CoT & KoD

[bojan95]

Hello everyone, first post here!

 

Anyways, I've been lurking around here for awhile and I noticed that people really don't like CoT, while they like KoD. With me, it's the opposite! I enjoyed reading CoT and thought it was a good book, while KoD was boring and seemed like it was 1000+ pages long. I also don't get why everyone is saying that nothing is happening in the plot. I mean sure, it's a slow book, but PoD was waaay slower than this one. Apart from Egwene's capture, there are still some good things in there. I mean, Perrin was quite enjoyable in this book - I can't stand him in the others. Sure, he is a crybaby, but at least at the end he shows his teeth. Mat! I don't like Mat as much as many people in here, but I loved him in this book! He was funny and his relationship with Tuon was interesting to read. Elayne. I hate Elayne because she is the most boring character ever.. but in CoT she's not that boring. Sure, she has like 10 baths or something, but her chapters were good... in a way. And Egwene. She is the winner in this book. I don't like Egwene that much, but the plots and secrets in her chapters were really good. I loved the Hall meeting the most. Finally Rand. He was featured less in this book, but his one chapter was excellent. Also this book introduces Rodel Ituralde, which I have mixed feelings about and the prologue, even though it was long, was good. I get it that some people don't like the book because they had to wait a long time and then they were disappointed, but if you push that aside, you'll see that it is great!

 

And KoD. I thought that it was going to be the best book in the series, as some of you say. But, I was disappointed. This book is great at the beginning and at the end, but in the middle it is such a drag. Rand's chapters were probably the worst! I've waited so long for his encounter with Semirhage, but it was boring and I hated that it was shared with Mat. Mat's battles with the Seanchan are the most boring part of the book, in my opinion. They are not long, but they are way boring. And Elayne! I wanted to strangle her when she made that stupid decision to go on her own to the BA. Three boring chapters about her rescue, when this could have been skipped. Perrin was okay in this book too, but I think Faile was better. I hated Faile before this book, but somehow she has grown on me here. And Nynaeve and Lan's chapter was too rushed and not very touching... The book needed more Nynaeve POVs (actually every book needs more Nynaeve POVs). Egwene's chapter was excellent and it was the best in the book, but not enough to do the book justice.

 

So yeah, that's about it. I was wondering if I was the only one who thinks this way - that CoT is good while KoD is bad?

[Finnssss22]

Only one question...when did you start reading the series?

 

If it was some what recent, I can see your confusion.

 

For me, I started the series just before tGH waaaaayyyy back in 1990 when I was 19.

We got the first 7 books in 7 years, then had a bit of a wait for tPoD, which after aCoS was a bit of a let down.

Then came WH, which perked us back up, then....after one of the longest waits for a book to that point, came CoT, which, at the time, was pretty unsatisfying.

After another long wait, KoD arrived and it had a lot more substance and plot furthering crap going on.

 

So, I can see why someone who started late (I assume you did) and didn't have to go through the agonizing wait periods longer readers did.

 

CoT is not a terrible book, but it is one of the weakest in the series for many and the long wait time getting to it definitely undermined it further.

[ironisles]

I gotta say it was the opposite for me. KoD was almost as good as the first books were.

[bojan95]

Around 3 years ago, I had to wait only a couple of months for TGS.

[UGAShadow]

The problem I see is you don't seem to enjoy Mat. Mat is awesome and the only good thing about CoT.

 

 

His battle with the Seanchan were great and his marriage was great. I love all of Mats stuff.

[bojan95]

But I liked Mat in CoT. The only problem about Mat in KoD are the battles, the earlier chapters are okay, and the one with the marriage is great. But the last chapter and the others with the battles were pretty boring.

[UGAShadow]

Mat's battles aren't boring.

 

 

 

Perrin buying grain is boring. Worst bubble of evil in the series.

[Feral]

The book needed more Nynaeve POVs (actually every book needs more Nynaeve POVs)

 

Always going to agree with that lol.

 

I half agree, in that I don't think CoT was that bad and I think parts of KoD were worse. But I think over all I prefer KoD, mainly because of two scenes that were spine-tingling for me. The Golden Crane scene, and the bit where Loagain says "weep if you must, but weep on the march to Tarmon Gaidon". Also, it wrapped up two plot lines that had been going on for way too long (Faile's captivity and Elayne's quest for the throne).

[David Selig]

I definitely agree that mat's battles in KoD were boring, it was basically Mat's forces slaughtering their opponents with zero tension or excitement because they were always winning really easily due to their upgraded crossbows, basically using the opposition for target practice.

 

Personally I am in the "CoT was weak, but not really terrible camp", but I also don't find KoD much better. Yeah, it finally ended some plotlines which really had gone on for too long, but all those were side quests and the main plot didn't move much. And nither "Honey in the Tea" nor "The Golden Crane" were particularly impressive chapters for me, unlike most readers who seem to love them.

[Suttree]

I definitely agree that mat's battles in KoD were boring, it was basically Mat's forces slaughtering their opponents with zero tension or excitement because they were always winning really easily due to their upgraded crossbows, basically using the opposition for target practice.

 

I thought the end battle was cool for the simple fact that we see the future of warfare change drastically in at the end of the book. The description was chilling especially when you think of the large scale ramifications.

[Never]

I definitely agree that mat's battles in KoD were boring, it was basically Mat's forces slaughtering their opponents with zero tension or excitement because they were always winning really easily due to their upgraded crossbows, basically using the opposition for target practice.

 

I thought the end battle was cool for the simple fact that we see the future of warfare change drastically in at the end of the book. The description was chilling especially when you think of the large scale ramifications.

 

 

I agree. This wasn't about the tension of a battle, this was about progress, much as Aludra's Dragons. More of a "the world has changed forever"-moment than a "OMG, will Mat die?"-moment.

 

Btw, Suttree, is your name in reference to the old hindu death-ritual? I came upon it reading somewhere a few days back :p

[Suttree]

I definitely agree that mat's battles in KoD were boring, it was basically Mat's forces slaughtering their opponents with zero tension or excitement because they were always winning really easily due to their upgraded crossbows, basically using the opposition for target practice.

 

I thought the end battle was cool for the simple fact that we see the future of warfare change drastically in at the end of the book. The description was chilling especially when you think of the large scale ramifications.

 

 

I agree. This wasn't about the tension of a battle, this was about progress, much as Aludra's Dragons. More of a "the world has changed forever"-moment than a "OMG, will Mat die?"-moment.

 

Btw, Suttree, is your name in reference to the old hindu death-ritual? I came upon it reading somewhere a few days back :p

 

Wow thanks Never, that is interesting to know. It's actually the name of and lead character in one of my favorite Cormac McCarthy novels.