Discuss Rand

[babuada]

It's clear that Rand does know, or at least suspect, that a dreamspike is there preventing gateways. He does, after all, tell Naeff exactly how to bypass the problem--Travel to a point outside the effect, then ride in.

 

-- dwn

I think we are mising the point. Rand does not have just LTT's memory. I just reread TGH VOG. He has memory of all previous Rands and LTTs. His knowledge is infinity.

"He remembered lives, hundreds of them, thousands of them, stretching to infinity."

[babuada]

He's probably not directly confronting the BT because he knows Taim is Moridin, or his right hand man, or other information we aren't privy to. It just isn't the time, and would make him way too vulnerable (And most likely kill him) while he has other things to do. So he's going the subtle Logain, Naeff route.

 

I'm sure he realizes this is his fault now though.

Forsaken's are no match for him anymore. His only fight is inside himself.

[WhiskyJack]

He's probably not directly confronting the BT because he knows Taim is Moridin, or his right hand man, or other information we aren't privy to. It just isn't the time, and would make him way too vulnerable (And most likely kill him) while he has other things to do. So he's going the subtle Logain, Naeff route.

 

I'm sure he realizes this is his fault now though.

Forsaken's are no match for him anymore. His only fight is inside himself.

 

 

Oh dear..

[WhiskyJack]

Rands twin are causing these "good" effects around camelyn. Rand has access to the True Source AND saidin..

 

Rand realizes that he's not a real person, more like a quantum function of reality. As the scene with Perrin, the wolves, and Rand show, Rands "real" battle will be within himself. Rand hold both possibilities and potentials...your basic duality... Creator and shaitan etc. All the bad things..the bubbles of evil were cause by Rand being bitchy. Now that he's accepted and cast off his dark influence, he's affecting everything around him in a good way.

However this leaves the 13x13 rule. Will he be turned back into a vessel for the dark one? I think yes. Rands already accepted the light/creator/lew therin aspect of himself...now he'll have to face the dark/shaitan side. Just as the traditional Aes Sedai symbol(yin yang) implies in order to creator new seals I predict that Rand will "die" locking both the aspect of light and dark together..freeing himself from both lews therein and shaitan.

 

I believe that Rand will kneel before Tuon. It's implied by Aviendha vision of the future and "The dragons peace". The Aiels Pride is what causes them to reject and create a new war with the Seachan. If they could kneel and offer humility as Rand, an child of Aiel, then the future wouldmbe of peace rather than being hunted down. Robert Jordan has already wrote that the Seanchan are peaceful once they conquer a land. The Seanchan granted existing kings and queens the rights of the "blood" in exchange for oaths of fealty.

Kneeling doesn't mean giving up anything. Techniqually at this point, Rand is only the king of Tear. Elayne has separated her rule from him by controlling first Camelyn then Carhein without him.

 

 

You don't say!!

[Ltsegarra]

I simply meant that Rand isn't the "ruler" of the world and he's not surrending control of the world to Tuon. Rands role is to fight the dark one period. It's tough to see the main character of a series surrendering without making them seem weak, but Rand can't simply beat them into submission. Which is why they have the biggest army and most versatile forces. In the last few books thyve even been shown to accept outsiders... Perrin and Mat both have come into agreements with Seachan.

[WhiskyJack]

I simply meant that Rand isn't the "ruler" of the world and he's not surrending control of the world to Tuon. Rands role is to fight the dark one period. It's tough to see the main character of a series surrendering without making them seem weak, but Rand can't simply beat them into submission. Which is why they have the biggest army and most versatile forces. In the last few books thyve even been shown to accept outsiders... Perrin and Mat both have come into agreements with Seachan.

 

 

I guess we missed that book;)

[f3llyn]

I simply meant that Rand isn't the "ruler" of the world and he's not surrending control of the world to Tuon. Rands role is to fight the dark one period. It's tough to see the main character of a series surrendering without making them seem weak, but Rand can't simply beat them into submission. Which is why they have the biggest army and most versatile forces. In the last few books thyve even been shown to accept outsiders... Perrin and Mat both have come into agreements with Seachan.

But him bowing to Tuon would make him lower than Tuon in the eyes of the people that are following him. Think about it.

 

He's the strongest taverin the world has ever seen. The strongest channeler the world has ever seen. He can cause miracles with a thought. The sun literally shines upon him and acknowledges his presence, and the landscape heals itself when he is near and he's to bow down to a tyrant? Why would anyone have faith in him if he did so? That doesn't make any sense.

[WhiskyJack]

I simply meant that Rand isn't the "ruler" of the world and he's not surrending control of the world to Tuon. Rands role is to fight the dark one period. It's tough to see the main character of a series surrendering without making them seem weak, but Rand can't simply beat them into submission. Which is why they have the biggest army and most versatile forces. In the last few books thyve even been shown to accept outsiders... Perrin and Mat both have come into agreements with Seachan.

But him bowing to Tuon would make him lower than Tuon in the eyes of the people that are following him. Think about it.

 

He's the strongest taverin the world has ever seen. The strongest channeler the world has ever seen. He can cause miracles with a thought. The sun literally shines upon him and acknowledges his presence, and the landscape heals itself when he is near and he's to bow down to a tyrant? Why would anyone have faith in him if he did so? That doesn't make any sense.

 

 

Needs of many outweigh the need of...

[babuada]

I simply meant that Rand isn't the "ruler" of the world and he's not surrending control of the world to Tuon. Rands role is to fight the dark one period. It's tough to see the main character of a series surrendering without making them seem weak, but Rand can't simply beat them into submission. Which is why they have the biggest army and most versatile forces. In the last few books thyve even been shown to accept outsiders... Perrin and Mat both have come into agreements with Seachan.

But him bowing to Tuon would make him lower than Tuon in the eyes of the people that are following him. Think about it.

 

He's the strongest taverin the world has ever seen. The strongest channeler the world has ever seen. He can cause miracles with a thought. The sun literally shines upon him and acknowledges his presence, and the landscape heals itself when he is near and he's to bow down to a tyrant? Why would anyone have faith in him if he did so? That doesn't make any sense.

But Rand is a true AS. It is natural that he would literally kneel before Tuon. But that won't make any difference, because he truely is servant of all.

[babuada]

I simply meant that Rand isn't the "ruler" of the world and he's not surrending control of the world to Tuon. Rands role is to fight the dark one period. It's tough to see the main character of a series surrendering without making them seem weak, but Rand can't simply beat them into submission. Which is why they have the biggest army and most versatile forces. In the last few books thyve even been shown to accept outsiders... Perrin and Mat both have come into agreements with Seachan.

But him bowing to Tuon would make him lower than Tuon in the eyes of the people that are following him. Think about it.

 

He's the strongest taverin the world has ever seen. The strongest channeler the world has ever seen. He can cause miracles with a thought. The sun literally shines upon him and acknowledges his presence, and the landscape heals itself when he is near and he's to bow down to a tyrant? Why would anyone have faith in him if he did so? That doesn't make any sense.

He would kneel only if Tuon and Seanchan are truely in favor of Light. Then at the sametime he will bind her because he is the embodiment of Light.

[Hopefire]

I simply meant that Rand isn't the "ruler" of the world and he's not surrending control of the world to Tuon. Rands role is to fight the dark one period. It's tough to see the main character of a series surrendering without making them seem weak, but Rand can't simply beat them into submission. Which is why they have the biggest army and most versatile forces. In the last few books thyve even been shown to accept outsiders... Perrin and Mat both have come into agreements with Seachan.

But him bowing to Tuon would make him lower than Tuon in the eyes of the people that are following him. Think about it.

 

He's the strongest taverin the world has ever seen. The strongest channeler the world has ever seen. He can cause miracles with a thought. The sun literally shines upon him and acknowledges his presence, and the landscape heals itself when he is near and he's to bow down to a tyrant? Why would anyone have faith in him if he did so? That doesn't make any sense.

But Rand is a true AS. It is natural that he would literally kneel before Tuon. But that won't make any difference, because he truely is servant of all.

That's kind of where I think that it'll go. Tuon will insist he kneel and serve the Crystal Throne. Rand will kneel, and say that of course he serves the Seanchan - he is the servant of every man, woman and child who opposes the Shadow.

[f3llyn]

Huuhhh, no. His service to everyone is that he'll die. At least that's what he thinks will happen. Why would he say he will issues his demands of all the monarchs at the field of Merrilor if he had that sort of mentality? It doesn't equate. Makes absolutely no sense.

 

"On the morrow, they'd hear his demands. Not what he would demand to keep from breaking the seals--he was going to do that, regardless of what Egwene said. No, these would be the demands of the world in exchange for going to Shayol Gul to face the Dark One."

 

If he was of the mindset where he was a "servant of all" as you guys say he wouldn't be making demands of anyone, he would be asking them what he should be doing. Besides that, where do we get the idea that the Aes Sedai of the AoL were servants like you guys are making them out to be? Just because Aes Sedai means "servants of all" doesn't mean they act like serving girls at an inn, or that they do what everyone else requests of them.

 

His position is that he thinks he's going to die, so this is what everyone else is going to do for him in return for his service/life.

[WhiskyJack]

I simply meant that Rand isn't the "ruler" of the world and he's not surrending control of the world to Tuon. Rands role is to fight the dark one period. It's tough to see the main character of a series surrendering without making them seem weak, but Rand can't simply beat them into submission. Which is why they have the biggest army and most versatile forces. In the last few books thyve even been shown to accept outsiders... Perrin and Mat both have come into agreements with Seachan.

But him bowing to Tuon would make him lower than Tuon in the eyes of the people that are following him. Think about it.

 

He's the strongest taverin the world has ever seen. The strongest channeler the world has ever seen. He can cause miracles with a thought. The sun literally shines upon him and acknowledges his presence, and the landscape heals itself when he is near and he's to bow down to a tyrant? Why would anyone have faith in him if he did so? That doesn't make any sense.

But Rand is a true AS. It is natural that he would literally kneel before Tuon. But that won't make any difference, because he truely is servant of all.

 

In AOL, Aes Sedai also ran the government.

[WhiskyJack]

Huuhhh, no. His service to everyone is that he'll die. At least that's what he thinks will happen. Why would he say he will issues his demands of all the monarchs at the field of Merrilor if he had that sort of mentality? It doesn't equate. Makes absolutely no sense.

 

"On the morrow, they'd hear his demands. Not what he would demand to keep from breaking the seals--he was going to do that, regardless of what Egwene said. No, these would be the demands of the world in exchange for going to Shayol Gul to face the Dark One."

 

If he was of the mindset where he was a "servant of all" as you guys say he wouldn't be making demands of anyone, he would be asking them what he should be doing. Besides that, where do we get the idea that the Aes Sedai of the AoL were servants like you guys are making them out to be? Just because Aes Sedai means "servants of all" doesn't mean they act like serving girls at an inn, or that they do what everyone else requests of them.

 

His position is that he thinks he's going to die, so this is what everyone else is going to do for him in return for his service/life.

 

 

Aes Sedai "served" people just like Musicians, Engineers, Scientist, Doctors, Senators, Congressmen, ....serve us now;) As you said, they were not a serving girl in an inn. Servant to all meant that their work was meant to benefit everyone.

[johthohar]

Sorry if this was mentioned before, I looked but did not see it on my skim through of the thread.

 

OK, if Rand's & LT's memories are fully integrated now. Why does he not immediately realize that a Dreamspike is being used at the BT when he can't Travel there. And knowing that, immediately understand that a someone/probably a Forsaken must be up to no good at the BT. This should immediately trigger him to take big action - not send an Ash'aman in disguise.

 

Obviously the Dreamspike is there for a reason. He knows that he just gave the WT permission to bond Ash'amen. He knows that all the Ash'amen & AS at the BT are trapped there. He should immediately take action to resolve the obvious threat. What he did in the Borderlands was important, what he did in the starving city was important -but the BT is vastly more important than either.

 

First, we don't have a Rand POV in this book except for briefly in the epilogue. Second, since we see this conversation from someone else' POV we don't know that Rand didn't immediately assume it was a dreamspike. I mean, we (the reader) only learned of the existence of dreamspikes shortly before this exchange occurred. As to why he doesn't see to the BT himself.... Rand obviously thinks Logain is still at the BT. A channeler so close in power to Taim should be able to keep the situation in check for a brief amount of time at least. Rand has to see to the unification of the nations against the shadow before he worries about the relatively smaller issue of the BT as he sees it.

 

I guess we could assume that there were possibly more things (other than the dreamspike) in the age of legends that would stop a channeller from travelling. I do get the impression that he suspects there is some bad sh!t going down at the BT though. So I guess to your second point, Rand disagrees.

Too many gusses for me.

 

Since we are guessing. I will make a guess that Rand will finally go to the TAR BT to try to find the Dreamspike and will run into trouble there. This is where Perrin (who also recently became aware of the possable dreamspike at the BT) will come to Rands rescue. Using his super Wolfbrother TAR Powers that he showed to Eggy. Hmm. I wonder if Perrin can add balefire to TAR just the way he erased it or Eggy. If he can "erase" it, he should be able to add it as well. He does not need to channel just "add" it to the dream. I would love to see him do that in front of Rand.

 

As somebody else already pointed out, Perrin did not "erase" balefire from the Wolf Dream. He simply willed it out of existence. Balefire is a thing of Power. Perrin has no access to the Power. Therefore, Perrin can not create balefire. Simple as that.

 

Rands twin are causing these "good" effects around camelyn. Rand has access to the True Source AND saidin..

 

Rand realizes that he's not a real person, more like a quantum function of reality. As the scene with Perrin, the wolves, and Rand show, Rands "real" battle will be within himself. Rand hold both possibilities and potentials...your basic duality... Creator and shaitan etc. All the bad things..the bubbles of evil were cause by Rand being bitchy. Now that he's accepted and cast off his dark influence, he's affecting everything around him in a good way.

However this leaves the 13x13 rule. Will he be turned back into a vessel for the dark one? I think yes. Rands already accepted the light/creator/lew therin aspect of himself...now he'll have to face the dark/shaitan side. Just as the traditional Aes Sedai symbol(yin yang) implies in order to creator new seals I predict that Rand will "die" locking both the aspect of light and dark together..freeing himself from both lews therein and shaitan.

 

I believe that Rand will kneel before Tuon. It's implied by Aviendha vision of the future and "The dragons peace". The Aiels Pride is what causes them to reject and create a new war with the Seachan. If they could kneel and offer humility as Rand, an child of Aiel, then the future wouldmbe of peace rather than being hunted down. Robert Jordan has already wrote that the Seanchan are peaceful once they conquer a land. The Seanchan granted existing kings and queens the rights of the "blood" in exchange for oaths of fealty.

Kneeling doesn't mean giving up anything. Techniqually at this point, Rand is only the king of Tear. Elayne has separated her rule from him by controlling first Camelyn then Carhein without him.

 

Umm..... WHAT?! Rand is the Dragon. The champion of the LIGHT. He may have been turned to the Shadow in past ages but there is not some kind of "Shadow" aspect to him. Wow....

 

Also, Darlin is the King of Tear. Not Rand. Rand is the King of Illian.

 

Huuhhh, no. His service to everyone is that he'll die. At least that's what he thinks will happen. Why would he say he will issues his demands of all the monarchs at the field of Merrilor if he had that sort of mentality? It doesn't equate. Makes absolutely no sense.

 

"On the morrow, they'd hear his demands. Not what he would demand to keep from breaking the seals--he was going to do that, regardless of what Egwene said. No, these would be the demands of the world in exchange for going to Shayol Gul to face the Dark One."

 

If he was of the mindset where he was a "servant of all" as you guys say he wouldn't be making demands of anyone, he would be asking them what he should be doing. Besides that, where do we get the idea that the Aes Sedai of the AoL were servants like you guys are making them out to be? Just because Aes Sedai means "servants of all" doesn't mean they act like serving girls at an inn, or that they do what everyone else requests of them.

 

His position is that he thinks he's going to die, so this is what everyone else is going to do for him in return for his service/life.

 

I think you're taking the word "servant" in regards to "Servant of All" a bit to literally. I always took it to mean one who serves as someone in the military serves the people but doesn't always do what the people want. Or like elected officials (are supposed to) serve the common good by doing what is best for the people. "Servant of All" means you do what is best for everybody whether they like it or not.

 

I think Rand now uses a New Power I guess the Power of Light. That is what Nyneave sees when she is trying to cure his madness, Light completely surrounding him from all the darkness. This is Rand not being blind anymore, Dragon Reborn not being blind anymore(that goes for all ages) Rand has said he feels more complete then ever.

 

Dark Prophecies have not been fulfilled, I think that is why they are shown at the back of the book to show you what could have been not what will be. Perin did not die.

 

I'm addressing this last because it bugs me the most. I feel like someone has pointed this out before but the True Source (Saidin/Saidar) IS the "Power of the Light"!!!!!! The True Power is from the Dark One. The True Source is from the Creator. How this isn't blatantly obvious to everyone is beyond me.

[johthohar]

Huuhhh, no. His service to everyone is that he'll die. At least that's what he thinks will happen. Why would he say he will issues his demands of all the monarchs at the field of Merrilor if he had that sort of mentality? It doesn't equate. Makes absolutely no sense.

 

"On the morrow, they'd hear his demands. Not what he would demand to keep from breaking the seals--he was going to do that, regardless of what Egwene said. No, these would be the demands of the world in exchange for going to Shayol Gul to face the Dark One."

 

If he was of the mindset where he was a "servant of all" as you guys say he wouldn't be making demands of anyone, he would be asking them what he should be doing. Besides that, where do we get the idea that the Aes Sedai of the AoL were servants like you guys are making them out to be? Just because Aes Sedai means "servants of all" doesn't mean they act like serving girls at an inn, or that they do what everyone else requests of them.

 

His position is that he thinks he's going to die, so this is what everyone else is going to do for him in return for his service/life.

 

 

Aes Sedai "served" people just like Musicians, Engineers, Scientist, Doctors, Senators, Congressmen, ....serve us now;) As you said, they were not a serving girl in an inn. Servant to all meant that their work was meant to benefit everyone.

 

Once again, I take too long replying to several points and somebody beats me to mine.

[f3llyn]

I think you're taking the word "servant" in regards to "Servant of All" a bit to literally. I always took it to mean one who serves as someone in the military serves the people but doesn't always do what the people want. Or like elected officials (are supposed to) serve the common good by doing what is best for the people. "Servant of All" means you do what is best for everybody whether they like it or not.

 

It's not me that's taking the "servant" bit to literally. It's the others. I was trying to point that out to them. I guess maybe my post wasn't worded very well.

[johthohar]

It's not me that's taking the "servant" bit to literally. It's the others. I was trying to point that out to them. I guess maybe my post wasn't worded very well.

 

Aahhh... Was there a sarcastic tone to that post that I didn't detect or how exactly were you pointing that out? I'm confused! Lol... This happens often.

[f3llyn]

If he was of the mindset where he was a "servant of all" as you guys say he wouldn't be making demands of anyone, he would be asking them what he should be doing. Besides that, where do we get the idea that the Aes Sedai of the AoL were servants like you guys are making them out to be? Just because Aes Sedai means "servants of all" doesn't mean they act like serving girls at an inn, or that they do what everyone else requests of them.

 

Bolded part..

[johthohar]

OOOOOOOkay..... I was just reading it wrong. All clear now. Grazie.

[f3llyn]

No problem, I probably could have worded my post better, too.

[StringWinder]

A comment as far as integration goes...

 

I think if Nyneave was able to cure the madness it would be a dissaster.

 

This kind of relies on Semmi speaking the truth about Rands madness. The taint caused Rand to hear a voice in his head. The voice he heard seemed to be real, in a sense. The personality of the LTT voice may or may not have been true to his personality, but i doubt it was. But the memories and talents that tranferred seemed real.

 

I'm having a bit of difficulty articulating this...but

 

It got me wondering that he sees all his past lives, but in reference to his age, he refers to himself as hundreds of years old, but not ancient or omnipresent.

 

The taint's effect was to let his previous incarnation to seep in, and to see himself as an extension of that life. A lot of the crazyness was probably due to his mind's inablility to reconcile the fact that he can remember his past life, so the strain of that mixed with the madness of the taint made him even crazier

I think the web of light, well it doesn't remove the taint (obviously ) or even really counteract it making him sane. The symptom, having his past life a part of him, is still there. But with the protection of the light, he can deal with it. Even if it is real, i think seeing your past life is crazy.

 

I think if the madness was healed, he wouldn't have access to LTT's life anymore, or think of himself as 400 years old. I guess that's what all this rambling leads to ;>

[Jyxxer]

Rands twin are causing these "good" effects around camelyn. Rand has access to the True Source AND saidin..

 

Rand realizes that he's not a real person, more like a quantum function of reality. As the scene with Perrin, the wolves, and Rand show, Rands "real" battle will be within himself. Rand hold both possibilities and potentials...your basic duality... Creator and shaitan etc. All the bad things..the bubbles of evil were cause by Rand being bitchy. Now that he's accepted and cast off his dark influence, he's affecting everything around him in a good way.

However this leaves the 13x13 rule. Will he be turned back into a vessel for the dark one? I think yes. Rands already accepted the light/creator/lew therin aspect of himself...now he'll have to face the dark/shaitan side. Just as the traditional Aes Sedai symbol(yin yang) implies in order to creator new seals I predict that Rand will "die" locking both the aspect of light and dark together..freeing himself from both lews therein and shaitan.

 

I believe that Rand will kneel before Tuon. It's implied by Aviendha vision of the future and "The dragons peace". The Aiels Pride is what causes them to reject and create a new war with the Seachan. If they could kneel and offer humility as Rand, an child of Aiel, then the future wouldmbe of peace rather than being hunted down. Robert Jordan has already wrote that the Seanchan are peaceful once they conquer a land. The Seanchan granted existing kings and queens the rights of the "blood" in exchange for oaths of fealty.

Kneeling doesn't mean giving up anything. Techniqually at this point, Rand is only the king of Tear. Elayne has separated her rule from him by controlling first Camelyn then Carhein without him.

I know these have been addressed mostly, but this rambling post bothers me lol.

True Power, is the DO's power, True Source is saidin/saidar. I don't know how you came up with the the theory that the Dragon will be turned to the shadow in the last book via mydraal, lol. Why would he need to free himself of Lews Therin? He did that at the end of TGS...

 

Rand will not, I repeat, WILL NOT bow to Tuon. Avi sees that he did in the columns, but that will change BECAUSE she saw it. He will have Perrin and Mat with him, along with the unified nations. With Mat's ties, Perrin's past help with the Shaido, and Rand's forace will be enough to bind the Nine Moons to him. I dont necessarily think Fortuona will bow to Rand, but I'm certtain he wont' bow to her.

 

The only nation Rand is actually still a king of is Illian. He gave Tear to Darlin.

 

It's clear that Rand does know, or at least suspect, that a dreamspike is there preventing gateways. He does, after all, tell Naeff exactly how to bypass the problem--Travel to a point outside the effect, then ride in.

 

-- dwn

I think we are mising the point. Rand does not have just LTT's memory. I just reread TGH VOG. He has memory of all previous Rands and LTTs. His knowledge is infinity.

"He remembered lives, hundreds of them, thousands of them, stretching to infinity."

I don't think he has memories of those hundreds or thousands of lives. In fact, I'm certain of it. He tells Cadsuane he's 450 years old, not thousands of years. He remembers LTT clearly, but lives before that are just faint dream memories, slowly fading. Much like Birgitte. I suspect dreamspikes aren't the only way to prevent traveling, as I recall RJ saying there were ways to prevent gateways in warfare, so it will be harder to pour armies in behind the lines.

 

A comment as far as integration goes...

 

I think if Nyneave was able to cure the madness it would be a dissaster.

 

This kind of relies on Semmi speaking the truth about Rands madness. The taint caused Rand to hear a voice in his head. The voice he heard seemed to be real, in a sense. The personality of the LTT voice may or may not have been true to his personality, but i doubt it was. But the memories and talents that tranferred seemed real.

 

I'm having a bit of difficulty articulating this...but

 

It got me wondering that he sees all his past lives, but in reference to his age, he refers to himself as hundreds of years old, but not ancient or omnipresent.

 

The taint's effect was to let his previous incarnation to seep in, and to see himself as an extension of that life. A lot of the crazyness was probably due to his mind's inablility to reconcile the fact that he can remember his past life, so the strain of that mixed with the madness of the taint made him even crazier

I think the web of light, well it doesn't remove the taint (obviously ) or even really counteract it making him sane. The symptom, having his past life a part of him, is still there. But with the protection of the light, he can deal with it. Even if it is real, i think seeing your past life is crazy.

 

I think if the madness was healed, he wouldn't have access to LTT's life anymore, or think of himself as 400 years old. I guess that's what all this rambling leads to ;>

 

I like where you are going with this, but I don't think healing madness on him would be a bad thing. It would probably take a huge circle directed by Nyneave that may take the course of a few days. As you sad they aren't necessarily countering or fighting each other, they just seem to cancel each other out. If the madness is healed it would just leave the web of light. Think how awesome he will be with JUST the web of light.

[Durinax]

I think heneeds the darkness to have balance. Ultra holy rand would not be good for the pattern just like ultra dark rand wouldnt be good for the pattern. The balance that they make is what will enable rand to repair the pattern to a pristine shape

[babuada]

If he was of the mindset where he was a "servant of all" as you guys say he wouldn't be making demands of anyone, he would be asking them what he should be doing. Besides that, where do we get the idea that the Aes Sedai of the AoL were servants like you guys are making them out to be? Just because Aes Sedai means "servants of all" doesn't mean they act like serving girls at an inn, or that they do what everyone else requests of them.

 

Bolded part..

Serving girls obey. Rand will not obey. But he can still kneel, because he has the humility. So, he will kneel if not just to teach these pretend AS some humility. We are talking about Rand2.0 here guys :)