General Galgan is Demandred

[cap10kirk]

I'm into my reread of TGS. I'm sure this has been discussed, but I believe General Galgan is Demandred. It seems that he was closely allied with Semirhage. He controls a massive army. And the Seanchan is causing all kinds of chaos. He doesn't need to murder Fortuona because she is doing what he wants. Just a hunch.

[Bob T Dwarf]

I'm into my reread of TGS. I'm sure this has been discussed, but I believe General Galgan is Demandred. It seems that he was closely allied with Semirhage. He controls a massive army. And the Seanchan is causing all kinds of chaos. He doesn't need to murder Fortuona because she is doing what he wants. Just a hunch.

 

Throughout the series the Big Bads have never set up overlapping areas of primary authority.

 

Bel'al had Tear.

Rahvin had Andor.

Sammael had Illian.

Asmodean had the Aiel.

Lanfear had the Dragon.

Graendal had Arad Doman.

Mesaana has/had the White Tower.

Aginor/Osan'gar had the Black Tower.

Balthamel/Aran'gar had the Rebel Tower.

Moghedien had Intelligence and Espionage.

Ishamael/Ba'alzamon/Moridin has Command.

Darkfriends and their networks are/were available to all.

 

Semirhage had the Seanchan.

 

The only major power bloc that is not covered by any of the others is the Borderlands. If you want to find Demandred look there.

[cap10kirk]

I understand where you're coming from. At first, I figured Demandred was among the Borderlander's leaders. Why else would they abandoned their posts? It just seemed too obvious. I also feel that the Borderlanders are more of a coalition, whereas Galgan has complete control over the Seanchan forces.

[Gor]

Murandy is unaccounted for as well.

[Tom Sawyer]

But Murandy's kind of a waste of time and I think Demandred would see it as beneath him to bother with a place so trivial. Demandred seems like the kind of guy who's doing something. The Borderlanders do seem like the main candidate since they're the biggest force out there which are doing something strange that people can't figure out the reasoning behind.

 

The Black Tower is another candidate since (Aran'gar or Graendal) mentioned that Demandred had something to do with how Dumai's Well ended and Demandred was mentioned along with Aginor as being in charge of watching Rand, which suggests he's involved with the Asha'men. If he was there, though, why send Aginor in? It would seem like needless redundancy to have both of them there while Taim's in charge of the place too - unless Taim's Demandred, which doesn't make any sense at this point.

 

The Seanchan have the same redundancy problem. Why put Demandred there while Semirhage was already in charge of the place? It's wasted resources.

[Pinzarn]

I am horribile at remembering all of the characters' names.

 

I feel that Damendred is the leader of Rand's army in Tear. The comments that Damendred has made about assembling an army and that the army is ready seem to line up with comments about the Tear army that Rand is ready to deploy. There are also some odd physical characteristic comments made by RJ/BS that I think line up with descriptions of Damendred.

 

I haven't fully completed all of my research on this (as 10 of the books are 600 miles away), but after re-reading TGS this jumped out at me.

 

Of course, I could also be convinced that Loial is Demandred.

[cap10kirk]

Throughout the series the Big Bads have never set up overlapping areas of primary authority.

 

Bel'al had Tear.

Rahvin had Andor.

Sammael had Illian.

Asmodean had the Aiel.

Lanfear had the Dragon.

Graendal had Arad Doman.

Mesaana has/had the White Tower.

Aginor/Osan'gar had the Black Tower.

Balthamel/Aran'gar had the Rebel Tower.

Moghedien had Intelligence and Espionage.

Ishamael/Ba'alzamon/Moridin has Command.

Darkfriends and their networks are/were available to all.

 

Semirhage had the Seanchan.

 

The only major power bloc that is not covered by any of the others is the Borderlands. If you want to find Demandred look there.

 

What's the difference between the above kingdoms and the Borderlanders? The above kingdoms are all separate, they don't work together. A forsaken could take over leadership in one country and not worry about another country. Whereas the Borderlanders are more united because of the Blight. They even marry off their nobility with one another. It would be much more difficult for a forsaken to take over one Borderland without the others being more suspicious. Morgase losing her mind over Gabriel, in Andor would be amusing to other heads of state in the Southlands. But if Queen Ethenielle started becoming irrational, the other Borderland leaders would investigate.

 

 

The Seanchan have the same redundancy problem. Why put Demandred there while Semirhage was already in charge of the place? It's wasted resources.

Seanchan is a huge empire. Maybe too much for one forsaken to manage properly. Maybe the caste system required a forsaken to work with the Empress (may she live forever) and her lot. And another forsaken to work with the military. I do admit, that the Borderlanders leaving their post really bother me. I can't get over that. One of the Borderlander's leader could be a dark friend.

[Tom Sawyer]

You mean Darlin? I don't think so. Min's viewings of him seem to peg him as a good guy. There's Weiramon who's a DF, but his comments to the DF Asha'men show him to be another lackey and not a Forsaken.

[Tom Sawyer]

 

The Seanchan have the same redundancy problem. Why put Demandred there while Semirhage was already in charge of the place? It's wasted resources.

Seanchan is a huge empire. Maybe too much for on forsaken to manage properly. Maybe the caste system required a forsaken to work with the Empress (may she rule forever) and her lot. And another forsaken to work with the military. I do admit, that the Borderlanders leaving their post really bother me. I can't get over that. One of the Borderlander's leader could be a dark friend.

 

Ya, it's a better explanation than most that the Seanchan would merit two of them. That would, however, leave the Borderlands without a Forsaken anywhere in them when they were so active in every other country, as was mentioned above.

 

A point away from the Borderlanders and towards the Seanchan, however, is Demandred's comment that his armies are ready to march. With the Trollocs pouring into Kandor (a strategy about which one can assume Demandred was aware when he made that statement), did he really think that the soldiers would be obeying any order except one to march back to the Borderlands? It sounds like he has an army ready to attack Rand, not just an army that's generically ready. The only army which is positioned to attack Rand as opposed to support him or attack the Trollocs is the Seanchan one.

[Gor]

Plus the army being built in Lugard by Demandred. I mean Roedran.

[cap10kirk]

Plus the army being built in Lugard by Demandred. I mean Roedran.

Oh, yeah. I forgot about that one. Hmmmmm...

[Tom Sawyer]

Plus the army being built in Lugard by Demandred. I mean Roedran.

 

But that runs into a similar problem that the Borderlander armies have - namely a reason to attack Rand's armies instead of supporting them. Demandred's conversation with his soldiers would need to be along the lines of:

 

"King Roedran, there are reports that a million Trollocs have come south out of the Blight."

"Great! Let's go attack Tear."

"Yes, your maj ... wait ... what?"

 

The only army which has a motivation to attack Rand is the Seanchan, since Ishamael skewed their prophecies to say that Rand needs to kneel before the Crystal Throne before the Last Battle. It's not enough to have a general or king who gives those orders, you also need soldiers who'll obey those orders. There's no chance of the Borderland soldiers obeying an order to do anything except return to Kandor and there's little chance of Murandian soldiers doing it. They all know that the Last Battle is here and they're not going to go along with attacking the army of the guy they know has to fight it.

 

The Seanchan, on the other hand, see the Last Battle coming and Rand not having knelt before Tuon like he needs to do. That means he needs to be brought to heel quickly so that the Trollocs can be dealt with. They would obey Demandred's order to attack him and are the only army available which would.

[Gor]

Plus the army being built in Lugard by Demandred. I mean Roedran.

 

But that runs into a similar problem that the Borderlander armies have - namely a reason to attack Rand's armies instead of supporting them. Demandred's conversation with his soldiers would need to be along the lines of:

 

"King Roedran, there are reports that a million Trollocs have come south out of the Blight."

"Great! Let's go attack Tear."

"Yes, your maj ... wait ... what?"

 

The only army which has a motivation to attack Rand is the Seanchan, since Ishamael skewed their prophecies to say that Rand needs to kneel before the Crystal Throne before the Last Battle. It's not enough to have a general or king who gives those orders, you also need soldiers who'll obey those orders. There's no chance of the Borderland soldiers obeying an order to do anything except return to Kandor and there's little chance of Murandian soldiers doing it. They all know that the Last Battle is here and they're not going to go along with attacking the army of the guy they know has to fight it.

 

The Seanchan, on the other hand, see the Last Battle coming and Rand not having knelt before Tuon like he needs to do. That means he needs to be brought to heel quickly so that the Trollocs can be dealt with. They would obey Demandred's order to attack him and are the only army available which would.

 

Look at what Rahvin did to Andor's troops. He sent away the "good/Light-fearing" ones and brought in the less upstanding types.

 

If Demandred is building an army from scratch, he would be bringing in those types of people. Murandy would be a prime area to find those types as well given its rather anarchical history.

[Callahan]

I'm into my reread of TGS. I'm sure this has been discussed, but I believe General Galgan is Demandred. It seems that he was closely allied with Semirhage. He controls a massive army. And the Seanchan is causing all kinds of chaos. He doesn't need to murder Fortuona because she is doing what he wants. Just a hunch.

 

Throughout the series the Big Bads have never set up overlapping areas of primary authority.

 

Bel'al had Tear.

Rahvin had Andor.

Sammael had Illian.

Asmodean had the Aiel.

Lanfear had the Dragon.

Graendal had Arad Doman.

Mesaana has/had the White Tower.

Aginor/Osan'gar had the Black Tower.

Balthamel/Aran'gar had the Rebel Tower.

Moghedien had Intelligence and Espionage.

Ishamael/Ba'alzamon/Moridin has Command.

Darkfriends and their networks are/were available to all.

 

Semirhage had the Seanchan.

 

The only major power bloc that is not covered by any of the others is the Borderlands. If you want to find Demandred look there.

 

 

While he may indeed have influenced the Borderland army and certainly has Black Ajah among the sisters there, I

am not so sure that he is actually with them.That army had to ask Elayne where Rand was, which seems kinda odd

if Demandred is with them.

[Tom Sawyer]

Plus the army being built in Lugard by Demandred. I mean Roedran.

 

But that runs into a similar problem that the Borderlander armies have - namely a reason to attack Rand's armies instead of supporting them. Demandred's conversation with his soldiers would need to be along the lines of:

 

"King Roedran, there are reports that a million Trollocs have come south out of the Blight."

"Great! Let's go attack Tear."

"Yes, your maj ... wait ... what?"

 

The only army which has a motivation to attack Rand is the Seanchan, since Ishamael skewed their prophecies to say that Rand needs to kneel before the Crystal Throne before the Last Battle. It's not enough to have a general or king who gives those orders, you also need soldiers who'll obey those orders. There's no chance of the Borderland soldiers obeying an order to do anything except return to Kandor and there's little chance of Murandian soldiers doing it. They all know that the Last Battle is here and they're not going to go along with attacking the army of the guy they know has to fight it.

 

The Seanchan, on the other hand, see the Last Battle coming and Rand not having knelt before Tuon like he needs to do. That means he needs to be brought to heel quickly so that the Trollocs can be dealt with. They would obey Demandred's order to attack him and are the only army available which would.

 

Look at what Rahvin did to Andor's troops. He sent away the "good/Light-fearing" ones and brought in the less upstanding types.

 

If Demandred is building an army from scratch, he would be bringing in those types of people. Murandy would be a prime area to find those types as well given its rather anarchical history.

 

But how big would such an army be and how many chanellers would it have? It would be totally irrelevant compared to Rand's army. Murandy just has nothing to offer in relation to the kind of threat that Demandred is being built up to be. He's being portrayed as a major threat that will do some damage, not a minor annoyance that Rand will have an underling sweep away in a paragraph.

 

The only thing that represents a legitimate threat to Rand's forces (other than the Trollocs) is the Seanchan. If Demandred is going to be posing a threat in a manner that involves an army, they're really the only choice.

[Bob T Dwarf]

The only thing that represents a legitimate threat to Rand's forces (other than the Trollocs) is the Seanchan. If Demandred is going to be posing a threat in a manner that involves an army, they're really the only choice.

 

All of that depends on the Forsaken doing something with the Seanchan that they did not do anywhere else. Remember, Semirhage was with Tuon, not back in Seandar with the Empress. Why, if they were going to double-down on the Seanchan, would both of them be in the Westlands?

 

No, if they were going to double-down, Semirhage would have remained in Seandar controlling the Empress, may she live forever, and Demandred would have accompanied the Return, controlling Tuon and the Ever Victorious Army. Since Semi accompanied Tuon, and totally neutralized their homeland, she was all they placed on the Seanchan.

 

The Borderlanders are too large, important, and experienced a group of forces to leave uncovered, and Demandred is the only Forsaken not to be occupied elsewhere.

 

There are only two candidates with the experience, stature, and influence to control all of the Borderland Armies. Agelmar and Bashere. Both Great Captains. Both a perfect cover for General Demandred. One of them virtually has to be Demandred.

 

Since Bashere miraculously showed up at Rand's side within hours of Lanfear's disappearance into Finnland, and since, according to the other Forsaken, Demandred and Osan'gar are the ones supposed to be keeping an eye on Rand, Bashere becomes the only real candidate to be Demandred.

 

In addition to being able to influence the Borderlanders to do pretty much anything he wants, Bashere is also the Commander of the Saldaean Horse he brought with him and the entire Legion of the Dragon that he has trained up since.

 

Those combined forces are in the best position to strike a crippling blow to the Light from where they are right now. No fancy or tricky evolution needed to get them into position like would be required with the Seanchan Forces.

 

Look for Demandred standing unseen at Rand's shoulder with a knife to his throat just like Melaine and Amys dreamed way back in Lord of Chaos, just after Bashere showed up.

[Tom Sawyer]

It's one thing to impersonate an anonymous noble from out in the country somewhere who comes into the palace and rises quickly to a level of prominence and control in the nation and quite another to impersonate a man travelling with his wife and officers he's known for years. It's just too improbable for Demandred to have inserted himself into Bashere's life with everybody from Bashere's life around him.

 

If Deira had fallen off a horse and his top officers died in random mishaps shortly thereafter and he hadn't gone right back into the relationship with Faile that she remembered having with him, then maybe, but as it is, I just don't see that. There's a chance he's a DF, but he's not a Forsaken in disguise.

[Bob T Dwarf]

It's one thing to impersonate an anonymous noble from out in the country somewhere who comes into the palace and rises quickly to a level of prominence and control in the nation and quite another to impersonate a man travelling with his wife and officers he's known for years. It's just too improbable for Demandred to have inserted himself into Bashere's life with everybody from Bashere's life around him.

 

If Deira had fallen off a horse and his top officers died in random mishaps shortly thereafter and he hadn't gone right back into the relationship with Faile that she remembered having with him, then maybe, but as it is, I just don't see that. There's a chance he's a DF, but he's not a Forsaken in disguise.

 

You're assuming he would attempt to impersonate Bashere.

 

There's a very real chance he could have become Bashere. Look at Slayer for how.

[cap10kirk]

Plus the army being built in Lugard by Demandred. I mean Roedran.

Oh, yeah. I forgot about that one. Hmmmmm...

I thought about it. Roedran was trying to bring his nobles to heel. He accomplished his goal, in large part, because of Mat's Band. He managed to raise an army, but that army is probably no larger than the Band was at that point. And what kind of troops would he have? Certainly not the veteran warriors of the Seanchan, Aiel, or Borderlanders. They would be little better than Massema's army. Well... not that bad, but you get the point.

 

Maybe I'm making something out of nothing, but why was General Galgan so surprised to see General Tylee? This was in TGS: Chapter 19. I found that odd. He was really surprised. Sure, Tylee was early, but Galgan was surprised. Because he sent the trollocs after her? Maybe she's becoming a little too good of a General?

[Sharaman]

I'm into my reread of TGS. I'm sure this has been discussed, but I believe General Galgan is Demandred. It seems that he was closely allied with Semirhage. He controls a massive army. And the Seanchan is causing all kinds of chaos. He doesn't need to murder Fortuona because she is doing what he wants. Just a hunch.

According to Brandon, Demandred's alter ego hasn't been seen onscreen in the series as of KoD. (He refused to confirm if Demandred had been seen onscreen in TGS.) If so, Galgan isn't Demandred.

[Nooska]

Except we have a Word of God that we haven't seen Demandreds persona on screen up to and including.. KoD or CoT (I can't remember off the top of my head).

We have seen both Bashere and Agelmar by book 4. Sorry, Demandred is neither of them.

(Finally it posted)

 

Edit: and got beat to the punch while waiting for the post to go through.

[Gor]

Also, from what I remember Suroth absolutely hated General Galgan. If Galgan is one of the Forsaken there is no way Suroth would have held him in contempt when we have her PoV(s).

[cap10kirk]

I'm into my reread of TGS. I'm sure this has been discussed, but I believe General Galgan is Demandred. It seems that he was closely allied with Semirhage. He controls a massive army. And the Seanchan is causing all kinds of chaos. He doesn't need to murder Fortuona because she is doing what he wants. Just a hunch.

According to Brandon, Demandred's alter ego hasn't been seen onscreen in the series as of KoD. (He refused to confirm if Demandred had been seen onscreen in TGS.) If so, Galgan isn't Demandred.

If this is the case... We haven't seen King Roedran "on screen", have we? I just listened to TPoD: Chapter 18. It seems Roedran has become very clever all of a sudden. He was supposed to be a guy who likes to party hard, now he's uniting a kingdom. Fah!!!

[Lynander]

He's not just in 1 place. We're thinking too small.

 

Here's what I think what happened.

Demandred was involved in rescue mission of Taim.

Converts Taim to DF/new Chosen...whatever...and becomes his boss.

Taim recruits for school. Taim converts some of his students to DFs. Taim and Demandred use the recruiting process for two purposes, more Dark Asha'man and more DFs. Demandred eventually controls many different areas: Murandy, Borderlanders, Shara, possibly homeland Seandar, possibly Tear (as someone suggested). I'm surprised how few people have thought about the Aiel. They were around at D's Wells same as Taim.

 

This is Demandred's gameplan. Use Seandar and Sea Folk to attack from the Sea. Use Shara to attack from the Spine. Have Moridin attack from the Blight. Use his proxies/generals to attack Randland from within.

 

He's got his hand dipped into Murandy, compelled Talmanes, Seandar, Shara after Graendal messed with the leadership, Taim and the BT, possibly Rhuarc and the Aiel, has someone controling the movements of the Borderlanders, Weiramon in Tear, etc. They are all part of his army with some purpose in mind.

[jdbond]

I hope Demandred surprises us all. I mean what kind of army Demandred could possibly raise from a country like Murandy! And Seanchan army must really have taken liking to Gagan since he will have to kill Tuon first. I doubt that will happen. Borderlanders "coalition" sounds lame too. Why would Demandred bring them all the way down to Far Madding? Oh Demandred where are you?