Will Moridin have his memories now?

[Duskfire]

Ya, but everyone who could channel could run around the dream world whenever they chose and ter'angreal were available to everyone else. One more guy in there because of the wolves isn't really all that much of an added value. It's like Delta Force soldiers being glad that not only do they have air support, but there's also that kid with a slingshot running around to help them out. It just doesn't give any benefit worth mentioning.

 

Even in the current age, the wolf brother thing was cool in the first couple of books, but once the Asha'men came along and the Wise Ones started getting into the fight, Perrin's powers got fairly pointless. Given the more advanced powers and weaponry available in the AoL, they'd be even more pointless back then.

 

Not really. You might as well say that the standard soldier is pointless to because of channelers. Perrin wolfbrother ability gives him more then just scouting out TAR.

 

In any case, the whole Ishamael thing is based purely on opinion. Personally, I believe that he doesnt remember squat about his previous lives other then what the Dark One told him. And due to his general nihilistic attitude and insanity by heavy usage of the TP, Ishy took it literally. Out of the characters who see their previous lives, there is Rand and Birgitte, and both are exceptional circumstances. There is no reason to think that Ishamael is any different to everyone else in terms of seeing their previous lives. Of course, some see things differently and thats cool, but wouldnt he be doing a better job of doing what he is doing if he could?

[Mr Ares]

What do you mean he didn't have memories that weren't his? They were all he talked about in the first two books. The whole "You think I haven't faced this before?", "We've done this a thousand thousand times", "You've made that choice sometimes in the past", etc.

I mean exactly what I said. Ishamael was insane and a liar, and in contact with a being who would remember those times. So, he could have heard it from Shai'tan, been lying because he thought it would help his cause, or even believed he was telling the truth. The later books indicate he doesn't have memories he considers his by rights, but they do not indicate that he had them as Ishamael and subsequently lost them. It could just as easily be that he never had them to begin with, but feels that he should. Absent further evidence, I would say this is most likely. In short, he might have had memories, he doesn't now, there is no indication he had them then lost them, therefore I conclude he never had them.

[jdbond]

Ishameal, being a theologian came to believe that fight between good and bad is going on forever. Also being a nutter, he came to believe that he was the DO and that he and Dragon has fought countless battles before. He didn't actually remember his past lifes.

 

Where do people get this idea? I don't remember anything that suggested that Ishamael was lying when he made all those references to the previous lives, like having faced a wolf brother before. Is there a quote for this?

 

 

And why would you believe he was telling the truth?

 

1) Ishamael was crazy.

2) He lied a LOT.

 

How many times Forsaken have confirmed that Ishy actually came to believe he was DO and he took the name "Ba'alzamon" and pretended to be DO for 3000 years. So yes, he was lying through his..

[chuckievi]

There's no evidence that he was lying about them either, so no reason not to take what's in the books at face value

 

To quote an interview with RJ

 

Question: Ishamael mentions in prior Turnings of the Wheel that the soul of Lews Therin was raised up as the Shadow's champion, and if that is the case, who was the champion of the Creator?

Jordan: You believe Ishamael??? Sorry, man, but c'mon!

 

That is some reason to not take him at face value...

 

I am just going to quote myself AGAIN here. Ishy is a liar. Let me bold it, and I'll underline it too, and make it really big.

[Jon Paul]

This is why I love Elan. Sometimes I think I have him pinned.. and other times I am not so sure. Was he really mad? How do we know it was not all an elaborate ruse? And whether or not he did become mad in latter times due to his tampering with the TP, he went over to the Dark One on pure sane, cold logic. Or did he? Did Elan's logic drive him mad independent of the TP like Lews Therin says?

 

Without a doubt, I think Elan is one of the greatest villains in fantasy-fiction.

[OptimusPrime]

Rand was a wolfbrother?

Rand himself was not a wolf brother, however a Dragon age’s before him was. When Moridim saw Perrin with the wolf it brought back the memory of the Dragon being a Wolf brother.

 

Therefor proving that he DID have memories of past lives and ages at one time.

 

Where was this? Quite honestly I think you cant trust anything Moridin says or thinks. He just isnt reliable enough. You have to go buy his actions with regard to the bigger picture.

 

For example, the eslefishness thing teh Dark One promotes. I think Ishamael does the same thing with paranoia. People say Ishy is the master of subtlety, AFTER "I am Ba'alzamon, bow to meh." Why would he say it so... not subtle-like? Surely if it really was Ba'alzamon he wouldnt want the Dragon Reborn to know he was free. Reason=it isnt the Dark One, Ba'alzamon never was.

 

Another example, in TGS.

 

Demandred: Nobody kills the Dragon but me! ME!

 

Moridin: You or the Great Lord, Demandred. Now, let us talk about when I will fight the Dragon at the end.

 

Do you see what Im getting at? Its like Moridin said "You can kill him Demandred, but Im going to fight him. You know, a fight, where one of us will probably die. So maybe I will kick Rands ass and then let you deliver the killing blow. Or maybe Im thinking Im the Dark One in that fight. Or maybe none of those, maybe Im planning on dying in that fight, because then when YOU kill Rand, Demandred, the Dark One can bring us both back coz we're connected, and then Rand will be ours."

 

Or none of that, of course. I just dont think anything Ishamael says or thinks should be used on its own to prove or disprove anything. Neither are reliable sources.

[Vermillion]

1. Ishy doesn't know his past lives as far as we know. Like people have said he was philosophical and all joined the shadow because he believe the battle as useless.

 

2. Rand and Elan souls tend to be bound per RJ or Brandon. The battles a thousand times a thousand, infinity times infinity was through his own logic or maybe DO's knowledge. I am sure the Lord of the Grave would know the souls and since his is tied to the Dragon/CoL there is the possibility that he told him.

 

3. Elan's mind was gone due to use of TP. RJ I believe said once you are that far along with TP symptoms you are near death unless granted a boon by the DO.