Morgase Trakand, meet Tam Al'thore

[Caedn of the Taardad]

Can't believe I never connected this before, but in Eye of the World, when Rand drops in for a visit with the queen, she lets him go for "having the advantage of having heard Two Rivers accents before" (not exact quote, but about that), but the Two Rivers hasn't seen so much as a tax collector in generations, much less some of the Queen's Gaurds, so how much less so the queen herself, (or even the heir to a powerful house if before her ascension to the throne) and NO ONE leaves the Two Rivers, never...  That just leaves Tam Al'thore to have meet the queen when he left to find adventure...  Something to look for if his prequel ever comes out...

[farthammer]

Well the area is famous on that side of the world for one of their crops (tobacco).  So there is trade going on there and it seems reasonable to me that Morgase being the ruler will have at one time or another interacted with people from the Two Rivers.  I don't think RJ meant to imply anything with that it was just a reason for her to disagree with Elaida.

[Caedn of the Taardad]

I see where you go, and the same doubts enter my mind as well, but the only person we have heard of leaving the Two Rivers is Tam (and more recently Abel Cauthon), so it's not too much of a stretch for Tam to have stopped by on his way to join the Companions and meet the Queen, or perhaps heir to the high seat of house Trakand... 

[ravenfier]

this theory has merrit due to what we know of Tam's past, he being the Second Captain of the Companions in Illian, probly the time they met was at the end of the "Aiel War" while he was making his way home- huge war hero ect, probly a party was thrown in his honour, blah blah blah.

 

 

[DemandredFO]

Two Rivers don't even know they are part of Andor so Tam may have met Morgase seeing how it seems no one else in the TR has.

[mb]

Like I posted in other threads, I doubt during the Aiel War because Gareth Bryne may have also have met him.

 

Also like I posted in those threads, a trip to the Two Rivers location when she was young (age 13 at the oldest) seems most probable.

 

Like I speculated in those threads, her father might have been a merchant's guard and might have let her come along.

 

 

There is also Gathering Storm content related to my reason; stated it in a thread in the Gathering Storm section.

 

[Caedn of the Taardad]

Like I posted in other threads, I doubt during the Aiel War because Gareth Bryne may have also have met him.

 

Also like I posted in those threads, a trip to the Two Rivers location when she was young (age 13 at the oldest) seems most probable.

 

Like I speculated in those threads, her father might have been a merchant's guard and might have let her come along.

 

 

There is also Gathering Storm content related to my reason; stated it in a thread in the Gathering Storm section.

 

 

 

Minus the search function, could you provide the name of said thread?  Can't see how that all adds up, but sounds like a good read...

[ravenfier]

It would be highly unlikely that her father would be a merchant gaurd, she is from, what would equate to, a High House, they would try to marry only from other HH's, keeping the line back to Ishara purer, remember that that is what counts how closely you are related to her, (Bryne is from a lesser house). She went to the tower when she was 14 and took the Rose crown when she was 16. From things that she has stated in conversations (and some of her actions that confirm) before fleeing from Ravin she had never lived "rough", even when she was in the WT life would have been hard but not rough. With the known timeline she very well could have met Tam when he was either one of the Leaders of the Illianer army or shortly after the Aiel war, this still being in her youth (she being in her late teens-early twenties)

 

edit: this situation being more likely seeing how part of the Aiel war happened in Andor.

[mb]

Minus the search function, could you provide the name of said thread?  Can't see how that all adds up, but sounds like a good read...

This thread I was referring to::

http://forums.dragonmount.com/index.php/topic,54317.0.html

 

 

The books seem to imply that the Houses have different occupations.  Merchant's guard I would consider a reasonable occupation for a House.

 

[Caedn of the Taardad]

Ah, thank you for the prompt response, good to know this has already been discussed in depth.  For the sake of this thread, I see absolutely no chance of her going to the TR, none at all.  They don't even know that they are part of "some queen's realm", and haven't seen any oficials in generations.  The daughter heir of one of the High Seats would have enough pomp and ceremony (or maybe not that, but an escort for sure) to leave a VERY memorable impression behind on the quiet townsfolk.  Another from the district (and yes, I had considered the Taren Ferryman) is a distinct possibility, I just brought this up since he is the only one we know left at all, much less going as far as the inner realm...  Anyway, thanks for the link, most informative...

[Soloce]

Well the area is famous on that side of the world for one of their crops (tobacco).  So there is trade going on there and it seems reasonable to me that Morgase being the ruler will have at one time or another interacted with people from the Two Rivers.  I don't think RJ meant to imply anything with that it was just a reason for her to disagree with Elaida.

 

IMO, famous last words about RJ -- he was a crafty one!  That more than anything else makes me agree with this theory.

[Caedn of the Taardad]

Found something more going through tGH this morning, here's the quote from Moirane:

 

'"Tam al'Thor left the Two Rivers as a boy, Mother. He joined the army of Illian, and served in the

Whitecloak War and the last two wars with Tear. In time he rose to be a blademaster and the Second Captain of

the Companions. After the Aiel War, Tam al'Thor returned to the Two Rivers with a wife from Caemlyn and an

infant boy.' -The Great Hunt, chapter 8

 

So Tam has very likely been to Caemlyn if he found a wife from there, though that doesn't say in itself that he entered the city...

[MikeRiley]

Rand was the one who said nobody ever left the Two Rivers. He also never really thought about how Tam left. Rand isn't a reliable source of information to assume that in all the Two Rivers nobody ever left. The manner that the line was used in also suggests he was embellishing the truth.

 

There are a lot of people living in the Two Rivers, it's not just Emond's Field. Morgase is the queen of Andor and believes the Two Rivers to be a part of Andor so she would have met some people from that area, even if they were just Taren Ferry folk. That's still far enough off to retain the unique Two Rivers accent.

 

Besides, there's any number of reasons why a person might leave the Two Rivers and not come back, so word wouldn't spread much of their "adventures". Some might become miners. Some might become merchants. It could be as simple as a dress maker moving to Caemlyn and making a dress for a lady who is destined to become queen.

 

In short I think it's a very big jump to assume Tam and Morgase met each other just because she recognized Rand's accent and Rand thought to himself that nobody ever leaves.

[farthammer]

Haven't Tam and Morgase run into eachother later in the series?  Wouldn't there be some hint of recognition if they had met previously.

 

Also I can't think of what it would matter if they had met or not, seems to be a dead end anyway.

[Caedn of the Taardad]

To MikeRiley, yes, I have considered these arguments (before posting this actualy), and all I say is that there is a distinct plausibility for such a meeting. 

 

Haven't Tam and Morgase run into eachother later in the series?  Wouldn't there be some hint of recognition if they had met previously.

 

Also I can't think of what it would matter if they had met or not, seems to be a dead end anyway.

 

And no, we actually haven't seen Tam and Morgase meet (Tam having been called to Perrin's side only last moment before the clash with the Shaido), so we don't know whether or not he would recognize her...  As for why it matters...  What else would one talk about after reading the books so many times?  Why else read them so often?  Light knows I probably read them too much anyway...

[mb]

Haven't Tam and Morgase run into eachother later in the series?  Wouldn't there be some hint of recognition if they had met previously.

The answer to that seems to be a Gathering Storm spoiler.

 

Though I agree that Tam and/or Morgase would have eventually recognized the other if they did meet before.  Probably not immediately, but likely after having several more encounters.