Min's Unfulfilled Visions (Probable Spoilers)

[Dreamwalker]

 

The odd thing about Avi's babies would be maybe they aint hers. Maybe Elayne shouldnt of took Mins viewing as meaning she wont die.

 

 

I think two of them could be Elayne's but that doesn't necessarily mean Elayne will die (though she might). I could see Aiel sister-wives considering each other's children to be their own since sister-wives are essentially married to each other as well as their husband. In fact, one of them could even be Min's child, and just one is Aviendha's. Physiologically speaking, that seems a lot more likely than having four kids at once.

 

The only other big possibility I see for this viewing would be if Aviendha gets pregnant post TG and there's been a body swap - so Rand is in a different body and the kids have different genes. It would be kinda strange, so I think that would fit too. But for this one, the fact that there are four bothers me because it seems so unlikely, so I tend to prefer the first idea (that at least two are not hers).

[J-Rad]

I suspect Towers of Midnight will shed light on this since we have at least three prominent, plot-defining towers throughout the lands: The White Tower, The Tower of Ghenjei (sp?), and the Black Tower.  Note that two of them are related to channeling.

You also have the 7 Towers of Malkier.  Considering Min's viewing of Lan and 7 towers and the fact that you have to pass them on the way to Tarwin's Gap (which just happens to be where Lan's going) we can assume something awesome happening here.

 

Anyways what about Min's viewing of Nyneave stooped over someone's body, greif covering her face?

 

Rand and someone else fusing is definaitley Moridin.  At the end of tGS Rand is like: "He and LTT where never 2 seperate people".

 

Also, I found Egwene/Galad link to be fairly straightforward.  Egwene had a dream about being linked to a hawk.  I always took this to be Berelain.  Berelain is gonna fall in love with Galad.  Bam, there's your connection.

[bronnt]

I suspect Towers of Midnight will shed light on this since we have at least three prominent, plot-defining towers throughout the lands: The White Tower, The Tower of Ghenjei (sp?), and the Black Tower.  Note that two of them are related to channeling.

You also have the 7 Towers of Malkier.  Considering Min's viewing of Lan and 7 towers and the fact that you have to pass them on the way to Tarwin's Gap (which just happens to be where Lan's going) we can assume something awesome happening here.

 

Anyways what about Min's viewing of Nyneave stooped over someone's body, greif covering her face?

 

Rand and someone else fusing is definaitley Moridin.  At the end of tGS Rand is like: "He and LTT where never 2 seperate people".

 

Also, I found Egwene/Galad link to be fairly straightforward.  Egwene had a dream about being linked to a hawk.  I always took this to be Berelain.  Berelain is gonna fall in love with Galad.  Bam, there's your connection.

 

There's an entire other thread talking about the Hawk.  It's a Golden Hawk, the symbol for Seanchan.  And given that we already have a Dream that links Egwene to Seanchan, I think it's the same thing.  There's a Seanchan woman, and I believe it's Egeanin, though that debate continues.

[Crossroad]

I suspect Towers of Midnight will shed light on this since we have at least three prominent, plot-defining towers throughout the lands: The White Tower, The Tower of Ghenjei (sp?), and the Black Tower.  Note that two of them are related to channeling.

You also have the 7 Towers of Malkier.  Considering Min's viewing of Lan and 7 towers and the fact that you have to pass them on the way to Tarwin's Gap (which just happens to be where Lan's going) we can assume something awesome happening here.

 

Anyways what about Min's viewing of Nyneave stooped over someone's body, greif covering her face?

 

Rand and someone else fusing is definaitley Moridin.  At the end of tGS Rand is like: "He and LTT where never 2 seperate people".

 

Also, I found Egwene/Galad link to be fairly straightforward.  Egwene had a dream about being linked to a hawk.  I always took this to be Berelain.  Berelain is gonna fall in love with Galad.  Bam, there's your connection.

 

There's an entire other thread talking about the Hawk.  It's a Golden Hawk, the symbol for Seanchan.  And given that we already have a Dream that links Egwene to Seanchan, I think it's the same thing.  There's a Seanchan woman, and I believe it's Egeanin, though that debate continues.

 

I always thought the Golden Hawk was the symbol of Mayene and the Raven was the symbol to the Seanchan must be reading things wrong.

[StefanR]

I suspect Towers of Midnight will shed light on this since we have at least three prominent, plot-defining towers throughout the lands: The White Tower, The Tower of Ghenjei (sp?), and the Black Tower.  Note that two of them are related to channeling.

You also have the 7 Towers of Malkier.  Considering Min's viewing of Lan and 7 towers and the fact that you have to pass them on the way to Tarwin's Gap (which just happens to be where Lan's going) we can assume something awesome happening here.

 

Anyways what about Min's viewing of Nyneave stooped over someone's body, greif covering her face?

 

Rand and someone else fusing is definaitley Moridin.  At the end of tGS Rand is like: "He and LTT where never 2 seperate people".

 

Also, I found Egwene/Galad link to be fairly straightforward.  Egwene had a dream about being linked to a hawk.  I always took this to be Berelain.  Berelain is gonna fall in love with Galad.  Bam, there's your connection.

 

The 7 towers thing could just refer to the army of Malkieri that Nynaeve has called together for Lan

[MikeRiley]

Malkier is part of the Blight now and he won't have to cross through there to get to Tarwin's Gap. He would likely end his march at Fal Dara and take the same path they took at the end of Eye of the World. We know Rand's party back then went in just about the opposite direction of the borderlanders and they were the ones who camped within view of the towers. So it would definitely be off the beaten path.

 

By the time Lan gets anywhere near there, he'll have an army behind him and he will need to stick to populated areas as long as possible or else watch everybody go hungry. There will be no side trips into the Blight for him.

[FarShainMael]

I suspect Towers of Midnight will shed light on this since we have at least three prominent, plot-defining towers throughout the lands: The White Tower, The Tower of Ghenjei (sp?), and the Black Tower.  Note that two of them are related to channeling.

You also have the 7 Towers of Malkier.  Considering Min's viewing of Lan and 7 towers and the fact that you have to pass them on the way to Tarwin's Gap (which just happens to be where Lan's going) we can assume something awesome happening here.

 

Anyways what about Min's viewing of Nyneave stooped over someone's body, greif covering her face?

 

Rand and someone else fusing is definaitley Moridin.  At the end of tGS Rand is like: "He and LTT where never 2 seperate people".

 

Also, I found Egwene/Galad link to be fairly straightforward.  Egwene had a dream about being linked to a hawk.  I always took this to be Berelain.  Berelain is gonna fall in love with Galad.  Bam, there's your connection.

 

There's an entire other thread talking about the Hawk.  It's a Golden Hawk, the symbol for Seanchan.  And given that we already have a Dream that links Egwene to Seanchan, I think it's the same thing.  There's a Seanchan woman, and I believe it's Egeanin, though that debate continues.

 

I always thought the Golden Hawk was the symbol of Mayene and the Raven was the symbol to the Seanchan must be reading things wrong.

 

The raven is the symbol of the Seanchan Imperial Family  (Tuon and Mat!!)

 

http://rivendell.fortunecity.com/realms/979/info.html

 

Artur 'Hawkwing' Paendrag's sign was a golden hawk in flight. Tuon Athaem Kore Paendrag is his descendent, so the hawk could refer to her; but so is Berelain sur Paendrag of House Paeron, who wears the Diadem of the First, a golden hawk in flight.

 

(Thank you EncWoT!)

 

From that, I'd say the hawk refers to Berelain.

[Dreamwalker]

I suspect Towers of Midnight will shed light on this since we have at least three prominent, plot-defining towers throughout the lands: The White Tower, The Tower of Ghenjei (sp?), and the Black Tower.  Note that two of them are related to channeling.

You also have the 7 Towers of Malkier.  Considering Min's viewing of Lan and 7 towers and the fact that you have to pass them on the way to Tarwin's Gap (which just happens to be where Lan's going) we can assume something awesome happening here.

 

Anyways what about Min's viewing of Nyneave stooped over someone's body, greif covering her face?

 

Rand and someone else fusing is definaitley Moridin.  At the end of tGS Rand is like: "He and LTT where never 2 seperate people".

 

Also, I found Egwene/Galad link to be fairly straightforward.  Egwene had a dream about being linked to a hawk.  I always took this to be Berelain.  Berelain is gonna fall in love with Galad.  Bam, there's your connection.

 

There's an entire other thread talking about the Hawk.  It's a Golden Hawk, the symbol for Seanchan.  And given that we already have a Dream that links Egwene to Seanchan, I think it's the same thing.  There's a Seanchan woman, and I believe it's Egeanin, though that debate continues.

 

I always thought the Golden Hawk was the symbol of Mayene and the Raven was the symbol to the Seanchan must be reading things wrong.

 

The raven is the symbol of the Seanchan Imperial Family  (Tuon and Mat!!)

 

http://rivendell.fortunecity.com/realms/979/info.html

 

Artur 'Hawkwing' Paendrag's sign was a golden hawk in flight. Tuon Athaem Kore Paendrag is his descendent, so the hawk could refer to her; but so is Berelain sur Paendrag of House Paeron, who wears the Diadem of the First, a golden hawk in flight.

 

(Thank you EncWoT!)

 

From that, I'd say the hawk refers to Berelain.

 

The Ravens may be a symbol of the Seanchan, but their Empire also uses the Golden Hawk as their symbol as well (just like Mayene does - because of their ties to Artur Hawkwing)

KoD, Ch. 34

"On one flagstaff the blue-bordered Imperial Banner hung in limp folds, hiding the spread-winged golden hawk clutching lightning in its talons."

This scene takes place in an average Seanchan camp, not the Deathwatch Guard or anything related specifically to Tuon.

 

So really, the Dream could refer to any Seanchan woman like Egeanin (it's not just because of Tuon's lineage - the hawk is used by the Empire as well), or to Berelain.

[Hadilmir]

My 2¢-

 

-Possible that Carlinya will be kidnapped by one of the remaining Bloodknives.

 

-Elayne's 'severed hand, not hers' could be a still resolving loss of the queen of Andor's right-hand-(man), Gareth Bryne.

 

-'A bloody hand and white-hot iron' could refer to the Asha'man. He created them, so every drop of blood they spill is on his hands (which later becomes 'hand'). The part about the white-hot iron might refer to the fact that iron must be white-hot for welding, which ties to the method of making 'pattern-welded blades'. That describes Rand's view of the Asha'man quite clearly, since he credits his ta'veren nature for most of the events leading to the creation of the Black Tower.

 

-Narg killed Asmodean.

 

*The pattern-welded blades part is a stretch, I was trying to think of something to tie together welding and Asha'man. In Randland times there were 3 things you could do with white-hot iron: torture someone, make a pattern-welded blade, and weld things...

[MikeRiley]

A bloody hand and white-hot iron. Rand lost a hand, and near the end of The Great Hunt when he obtains the first of his two major wounds (the stab and loss of hand), the wounding is described like this:

 

    Rand screamed as he felt it pierce his side, burning like a white-hot

poker.  The void trembled, but he held on with the last of his strength, and

drove the heron-mark blade into Ba'alzamon's heart. Ba'alzamon screamed,

and the dark behind him screamed. The world exploded in fire.

[Matrim DeLaneous]

what is it that Rand and the Asha'man "won't like at all" that Cadsuane teaches them.?

 

Have begun thinking that this may be that men who can channel can only have children with women who can channel and/or have the spark? 

* Don't know of any instances in the books to refute this?

* Interesting that Rand is with Elayne once, and she's pregnant, we know that Avi will be pregnant soon but even after months & months with Min... nothing.

* This realization wouldn't set well with the Ashaman that want to wipe out and/or control the women of the tower. 

 

Just a far fetched idea!

[yoniy0]

* Don't know of any instances in the books to refute this?

What about LTT? We know he had kids with Ilyena, and IIRC she couldn't channel.

 

Edit: Sorry, I did a quick search and apparently we've never actually seen that she COULDN'T channel. My apologies.

[FarShainMael]

See reply #27 on

 

http://forums.dragonmount.com/index.php/topic,55716.24.html

 

Ilyena could channel. She was Aes Sedai.

[Sharaman]

* Don't know of any instances in the books to refute this?

What about LTT? We know he had kids with Ilyena, and IIRC she couldn't channel.

 

Edit: Sorry, I did a quick search and apparently we've never actually seen that she COULDN'T channel. My apologies.

 

Bailey's Crossroads VA 2005 - John Nowacki reporting:

Signing of KoD

Q:  Was Ilyena Aes Sedai?

RJ:  Yes.

 

 

[threadnecromancer]

 

Source: Robert Jordan letter to Ms. Carolyn Fusinato dated April 3, 1995. A Full Copy of this letter is archived at Archive.org here[/i]

 

The piece in the game could be said to still be human - those pieces that came from humans, anyway; there were other sources too == though they are about the size of moderately large chess-pieces. They retain memories, souls, personalities, but they are part of the game now, permanently slaved to the game anad part of it as surely as a cog in a clock is part of the clock. They have no personal volition, though they do have awareness. The only lives they can [can is underlines] live are being used in the game. In the Age of Legends, these games were destroyed when found; the choice for the pieces was to remain part of the game or death, since removing them from the board\ field meant death in any case. the game is all one, board and playing pieces together. And that is much as I will tell you of it. I don't want to give away what I might use later on, after all.

 

How did you find that? Are there anymore?

 

 

[Hadilmir]

A bloody hand and white-hot iron. Rand lost a hand, and near the end of The Great Hunt when he obtains the first of his two major wounds (the stab and loss of hand), the wounding is described like this:

Blasting a hand from existence doesn't draw blood, the wound is cauterized the instant it is made, also, bloody hand implies there is a hand left to be bloody. It's entirely up to how you interpret it, so I can't really make an argument against your post.

[yoniy0]

Blasting a hand from existence doesn't draw blood, the wound is cauterized the instant it is made, also, bloody hand implies there is a hand left to be bloody. It's entirely up to how you interpret it, so I can't really make an argument against your post.

I find it funny that this is the common opinion on the matter. How many of us have truly witnessed a limb exploding, and can comment on the bloodiness of the wounds caused? I (thankfully) can't say I've witnessed such horrors personally, but my general understanding is that the whole affair is much bloodier in real life than we might like to believe.

Let me remark that, unlike most of us, RJ COULD draw on his own experience for this kind of thing (at least I hope most of us can't).

[Sharaman]

Have begun thinking that this may be that men who can channel can only have children with women who can channel and/or have the spark? 

* Don't know of any instances in the books to refute this?

* Interesting that Rand is with Elayne once, and she's pregnant, we know that Avi will be pregnant soon but even after months & months with Min... nothing.

* This realization wouldn't set well with the Ashaman that want to wipe out and/or control the women of the tower. 

Just a far fetched idea!

 

The BT has a lot of wives and kids in tow so, your idea is wrong anyhow.

WH Prologue Toveine's PoV

"Scattered around them stood nearly two hundred houses that might have been seen in any village, where some

of the married men lived, and the families of others not far enough along in training."

 

A little later in the same section.

"Women bundled up against the cold walked past them, placidly carrying baskets to the quartermaster’s storehouse or watch buckets to the nearest fountain, though how any woman could remain, knowing what her husband was, was beyond Toveine’s comprehension. Even more bizarre, children ran up and down the street, around the squares of men who could channel, shouting and laughing, rolling hoops, tossing painted balls, playing with dolls or dogs. A drop of normality that heightened the evil stench of the rest."

 

Blasting a hand from existence doesn't draw blood, the wound is cauterized the instant it is made, also, bloody hand implies there is a hand left to be bloody. It's entirely up to how you interpret it, so I can't really make an argument against your post.

I find it funny that this is the common opinion on the matter. How many of us have truly witnessed a limb exploding, and can comment on the bloodiness of the wounds caused? I (thankfully) can't say I've witnessed such horrors personally, but my general understanding is that the whole affair is much bloodier in real life than we might like to believe.

Let me remark that, unlike most of us, RJ COULD draw on his own experience for this kind of thing (at least I hope most of us can't).

 

I have, for my sins, seen this sort of wound several times, in Iraq, Sri Lanka, Delhi and Kashmir. Yes, there could, and normally would, be a lot of blood, for a standard explosion, as well as flesh scattered all over the place. But what Semirhage did from description was hit him with a pure ball of fire - that's plasma, not shrapnel, which is what I've seen. Maybe, that might cause an instant cauterisation - even high-velocity bullet wounds do that sometimes.

What about Perrin chopping the Shaido? That needed to be healed while spurting blood and maybe fits.

 

 

 

 

[Hadilmir]

Sharaman, (again) is right. I didn't mean blasting as in concussive, which I know is very bloody and I am lucky not to have ever seen something of the sort. A ball of fire has a net force of what, a water-balloon? So it must have melted the bones in his hand and at that temperature, blood is vaporized instantly anyway.

 

The viewing is about Rand, Sharaman. Sorry, no Shaido-chopping Perrin's involved. But Narg really did kill Asmodean; Narg smart.

[Matrim DeLaneous]

The BT has a lot of wives and kids in tow so, your idea is wrong anyhow.

 

I considered this point but thought that the men did not have the spark and had children BEFORE they started to channel.  Weak... but possible.

[Wingendosering]

Min has been taking some sort of concoction that prevents pregnancy.  She mentions offering some to Elayne in WH.

[FarShainMael]

Heartleaf tea?

 

[ravenfier]

with the avi viewing, I always thought that that was because she could never see anything on herself and two of the kids are hers, so she and avi have twins at the same time.

[yoniy0]

Sharaman, (again) is right. I didn't mean blasting as in concussive, which I know is very bloody and I am lucky not to have ever seen something of the sort. A ball of fire has a net force of what, a water-balloon? So it must have melted the bones in his hand and at that temperature, blood is vaporized instantly anyway.

 

The viewing is about Rand, Sharaman. Sorry, no Shaido-chopping Perrin's involved. But Narg really did kill Asmodean; Narg smart.

Not so. We get a few descriptions of Moiraine and other AS throwing fireballs at trollocs, and sometimes those cause heads to fly. Hence, there is some sort of explosion involved. Sharaman is right in that I don't think there would be any shrapnel, but an explosion nonetheless.

[Random Man]

 

Anyways what about Min's viewing of Nyneave stooped over someone's body, greif covering her face?

 

I completely missed this part until my last reading of TGS. Does no one else want to discuss this or has it just been overlooked? I've looked everywhere for discussion on Min's new viewings in Ch. 48 -- Nyn grieving over a corpse, and a black knife over Beldeine's head -- and found nothing except for the above quote.

 

The "obvious" fulfillment of the viewing of Nyn is that Lan's going to die. Considering that Myrelle has disappeared into the quagmire that is the Black Tower at the moment and may be dead or turned, coupled with Lan getting ready to ride into the Blight, it's not looking good for him. Odd that Egwene didn't seem at all concerned with what would happen to Lan when she heard about the delegation disappearing. The corpse could be anyone else, or it could just be Min not wanting to admit to herself that she recognizes Lan's body.

 

Beldeine -- probably not a BA because Egwene would have recognized the name immediately since Beldeine was her Keeper in the Arches test, and it's unlikely that another of Rand's followers is not only BA but one that Verin didn't find. I say she's gonna get turned -- either that or Verin might have Compelled Beldeine to do something that will have implications in the near future.