Tarmon Gai'don. When Will It Begin? How Will It Be Launched? (Full Spoilers)

[Impressive Bosom]

-Tuon needs a major wake-up call and needs to stop the leashoing, and only leash severe channeling criminals and darkfriend channelers. (how they'll do it, i have NO idea  ::) )

 

It seems like the Seanchan are actually the ideal society to usher in a new AoL... rand even notices at the end of tGS how much happier and more prosperous people were under their rule. The only problem - and its a BIG one - is that they embrace the concept of slavery, particularly the enslaving of those who can channel. I figure the best way to end that little issue is for someone to leash Tuon herslef... that rather sudden and stark realization could well be the catalyst to changing the Imperial view.

[Blackhoof]

everyone needs to stop seeing rand as a problem to be solved or an unruly child to be guided onto the correct path and as a man to be helped

 

They need to start seeing him as a leader, and he needs to start acting like one.

 

I agree, but Rands not that bad as a leader, is he? Hes done pretty well so far.

[thewalrus777]

Rand is the strongest ta'veren EVER. And he is a good leader. He knows more of what needs to be done than anyone in that realm. And not to mention, all of his desicions regarding how things are run in diffent places is all based on making people do the right things in their own kingdoms. Righting wrongs, and clearly not putting up with anyone's nonsense or disobediance regarding his rule. He has no time to pander to others selfish reasoning. What he does, he does for the good of all.

[Crael123]

rand is a great leader. we shouldn't get mad at him for trying to rip apart the world and ending it all. who hasn't felt that way? jk jk. but seriously. the people of the world, not pointing fingers (aes sedai) need to start seeing him as a leader. once the seanchan see him like the savior he is and tuon gets knocked down a few pegs most of the world will see him as a leader not destroyer. the alliance with seanchan is crucial for the world seeing him as something other than a rabid dog, because he managed something that even aes sedai couldnt do. then the nations will see beyond their own noses and accept that the Last Battle is really going to happen and they will see that trollocs dont care who Almoth plain belongs too, or something like that. then they will join the bandwagon and get over themselves long enough to fight some dreadlords and then when the last battle is over they will see that life has a bigger meaning than just pleasing themselves and influence in the government

[Blackhoof]

Here here!

 

[clu7ch]

none of this will matter when Rand, in his laff-drunk state trips and falls off of dragonmount.

[thewalrus777]

AMEN! Rand just needs to start bitch-slapping some sense into these incredibly selfish people on this side of the Aryth. Including the Seanchan. He just needs to throw down the pimp hand and say "You better have my money!"

[clu7ch]

rofl at the idea of Rand wearing mat's hat and having a big purple coat and making callandor into a walking cane.

[Blackhoof]

LOL!

[thewalrus777]

ROFL! Struttin' down the streets of Tear yellin' "Bitch better have my money!" Or telling High Lords to sit their punk asses down!

[asunawa]

Maybe this has been discussed, but do we know that the Dark ones forces are as big as, or bigger than Rands? I was thinking about when Demandred is on his way to talk to the dark one in LoC and he can see only a few human prisoners, a lot less than usual. This should mean something I think. And also, Verin stated that the Last battle will not be what Rand expects it to be, so maybe these two things are connected. Maybe the Dark one has other plans than using trollocs and other creatures. Just a thought...

[Sharaman]

We don't really have a handle on GLoD's manpower or rather Trolloc and Fade power. There's no clear take on how fast trollocs breed and how fast they become adults. Also we don't have a clue how these vast forces are fed and clothed. 

The numbers could be considerable given that one Chosen could commit 100,000 trollocs and 100 Fades on one single raid/ attack.

In the Trolloc wars, often there were several armies of 300,000 trollocs each in the field.

The lack of prisoners is partly because there have been fewer raids out of the Blight apparently as a matter of deliberate policy. 

[wingedearth]

We don't really have a handle on GLoD's manpower or rather Trolloc and Fade power. There's no clear take on how fast trollocs breed and how fast they become adults. Also we don't have a clue how these vast forces are fed and clothed. 

The numbers could be considerable given that one Chosen could commit 100,000 trollocs and 100 Fades on one single raid/ attack.

In the Trolloc wars, often there were several armies of 300,000 trollocs each in the field.

The lack of prisoners is partly because there have been fewer raids out of the Blight apparently as a matter of deliberate policy. 

 

None of that really matters. After the Bore, the DO's side started off with zero Shadowspawn, dreadlords, darkfriends, etc.  But since he was touching the world, he was able to quickly convert followers, who then created the Shadowspawn. During Tarmon Gai'din, no matter what the DO has left over from the War of the Shadow, he can probably build a new army.

[Sharaman]

GloD has armies up the kazoo if His minions can casually waste 100,000 trollocs on an off-chance.

We just don't know how large they are and we don't have enough info about logistics of trolloc societies or about the Blight's food-growing capacity to even begin guessing.

The War of Shadow ended 3000 years ago and the Trolloc Wars ended millenia back. Even the great-great descendants of most of the fighters on either side are dead. The numbers are relevant only in the sense that He may be able to put armies of similar size in the field once again.

 

 

[thewalrus777]

GloD has armies up the kazoo if His minions can casually waste 100,000 trollocs on an off-chance.

We just don't know how large they are and we don't have enough info about logistics of trolloc societies or about the Blight's food-growing capacity to even begin guessing.

The War of Shadow ended 3000 years ago and the Trolloc Wars ended millenia back. Even the great-great descendants of most of the fighters on either side are dead. The numbers are relevant only in the sense that He may be able to put armies of similar size in the field once again.

 

 

 

agreed :)

[Durinax]

The main thing the shadow has is that they have people infiltrated into the lights armies and can at any time destroy any light armies moral

[thewalrus777]

The main thing the shadow has is that they have people infiltrated into the lights armies and can at any time destroy any light armies moral

 

Agreed. :)

 

It's a HUGE advantage to have DF's iinfiltrated in the armies of Randland. Instilling doubt and fear in an opposing army, is just as good as attacking them with a massive army.

[ed2funy]

How long does it take for the DO to take power exactly.

The WOT-encyclopaedia says it was 50-100 years until the the Strike at SG.

Firstly, I believe it was stated (as a theory) that the hole in his prison was to small for for him to actually assert himself in our reality or world or w/e. And that is the reason why he didn't just take control and break the Wheel and remake the world while he was out.

 

But, in the Prolouge in tEotW, LTT tells Ishy:

 

"Ten years your foul master has wracked this world. And now this, I will..."

 

So, is that when the DO made his presence known?

Was Ishy already crazy enough to claim that title?

 

If it was in fact the DO, why didn't he just go...boom...I win?

I think it was most likely Ishy, but I wanted to put this out there.

 

The reason I put this in this thread now is because if Rand breaks the seals, what will happen? Will the DO immediately come out? Will he control Moridin (take over him as his surrogate in this world)?

 

 

[thewalrus777]

How long does it take for the DO to take power exactly.

The WOT-encyclopaedia says it was 50-100 years until the the Strike at SG.

Firstly, I believe it was stated (as a theory) that the hole in his prison was to small for for him to actually assert himself in our reality or world or w/e. And that is the reason why he didn't just take control and break the Wheel and remake the world while he was out.

 

But, in the Prolouge in tEotW, LTT tells Ishy:

 

"Ten years your foul master has wracked this world. And now this, I will..."

 

So, is that when the DO made his presence known?

Was Ishy already crazy enough to claim that title?

 

If it was in fact the DO, why didn't he just go...boom...I win?

I think it was most likely Ishy, but I wanted to put this out there.

 

The reason I put this in this thread now is because if Rand breaks the seals, what will happen? Will the DO immediately come out? Will he control Moridin (take over him as his surrogate in this world)?

 

 

 

The ten years quote is referring to the War of Power, which only lasted 10 years. The DO had been slowly creeping out to touch the world over a stretch of 50 to 100 years, known as The Collapse. Even when the seals weren't made yet he still coudn't fully touch the world. I don't think his prison will ever be fully broken open. I think it will be completely sealed again, to start the process in the next Ages of "forgetting" the DO's presence, as it was when the AoL comes back around again. But now, that's just philosophy talk. ;D

[ed2funy]

lol...

Totally missed that part.

:P

 

Nevermind.

[thewalrus777]

lol...

Totally missed that part.

:P

 

Nevermind.

 

You crack me up, man. ;D

[ed2funy]

I crack myself up...

that is why I take the pills. o.0

:D

lol...I am so glad I don't have to take any though....my brother used to...he was horrible.

[wingedearth]

How long does it take for the DO to take power exactly.

The WOT-encyclopaedia says it was 50-100 years until the the Strike at SG.

Firstly, I believe it was stated (as a theory) that the hole in his prison was to small for for him to actually assert himself in our reality or world or w/e. And that is the reason why he didn't just take control and break the Wheel and remake the world while he was out.

 

But, in the Prolouge in tEotW, LTT tells Ishy:

 

"Ten years your foul master has wracked this world. And now this, I will..."

 

So, is that when the DO made his presence known?

Was Ishy already crazy enough to claim that title?

 

If it was in fact the DO, why didn't he just go...boom...I win?

I think it was most likely Ishy, but I wanted to put this out there.

 

The reason I put this in this thread now is because if Rand breaks the seals, what will happen? Will the DO immediately come out? Will he control Moridin (take over him as his surrogate in this world)?

 

 

 

If the seals are broken, conditions will revert to what they were just before the seals were created, specifically the Dark One will touch the world in the same way as during the War of the Shadow. That doesn't mean he can just break the Wheel of Time, otherwise he would have done so after the Bore was drilled into his prison.

 

What happens when the Dark One is free probably means that it's easier to turn people to the Shadow. Otherwise, I don't really see the difference the seals make, since the Forsaken are already free. Maybe without the seals, the Forsaken and all the dreadlords can channel the True Power, and the DO can speak to anyone, anywhere, without them being at Shayol Ghul.

[Pinzarn]

Here is my take on what will happen with the armies...

 

Lan's forces will start falling behind.  At the crucial moment, AS will show up to turn the tide.  I have been thinking that the AS have to redeem themselves for letting Malkier fall before.  Lan will receive some sort of deathblow, but since Nyn is a super-healer, she will invent the first powerwrought difibrilator and bring him back to life.  Lan and Nyn will rule Malkier.

 

Mat's forces will show up at one of these battles with tanks and/or mobile artillery.  Between the cannons and the steam engines that were being invented at one of the schools, this just seems to fit.

 

I am leaning towards the Borderlanders being part of Lan's forces mentioned above.

 

Some unforeseen amry will show up out of no where and save the day/attack from the flank.  Either from Shara (sp?) or from the Seanchan.  I guess this could the borderlanders as well.

 

Matheraen (sp?) will be reborn since a trolloc horde will show up there, and Perrin's forces will be poised to fight them back in a "Remember the Alamo" type of way.

 

The final battle will involve Fain some how.  I think Fain is the patch for the bore or a welding rod or conduit to apply the patch.  My thought run that Fain is a different kind of evil from the DO; therefore, he can't be tainted by the DO.  Also, he is of this world; therefore, he can be applied to the bore.

[rhadamanthus]

I have to admit, I am scared that Logain might end up with credit for Rand's work, which would be terribly lame.