The Big (Currently) Unoticed Thing In Books 4-6 (Mistborn Spoilers)

[Dreamwalker]

Wait so when Kell told vin that he liked her earing in one of the early chapters of the first mistborn book you thought that the earing would end up saving her life. if thats true which i highly doubt then i am impressed. But if we are looking for hints like that any trivial comment on ANYTHING in books 4-6 qualifys as being that thing we missed

 

This is why it is totally Mat's hat. :P It's a bloody good hat! ... and Lanfear sold it to him.

[Netizen]

I keep coming back to Aiel Dfs too.

 

Consider - Elza swore to serve Rand so that she could keep him alive for the DO. Maybe this foreshadows the motivation of Aiel DFs?

 

If it is Aiel being DFs on a large scale, ie it's part of who they are as a people, it can't be all of them because Rand has seen through the eyes of his Aiel ancestors and he would have noticed them thinking about it.

 

So maybe it's only some of them but still a large amount. Such as the siswai'aman, or the Maidens, or the Wise Ones.  ???

 

If all the Aiel are DFs serving Rand for their own reasons, it would be huge. I don't know how credible it would be. Aviendha's POVs don't seem to drop any hints about it but then, she's still only an apprentice.

 

???

[alligator]

So maybe it's only some of them but still a large amount. Such as the siswai'aman, or the Maidens, or the Wise Ones.  ???

 

If all the Aiel are DFs serving Rand for their own reasons, it would be huge. I don't know how credible it would be. Aviendha's POVs don't seem to drop any hints about it but then, she's still only an apprentice.

 

???

 

Oh gosh. What if part of becoming a Wise One includes being 13x13ed? Avi is doing her Wise One stuff next book maybe, so we might actually get to see what happens, her realizing they are all DFs, trying to fight back, etc.

Dunno, think it would be cool.

[Netizen]

Oooooh!  :o

[Crael123]

was sevanna a darkfriend or was she just powerhungry

[Skeeve the Great]

I doubt it's Wise Ones. At least not all of them. Min spent a lot of time among them and didn't see anything dangerous about them. True it's not a proof, but seeing so much Wise Ones, she could've picked something.

[StefanR]

I keep coming back to Aiel Dfs too.

 

Consider - Elza swore to serve Rand so that she could keep him alive for the DO. Maybe this foreshadows the motivation of Aiel DFs?

 

If it is Aiel being DFs on a large scale, ie it's part of who they are as a people, it can't be all of them because Rand has seen through the eyes of his Aiel ancestors and he would have noticed them thinking about it.

 

So maybe it's only some of them but still a large amount. Such as the siswai'aman, or the Maidens, or the Wise Ones.  ???

 

If all the Aiel are DFs serving Rand for their own reasons, it would be huge. I don't know how credible it would be. Aviendha's POVs don't seem to drop any hints about it but then, she's still only an apprentice.

 

???

 

Elza had compulsion used on her by Verin though

[Dreamwalker]

So maybe it's only some of them but still a large amount. Such as the siswai'aman, or the Maidens, or the Wise Ones.  ???

 

If all the Aiel are DFs serving Rand for their own reasons, it would be huge. I don't know how credible it would be. Aviendha's POVs don't seem to drop any hints about it but then, she's still only an apprentice.

 

???

 

Oh gosh. What if part of becoming a Wise One includes being 13x13ed? Avi is doing her Wise One stuff next book maybe, so we might actually get to see what happens, her realizing they are all DFs, trying to fight back, etc.

Dunno, think it would be cool.

 

If this were the case and all Wise Ones were DFs, don't you think they definitely would have 13x13ed Egwene since she's this awesomely strong channeler and from the same village as Rand - they had plenty of opportunities while she was living with them, helplessly asleep while trying to learn to be a Dreamwalker and all...

 

So, I highly doubt it (though it is a pretty cool theory). Some of the Wise Ones could definitely be DFs, I just doubt that they all are.

[Calderis]

Does no one remember When Mat was almost murdered by his Shaido DF lover, and one of the Aiel commented that on learning she was a darkfriend her own first sister wouldn't have tried to protect her? DF's are shunned just as badly, if not more so in Aiel society. The main reason you probably don't hear them spoken about by Aiel is just how strictly they society holds them on certain subjects. Acknowledging them as Aiel is probably a self-shaming act.

[Sharaman]

I meant that somebody high up in the Aiel power-influence structure is a Friend of the Dark, which we have received hints of ever since Book IV. Not that the entire freaking Aiel nation consists of DFs.

 

[alligator]

So maybe it's only some of them but still a large amount. Such as the siswai'aman, or the Maidens, or the Wise Ones.  ???

 

If all the Aiel are DFs serving Rand for their own reasons, it would be huge. I don't know how credible it would be. Aviendha's POVs don't seem to drop any hints about it but then, she's still only an apprentice.

 

???

 

Oh gosh. What if part of becoming a Wise One includes being 13x13ed? Avi is doing her Wise One stuff next book maybe, so we might actually get to see what happens, her realizing they are all DFs, trying to fight back, etc.

Dunno, think it would be cool.

 

If this were the case and all Wise Ones were DFs, don't you think they definitely would have 13x13ed Egwene since she's this awesomely strong channeler and from the same village as Rand - they had plenty of opportunities while she was living with them, helplessly asleep while trying to learn to be a Dreamwalker and all...

 

So, I highly doubt it (though it is a pretty cool theory). Some of the Wise Ones could definitely be DFs, I just doubt that they all are.

 

Yeah, I know, it just had me thinking about what a crazy-cool plot twist that would be.

I mean who needs continuity, right?  :P

[Aquarius]

"A high-ranking Aiel DF" could be the BUT... however, I had thought more about something factual, a situation, an event, the use of some object,... more that just "someone".

[Hunter of Trollocs]

Long time reader, first time poster...thought I would throw these out there. I picked up during my audio playback of the book, currently going through book 4.  I picked up the following potential BUTs.  Sorry for any spelling errors, I don't have access to the books right now.

 

BUT#1

Book 4, Lanfear's coming out chat with Rand, she talks about 'only two more powerful' sa'angreal that a man can use over Callandor.  We know one more powerful is the chodan kal, what is the other?

 

Also, book 4 in the dream, Egwene discovers the hidden cache in Tanchico, one is a half broken female statue.  She is called to it and when she touches it, the power goes a bit haywire.  Is this a replica or one of a pair of the female chodan kal?  I believe it's description is the same as the one found in the Waste.

 

Could there have been two pairs each (male and female) of access keys for the chodan kal?  If so, where is the second male one, and could the destroyed female one be merged somehow with the one referenced in Tanchico?

 

BUT#2

We hear about the Jendai prophecy in book four.  Here is a line on it referring to the coramoor:

 

"The White Tower shall be broken by his name, and Aes Sedai shall kneel to wash his feet and dry them with their hair." (4.316)

 

This sounds familiar!  Isn't the ceremony for raising an Amarlyn eerily similar to this?

 

Also, we know later in the books Elaida commissions for a new tower to be built in Tar Valon.  Whatever happened to that?  Who will use it?

 

Perhaps some foreshadowing that the White/Black tower will ultimately unite, with Rand as the Amarlyn seat? Hrm, what was it that Elaida foreshadowed, about the Dragon knowing the wrath of the Amarlyn.  I would say so,considering they might be the same people down the road.  OR, it might be as simple as Rand assuming authority over the Amarlyn (Egwene) through some treaty to join the two chaneller communities. That would piss off Egwene too, if that is what is meant from the foretelling.

 

 

[J-Rad]

Book 4, Lanfear's coming out chat with Rand, she talks about 'only two more powerful' sa'angreal that a man can use over Callandor.  We know one more powerful is the chodan kal, what is the other?

There are 2 Choden Kal (1 for male and 1 for female) this makes 2 sa angeal that are stronger than Callandor.

 

Also, book 4 in the dream, Egwene discovers the hidden cache in Tanchico, one is a half broken female statue.  She is called to it and when she touches it, the power goes a bit haywire.  Is this a replica or one of a pair of the female chodan kal?  I believe it's description is the same as the one found in the Waste.

I always thought that since it looked like an access key and caused pain to the person who tried to channel with it, that it was just some kind of trap, meant to hurt someone who would use that much power for an evil purpose.

 

Also regarding multiple keys, I remember the Forsaken meeting in WH and it was implied that infact more access keys.  Everyone of the Forsaken was suprised to find out that a set was still intact.

 

Personally, I like the whole Aiel DF thing.  Goes suprisingly well with the one dream regarding someone Rand didn't see holding a knife to his throat

 

[Hunter of Trollocs]

Book 4, Lanfear's coming out chat with Rand, she talks about 'only two more powerful' sa'angreal that a man can use over Callandor.  We know one more powerful is the chodan kal, what is the other?

There are 2 Choden Kal (1 for male and 1 for female) this makes 2 sa angeal that are stronger than Callandor.

 

Sorry, she says, "There are only two more powerful that a man can use. One at least, I know, still exists."

 

So, what is the second more powerful if we know the Choden Kal is one?  Is it a second access key, or something else entirely.  Is this a big deal, you tell me!

 

Also, book 4 in the dream, Egwene discovers the hidden cache in Tanchico, one is a half broken female statue.  She is called to it and when she touches it, the power goes a bit haywire.  Is this a replica or one of a pair of the female chodan kal?  I believe it's description is the same as the one found in the Waste.

I always thought that since it looked like an access key and caused pain to the person who tried to channel with it, that it was just some kind of trap, meant to hurt someone who would use that much power for an evil purpose.

 

Also regarding multiple keys, I remember the Forsaken meeting in WH and it was implied that infact more access keys.  Everyone of the Forsaken was suprised to find out that a set was still intact.

 

The female statue in Tanchico is indeed a second access key according to here.  The implications that 1) there is likely a second male access key, and 2) the female access key might be repairable, could be explored I think.  Might be a pretty big development...

[Sharaman]

The Choedan Kal themselves have both been destroyed so no, more access keys are not important.

A second super-strong saidin  sangreal may be a big deal but we've only heard it mentioned that once in Book IV.

The BUT continues through later books so, that second sangreal is not the BUT, though it could play a part.

BTW the second Sangreal is mentioned every 10 pages or so by a new poster.

 

 

[redarm1]

Late to the party I know, so I imagine this has already been brought up, but just in case...

 

The issue that I noticed on my recent read through that came up and disappeared was the alternative plan that the Black Ajah prisoners coughed up in the stone of Tear, about supporting Taim as a Rand impersonator in a negative PR campaign.  When Nynaeve & Elayne meet up with the black witches in Tanchico, aren't only half of them accounted for?  It just seems to me like they are setting up the Black Tower to be a focal point in this book, with the title, and the fact that its a rather large loose end hanging out there.  So I wouldn't be surprised if this was somehow involved.

[bronnt]

Late to the party I know, so I imagine this has already been brought up, but just in case...

 

The issue that I noticed on my recent read through that came up and disappeared was the alternative plan that the Black Ajah prisoners coughed up in the stone of Tear, about supporting Taim as a Rand impersonator in a negative PR campaign.  When Nynaeve & Elayne meet up with the black witches in Tanchico, aren't only half of them accounted for?  It just seems to me like they are setting up the Black Tower to be a focal point in this book, with the title, and the fact that its a rather large loose end hanging out there.  So I wouldn't be surprised if this was somehow involved.

 

Pretty sure that, since we learn from Verin that Black Ajah swear an Oath that doesn't permit them to betray any Black Ajah plots, that Joiya was basically blowing smoke all through that.  The fact that Taim eventually escapes is supposed to cast some suspicion on him, but that plot never went anywhere. 

 

The one who was stilled-Amico, I think-is the one who told the truth.  Her stilling broke her connection to the Oaths.  She's the one that told them to look in Tanchico.

[morkhon]

I meant that somebody high up in the Aiel power-influence structure is a Friend of the Dark, which we have received hints of ever since Book IV. Not that the entire freaking Aiel nation consists of DFs.

 

Could we be looking at where Demandred has positioned himself? And the real reason behind the siswai'aman. Could he perhaps be some unknown Aiel organizing this little group of 'Spears of the Dragon'.

 

Maybe that's a stretch  ::), but I do think the siswai'aman is the 'unnoticed thing' this thread is about.

[Drakhaun]

What about the broken Choedan Kal"access key" ter'angreal that Nyneve found in Tanchico, implying... there may be others?

[Crael123]

What about the broken Choedan Kal"access key" ter'angreal that Nyneve found in Tanchico, implying... there may be others?

 

well they are kinda useless now, both CK are destroyed

[birtikidis]

what about the music box ter'angreal?  wasn't that found in TSR in Rhuidean (even though it isn't specifically mentioned)?  then it pops up a few times later.  I think it'll be used to save Moraine...

[firstfishman]

Anything said about the "unseen eyes" in TaR?

[myn0s]

Could the "unseen eyes" in TaR be in any way related to the finns?

[Knobs Mahoney]

I'm not sure if it's been spelled out this way or not, but I know I've seen pieces of this in the 200+ pages on this thread.

 

Perhaps it is Ogier Darkfriends. Think about it--Trollocs started showing up out of no-where in TSR (inside the Stone of Tear), and again at Imre stand in the Aiel Waste. Perhaps they are helping Trollocs to travel through The Ways via orders of the Forsaken? This would definitely be a big "gotcha" moment in the next book if it were true. Not many people suspect Ogier of being Darkfriends...