The Blight.

[Roxinos]

A thought just occurred to me, and I want to flesh it out. In truth, it's more of a question than a thought.

 

I'm fairly certain the Blight did not exist in the Age of Legends. I'm not certain when it formed, but it certainly formed after The Bore was drilled. This tells us that at some point, the Blight is reclaimed by the Light and just becomes normal land again. We can suppose that since the Blight is a product of the Great Lord's taint on the land (though, its nature is odd because the Blight continues its advance naturally seemingly without the aid of the Great Lord, and it is repelled naturally as well), it will go away after the Great Lord's prison is patched up completely by Rand.

 

The question is this: how will the Blight go away? Will it fade away with time, its effects being weakened as time passes until the land is habitable once more? Will its encroachment be reversed until it pulls into Shayol Ghul and then disappears? Or will, after the Bore is completely sealed, the Blight simply vanish?

 

All of these questions are fairly subjective. Considering we know little about how the Blight was first formed, we have little to go on in considering how it would end. As mentioned previously, though, we do have information regarding the Blight's nature in its advancement. If I recall correctly, it has been mentioned that the Blight pulls back and moves forward with time depending on how well the Borderlands are doing (though this point could prove false since I have a pretty terrible memory).

 

No matter, though, we know that Malkier fell and was taken over by the Blight. This was a fairly long time before the Bore weakened enough to free the Chosen, so we can assume that the Great Lord was also incapable of effecting the world in such a direct manner as to extend the Blight to encompass Malkier willfully. So when the Trollocs began their occupation of Malkier, the Blight unconsciously moved on. This, I would think, is a strong indication of the nature of the Blight. Also, the only indication of its nature beyond that of it being a product of the Great Lord's taint.

 

So what controls the Blight's advance? Is it the Trollocs? Do they and the other Shadowspawn somehow help to propagate the Blight?

 

So many questions, so few answers.

[42Bonzo88]

    I don't know if this is possible, but maybe with Rand defeating the Dark One it might be like getting rid of the taint. Where he used Shadar Logoth to put the taint after it was cleansed and Shadar Logoth was gone.

 

    It might be that Tarmon Gaidon is fought in the blight and it might tell how the Last Battle is doing depending on if the Blight is shrinking or expanding.

 

    There is two that I came up with. Great Question!

[CUBAREY]

Your post raises several interesting questions. I would like to note a few things.

 

If Rand "patches" the bore in all likelihood the blight might gradually retreat but it will not disappear. Remember a repaired patch is still imperfect and allows the DO a certain limited influence into the world. Thus unless Rand was to totally replace the patch with a perfect seal the DO's influence would not be totally cut off by the bore being "repatched".

 

Second the Third Age is over Three Thousand Years the fact that Malkier disappeared 40 years ago does not mean that the seals were not beginning to fail back then to the extent that the Blight and the DO's influence were not responsible for the fall of Malkier. Think of it this way the fall of Malkier could be seen as the first crack in the dam, it was relatively small and only had a fleeting overall effect on the Pattern but it signaled the beginning of the end. Soon ater things got worse: Laman dedecided to cut down the Ail's gift, they relatliated by invading Randland to punish him, which gave the oppertunety for Rand to be born on Dragonmount, etc..

 

Lastlty, as the blight causes a cancerous growth on nature, if you remove the cancer (the DO's influence) it will take time for the effects to heal and thus the cleansing of the Blight would be gradual.

[agaga]

I'd like to ask a question because I've been thinking about it and haven't ever seen it posted about. Is it possible The Blight is a sentient being, and Lan could actually win his personal war against it? I mean has anyone ever made their way through the whole of The Blight and survived? Could it be that the Blight has a core that can be killed the same as anything else? Is it possible?

[Theleos]

Very interesting question. I would say that the nature of the blight's dissapearance would be a gradual(Sp?) retreat, but it depends on the nature of the DOs defeat. Also does anyone remember how the blight retreated after TEotW? because i remember they said they dealt the blight a large blow and it retreated, it might have been a near-instant type reteat or a gradual surrender.

 

Also i doubt that the blight is something that Lan can kill. I think Lan will win his batle by leading an army in the LB and doing something important tactifully. Especially since the last we saw Nyneave set him up to have an army flock to him before he can even get there. Maybe he will fight the creatures of the blight, like the worms and such, or maybe just trollocs and fades.

[Osan`gar]

i would think that some things would be slow and others fast. for example. anything directly dependant upon the DO or his taint would die or cease to exist rather quickly. myrdrahls, trollocs, gholam, those evil menacingg trees, etc... while the land which was claimed may take years to recover... if ever. once the land has become arid and desert like it may no longer be able to sustain itself. but may possibly be reclaimed at a future date.

[Builder]

If the Blight vanishes because Rand did something spectacular, then I don't think it would turn into a desert. It's too far to the north to become a desert, and I guess the north pole would melt creating rivers that would make the ground somewhat fertile.

[Nightstrike]

I think the Shadowspawn will die when the Bore is unmade. They were made with the True Power (and other stuff). I don't think they can exist after the True Power is gone. I don't think the Wheel is spinning their souls (whatever souls they might have) out like the Wheel does with humans.

 

 

[Roxinos]

If Rand "patches" the bore in all likelihood the blight might gradually retreat but it will not disappear.

 

If you're responding to my use of the word "patch," I believe I also used the phrase "reseal completely." I use them interchangeably.

 

Second the Third Age is over Three Thousand Years the fact that Malkier disappeared 40 years ago does not mean that the seals were not beginning to fail back then to the extent that the Blight and the DO's influence were not responsible for the fall of Malkier.

 

Never suggested they weren't. However, you said it yourself. The Third Age is old. The Blight has been around a long time. Do you honestly believe that the Blight has been stagnant except in recent years with its swallowing up of Malkier? If that were the case, then I would imagine the Borderlands would have raised hell with the sudden extension of the Blight in contrast to some long period of stillness.

 

No, the invasion of Malkier and the swallowing of Malkier into the Blight was not a surprise. (Well, the invasion was....) It was just part of the Blight's machinations, so it is doubtful that Malkier's end was a result of the seals weakening.

 

Lastlty, as the blight causes a cancerous growth on nature, if you remove the cancer (the DO's influence) it will take time for the effects to heal and thus the cleansing of the Blight would be gradual.

 

It does seem rather unlikely that the Blight will simply vanish.

 

Is it possible The Blight is a sentient being, and Lan could actually win his personal war against it? I mean has anyone ever made their way through the whole of The Blight and survived? Could it be that the Blight has a core that can be killed the same as anything else? Is it possible?

 

Is it possible? Certainly. Is it likely? Most certainly not. There is no evidence to suggest a level of sentience to the Blight. If it were suddenly included, it would be on part with a retcon because of the sudden shift in perspective required to include the Blight in the list of evil things that must be fought. Lan is not fighting a personal war against the Blight, he's fighting a personal war against the Shadow. Is there a core to the Blight? Yes. It's called the Great Lord of the Dark.

 

while the land which was claimed may take years to recover... if ever. once the land has become arid and desert like it may no longer be able to sustain itself. but may possibly be reclaimed at a future date.

 

As I said, we know that the Blight is reclaimed after a certain period. We know that it just becomes regular land because the Blight does not exist during the Age of Legends.

 

It's too far to the north to become a desert...

 

You do know that frozen deserts exist, right? Deserts are not merely barren wastelands where the heat pounds the sand into submission. For example, Antarctica is one large freaking desert. A desert is merely defined as a place with limited precipitation.

 

I don't think they can exist after the True Power is gone.

 

Trollocs, Myrddraal, and the like can exist inside the stedding. They do not like to go in for whatever reasons, but they can exist inside the stedding. The absence of the True Power does not destroy the Shadowspawn.

[Builder]

The Shadowspawn must be killed, but they will have less space to live in after TG. And no, I didn't knew about frozen deserts. Besides, my point was that the Blight would turn into forests or whatever.

 

Now I think it would be entirely overcome with ice. The north pole would expand, because the Blight was warm. The Borderlands were not, so I assume that if the Blight vanished the north pole would roll over the former Blight and quite possibly to the Mountains of Doom.

[Nightstrike]

I don't think they can exist after the True Power is gone.

 

Trollocs, Myrddraal, and the like can exist inside the stedding. They do not like to go in for whatever reasons, but they can exist inside the stedding. The absence of the True Power does not destroy the Shadowspawn.

The Bore exists everywhere. That means that the Bore exists in the stedding. When the Bore is unmade, then there will probably be no more Shadowspawn.

[Roxinos]

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing. There is no relevant information to suggest that the Trollocs can only exist in the presence of the Bore. So it's speculatively possible that you're right. However, your idea that the Trollocs' supposed link to the True Power would be cause for their destruction upon the True Power's absence is just false, and that is what I was commenting on.

[Nightstrike]

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing. There is no relevant information to suggest that the Trollocs can only exist in the presence of the Bore. So it's speculatively possible that you're right.

Yes, I think it is possible. And likely. But no 100% certain evidence either way.

 

However, your idea that the Trollocs' supposed link to the True Power would be cause for their destruction upon the True Power's absence is just false, and that is what I was commenting on.

No, we don't have anything that says that absense of True Power can not be the cause for their death.

 

[Roxinos]

No, we don't have anything that says that absense of True Power can not be the cause for their death.

 

Yes, we do. As I said, the Trollocs can live inside the stedding. The True Power does not exist within the stedding just as the True Source does not exist within the stedding. And yet, the Trollocs can continue to live there.

 

Whether or not the Bore exists within the stedding is debatable. If the stedding were an exception to the rule "the Bore is everywhere" I would imagine it wouldn't be something that's particularly well known. The stedding haven't been studied too extensively after all. So their nature is arguable. Considering the True Source does not exist within the stedding and the True Source is the driving force of the entire universe, it would suggest that the stedding exist outside of the universe somehow. Perhaps like separate pockets of universe that are entirely self-contained.

 

However, that last bit is speculation.

 

You have no evidence to suggest that Trollocs are tied to either the Bore's presence or the presence of the True Power. In fact, you have evidence to suggest that at least the latter is untrue because Trollocs can exist in the absence of the True Power.

[Nightstrike]

Yes, we do. As I said, the Trollocs can live inside the stedding.

That doesn't tell us much about this matter.

 

The True Power does not exist within the stedding just as the True Source does not exist within the stedding. And yet, the Trollocs can continue to live there.

The True Power may or may not "exist" anywhere in the world, except were it is manifesting itself of course. That is beside the point. We don't know how a stedding works. We've never been told about it.

 

Whether or not the Bore exists within the stedding is debatable.

No, it isn't.

 

The stedding haven't been studied too extensively after all. So their nature is arguable.

Maybe they have been studied extensively. Anyway, their nature is indeed arguable.

 

Considering the True Source does not exist within the stedding and the True Source is the driving force of the entire universe, it would suggest that the stedding exist outside of the universe somehow.

Unsupported and extremely unlikely.

 

You have no evidence to suggest that Trollocs are tied to either the Bore's presence or the presence of the True Power.

No, but it is still very likely. In my opinion, of course. It was my opinion all along. I never claimed that it was a matter of fact.

 

In fact, you have evidence to suggest that at least the latter is untrue because Trollocs can exist in the absence of the True Power.

No, we don't have any such evidence. We don't know how a stedding works.

 

[Roxinos]

That doesn't tell us much about this matter.

 

Yes it does, it tells us that they can live in the absence of the True Power.

 

The True Power may or may not "exist" anywhere in the world, except were it is manifesting itself of course. That is beside the point. We don't know how a stedding works. We've never been told about it.

 

But we do know how the One Power and the True Power work. And we do know the effects that the stedding have on the One Power, and so we can extrapolate the effects the stedding would have on the True Power because they both work the same in reference to the reality of Randland. That being, they are both powers outside of the universe and, as such, exist everywhere at the same time. The only real difference between the two (setting aside the True Power's effects on the channler, which is a moot point) is that the Great Lord controls the True Power as he is the source of the True Power.

 

So, considering the One Power's lack of existence within the stedding, we can assume that the True Power doesn't exist there either. We can speculate on the nature of the stedding as being a pocket of reality outside of reality as it does not have the same connection to the One Power that drives the universe that regular reality has. It is self-contained. Whether or not it is actually a part of the Pattern is inconsequential, the fact that the stedding are self-contained is relatively easy to distinguish considering its effects on the One Power. The One Power can exist within the stedding, but only if it is brought in through a well ter'angreal.

 

No, it isn't.

 

Why is it not debatable?

 

The Bore and the Wheel exist outside of the Pattern. The One Power drives the Wheel, therefore it also exists outside of the Pattern. If the One Power, which exists outside of the Pattern, is somehow blocked off or effectively non-existent within the stedding, then certainly the Bore would be blocked off or effectively non-existent within the stedding.

 

Why do you suggest so haphazardly that there is no room for debate on that topic?

 

Unsupported and extremely unlikely.

 

See my logic previously in this post. It seems relatively supported, at least implicitly, to me.

 

No, but it is still very likely. In my opinion, of course.

 

The likelihood of a situation is outside of your realm of opinion. The likelihood of a situation does not change merely by your opinion. The likelihood of a situation is fact that we must attempt to objectively determine. So your opinion is on the nature of the Trollocs, the True Power, and the stedding. However your opinion is, though, is unquestionable. And I've made no attempts to either say it isn't likely or it is. I've merely attempted to get you to stop making assertions as to the likelihood of your opinions.

 

No, we don't have any such evidence. We don't know how a stedding works.

 

But we can draw reasonable assertions as to their nature considering what we know of the One Power (since we know how that works), what we know of the True Power (since we know how that works, to an extent), and what we know of the stedding in relation to the One Power.

[ROB_88]

i'm tired and have not read thorugh the whole topic so excuse me if i'm just repeating someone.

 

in TEoTW after Rand has defeated the various Forsaken, it is said that the Blight retreats pretty far as well as the weather turning back to normal for the time being. i've never understood this connection. why does the Blight weaken just because Ishmael and co were wounded/killed?

[Roxinos]

Which certainly seems to lend credence to the idea that the Blight will simply vanish at the end of the Last Battle. Certainly to the idea that the Blight will follow the battle, advancing with the Shadow's victories and retracting with its losses.

[Nightstrike]

in TEoTW after Rand has defeated the various Forsaken, it is said that the Blight retreats pretty far as well as the weather turning back to normal for the time being. i've never understood this connection. why does the Blight weaken just because Ishmael and co were wounded/killed?

I don't know. I think the blight is likely to disappear when the Bore is sealed. I also think that the Shadowspawn will disappear when the Bore is sealed.

[matisbestino]

      I think Perrin is going to play a major role in how the land in the blight is brought back to good quality. I remeber reading before (maybe a viewing by Min) that there was green plants sprouting around him. I assumed it would be something like him and his tinker friends would rediscover " the song " and sing with the ogiers and what not to make the land healthy. I guess this would probaly take place after the last battle.                    My first post :)( besides when i signed up on the noob boards)         

[arkinia]

I think of it like the Zerg. The Blight is the creep, Shayol Ghul is the hive. Darkfriends can be drones, Trollocs can be zerglings and Myrrdaal can be... ultralisks. The Chosen are Queens. Then Rand is a firebat and the borderland kingdoms are photon cannons.

 

P.S. This is an accurate analogy, no arguments.

[Builder]

Well maybe the Blight will vanish just as parts of Mordor vanished when the Ring melted. It won't collapse, but it will vanish pretty quickly. I just wonder why?

 

think of it like the Zerg. The Blight is the creep, Shayol Ghul is the hive. Darkfriends can be drones, Trollocs can be zerglings and Myrrdaal can be... ultralisks. The Chosen are Queens. Then Rand is a firebat and the borderland kingdoms are photon cannons.

 

P.S. This is an accurate analogy, no arguments.

 

Sorry but I have to. Rand must be a Templar or something more powerful than a Firebat. How about Battlecruiser. Also, photon cannons suck. People only build them to gain detection, but when it comes to defenses, I would definitely go with good ol' trusty Bunkers  ;)

[arkinia]

I just said he was a firebat because they are anti-zerg with their fire. I guess a templar would make more sense. I was going to say sunken colony, but that is zerg and not all the borderlanders are darkfriends. Then saying they are bunkers isn't much of a stretch so it just wouldn't fit so I went with cannons.

[Yllek]

I believe that the corruption/decay that exists in the blight will cease to exist after the DO's prison is created as it was by the creator; however, it will take awhile to heal itself. 

 

As for Trollocs and other shadowspawn, weren't they created by channelers (Aginor, I believe)?  If they were created by man and not the DO, one could assume that they would continue to exist after the last battle.  They would need to be killed off one by one (unless they are all connected to Shardar Harin and killing him would kill all of them...wouldn't that be kinda cool?). 

 

Furthermore, many of the creatures considered to be shadowspawn living in the blight are merely creatures brought to this world from worlds connected by the stones.  That doesn't really mean that they are creatures of the shadow, just considered such.